Fant4stic Fantastic Four 2?

[Matt]

There seems to be a matter of rights extensions. If they were allowed to simply include the FF in any X film and include them in the title they are basically extending the rights of two separate franchises with one film. I would think that contracts written at the time are very specific about what constitutes an extension. For instance spinoffs would reset the clock. We saw this with Elektra and DD. There were safeguards in place against such a thing. Certain characters were included with each property. Doubt they could just make Galactus the main villain in Xmen 8.

Just to clarify, I agree that sticking Johnny Storm in X-Men would be insufficient to extend the rights of Fantastic Four, no matter how the contract is written regarding crossovers.

 

[R_Hythlodeus]

*shutters at the thought of Foxlactus*

 

[Orba]

There are also other issues with crossovers, we know that the two film rights had different agreements on how much everyone gets. Its known that the FF rights were a better deal than the X-Men rights which were done by guys who had no idea what they were doing and Fox exploited that. So in a crossover there would be questions over which agreement would count.

Then there is the question if a crossover was an X-Men film with an appearance of the FF or a FF film with an appearance of the X-Men. If the contracts don't have terms for crossovers then there are questions over how much screentime each franchise would need in order to renew the contract.

Since film crossovers were no a big thing back when the contracts were written its highly likely that crossover provisions were never considered so its highly unlikely that Fox bothered to waste time on negotiating for any.

Off the top of my head only two film crossovers spring to mind (outside of the recent MCU and DCU stuff), one is Freddy vs Jason and the other AvP, but in both cases the production companies (as far as I'm aware) were the full owners of the IPs and were not bound by any contract arrangements and as such could do what they wanted. Fox on the other hand has the rights under contract with Marvel and as such would have to negotiate with Marvel for anything that went outside of the provisions of the existing contract.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

*shutters at the thought of Foxlactus*

Already got him.

He was a giant cloud.

 

[R_Hythlodeus]

Already got him.

He was a giant cloud.

That was Storylactus, but what about Tranklactus? Or Singerlactus?

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

That was Storylactus, but what about Tranklactus? Or Singerlactus?

Tranklactus would have been some fat guy who breaks into the Baxter Building to eat all of their food. Grounded and gritty!

Don't worry about Singerlactus. He would have just been replaced in the last act by Magneto after he turned on the X-Men anyways.

 

[R_Hythlodeus]

I kinda want to see Taikalactus, though. Or even Gunnlactus.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

Tranklactus would have been some fat guy who breaks into the Baxter Building to eat all of their food. Grounded and gritty!

Don't worry about Singerlactus. He would have just been replaced in the last act by Magneto after he turned on the X-Men anyways.

 

[Willie Lumpkin]

I kinda want to see Taikalactus, though. Or even Gunnlactus.

 

[Chip Chipperson]

whats the matter, no one wants to see Josslactus?

 

[R_Hythlodeus]

whats the matter, no one wants to see Josslactus?

I hadn't thought about this. But yeah, why not. Snyderlactus on the other hand...

 

[metaphysician]

The big issue is that fan complaints are too often dismissed as being nitpicking over minor details. And while that does happen, a lot of the fan complaints are about major character and story concerns and those very much do matter and are things that the general audience cares about as well. Not all fan complaints are equal. Not by a long shot.

The fans aren't always overreacting. They were dead on about Fant4stic, after all. Virtually everything that fans complained about regarding Fant4stic prior to the film coming out are things that the critics and general moviegoers also complained about after seeing the final product.

Which is why movie-making takes a lot of skill. You need to listen to the fans. . . and by that I mean "listen", not "obey". You hear what the fans say about the characters and the plot and the movie, and then figure out what this actually means. This requires filtering out the obvious stupidity, like fans wanting to turn characters into murderous psychopaths because it'd be so kewl. Then you take the more reasonable feedback, and have to dig down to figure out *why* said responses happen, because the fans themselves may not know why they respond a certain way.

 

[metaphysician]

I hadn't thought about this. But yeah, why not. Snyderlactus on the other hand...

Snyderlactus would probably successfully eat half the planet before being beaten, all in gory CGI detail that stretches well past the point of boredom. This would then be ignored two scenes later.

 

[Panacea]

The franchise completely lost all those people due to the poor quality of the previous films. They aren't coming back.

Baseless assertion.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

Baseless assertion.

Believe what you want. The rest of us will continue living in reality.

 

[Tony Stark]

What the fans want is almost entirely irrelevant. The Fans™ make up an absolutely minuscule proportion of the viewing audience and if a movie relied on them to succeed it would be dead before it even opened up in theatres. The idea that the execs at Fox, a company with a track record of making profitable superhero movies, is going to just up and decide that they're too inept to make money from the Fantastic Four IP and so should just let the rights revert to Marvel is naive in the extreme. There is zero chance of that happening.

Sorry you have this completely backward. Let's have a history lesson. The first FF film was a modest hit, at least good enough to warrant a sequel despite the fact the film was panned by critics and met with tepid response from the fan base. The sequel was "better" but still a disaster but worst of all, it did worse than the first film. The franchise was shelved until the 2015 reboot.

The reboot was a case where Fox was interested in dipping their feet in the water, but it was clear they wanted to do the film on the cheap, with an untried director, and a cast of up and comers they could pay cheaply. When word got out about the film being a disaster needing multiple reshoots and forcing Trank out of the editing room everyone knew this film was a complete screw up.

The executives you're talking about are not going to spend a dime on any future effort, because on a third effort the film was the biggest bomb of the bunch. Even ROTSS wasn't a bomb, it was a disappointment for sure, but it wasn't a bomb.

So you tell me what exec is going to put his job on the line by committing money for the production of something that after three efforts, each one made less than the previous.

Fox can either just decide to be d**** and make a required movie every so often in the hopes they'll get a cash out from Marvel, or try to negotiate the rights back for something else they want, or just let the rights revert.

 

[metaphysician]

*cough* I think the second one made the first one look good. It basically killed all the good characterization the first had, and made everyone look like idiots.

 

[I SEE SPIDEY]

I definitely believe that the first one is superior to the second.

 

[Panacea]

Sorry you have this completely backward. Let's have a history lesson. The first FF film was a modest hit, at least good enough to warrant a sequel despite the fact the film was panned by critics and met with tepid response from the fan base. The sequel was "better" but still a disaster but worst of all, it did worse than the first film. The franchise was shelved until the 2015 reboot.

The reboot was a case where Fox was interested in dipping their feet in the water, but it was clear they wanted to do the film on the cheap, with an untried director, and a cast of up and comers they could pay cheaply. When word got out about the film being a disaster needing multiple reshoots and forcing Trank out of the editing room everyone knew this film was a complete screw up.

The executives you're talking about are not going to spend a dime on any future effort, because on a third effort the film was the biggest bomb of the bunch. Even ROTSS wasn't a bomb, it was a disappointment for sure, but it wasn't a bomb.

So you tell me what exec is going to put his job on the line by committing money for the production of something that after three efforts, each one made less than the previous.

Fox can either just decide to be d**** and make a required movie every so often in the hopes they'll get a cash out from Marvel, or try to negotiate the rights back for something else they want, or just let the rights revert.

I don't know what the point of that history lesson was, we all know what happened. Movies losing money happens all the time, but to allow an IP to go for free to a studio that wants it? That is ineptitude in the extreme. Fox will either commit to reboot and try to do it properly, negotiate a rights-sharing agreement, or sell the rights. There is absolutely zero chance that they will just allow the rights to run out. Not going to happen.

 

[First Avenger]

I don't know what the point of that history lesson was, we all know what happened. Movies losing money happens all the time, but to allow an IP to go for free to a studio that wants it? That is ineptitude in the extreme. Fox will either commit to reboot and try to do it properly, negotiate a rights-sharing agreement, or sell the rights. There is absolutely zero chance that they will just allow the rights to run out. Not going to happen.

So Fox better keep losing money right? They would show to be the clueless idiots we all believe they are.

 

[Tony Stark]

I don't know what the point of that history lesson was, we all know what happened. Movies losing money happens all the time, but to allow an IP to go for free to a studio that wants it? That is ineptitude in the extreme. Fox will either commit to reboot and try to do it properly, negotiate a rights-sharing agreement, or sell the rights. There is absolutely zero chance that they will just allow the rights to run out. Not going to happen.

the history lesson was so that you'd understand that studios generally don't throw good money after bad. They will not reboot again unless it's a cheap effort just to try and extort a buyback of the rights from Marvel. I could see a negotiation, but as Marvel has shown with Sony, it basically means their branding will be on it, and their people producing it. You're out of your mind if you think a studio exec would approve rebooting this again as things currently stand.

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

I don't know what the point of that history lesson was, we all know what happened. Movies losing money happens all the time, but to allow an IP to go for free to a studio that wants it? That is ineptitude in the extreme. Fox will either commit to reboot and try to do it properly, negotiate a rights-sharing agreement, or sell the rights. There is absolutely zero chance that they will just allow the rights to run out. Not going to happen.

Explain Daredevil.

 

[Tony Stark]

*cough* I think the second one made the first one look good. It basically killed all the good characterization the first had, and made everyone look like idiots.

Hence why I used "better" in quotes. It was a veiled backhanded compliment in that it got a slightly better RT score and some of the reviewers said it was better than the first. Both films are a hot mess. The only reason to watch either is that they're currently the only things that remotely resemble an honest attempt at bringing the comics to film.

 

[AlluAllu]

Another reboot by Fox would obviously be another rights grab, completely artless, and everyone could see it. That would have to be some bad PR.

 

[bubbadoom]

For what its worth I seem to recall hearing that Fox did have to get permission from Marvel to crossover the FF with the Surfer, so I suspect the same would be true with the FF and X-Men...