Fox, The Infamous Studio, At It Again!

[Addendum]

And their movies don't affect me at all

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

If he didn't care...he wouldn't worry about our posts. But critically and financially along with the constant outcry of fans...something is wrong at Fox. Hell, even directors have said that they will never work for Fox again. Something is wrong. It is your opinion to think differently but you are in the extreme minority with that view. Fox has problems and it is affecting their movies.

I'm going to be honest - I get rather annoyed at all of the Fox-hate myself.

It's a movie studio. They produce entertainment. If you're not entertained by it, that doesn't make them some evil conglomerate. They just make a product you don't like.

Sure, directors might have problems working there. Guess what, I have problems working at my job too. I'll eventually find a new job, move on, and won't look back. It doesn't make the company that I work for some kind of evil. They have a workplace environment that I don't agree with, that's about it.

 

[chaseter]

Fair point...but if Fox is just another studio, why do we never hear these same things about other studios? People aren't calling Fox and Rothman evil for fun.

 

[Eggyman]

If they ever bring out a film I'd actually want to watch, then this might piss me off.

 

[SuperFerret]

I must be the only one who doesn't watch or listen to the Special Features or Commentaries.

 

[PWN3R]

If they ever bring out a film I'd actually want to watch, then this might piss me off.

+11 Logic points

 

[chaseter]

Eggy maxed out his points a long time ago.

 

[BlackSymbiote]

Well then I guess I'll just stop renting Fox DVDs unless Rifftrax (http://www.rifftrax.com) riffs a Fox movie.

 

[thejon93]

Guess what?
-Fox is serious about doing remakes of Daredvil and FF. They have to make new movies with these characters every few years because otherwise the options will revert to us. This point is kinda obvious but Im not sure people realise it –I havent seen anybody pointing it out anywhere. The mood around here is pretty negative about Rothman’s potential to execute these properties properly, (Im sure you know why it might be particularly negative at the moment) but we are all hoping his recent promotion will mean hes kept away from direct control of these movies.
http://www.aintitcool.com/node/40410

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

Fair point...but if Fox is just another studio, why do we never hear these same things about other studios? People aren't calling Fox and Rothman evil for fun.

Yea, they are. Fox and Rothman have done NOTHING even CLOSE to "evil".

People are complaining because it seems to be human nature to complain about what goes wrong, instead of being happy with what went right.

Perfect example is X-Men: The Last Stand. All I ever hear about is people griping about what was done "wrong" with that film, but nobody ever gives it credit for the things it got right (and yes, it DID get things right).

People complain, and people are sheep. So something goes bad, one person complains, and then everyone else complains about the same things because it's the "thing" to do.

I've been around plenty of message boards for plenty of different topics, and I see the same thing everytime.

It's one thing to be dissatisfied with a product, it's another to over react and take things like movies way too seriously. If you don't like the movies that Fox has put out, then don't watch them.

 

[thejon93]

Yea, they are. Fox and Rothman have done NOTHING even CLOSE to "evil".

People are complaining because it seems to be human nature to complain about what goes wrong, instead of being happy with what went right.

Perfect example is X-Men: The Last Stand. All I ever hear about is people griping about what was done "wrong" with that film, but nobody ever gives it credit for the things it got right (and yes, it DID get things right).

People complain, and people are sheep. So something goes bad, one person complains, and then everyone else complains about the same things because it's the "thing" to do.

I've been around plenty of message boards for plenty of different topics, and I see the same thing everytime.

It's one thing to be dissatisfied with a product, it's another to over react and take things like movies way too seriously. If you don't like the movies that Fox has put out, then don't watch them.

You got that from the guy who did the 'Watchmen' rant, didn't ya?

 

[Obsidian]

The only positive thing coming out of FOX seem to be its independent division, Fox Searchlight.

 

[Ghostvirus]

Fair point...but if Fox is just another studio, why do we never hear these same things about other studios? People aren't calling Fox and Rothman evil for fun.

Because the sheep run in packs, & they haven't migrated anywhere else yet.

I'm going to be honest - I get rather annoyed at all of the Fox-hate myself.

It's a movie studio. They produce entertainment. If you're not entertained by it, that doesn't make them some evil conglomerate. They just make a product you don't like.

Sure, directors might have problems working there. Guess what, I have problems working at my job too. I'll eventually find a new job, move on, and won't look back. It doesn't make the company that I work for some kind of evil. They have a workplace environment that I don't agree with, that's about it.

Hey look at that. You & I agree on something.

I must be the only one who doesn't watch or listen to the Special Features or Commentaries.

Nope I don't either. It kills that magic of the film if you know who the men behind the curtain are. Occassionally I will watch the deleted scenes.

 

[chaseter]

You two are right...

Here is a list of movies from the last 3 years that have been financial bombs and/or been bashed by critics and fans alike:
Fantastic Four1&2, Daredevil, Elektra, X-Men 3, Babylon A.D., Street Fighter the Legend of Chun Li, Pink Pather 1&2, Big Momma's House 1&2, Date Movie, Phat Girlz, My Super X Girlfriend, The Marine, Eragon, Pathfinder, Epic Movie, Live Free or Die Hard, The Seeker: The Dark is Rising, Hitman, AVP, AVP-R, The Onion Movie, 27 Dresses, Meet the Spartans, Jumper, The Happening, Meet Dave, Shutter, What Happens in Vegas, The Happening, The X-Files: I Want to Believe, Mirrors, Max Payne, Australia, Marley & Me...and coming up DragonBall Evolution, Bride Wars, The Rocker, Miss March...ALL SUCK.

All of those films have all critically sucked and most bombed financially. They ruined past franchises by ****ing them out for another sequel...Die Hard with a Vengeance...WTF happened!? They made Taken PG-13...all of that has only been within the last 3 years.

I guess director Mathieu Kassovits was crazy when he said this "I never had a chance to do one scene the way it was written or the way I wanted it to be. The script wasn't respected. Bad producers, bad partners, it was a terrible experience."

Alex Proyas must also be loony when asked if he was working on the Silver Surfer film: "Because it's a Fox picture," he said. "And I'm determined never to work with them ever again because of my experience on 'I,Robot.'"

They denied Cameron/Scott a chance to make Alien 5 because they thought AVP was a better choice

Under Tom Rothman, the studio had one of the worst years financially in its history last year. I wonder why? They wait until Watchmen was completely done with production and then they shoehorn WB with a lawsuit...how childish. I can understand wanting profit share but why wait until it was finished to try and get it never to be released? They notoriously chop down movies to fill more theatres and it affects the quality of the films.

Here is a list compiled from a thread here in the Misc. Films section entitled "Full List of Crimes by Tom Rothman" and other forums: These are not my words

Tom Rothman, is the current is Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of Fox Filmed Entertainment, the parent company of Twentieth Century Fox. Everywhere I go on the internet, when this guy is mentioned, it's always in a very negative light. For instance, under Rothman's watch, Fox's movies (particularly their summer blockbusters) are mandated to not run under two hours in order to fit in more theater showings (thus automatically guaranteeing more money).

Things that Fox under Tom Rothman's eye has been bashed for (as far as I know):

-Editing "Die Hard 4" to make it a PG-13 film even though the previous three, had been R-rated. This pretty much meant that Bruce Willis couldn't say John McClaine's trademark "Yippie-ki-ya, mother ****er!" line as it was fully intended.

-The mismanagement of the production for "X-Men 3". For instance:
Not waiting for Bryan Singer to finish working on "Superman Returns", and not having a replacement director until I believe weeks before filming was due to start. And when a director is finally hired, it's Brett Ratner, who has grown a reputation for being a hack, *****ebag, MTV music video, action director.

-Not waiting for several actors (e.g. James Marsden, Rebecca Romjin, and Anna Paquin) to take care of prior engagements before filming. For in the process, certain characters were "killed off" as a matter of convenience.

-Seemingly rushing the production as means of retailiating against Bryan Singer for heading off to make "Superman Returns" (which also opened in the summer of 2006).

-Tom Rothman also allegedly didn't want Sentinels (the gigantic, mutant hunting robots) appearing in an X-Men film because he believed that audiences would immediately think that giant robots appearing in live-action would be too "silly". This was of course, before "Transformers" (a movie for which Tom Rothman allegedly turned down) came out.

-Ordering Ridley Scott to edit his movie "Kingdom of Heaven" to make it look like a more formulaic action-adventure film, when Scott intended for it to be much deeper.

-Having "Daredevil" edited to make it appear more like a summer blockbuster (i.e. more CGI) in the mode of "Spider-Man". "Daredevil" was initially conceived as a more violent, R-rated film in the mold of Frank Miller's run with the comics.

-Not giving the "Fantastic Four" films a better budget, to go along with hiring Tim Story (who is primarily known as a comedic director rather than a sci-fi, action-adventure director) and aiming for a campy, cookie-cutter, sitcomy feel. Rothman also allegedly thought that it would be better for us to see Galactus as a cloud.

-Trashing plans for an "ID4" sequel.

-Browbeating "LXG" director Stephen Norrington until he quit the business altogether. Rothman also allegedly almost convinced "I, Robot" director Alex Proyas to give up filmmaking.

-Firing Hitman director Xavier Gans and going back to reshoot certain scenes with a different director.

-Painting a set piece of Wolverine while Gavin Hood was away.

-Trying to get Watchmen to never be released(This one pisses me off the most.)


Now these are my words again
I am sure Tom Rothman isn't all to blame for all of this but he has the final say being the head honcho there. So yes, we are all sheep who like to ***** at Fox with no merit or proof there of I would rather be a sheep running with the flock than being the one or two blinded by their wool to actually see the obvious and then get eaten by the wolves that are these rapers of cinema. All of that up there is hardly the least of it...I just got bored typing and finding most of that. I suggest you find equivalent examples of all the studios doing that much damage since apparently they are all on the same page and doing the same thing.

 

[K.B.]

All I ever hear about is people griping about what was done "wrong" with that film, but nobody ever gives it credit for the things it got right (and yes, it DID get things right).

The first 10 minutes (so from opening credits to when they leave the danger room) and Beast. Wow....two whole things.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

You two are right...

And all of that stuff makes him EVIL how?

The company might be a ****hole to work for, and create products that you don't like. That doesn't make them bad, or evil. It means they don't produce products that you enjoy.

For the record, I'm glad they didn't make an ID4 sequel. Sometimes, less is more.

 

[Nell2ThaIzzay]

The first 10 minutes (so from opening credits to when they leave the danger room) and Beast. Wow....two whole things.

Most of the characterization was correct. Killing Cyclops and Xavier and killing Rogue was out of character, but other than that, the characterization was pretty much on all the way around. The horrible character bastardizations were established by SINGER (Pyro, Iceman, Storm), not Ratner.

Cyclops dying in the Phoenix Saga was bad - but most everything else was actually rather good. Is it not comic book accurate that Xavier puts mental blocks in Jean? And that those blocks are destroyed, and the Phoenix eventually takes over? And that she becomes manipulated, and turned dark? Oh, but wait, the Phoenix wasn't a cosmic entity, and Jean Grey wasn't actually a clone with the real Jean Grey still underneath Alkali Lake...

Does Wolverine actually NOT love Jean Grey? Would he actually not try to save her by any means necessary, and even be willing to die for her? Yes, it would have been better to have Cyclops fighting for Jean, and I am still bitter over that - but to be honest Jean and Wolverine aren't out of character in the least bit (Jean never returns Logan's love, and she wants to be destroyed because of what she did to Scott - because of her love for him).

X-Men: The Last Stand did PLENTY right. People just hate it because:

A. It's "cool" to hate all things Fox
B. Certain things were changed from the comics (admitedly more drastic than any changes Singer made) and people refuse to get over it

I like it because:

A. it excels in certain areas that Singer wasn't too great at (mainly, epic events and action)
B. it respects the previous movies and follows continuity rather brilliantly
C. despite certain major deviations to the source, the overwhelming majority of the film is still accurate to both the source characters and stories, as well as the movie-verse characters and stories.

 

[Ghostvirus]

Now these are my words again
I am sure Tom Rothman isn't all to blame for all of this but he has the final say being the head honcho there. So yes, we are all sheep who like to ***** at Fox with no merit or proof there of I would rather be a sheep running with the flock than being the one or two blinded by their wool to actually see the obvious and then get eaten by the wolves that are these rapers of cinema. All of that up there is hardly the least of it...I just got bored typing and finding most of that. I suggest you find equivalent examples of all the studios doing that much damage since apparently they are all on the same page and doing the same thing.

The thing is I honestly don't care. There are way more important issues on my plate than whether or not this Rothman guy is screwing movies up. Why? Because every single studio is more or less producing sh** these days. I absolutely hate just about 90% of the movies that come out.

In the last year I have only seen The Dark Knight, & Watchmen in theatres. & I have a friend that works at the video store, so he tosses me all the new releases. I can honestly say that with the exception of There Will Be Blood, No Country For Old Men, The Dark Knight, & Watchmen. There have been few movies that have sparked my passion in the last 10 years.

The Movie industry is a corporation now. None of these studios care about nothing more than how beans are counted at the end of the day. The delicate balance of art & business is severly one sided these days. Make no mistake it is all about the cheddar.

These days more movies are basically directed by the producers, not so much by the directors.

I could keep going, but I am just going to say this. The main reason why this doesn't bother me is simple. I am 30 years old. I have a whole catalogue of movies that I love & adore. I don't need anymore new movies, but is something wants to come out & surprise me Like No Country, There Will Be Blood, TDK, or Watchmen. Then I am all for it. But like the Comedian in Watchmen. I realise that these days the entire movie industry is a joke. No just one company.

 

[Sam Fisher]

You see, Tom Rothman was a rapist in his past life, so in his current form, he is instead raping movies.

He raped Daredvil.
He raped Fantastic Four.
He tried to rape X-Men, but that ***** was a fighter, so it took him a few tries before the rape was successful (X3).
He sat back and watched Street Fighter rape itself (sometimes he just likes to watch).
He is currently raping Dragonball.
He raped Deadpool in a WOLVERINE movie, which I like to call "Indirect Rape".

And now, thanks to the 'word a day' calendar that Rupert Murdoch got him for Christmas, he has discovered the meaning of the word "reboot". This has caused Rothman to consider restarting Daredevil and FF, in a move I like to call 'double rape', or in F4's case 'rape squared'.

But Dragonball was already ****

I thought Marvel had at least gotten the rights back to Daredevil.

Apperently Tom Rothman wants a DD reboot.

 

[Eggyman]

All this sheep talk is stupid. Call a spade a spade. If lots of people agree, does it make them sheep, or does it mean that there's enough hard facts to warrant the disdain? I have no personal grudge against Fox; I was only calling it as I see it: they release a lot of sh**.

Sometimes people are sheep. Sometimes they're not. Sometimes when people agree, it's not because they are sheep, it's because they have reached the same popular conclusion because they have witnessed the same evidence.

 

[Sam Fisher]

Most of the characterization was correct. Killing Cyclops and Xavier and killing Rogue was out of character, but other than that, the characterization was pretty much on all the way around. The horrible character bastardizations were established by SINGER (Pyro, Iceman, Storm), not Ratner.

Cyclops dying in the Phoenix Saga was bad - but most everything else was actually rather good. Is it not comic book accurate that Xavier puts mental blocks in Jean? And that those blocks are destroyed, and the Phoenix eventually takes over? And that she becomes manipulated, and turned dark? Oh, but wait, the Phoenix wasn't a cosmic entity, and Jean Grey wasn't actually a clone with the real Jean Grey still underneath Alkali Lake...

Does Wolverine actually NOT love Jean Grey? Would he actually not try to save her by any means necessary, and even be willing to die for her? Yes, it would have been better to have Cyclops fighting for Jean, and I am still bitter over that - but to be honest Jean and Wolverine aren't out of character in the least bit (Jean never returns Logan's love, and she wants to be destroyed because of what she did to Scott - because of her love for him).

X-Men: The Last Stand did PLENTY right. People just hate it because:

A. It's "cool" to hate all things Fox
B. Certain things were changed from the comics (admitedly more drastic than any changes Singer made) and people refuse to get over it

I like it because:

A. it excels in certain areas that Singer wasn't too great at (mainly, epic events and action)
B. it respects the previous movies and follows continuity rather brilliantly
C. despite certain major deviations to the source, the overwhelming majority of the film is still accurate to both the source characters and stories, as well as the movie-verse characters and stories.

:I totally agree with you there.


You don't like Fox, don't go see their movies.

 

[Sam Fisher]

All this sheep talk is stupid. Call a spade a spade. If lots of people agree, does it make them sheep, or does it mean that there's enough hard facts to warrant the disdain? I have no personal grudge against Fox; I was only calling it as I see it: they release a lot of sh**.

Sometimes people are sheep. Sometimes they're not. Sometimes when people agree, it's not because they are sheep, it's because they have reached the same popular conclusion because they have witnessed the same evidence.

Saying a movie is a piece of **** is a opinion. Doesn't make it right or wrong. And have been around the internet at all? People will see something like the Fox bashing and jump on the bandwagon because it's the "cool thing to do". And anyone with a differening opinion is automatcally wrong to those people.

 

[Eggyman]

You don't like Fox, don't go see their movies.

Missing the point*

At least the point I'm making. The only reasonable way to dislike Fox is to view their films, otherwise how would you be able to say that you dislike them by judging them on films you haven't seen?

 

[Sam Fisher]

Missing the point*

At least the point I'm making. The only reasonable way to dislike Fox is to view their films, otherwise how would you be able to say that you dislike them by judging them on films you haven't seen?

This is what I have been saying. People are already bashing Wolverine even before it comes out. I can bet you that if that movie was at another studio, there wouldn't be so much automatic hate for it.



I said in the Tom Rothman hate thread that I was not going to boycott Wolverine and that I was going to judge Wolverine when it comes out, and you know what the responses I got were? "Well, you go ahead and support that crappy studio blah blah blah" and the same old crap over and over again.

 

[Eggyman]

Saying a movie is a piece of **** is a opinion. Doesn't make it right or wrong. And have been around the internet at all? People will see something like the Fox bashing and jump on the bandwagon because it's the "cool thing to do". And anyone with a differening opinion is automatcally wrong to those people.

How the f*** am I supposed to know why these people are saying what they're saying? I'm only speaking from my own perspective. I don't know whether the people saying they dislike Fox are saying it because they dislike Fox or because it's 'the cool thing to do'. I know I'm certainly not. I'm saying it because I've watched A LOT of sh** films released by them.

Do I have to write 'in my opinion' after all the things I say? I would've thought that it was obvious that this is all my opinion because I'm the guy who's writing it.

So because you get some people jumping on the bandwagon, that makes people who have come to the same conclusion by looking at evidence nil and void? Bullsh**.

Fair enough about the people who keep jumping on the bandwagon, I agree. People who can't form their own opinions and decide to just follow the masses are stupid. But you have to understand, you get that everywhere. It's not productive to bring it into a discussion because you can't prove who these people are - you can't prove if they have formed their own opinion or if they've just spotted a poster they think is cool and thought, 'Oh shizzle, I want to agree with HIM!'