Justice League For the Lead Up Films: How to Differentiate From "The Avengers Stretegy".

[sethypants]

For me, I think one of the best ways to differentiate a Justice League film from the Avengers is just to drop the movie and then springboard individual franchises off of it. Perhaps the movie can tell the story of how the team came together, but individual movies can do character origin stories (if necessary) after the fact.

Justice League might be the perfect way to finally get Flash, Wonder Woman, and Aquaman films. And another Green Lantern and maybe even Martian Manhunter. And fingers would be crossed to see if we could get a Black Lightning or Vixen film out of the deal too. A JL film might be a good set up for Blue Beetle and a host of other DC characters that could be in their own movies or TV shows.

As for minor or 'cheap' character cameos in films like Man of Steel, I'm not opposed to them at all. I did like Amanda Waller showing up in Green Lantern and was hoping she would be like a Sam L. Jackson Nick Fury for the DCU that would show up in other films. Heck I even liked the mention of Metropolis in Batman Forever back in the day.

agreed. dont see a need for lead in films. like i said dc solo heroes all have a bigger history, supporting cast, stories, rogue gallery and all. So if the justice league can give renewed interest in the members im all for it. Who knows we could see ironman like success for each of them instead of just captain america like success.
So I hope that theres no lead in film.

 

[Raiden]

The biggest diffrenciation of all: keep it grounded and real-world.

Are you implying that Marvel's movies aren't "grounded and real-world"? And I would argue that DC superheroes are actually more fantasy-based than Marvel's, since they are either aliens, gods, or people who got magical powers. Marvel tends to love origins based on scientific experimentations or natural mutations.

 

[The Guard]

I'm kind of a sucker for cameos, if they're well handled, and the character is deserving.

Hawkeye's in THOR would have been better if he'd shot at least one arrow, but it was cool to see him there. Not neccessary, but most aren't.

I don't consider Waller's role a cameo. She had a very defined role in the story of GREEN LANTERN.

 

[sethypants]

Just thought you guys should read this page.
Its rumored that WW would cameo in MOS.
http://forums.superherohype.com/showthread.php?t=388249&page=7

 

[DoomsdayApex]

Are you implying that Marvel's movies aren't "grounded and real-world"? And I would argue that DC superheroes are actually more fantasy-based than Marvel's, since they are either aliens, gods, or people who got magical powers. Marvel tends to love origins based on scientific experimentations or natural mutations.

There's a difference between Marvel Studios' 'grounded' format and Nolan-esque 'gritty' levels though.

I think that's where WB is heading, and what Blackman implied.

 

[sethypants]

I think one way WB should differentiate themselves is to have even more silly cameos. Several of the cameos for the individual films did not make any sense whatsoever. So wb should definitely out do marvel in the cameos department.

 

[Rockstar]

Now that Nolan is gone, the best thing WB/DC could do to diffrenciate Justice League from Avengers is keep JL seperate and self-contained.

Have "Man of Steel" be it's own franchise and "Justice League" be a seperate franchise taking place in a different world.


My idea is to draw inspiration from Alex Ross' Justice and Kingdom Come, and have two Justice League films build towards Kingdom Come (KC could potentially destroy Avengers in scale).



Ultimately, WB/DC could have the Man of Steel franchise (with Cavill), a Justice League franchise (with the cast I've suggested in my sig) and eventually launch a new solo Batman franchise inspired by TAS and Arkham City.


Those three franchises in place could be a box office goldmine for the next decade if done right.

 

[shauner111]

Gina Carano? bradley cooper? wtf. If that ever happens ill throw up. Jon Hamm would make a great older Bruce Wayne but a laughable Batman.

Having 2 Supermans and 2 (or 3 counting Bale) Batmans in the same decade pretty much? Stupid. Confusing. ******ed. The general audience will always be thought of, and anything like that would make normal movie-goer scratch their heads endlessly.

The best idea at this point..if rumours are true that they're trying to throw out JLA in the next 3 to 4 years. Would be to just jump right into it after Man Of Steel. They can use Henry Cavill as a springboard, and everybody elses solo movies can be done after the team up film. That's how you make it simple, give Batman on film (by himself) some breathing room coming after Rises, and seperate it from the concept of Avengers.

It would be like if they did the first Iron Man back in 2008 & went into Avengers with a recasted Hulk. Whether that would have been Norton or Ruffalo. Introduding Thor, Captain America, Black Widow and Hawkeye all in the team-up. Then branched off into their own. Of course this is what WB/DC should do cuz it's a little different. If they ABSOLUTELY need to give us their Flash and Wonder Woman movies before hand then go for it i guess. As long as the character of Batman, Green Lantern (Reynolds or not), Aquaman and maybe Martian Manhunter debut at the same time.

 

[TheHeatKitchen]

I vote have no lead up films except Man of Steel. Do Man of Steel, Justice League, Wonder Woman, Flash, Green Lantern (John Stewart instead of Hal Jordan), Aquaman, Justice League 2.

 

[Rockstar]

Gina Carano? bradley cooper? wtf. If that ever happens ill throw up. Jon Hamm would make a great older Bruce Wayne but a laughable Batman. .

You should read the Alex Ross Justice comics. They fit those versions of the characters perfectly.

Cooper as Barry Allen has been a popular choice for years.

Even Ryan Reynolds suggested Cooper for Flash.

Having 2 Supermans and 2 (or 3 counting Bale) Batmans in the same decade pretty much? Stupid. Confusing. ******ed. The general audience will always be thought of, and anything like that would make normal movie-goer scratch their heads endlessly.

The best idea at this point..if rumours are true that they're trying to throw out JLA in the next 3 to 4 years. Would be to just jump right into it after Man Of Steel. They can use Henry Cavill as a springboard, and everybody elses solo movies can be done after the team up film. That's how you make it simple, give Batman on film (by himself) some breathing room coming after Rises, and seperate it from the concept of Avengers.

It would be like if they did the first Iron Man back in 2008 & went into Avengers with a recasted Hulk. Whether that would have been Norton or Ruffalo. Introduding Thor, Captain America, Black Widow and Hawkeye all in the team-up. Then branched off into their own. Of course this is what WB/DC should do cuz it's a little different. If they ABSOLUTELY need to give us their Flash and Wonder Woman movies before hand then go for it i guess. As long as the character of Batman, Green Lantern (Reynolds or not), Aquaman and maybe Martian Manhunter debut at the same time .

Nolan, Goyer and Snyder designed "Man of Steel" to exist separately on it's own.. in it's own world.

For the sake of preserving that, I'd rather Man of Steel be kept separate.

There is no point doing the solo film build-up like Marvel did. It's too late for that. Warners want Justice League out by 2015 and Man of Steel was already finished filming months ago.


Audiences aren't that stupid. If Justice League introduces a new Superman, no one is going to freak out. Especially if the JL Superman is vastly divergent in tone and approach from the grounded Cavill version.

 

[DoomsdayApex]

Yeah... a 'hell no' to Carano and Cooper being involved in JLA.

 

[Rockstar]

She's the only one who can visually pull off the Alex Ross Wonder Woman in look and proportions.

 

[shauner111]

Just because Cooper as Flash is popular doesn't mean i have to enjoy it. And i dont "dislike" just because it's popular either. I'm the guy who wants Gosling for either Batman or Flash. I just don't want Cooper.

If Carano fits that version of Wonder Woman then i simply don't want that version adapted on screen.

 

[Rockstar]

What do you have against Cooper? He has good comedic timing for Flash and can easily bring some fun to the cast.

It's funny how him and Ryan were the finalists for Hal when they were perfect for Barry and Wally respectively.

 

[shauner111]

I like him and to be honest maybe my mind would change once i see him in a Flash movie. But for right now i find he's the go to guy for a superhero because of his looks, he's a decent actor but not amazing what so ever. And he comes mainly from a comedic backround like Reynolds.

Reynolds looked like Hal, he's decent but they could do better. He had too much of comedic approach. Even when he's trying to be serious. Not saying Bradley can't be more serious than Reynolds cuz he can, but i just dont find him to be that great of an actor plus it's one of those lazy choices.

You can say Gosling is a lazy choice too because he's popular and rumored a lot for these roles, but unlike those guys he's an unconventional choice for say Batman (popular but not 100 percent fitting like Bale was) and he's one hell of an actor.

Carano is just a stupid choice all together. She can't act but has the look. Big whoop. That means nothing to me. It's about getting the character and being able to give a good performance. I always say this..the look is a bonus if it's dead on with the character, but it doesn't even really matter. It can always be altered. Everything else is what matters.

 

[Rockstar]

I wouldn't go that far.

Justice League isn't going to be some deep Christopher Nolan movie. It's going to be a summer popcorn action flick.

Gina's acting is enough for this specific role. It isn't a Wonder Woman movie where the focus is solely on her, it's an ensemble piece.

WW is 50% appearance, 50% acting and the threshold for acting in this isn't super high. It's not like WB is laying the foundations for this to be an Oscar-calibur film.

This is going to be another internal project with every exec having their hands in the pie, like Green Lantern.

Reynolds looked like Hal, he's decent but they could do better. He had too much of comedic approach..

I really never saw the resemblence. Even in the costume, he looked silly with the mask on. He doesn't have Hal's square jaw or features.

Not that it was a big deal though... but he was cast to play Van Wilder in space... that was the problem.

You can say Gosling is a lazy choice too because he's popular and rumored a lot for these roles, but unlike those guys he's an unconventional choice for say Batman (popular but not 100 percent fitting like Bale was) and he's one hell of an actor.

Gosling isn't a lazy choice. He's just miscast as Batman.

Luckily, he's already turned down Batman for Justice League Mortal, and turned down Green Lantern.

This isn't his genre at all.

 

[shauner111]

You could of said that about Heath Ledger or Christian Bale or Tobey Maguire, etc before they ever appeared in a superhero flick. "It's not their genre". And don't say he doesn't like the genre because he's said he always wanted to do one of those movies but he's never been offered the type of scripts he could enjoy.

If it were just about casting Wonder Woman in this justice league movie only, i would agree with you. Just cast someone with a look for WW. But im also thinking of the solo flick for her origin story. It's something i'd like to see on film and it will happen soon. Her story, especially in some recent comics of her origin..lends itself to some epic scope ****. If done right. She's supposed to be a very strong character and not one dimensional, even if the casting on Nicolas Refns part was a little off (Christina Hendricks) at least he thought of a good actress who was also beautiful. The idea of friggin Carano coming on board would turn the movie into either a Green Lantern cheeseball failure or some rough and tough feministic flick that's all action with zero meaning. And crap performances.

It all flows into Justice League, the movie. So maybe im thinking too far ahead but i want good actors cast for each role not just look-wise.

 

[BestGirl]

I wouldn't go that far.

Justice League isn't going to be some deep Christopher Nolan movie. It's going to be a summer popcorn action flick.

Gina's acting is enough for this specific role. It isn't a Wonder Woman movie where the focus is solely on her, it's an ensemble piece.

WW is 50% appearance, 50% acting and the threshold for acting in this isn't super high. It's not like WB is laying the foundations for this to be an Oscar-calibur film.

This is going to be another internal project with every exec having their hands in the pie, like Green Lantern.

If JL's a success WB might want to make a solo WW movie, though. Whoever plays Wondy is going to have to be capable of carrying her own film.

 

[dnno1]

Justice League is already differentiated from Avengers in that they have different heroes. One strategy that Marvel used was to feature their heroes in solo films as they led up to the Avengers where they all teamed up. What seems to be a different approach and maybe a good fit for the DC heroes is to just get the characters out there in any medium you can (video games, television, magazines, collectibles, et. al). I still think that they should leverage the success and brand recognition that the Batman and Superman franchises have to feature their sub-tier heroes in films to get them exposure to film audiences. Rumor has it that there is some chance that Wonder Woman may have a cameo in the new Superman film for example, but you could go the other way and cameo a Superman or a Batman in one of the solo films (like Flash, Green Lantern, or Supergirl). That way you get the fans of Batman or Superman attracted to a character they would otherwise overlook.

 

[sethypants]

Now that Nolan is gone, the best thing WB/DC could do to diffrenciate Justice League from Avengers is keep JL seperate and self-contained.

Have "Man of Steel" be it's own franchise and "Justice League" be a seperate franchise taking place in a different world.


My idea is to draw inspiration from Alex Ross' Justice and Kingdom Come, and have two Justice League films build towards Kingdom Come (KC could potentially destroy Avengers in scale).



Ultimately, WB/DC could have the Man of Steel franchise (with Cavill), a Justice League franchise (with the cast I've suggested in my sig) and eventually launch a new solo Batman franchise inspired by TAS and Arkham City.


Those three franchises in place could be a box office goldmine for the next decade if done right.

I dun like the actor for Superman. I rather have Joe Manganiello

 

[MadVillainy]

I don't know why people.keep.ignoring the OP. IF THERE ARE LEAD UP FILMS HOW WOULD THEY DIFFERENTIATE
not how to make a self contained universe

 

[Sub-Zero]

the avengers strategy did a pretty good job with it: little nods to a bigger universe. but what was dumb was putting in random characters who really didn't need to be in teh movie(hawkeye in thor, black widow in im2,) in larger than average "cameos". I mean if they wanted to introduce characters don't give them meaningless parts in movies. dc has already done this with amanda waller. why was she in gl? don't do that for the dc shared universe.

 

[Rockstar]

You could of said that about Heath Ledger or Christian Bale or Tobey Maguire, etc before they ever appeared in a superhero flick. "It's not their genre". And don't say he doesn't like the genre because he's said he always wanted to do one of those movies but he's never been offered the type of scripts he could enjoy.

If it were just about casting Wonder Woman in this justice league movie only, i would agree with you. Just cast someone with a look for WW. But im also thinking of the solo flick for her origin story. It's something i'd like to see on film and it will happen soon. Her story, especially in some recent comics of her origin..lends itself to some epic scope ****. If done right. She's supposed to be a very strong character and not one dimensional, even if the casting on Nicolas Refns part was a little off (Christina Hendricks) at least he thought of a good actress who was also beautiful. The idea of friggin Carano coming on board would turn the movie into either a Green Lantern cheeseball failure or some rough and tough feministic flick that's all action with zero meaning. And crap performances.

It all flows into Justice League, the movie. So maybe im thinking too far ahead but i want good actors cast for each role not just look-wise.

If JL's a success WB might want to make a solo WW movie, though. Whoever plays Wondy is going to have to be capable of carrying her own film.

Not at all.


The problem is you guys are assuming the WB/DC plan for these characters will fold out like Marvel when clearly no evidence exists that this is the case.


Justice League will very likely be a self-contained franchise driven by the studio, especially given by the fact that they're rushing it for a 2015 release.


IF they ever do Wonder Woman as her own franchise (huge IF), it will be a separate thing.


In fact, I'm willing to bet this question will be raised today at the Man of Steel panel with Snyder and Cavill.... whether Man of Steel will be tied to Justice League (willing to bet Man of Steel will be a self-contained franchise).


Don't forget Snyder's previous response:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2uEgIONT2vo



The odds aren't really in the favor of a 'shared universe.' WB, in it's current state, isn't even set up to pull it off logistically. It's not Marvel Studios.

Nolan was really the only chance of pulling the franchises together under one direction, and that's over now.

I dun like the actor for Superman. I rather have Joe Manganiello

Ew.

I know WB will aim low with JL, but hopefully not that low.

 

[Joeyjojo72]

This is how I would do it:

2013 MoS
2014 Flash movie with a mid-credits WW cameo
2015 World's Finest with Supes and Bats teamup, and WW in 3rd act. Mid-credits Aquaman
2016 WW movie with mid-credits Martian Manhunter cameo.
2016 Aquaman movie with JL mid-credits setup.
2017 JL movie featuring Supes Bats WW MM Flash and Aquaman.

Im not a GL fan, and have no interest in a reboot. 5 members is plenty imo. If you disagree, just replace either Aquaman or MM with GL i suppose.

My setup seems to me to be the least risky way to go about it. A Flash movie would be by far the cheapest to produce, and if its successful and theres positive feedback on the WW cameo, you can proceed accordingly. A Supes and Bats movie is guaranteed to make money, if its done well, and you can give Wonder Woman a proper introduction and cement the tone for her movie.

The Aquaman movie is a risk, given the expense of an ocean-based production, but theres really no avoiding this if you're committed to the JL concept.

WB can of course hedge their bets by spreading this out more, allowing each film to succeed or fail before proceeding with the next one. In that case, we are talking 8 years before we arrive at JL, assuming none of the movies fail along the way. And they will probably want to squeeze in another Superman movie at some point.

 

[Skrilla31]

Hey guys, long time lurker and first time poster. Happy to join the discussion.

I think the one thing DC has going for it that Marvel doesn't in this case is that their characters are a lot more iconic. Superman and Batman are without a doubt the two biggest superheroes of all time. I know people are clamoring for a Justice League movie but if DC really wants to differentiate themselves from Marvel and not be looked upon as just a mere copycat, then perhaps they're better off just setting things up for a World's Finest movie. In my opinion, just having Superman and Batman in the same movie would feel like more of an "event" than any Avengers film. Not to mention they wouldn't be bogged down by the other, lesser known Justice League members.

The only other character with the potential to launch a successful film is probably Wonder Woman... because she, too, is iconic. But Flash? I'm sorry, the masses won't sit through a Flash movie. At least I don't think they would. But who knows. The same goes for Aquaman. Lol this isn't Entourage. No one is going to see Aquaman. The dude talks to fish. Green Lantern? Well that had all the potential in the world but it's gonna be REALLY tough to erase the 2011 film from people's minds.

Plus another thing. Batman is probably at his most interesting when he's not playing with others. I know he's an integral figure in the DC universe but he becomes a lot less engaging when he's taking on other-worldly threats and fighting alongside Superman and Wonder Woman. He's Batman. Batman belongs in Gotham City with The Joker and The Penguin, lurking in the shadows... not in some space station. You thought Captain America was useless in The Avengers? Batman is even more useless to the Justice League. Yea, yea we get it. Billionaire genius... sure. Next to Superman and Green Lantern, he's an ant. And I don't care what comic shows him holding his own. He wouldn't. Pure and simple. Keep Batman away from anything having to do with aliens. It's not a good match.

All in all I'm of two minds when it comes to a Justice League movie. I can see the pros and I could see the cons. But it's gonna be really, really tough to pull off.