Gotham Gotham Season 3, Episode 17 "The Primal Riddle"

[Guts]

GOTHAM'S MOST UNHINGED VILLAINS UNITE ON AN ALL-NEW "GOTHAM" MONDAY, MAY 8, ON FOX

Mr. Freeze (Guest Star Nathan Darrow) and Firefly (Guest Star Camila Perez) Return

Some of Gotham's most unhinged villains band together, while The Riddler continues his conquest of the city. Gordon is on a search for answers and all roads keep leading him back to the Court of Owls. Meanwhile, as Alfred begins to notice a change in Bruce, Bruce 2 confides in Selina (Camren Bicondova) in the all-new "Heroes Rise: The Primal Riddle" episode of GOTHAM airing Monday, May 8 (8:00-9:01 PM ET/PT) on FOX. (GTH-317) (TV-14 L, V)

 

[Ozbridge]

Spoiler

 

[Kathemy]

Wager: This is the episode that sends Selina crashing through a window.

 

[Arachnerd]

Promo:

[YT]xV0VM_uuWDw[/YT]

Spoiler

That last clip though. Full on Riddler. t:

 

[Kathemy]

This episode has received some pretty damn glowing advance reviews. I think my favorite comment was, “I want to marry this episode and have little evil, well-dressed babies with it.” Don't miss out.

 

[Arachnerd]

It's gonna be tons of fun to see Nygma go full Riddler.

 

[Kathemy]

Yeah, this is also one episode where I've gone into lockdown mode. I don't read the full advance reviews, I won't watch the teasers. For once, most of the episode will come as a surprise to me.

 

[Kathemy]

Written by: Steven Lilien and Bryan Wynbrandt
Directed by: Maja Vrvilo

Steven and Bryan wrote "Smile Like You Mean It."

 

[Sawyer]

Look forward to seeing Freeze back. I love the look, but I hope they develop the persona.

 

[Sithborg]

Oh damn, Bruce2.

 

[NotNickFury]

Okay, I'll admit to not knowing much about Catwoman's origin and such, but...is the whole cats licking the dead body based in any form of Batman mythology or is that purely a Batman Returns thing?

 

[Wildcard]

Wow, I can't believe they really just pulled a Batman Returns tonight.

Awesome.

Okay, I'll admit to not knowing much about Catwoman's origin and such, but...is the whole cats licking the dead body based in any form of Batman mythology or is that purely a Batman Returns thing?

To my knowledge it's purely a BR thing. I don't think that was ever a staple in the comics.

 

[Sithborg]

I did like the conversation in the car between Gordon and Nygma.

 

[NotNickFury]

Huh. Interesting. I mean, I know Gotham has been cherry picking from various incarnations and stories about Batman, whether comic, animated, or live-action, but the Selina falling out of a window is pretty specific to Batman Returns.

Sure, Jerome's voice was very Ledger-like, but he didn't go as far as do things like blow up a hospital or set a mountain of cash on fire. Don't get me wrong. I think the Batman Returns Catwoman origin makes from great visuals on this show in particular, but since it's so tied to that film specifically, having it done note for note here feels less like an homage and more copy and paste.

 

[Wildcard]

I did like the conversation in the car between Gordon and Nygma.

Same here, really nice moment for them to both call back to when things were less chaotic.

I wonder what happened between Ed & the Court after?

 

[Gold Samurai]

20% Nolan with the smart Lucius and maybe joker

80% out there wackiness/weirdness burton

Now carmen can embrace her full Michelle phieffer and trash her apartment/loft

 

[godisawesome]

Wow, I can't believe they really just pulled a Batman Returns tonight.

Awesome.



To my knowledge it's purely a BR thing. I don't think that was ever a staple in the comics.

I think the New 52 version of Catwoman had some variation on it, and that was under a very unpopular writer (Nocenti). Generally, I tend to find that origin stupid; Burton kind of got away with it by only barely using a supernatural sense for it with her nine lives, and because of originality for the time. At least Gotham!Selina already has the skills and attitude for Catwoman, so they won't go whole hog on it like they did in the movies.

It can work here, they just better not have her start licking herself and acting crazy. Concussed? Sure. But not schizo.

 

[Kathemy]

I really loved the episode.

I don't think they'll have Selina go all permanent "comic-booky" on us because I think they're happy with her personality as it is, and I'm not sure if Camren does eccentric theater well.

 

[<(o_o)>]

I really loved the episode.

I don't think they'll have Selina go all permanent "comic-booky" on us because I think they're happy with her personality as it is, and I'm not sure if Camren does eccentric theater well.

She will be watching Halle Berry's Catwoman movie for reference.t:

 

[Arachnerd]

Great episode. Love that scene with Ed and Jim in the car.

And I wouldn't be against Camren going full Pfeiffer.

 

[NotNickFury]

Okay, maybe it was all the makeup and the outfit, but I had no idea that Gotham recast Firefly.

 

[Kathemy]

This season actually looks like it's leading up to a FANTASTIC final stretch.

Both season 1 and 2 had rather messy endings. Here's to breaking the trend!

 

[Arachnerd]

Wasn't it stated somewhere Ben McKenzie also directed the season finale or something?

 

[Guts]

Huh. Interesting. I mean, I know Gotham has been cherry picking from various incarnations and stories about Batman, whether comic, animated, or live-action, but the Selina falling out of a window is pretty specific to Batman Returns.

Sure, Jerome's voice was very Ledger-like, but he didn't go as far as do things like blow up a hospital or set a mountain of cash on fire. Don't get me wrong. I think the Batman Returns Catwoman origin makes from great visuals on this show in particular, but since it's so tied to that film specifically, having it done note for note here feels less like an homage and more copy and paste.

Paul Ruebens played Oswald's dad on this show and he already played Penguin's father in Batman Returns.

 

[NotNickFury]

Yeah, but this isn't like Superman Returns where a lot of Lex's dialogue is lifted directly from previous Superman films. Plus, Selina's transformation is probably more memorable than Reubens character, and it wasn't just this Selina got pushed out of a window and that was it, it went as far as even having the cats resurrect her.