The Dark Knight I guess joker just applies make-up after all

[Keyser Soze]

I do have a theory, if it is simply makeup, as it why Nolan chose that.

The obvious is that he's trying to avoid what's been done before. The chemical bath, the "you made me!" theme was done almost to perfection by Burton, so Nolan might feel that there's nothing to gain in going down that road again. It's like when someone remakes a movie, they try to do something new with it. Problem is, in this case it's based on source material that people hold very dear.

But he may also be going down a new thematic road, one that's yet to be explored in a Batman movie (or ANY superhero movie, that I can think of). What if Joker is, literally, the ANTI-BATMAN? A "normal" man that transforms himself into something special, something "terrifying." Something to, instead of strike fear into criminals, strike fear into innocent people. A symbol of anarchy that criminals can rally behind, just like Batman is a symbol of order and hope. The makeup would work in a way that it is his self-made "character", just like Batman's cape and cowl is.

I do hope he is permawhite, but I can't say I'd completely hate the makeup if it led to questions like this, which I frankly find intriguing.

Great post. It's so refreshing to see something NEW actually be contributed to this discussion. This would be a fascinating dynamic, and a new one for The Joker too. I could very well see Nolan going down this route.

 

[deathfromabove]

i think you are diminishing the importance of him being a freak. the freak propels the madness, you're making the white skin sound coinsidental. also it distinguishes him from batman in that the joker's mask cannot be removed (but makeup can). his physical features match his psychosis- permanent, and askew.

what i am saying is, appearance is PART of the character, so removing one hampers the other.

he is still a freak. normal people might get facial scars but how many people have you seen with smiles carved onto their faces? he still has a permanant deformity. it may be a different type of deformity but its actually alot harder to hide than white skin, which could be covered by makeup.

well- if the rain washes off all the makeup, then we'll know that. i'm sorry- but to me, the joker is a freak, and not just mentally. i have no problem with his mind being explored, or even emphasized, but at the end of the day, he's still not like the rest of us in appearance, which elevates the terror of the joker FAR PAST a guy wearing makeup. not much else I can say about. the comic canon agrees historically.

so the rain would wash that smile off his face? i understand your point about joker not just being some guy who puts on a "mask" he can later remove. i agree completely. the scarring provides this, perhaps more so than white skin. like i said, he cant easily hide it with flesh colored makeup.

white skin as permanant physical deformity = scarred smile as permanant physical deformity.

its just semantics (and personal preference).

 

[Crook]

he is still a freak. normal people might get facial scars but how many people have you seen with smiles carved onto their faces? he still has a permanant deformity. it may be a different type of deformity but its actually alot harder to hide than white skin, which could be covered by makeup.

A scar in the mouth area is more severe than your entire skin being bleached?

The concealing thing could work in the winter time, since everyone's pretty much covered up. But what about the rest of the year, is he gonna put make-up on every single part of his body, every day? Not very constructive.

And it's been pointed out the scars aren't even as pronounced anymore, when comparing the newer pics to the first released shots. Which means they have the tweaked the design a little. Good for the purists who want a more traditional design, bad for the people that used it as a crutch to substitute the bleached skin as a physical deformity. It's simply not as prominent, therefore it dilutes the idea that this could turn him into a murderous clown, whatever his mental state was prior to this accident/incident.

 

[bgshw44]

A scar in the mouth area is more severe than your entire skin being bleached?

The concealing thing could work in the winter time, since everyone's pretty much covered up. But what about the rest of the year, is he gonna put make-up on every single part of his body, every day? Not very constructive.

And it's been pointed out the scars aren't even as pronounced anymore, when comparing the newer pics to the first released shots. Which means they have the tweaked the design a little. Good for the purists who want a more traditional design, bad for the people that used it as a crutch to substitute the bleached skin as a physical deformity. It's simply not as prominent, therefore it dilutes the idea that this could turn him into a murderous clown, whatever his mental state was prior to this accident/incident.

i agree that the leaked pics were not as sinister looking as regards to the joker's look compared w/ the first released pic. however, the pic on rory's first kiss has the same "look and feel" as the first pic. i prefer that look

 

[gillberg2k1]

I do have a theory, if it is simply makeup, as it why Nolan chose that.

The obvious is that he's trying to avoid what's been done before. The chemical bath, the "you made me!" theme was done almost to perfection by Burton, so Nolan might feel that there's nothing to gain in going down that road again. It's like when someone remakes a movie, they try to do something new with it. Problem is, in this case it's based on source material that people hold very dear.

But he may also be going down a new thematic road, one that's yet to be explored in a Batman movie (or ANY superhero movie, that I can think of). What if Joker is, literally, the ANTI-BATMAN? A "normal" man that transforms himself into something special, something "terrifying." Something to, instead of strike fear into criminals, strike fear into innocent people. A symbol of anarchy that criminals can rally behind, just like Batman is a symbol of order and hope. The makeup would work in a way that it is his self-made "character", just like Batman's cape and cowl is.

I do hope he is permawhite, but I can't say I'd completely hate the makeup if it led to questions like this, which I frankly find intriguing.

Uh oh! Look out! Someone actually gets it!

 

[sasquatchs]

It's pretty different to the standard interpretation of Joker, where he had no real choice in the way he is. Although it fits well into the born a sociopath angle that I love, so in that way it's not really a choice. If there's some truth to Joker bribing the mob to help him with Batman that seems to imply that Batman is his inspiration for all of this, the same as those vigilantes. I prefer Joker to recognise from the start that Batman is his true anthesis and enemy, rather than the motivation being something personal, so I appreciate that.

I've never wanted a safe film, he should have room to play as long as there's a point behind everything

 

[Carnotaur3]

I've never wanted a safe film, he should have room to play as long as there's a point behind everything

Good call, my friend. Let Nolan have his sand box. That's what he's hired to do. That is his passion.

 

[Keyser Soze]

It's pretty different to the standard interpretation of Joker, where he had no real choice in the way he is. Although it fits well into the born a sociopath angle that I love, so in that way it's not really a choice. If there's some truth to Joker bribing the mob to help him with Batman that seems to imply that Batman is his inspiration for all of this, the same as those vigilantes. I prefer Joker to recognise from the start that Batman is his true anthesis and enemy, rather than the motivation being something personal, so I appreciate that.

I've never wanted a safe film, he should have room to play as long as there's a point behind everything

I too like the idea that Batman hasn't so much created The Joker directly, so much as he has created The Joker simply by existing. Setting up The Joker as the anti-Batman in a manner that Paste Pot Pete described could make for some marvelous storytelling.

 

[Carnotaur3]

I too like the idea that Batman hasn't so much created The Joker directly, so much as he has created The Joker simply by existing. Setting up The Joker as the anti-Batman in a manner that Paste Pot Pete described could make for some marvelous storytelling.

 

[SuBe]

That may be one of the reasons Nolan chose makeup over permawhite (if he did) - to avoid repeating himself with Two-Face. Much like the Spider-Man villains (science experiments gone wild!), it can get redundant. Perhaps juxtaposing a man who chooses to look like a freak (Joker) with one who had no choice (Harvey) is what Nolan will go for (think back to Penguin's "you're just jealous cause I'm a genuine freak, and you have to wear a mask!")

Even though his performace wasnt all that great, ***** in Dead End did have it good when he said that similar line about not being able to take the mask off. I kinda hope that Joker in TDK is Permawhite, I will be ok if he is not, but I'm a traditionalist.

 

[JStorm]

Most of the times that I come in here, all I read is constant whining about the Joker and his "skin."

However, I would like to give PPPete a cyber-high-five. Nice theory.

Touche', good sir.

 

[FlawlessVictory]

I do have a theory, if it is simply makeup, as it why Nolan chose that.

The obvious is that he's trying to avoid what's been done before. The chemical bath, the "you made me!" theme was done almost to perfection by Burton, so Nolan might feel that there's nothing to gain in going down that road again. It's like when someone remakes a movie, they try to do something new with it. Problem is, in this case it's based on source material that people hold very dear.

But he may also be going down a new thematic road, one that's yet to be explored in a Batman movie (or ANY superhero movie, that I can think of). What if Joker is, literally, the ANTI-BATMAN? A "normal" man that transforms himself into something special, something "terrifying." Something to, instead of strike fear into criminals, strike fear into innocent people. A symbol of anarchy that criminals can rally behind, just like Batman is a symbol of order and hope. The makeup would work in a way that it is his self-made "character", just like Batman's cape and cowl is.

I do hope he is permawhite, but I can't say I'd completely hate the makeup if it led to questions like this, which I frankly find intriguing.

Great post. But I still think he will have traces of permawhite on his face and he will just fill in the rest with make-up.

 

[Rogzilla]

I too like the idea that Batman hasn't so much created The Joker directly, so much as he has created The Joker simply by existing. Setting up The Joker as the anti-Batman in a manner that Paste Pot Pete described could make for some marvelous storytelling.

Completely off topic but I once had an idea for an Elseworlds story of the on going battle between Batman and Joker, only to discover that Batman had accidently killed the Joker long ago and without Joker, he really had no purpose, so that combined with his own anger caused him to actually BECOME the Joker. He would still be showing up after the Joker's crimes and would not be aware of the fact he WAS the Joker.

Thought it might be cool but DEFFINATELY would have to be Elseworlds.

 

[sasquatchs]

I'm kind of surprised they didn't go with the mask theme after Rachel's lines at the end of Begins, although it's been covered before. The larger theme of Begins was inspiration and perception, that in itself is fairly non-standard. He's not been portrayed in film as a traditional hero before, and although a hero Batman doesn't seem like the best of fits for me, the reaction of a mundane Gotham to theatrical freaks is really fruitful ground to explore now. It's a battle for the hearts and minds of Gotham t:

 

[gwynplaine]

This is all for legal reasons, WB doesn't want kids to start diving into vats of chemicals to emulate their favourite character, on the other hand kids stealing theit mommies make-up, not a problem.

 

[Crook]

Shooting bank managers in the face, at broad daylight? No problem.

 

[sasquatchs]

Boy's putting their mother's lipstick on? I think the christian right would rather their sons fell into the chemicals t:

 

[Batman18]

This is all for legal reasons, WB doesn't want kids to start diving into vats of chemicals to emulate their favourite character, on the other hand kids stealing theit mommies make-up, not a problem.

You cannot be serious

 

[Keyser Soze]

You cannot be serious

I don't think he was trying to be....

 

[DeaDheaD]

Some idiot in a trailer park is gonna do it...........

 

[gwynplaine]

Shooting bank managers in the face, at broad daylight? No problem.

I was going to attempt to answer that

You cannot be serious

and that

I don't think he was trying to be....

but thanks for doing it for me, Keyser. (and why the dry face, I was just trying to make my fellow posters smile ? Even if I apparently failed why so serious ?)

 

[Knightsaber Priss]

Some idiot in a trailer park is gonna do it...........

And he'll most likely videotape it so he can post it on Youtube.

 

[CaptainClown]

ya once tdk becomes pretty popular we are goign to see tons of youtube videos of poorly done Jokers saying stupid crap and we are going to get a bunch of new users that say "OMFG NEW TRAILER"
and its them saying in a poor hamil voice you have been jokered!

 

[gwynplaine]

I wonder if we'll see the Joker apply his war paint ? I, personally, hope not. Too crowish, and it would also humanize him too much.

 

[DeaDheaD]

And he'll most likely videotape it so he can post it on Youtube.

That seems to be where all of life's lessons end up. Youtube