Fant4stic Fant4stic: Reborn! - - - - Part 38

[wobbly]

Guys....Just a friendly reminder of C-Lee's warning yesterday. Some of this can be taken over the FFINO thread (I would reply to some comments I agree with, but not in this thread).

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Wait, so...this is a film about puberty...but it's also not for kids. Doesn't that just seem like the audience that topic may be most relevant to...?

This is a movie for kids. The ads are designed for kids and they're playing on kids channels.

But when you're making a movie for kids, the last thing you say is: "This is a movie for kids." Kids want to see movies they think are for grown-ups.

I believe there's also confusion because few people know what this film is about. Saying "This film is about Josh Trank's moobs." wouldn't go over well, so they keep trying to describe it and market it as something more interesting.

They also want to set themselves apart from the Tim Story films.

But I've been watching this whole thing for a long time and there's no doubt in my mind that Fox hopes to have a lot of under 18 year olds seeing this film.

 

[Orba]

Anyone know whats going on with IMDB changing Tim Blake Nelson's credit to Dr Allen? Could they have scrapped the character being Harvey Elder? (not that the character looks to be anything like the comic character)

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1502712/


Edit:

In the video they published this week they still refered to him as Harvey Elder

[YT]0hxLVE6EW4U[/YT]

So not sure whats going on.

 

[Marvin]

The Ben casting I am iffy on now I'll admit so I should revise my opinion a bit.

I wouldn't have had any issue if Sue were played by a black actress but Hollywood seems to think only one black actor in a prominent role per film or the film turns into a "black movie."

There are plenty of hollywood movies with more than one in prominent role(including this one).
There is a matter of how many prominents can you race change per inch of material however. That this film only has one black 'lead' and not more I find a 'fault' of the material more than hollywood tbh. That they found a way to involve even one in such a way I consider great.
Save for blade, we don't see any afro americans in anything outside of heimdall like 'supporting' roles in modern cbms.
Xmen is the one with the most opportunity given the material and it always amounts to something like storm or bishop. The mcu stuff has it's formula(s) and the dc stuff only makes superman/batman and no teams. Things are looking to change though.

F4 is currently looking to stand in a class of it's own in this particular regard, given how much leading the minority is looking to do. And all by usurping the material at that. I for one am not one to complain.

 

[wobbly]

Anyone know whats going on with IMDB changing Tim Blake Nelson's credit to Dr Allen? Could they have scrapped the character being Harvey Elder? (not that the character looks to be anything like the comic character)

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1502712/


Edit:

In the video they published this week they still refered to him as Harvey Elder

[YT]0hxLVE6EW4U[/YT]

So not sure whats going on.

IMDB is always getting things wrong, though if he is an 'agent' maybe the Allen name is an alias or something. My money would be on IMDB just having it wrong.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Anyone know whats going on with IMDB changing Tim Blake Nelson's credit to Dr Allen? Could they have scrapped the character being Harvey Elder? (not that the character looks to be anything like the comic character)

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1502712/


Edit:

In the video they published this week they still refered to him as Harvey Elder

[YT]0hxLVE6EW4U[/YT]

So not sure whats going on.

Weird. I certainly hope they would do that so there's still at least a chance we could get Mole-man, but that would seem difficult to change this late.

 

[DigificWriter]

Yes, but it does change their relationship.

Oh, absolutely, and I'm not the biggest fan of it being in this film, but the guy seems baffled by the concept of them having that kind of relationship.

I'm not trying to stir anything up, but these comments give the impression that you two don't truly understand the dynamics of an adoption family. I can tell you from personal experience that any family that has adopted children in it would be appalled at and offended by the notion that there's any difference between the relationships of biological children/siblings and adopted children/siblings.

My adopted siblings are as much a part of my family as my biological siblings, and their relationships with me and my parents are just as strong and meaningful as the relationships that my biological siblings have with me and my parents.

 

[Ragnaroknroll]

I understand that in the 21st Century more diversity is needed. I have no problem with this provided the core source material is respected. I don't have a problem with MBJ or the adoption angle - DigificWriter stated an excellent argument on this issue earlier on this forum. I do however have a problem with Ben Grimm being a pipsqueek turned exhibitionist and Doom being a Storm family adoptee blogger who turns into a krill eating Tim Story version 2.0.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

I understand that in the 21st Century more diversity is needed. I have no problem with this provided the core source material is respected. I don't have a problem with MBJ or the adoption angle - DigificWriter stated an excellent argument on this issue earlier on this forum. I do however have a problem with Ben Grimm being a pipsqueek turned exhibitionist and Doom being a Storm family adoptee blogger who turns into a krill eating Tim Story version 2.0.

That's because those changes aren't even remotely interesting. Jamie Bell is not and never will be "the muscle." Doom being the fifth member of the Fantastic Four yet again is lazy and unimaginative writing.

If one doesn't agree with the race change because one is a purist, fine. I'm not that much of a purist though.

 

[Drz]

Ah, the closer we get the better things sound!

 

[starscream22]

So it's wrong to try an make this place a little more inviting to those that are interested in this movie? The comic fans opinions are not superior or more valid to the non-fans.

Then why is it so hard for you to ignore them???

The Mods/Admins have explain this 100x's over.

And while it is okay to be critical of the movie, you have to realize just how much of a toxic forum this has become.

Yeah you just see what you wanna see. The mods have tried to be as fair as they can with this part of the forum. Its not their fault there's so many problems with this reboot. The anticipation for this film is clearly mixed, so anyone thinking they can say anything about this film w/o some type of disagreement isn't rational at this point. If they're not being disrespectful I think you have much of a leg to stand on on the "victim" category.

 

[protocida]

I'm a little curious, why did people latched onto the changes in this movie when numerous good movies have substantially changed the source material? Hasn't it been proven by now that, while faithfulness to the source material is not bad, it is not exactly mandatory to deliver an entertaining movie?

 

[TheVileOne]

Kinberg has said (and I cringe to even paste this):

"And the FF’s transformation, for him, was a literalisation of that coming of age. To make them older, in their thirties or forties, would have taken away from what he wanted to do dramatically.”

"It’s almost like if this is a coming of age story for these characters, the next movie is about what it is to be a grown-up in the world…”

And Josh Tank has said:

"When I was in middle school and high school, I was over 100 pounds overweight," he said. "I had a condition called gynecomastia — I had really big man boobs — and I got a surgery for it. My whole adolescence was hating myself and feeling suicidal. I was made fun of by a lot of other kids in such a way that I didn't feel like I was human."

That's it. That's what the story is about. It's not about people with amazing powers exploring strange worlds battling alien creatures . . . it's about Trank's man-boobs.

Trank and Kinberg thought it would be a really neat idea to make a film not about superheroes but about puberty. The transition and 'body horror' is an allegory for puberty and the military stands in for the parents and teachers who "just don't understand" (from the ignorant view of the kids - we adults understand much better than kids realize because we were there once).

It's a really dumb idea and this is a film geared towards kids, but that's the explanation.

Kate Mara is 32.

 

[starscream22]

Ah, the closer we get the better things sound!

Hopefully we both get what we want.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Kate Mara is 32.

That's just one more yech about this whole thing. Did you see the clip of Teller at his high school science fair?

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

I'm a little curious, why did people latched onto the changes in this movie when numerous good movies have substantially changed the source material? Hasn't it been proven by now that, while faithfulness to the source material is not bad, it is not exactly mandatory to deliver an entertaining movie?

It is the degree of the changes that is the problem. Yes, every comic book film makes changes, sometimes substantial changes. But this film has changed so much that it doesn't even appear to resemble the comics in any meaningful way whatsoever. Very few comic book films are not even recognizable in the way that this one is, and those few that are (ex. Catwoman, Dragon Ball: Evolution) get just as much criticism from the fans as this film has.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

I'm a little curious, why did people latched onto the changes in this movie when numerous good movies have substantially changed the source material? Hasn't it been proven by now that, while faithfulness to the source material is not bad, it is not exactly mandatory to deliver an entertaining movie?

To be fair fanboys always complain about any changes made to the source material but if the film is good to them they shut up.

I think Kahran is correct that it's the amount of changes that is bothering people, that mixed with the film generally not looking good.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

It is the degree of the changes that is the problem. Yes, every comic book film makes changes, sometimes substantial changes. But this film has changed so much that it doesn't even appear to resemble the comics in any meaningful way whatsoever. Very few comic book films are not even recognizable in the way that this one is, and those few that are (ex. Catwoman, Dragon Ball: Evolution) get just as much criticism from the fans as this film has.

I find it odd that Kinberg will say things like the fans are being 'unfair' in the same interview that he talks about the nifty changes they're making.

The fans aren't a crazy, unpredictable variable. The fans respond in ways that are very predictable to anyone who pays attention, listens and gives a damn. The fans aren't one person, they're millions of people, and by the way, they're the customer for the product Kinberg is trying to sell.

Kinberg's like a guy who walks up to a wall, hits it with a sledgehammer and then blames the wall for falling down.

 

[Marvin]

That's because those changes aren't even remotely interesting. Jamie Bell is not and never will be "the muscle." Doom being the fifth member of the Fantastic Four yet again is lazy and unimaginative writing.

The changes aren't interesting to you, I know some people that have finally taken an interest to this material after passing up the book for years. As for bell, being the muscle is a state of mind; just like being confident, or being a bully or being a push over. As for unimaginative, simply copying source is also a form of lazy. Just saying.

Given that many were worried this film would be too "talky," how much action is actually in the film?

It is interesting. Fox of all studios not giving away all the big action ala first class/spiderman/avengers in their marketing..
I get why people wanting this to do good would be worried that fox isn't selling their big movie in the same way as the one with the hulk buster fight if you will, but to actually complain about things not being spoiled(for once)... in this day and age.
Between chronicle and the way fox makes their cbms, this movie having action seems like no brainer.

I suspect this film and all it's vfx assets/work finishing last minute has both affected the 3d conversion even happening as well as the marketing footage. But that's me.

 

[Snikt]

It is interesting. Fox of all studios not giving away all the big action ala first class/spiderman/avengers in their marketing..
I get why people wanting this to do good would be worried that fox isn't selling their big movie in the same way as the one with the hulk buster fight if you will, but to actually complain about things not being spoiled(for once)... in this day and age.
Between chronicle and the way fox makes their cbms, this movie having action seems like no brainer.

I think people just need re-assurance this cbm will actually have good action. It's a reboot with A LOT of hostility towards it. With t MCU, we know what kind of action to expect and we know it'll be damn good action.

But many are still unsure of this film. We all assumed it would have action; just how much is the question.

 

[Snow Queen]

I'm not trying to stir anything up, but these comments give the impression that you two don't truly understand the dynamics of an adoption family. I can tell you from personal experience that any family that has adopted children in it would be appalled at and offended by the notion that there's any difference between the relationships of biological children/siblings and adopted children/siblings.

My adopted siblings are as much a part of my family as my biological siblings, and their relationships with me and my parents are just as strong and meaningful as the relationships that my biological siblings have with me and my parents.

Well I hope you accept my apology on this matter then. It was late, I said something stupid, sorry.

 

[marvelmadness13]

Just a reminder to everyone to take this dony guys reports with a grain of salt. We have no confirmation of any screenings I'm Israel, we know he's wrong about the embargo, and he's way off on the films run time.

 

[Sullstar]

Just a reminder to everyone to take this dony guys reports with a grain of salt. We have no confirmation of any screenings I'm Israel, we know he's wrong about the embargo, and he's way off on the films run time.

While I agree, he didn't really say anything about the embargo. He just said he's not under any embargo to tell people about what he saw. He's probably not allowed to post an official review or anything

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Just a reminder to everyone to take this dony guys reports with a grain of salt. We have no confirmation of any screenings I'm Israel, we know he's wrong about the embargo, and he's way off on the films run time.

We'll know in a week. Call me gullible, but I like to believe people unless I have good reason to think otherwise.

 

[dony2012]

About the X-Men, I don't think the FF are in the same world as them, however because they introduce the concept of interdimensional portals there's no reason they wouldn't cross into the X-Men dimension, which also mean if Fox will ever make a deal with Marvel I don't see any reason why we couldn't get this version of the X-Men and FF in the MCU after they will cross dimensions into the Marvel universe.