The Dark Knight Rises I really want to see Batman lose control

[Brother Jack]

You do have to wonder what kind of code of ethics you follow when you can torture regular crooks, but can't let a guy like Joker fall to his death.

Had he not saved him Batman would've done more than just 'let' Joker fall. Joker didn't just slip and fall, Batman grabbed him and threw him off the building and if he didn't save him it would have been flat-out, cold-blooded murder.

 

[Mr. Earle]

Wonder Woman does kill. She is a warrior, not a superhero.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Spider-Man doesn't. The Fantastic Four doesn't. Superman doesn't. The Flash doesn't. I could go on and on....

Superman has, actually, several times. Though, really, you want me to make a counter-list or something?

And ironically, Batman has also killed in the past. And maybe in Batman Begins, though I guess you could argue since he blew up the League's HQ before officially becoming "Batman" that might not count on account of a technicality.

 

[TheRookie311]

Im sure he will. He is on the verge already, nolan has set that up.

 

[TruerToTheCore]

In the first canon appearance of Robin, Detective Comics 38 (1940), Batman is very much in control of himself.

And the retelling of Robins first appearance following Year One, was in Dark Victory (sequel to The Long Halloween, which also follows Year One).

there's also "Year Three", which re-tells Robin's origin

 

[TruerToTheCore]

Wonder Woman does kill. She is a warrior, not a superhero.

Dumbest statement I heard today

She was clearly concepted as a superheroine, opposed to Superman to be a role model for girls. And no, she does not kill.

 

[mothy]

batman can be dark and terrible without resorting to hard levels of violence. it is the lurking in the shadows and the fear of his presence that aids him. that is the scary part. the fear of the unknown. taking on thugs one on one, away from the main group creates his reputation.

 

[Mr. Earle]

Dumbest statement I heard today

She was clearly concepted as a superheroine, opposed to Superman to be a role model for girls. And no, she does not kill.

Wow you go out and call me dumb when you dont know what you re talking about. Yes WW was introduced as a superheroine with a brightly coloured suit, but through the years her character has been defined and refined. Just like Robin was introduced as a comic relief sidekick and through the years he's been refined as one of the most important, tragic and serious characters in the franchise.

WW is a warrior first and foremost and she has no problems killing when the situation calls for it. She obviously refrains from it when she can but sometimes she just goes ahead. Like here where she had to kill this man to free Superman from mind control.

OWNED

 

[Mr. Earle]

As for Batman, yes he used to carry a gun back in the early years but then they decided to change the character and retcon the killing out. Therefore in comics Batman has never killed.
Now, i clearly saw batman lose control in TDK when he heard that Rachel was abducted, so i dont see why this thread even exists. He probably had to send the Joker to the ICU it seems because slamming his head against the wall is nothing to you guys.
And in real life, very few people would sit up and joke around with the cop after a beating that harsh. But Nolan had to show Batman lose control and have the joker healthy enough for an escape. Otherwise, in realistic terms the joker wouldnt have been OK after that.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

He lost it when he was interrogating The Joker.

 

[El Payaso]

As for Batman, yes he used to carry a gun back in the early years but then they decided to change the character and retcon the killing out. Therefore in comics Batman has never killed.

In the current comic history no he hasn't, but in comics he has killed.

Now, i clearly saw batman lose control in TDK when he heard that Rachel was abducted, so i dont see why this thread even exists. He probably had to send the Joker to the ICU it seems because slamming his head against the wall is nothing to you guys.

And in real life, very few people would sit up and joke around with the cop after a beating that harsh. But Nolan had to show Batman lose control and have the joker healthy enough for an escape. Otherwise, in realistic terms the joker wouldnt have been OK after that.

Very true. Batman did lose control and he did it knowing it was because of what Alfred told him; because he was unable to understand the Joker's mind. He couldn't stand that beating him would just make him laugh. Joker could have lied about having kidnapped Rachel but Batman still believed him... because he had something to lose. He completely lost control.

 

[david icke]

Had he not saved him Batman would've done more than just 'let' Joker fall. Joker didn't just slip and fall, Batman grabbed him and threw him off the building and if he didn't save him it would have been flat-out, cold-blooded murder.

No, it would've been self-defence, big difference. It's self-defence only if there was no other recourse, and Batman had the ability to try to save him from death, so to make it self-defence technically all he had to do was try to save him. If he had missed with the grappling hook, it still would've been self-defence.

 

[Darknightnomis]

Batman almost lost control when he was wailing on the Joker in the holding pin in Dark Khigt (love that scene).

Also I LOVE ALL-STAR BATMAN just because is so out-there!

 

[reservoirdog]

I'm going to get off topic for a moment, but seeing as how I started this thread, I think that's OK.

Isn't it amazing how pissed some people seem to get at certain suggestions. So far, many people have written this thread off as ridiculous and stupid and they don't even know why it exists. I'm sensing some anger management issues...kind of pathetic really.

Anyways, all I was suggesting was that for one scene in the next movie, Batman get pissed and savagely beat a child molester or something. But instead, everyone exaggerates my wishes and acts like I want him to turn into a cross between Michael Myers, Ted Bundy, and Dexter --wantonly killing and raping bad guys. Seriously guys, I really think one scene of him beating someone to a pulp isn't overkill.

 

[Rodrigo90]

Batman has got a short temper and good right too. But he doesnt take pleasure in beating people. Its a reflex for him to be violent. He does it cause hes angry. Not a sadist.

 

[Trooper]

Spider-Man doesn't. The Fantastic Four doesn't. Superman doesn't. The Flash doesn't. I could go on and on....

The only time Batman should seriously lose it to the point where he'll try and kill the villain, like in Hush, is when his mind is under the influence of something. Like that microchip Hush put in Batman's brain during surgery. Or one of my favorites, when Batman went psycho on Scarecrow's fear gas after it made him see images of Joker killing Jason Todd:

...pictures removed.

you know i was thinking.. batman screaming jason todd like that should be a clear give away that batman is bruce. i mean joker being smart as it is, should be able to figure out that todd was adopted by wayne, multi billionaire. am i being stupid?

 

[Mr. Earle]

I'm going to get off topic for a moment, but seeing as how I started this thread, I think that's OK.

Isn't it amazing how pissed some people seem to get at certain suggestions. So far, many people have written this thread off as ridiculous and stupid and they don't even know why it exists. I'm sensing some anger management issues...kind of pathetic really.

Anyways, all I was suggesting was that for one scene in the next movie, Batman get pissed and savagely beat a child molester or something. But instead, everyone exaggerates my wishes and acts like I want him to turn into a cross between Michael Myers, Ted Bundy, and Dexter --wantonly killing and raping bad guys. Seriously guys, I really think one scene of him beating someone to a pulp isn't overkill.

1) I am not angry.
2) You want Batman to beat up a child molester? He faces bigger threats than that on a daily basis. His villains kill people by the thousands. For him it would be like losing control over a cockroach.
3) And how about Batman losing control when the Joker is threatening to kill his childhood sweetheart? Why doesnt that count?

You re clearly the one with the problem because you made a thread asking for something you ve already received. And yet here you are screaming "i want batman to lose control over a grocery store theif"

The Joker pushed all the right buttons and Batman lost it. Just like he lost it when he lost his comicbook childhood friend Tommy Elliot and he nearly killed the Joker. Its the same thing!

you know i was thinking.. batman screaming jason todd like that should be a clear give away that batman is bruce. i mean joker being smart as it is, should be able to figure out that todd was adopted by wayne, multi billionaire. am i being stupid?

I dont know if he knew then, but he knows now. In B:RIP bruce takes off the mask in front of him and judging by his reaction he knew for a long time. And he just doesnt care.

 

[reservoirdog]

1) I am not angry.
2) You want Batman to beat up a child molester? He faces bigger threats than that on a daily basis. His villains kill people by the thousands. For him it would be like losing control over a cockroach.
3) And how about Batman losing control when the Joker is threatening to kill his childhood sweetheart? Why doesnt that count?

You re clearly the one with the problem because you made a thread asking for something you ve already received. And yet here you are screaming "i want batman to lose control over a grocery store theif"

Because molesting a child and stealing from a grocery store are equally heinous crimes......right........

Once again, my position has been exaggerated. I didn't claim that I wanted Batman to get mad and beat the crap out of a common thief.

 

[Mr. Earle]

No, you wanted him to beat a child molester. For a cop a child molester is a serious threat to society. For Batman, he's a mosquito compared to Ras, the Joker or Freeze.

So if a child molester makes him snap, then what will happen when he faces a genocidal villain like Ras?

 

[reservoirdog]

No, you wanted him to beat a child molester. For a cop a child molester is a serious threat to society. For Batman, he's a mosquito compared to Ras, the Joker or Freeze.

So if a child molester makes him snap, then what will happen when he faces a genocidal villain like Ras?

Thank you very much. Someone finally got my position right. I do want Batman to beat a child molester (or something equally heinous).

Since we can agree about what the point is I am trying to make, we can just agree to disagree about whether or not Batman beating a child molester is justifiable. =)

 

[Mr. Earle]

But for batman that's not so heinous because he's used to bigger crimes. Like people blowing up/gassing/freezing the whole of Gotham, or the whole world (Ras).
You re asking to see Michael Schumacher crash on his way to the grocery store while driving at 40 mph. Batman freaking over a common molester would be the equal of him losing his mind.
So just say so: "I want batman to go crazy". Read All-Star Batman and Robin.

 

[Hound55]

I think he's saying he wants to see Batman lose it over a lesser guy because the work as a whole has started to get to him... because he can "get to" the child molesterer, but is frustrated over a greater foe. That's how I was reading what he was saying.

I didn't view it as him saying he wanted Bats to go Allstar B & R on every petty crim that came his way...

And I still don't think that Batman lost it on the Joker in that scene. I maintain that he lost control of the situation and that all control was in the hands of the Joker in the interrogation room, but Batman didn't "lose it". He just went closer to his limits.

 

[Brother Jack]

No, it would've been self-defence, big difference. It's self-defence only if there was no other recourse, and Batman had the ability to try to save him from death, so to make it self-defence technically all he had to do was try to save him. If he had missed with the grappling hook, it still would've been self-defence.

It was not self-defense. Joker was not going to kill Batman and at that point wasn't even fighting him. Batman threw him off the building to stop him from blowing up the ferries, and again, if he hadn't saved him it would have been murder.

 

[Mr. Earle]

I think he's saying he wants to see Batman lose it over a lesser guy because the work as a whole has started to get to him... because he can "get to" the child molesterer, but is frustrated over a greater foe. That's how I was reading what he was saying.

I didn't view it as him saying he wanted Bats to go Allstar B & R on every petty crim that came his way...

And I still don't think that Batman lost it on the Joker in that scene. I maintain that he lost control of the situation and that all control was in the hands of the Joker in the interrogation room, but Batman didn't "lose it". He just went closer to his limits.

Maybe that's what he said. But that would mean that Batman is starting to lose it.
Personally i'd like to see Bruce lose himself into Batman, becoming more and more obsessed, losing his sense of humour, the little fun he has outside of his job, etc in order to be pulled back by Robin. But having him freaking out over petty criminals (by comparison to his supervillains) is taking it too far.

Buts its a personal thing. My kind of Batman is the zen, cool, focused one. The more balanced person that we see in BTAS (apart from the last season where he starts losing himself), in BB and in Morrison's and Dini's work.
I dont mind him going through darker phases and having to regain his composure and focus (he is only human after all) like in TDK, but in general i prefer a more balanced Batman.

 

[BestGirl]

Batman has got a short temper and good right too. But he doesnt take pleasure in beating people. Its a reflex for him to be violent. He does it cause hes angry. Not a sadist.

I think Bale said in an interview that he played Batman as a kind of controlled sadist.