I think I can tell you what the main plot is...

[EmeraldBeast]

The new stamps are Spider-Man, The Incredible Hulk, Captain America, Iron Man, Sub-Mariner and the Silver Surfer, The Thing, Wolverine, Spider-Woman and Elektra. Why did they pick Elektra, I have no idea.

 

[Sava]

I'm not going to dig it up, but at some point in this discussion, someone said he was only "slightly" stronger than the Hulk. I granted that they were correct, but if you're saying it's different, then I'll go with what you're saying.

well, it varies from being alot stronger to slightly stronger, its all really down to the writer, the basic thing is, Abomination can handle a normal powered hulk.

Well, let's be clear then. He's either sacrificing his life or committing suicide... two words with entirely different meanings. I don't think anyone wants to see him just running around trying to kill himself.

He's sacrificing his life, cause, i think this movie starts off a couple of years down the line or more. So, we can assume that all this time, he's been very close to finding the cure but failing at the last hurdle.

 

[Sentinel X]

You didn't; it was implied. Reference post #43 and everything thereafter on page 2 of this thread. People with like minds can disagree, but I see no sense in "suicide" ever. Comparisons to Jesus? Okay, but that's sacrifice - not suicide. Otherwise the same formula that's been used in every hero movie ever conceived - because it's the best story and Biblical, at that. Movie-makers wouldn't waste their time or money, otherwise.

Sacrifice: A person lays down his life for a friend.

Suicide: The ultimate act of selfishness.

Okay I don't really think people choose their charecters to sacrifice themselves because Jesus did Im pretty sure Jesus wasn't the first person to sacrifice himself. Sacrificing is something heroic; and no matter how much people say suicide is easy...its not, most people would've done it already

but i dont really think Bruce taking his life would be selfish. He's sacrificing his life to save others, the world even, from Hulk. As far as he's concerned, Hulk is everything he doesnt want to be, Hulk is what he think is evil. Ofcourse, we know Hulk isnt that but he doest, all he sees is the distruction and hurt Hulk causes to everything and everyone around him.

Indeed...Indeed...and INDEED!!

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

From what I'm getting Abomb will taste defeat at the hands of the Hulk and be back in Hulk 3 along with the Leader. Gotta pack my bags as I'm headed to San Diego! Comic-con here I come!

Thats good, Abom is Hulk's MAIN physical villain, so killing him off or giving him no chance of returning would be stupid IMO.

 

[Bannerless Hulk]

Okay I don't really think people choose their charecters to sacrifice themselves because Jesus did Im pretty sure Jesus wasn't the first person to sacrifice himself. Sacrificing is something heroic; and no matter how much people say suicide is easy...its not, most people would've done it already

Aren't we saying the same thing? If you go back to my post, it says, "Otherwise the same formula that's been used in every hero movie ever conceived - because it's the best story and Biblical, at that." I didn't say anything to the effect that movie-makers have always chosen to base stories off of Jesus. Basically, sacrificing your life for the lives of others is, in my opinion, the best story out there. And I was just trying to make the distinction between it and suicide with Sava. But if you're saying there are positive qualities to the story of suicide - because it's not "easy," as you say - then I firmly disagree. There is absolutely nothing good about suicide, no matter how you tell the story. It's selfishness drawn out to its sad, logical end and nothing more.

 

[Sentinel X]

Aren't we saying the same thing? If you go back to my post, it says, "Otherwise the same formula that's been used in every hero movie ever conceived - because it's the best story and Biblical, at that." I didn't say anything to the effect that movie-makers have always chosen to base stories off of Jesus. Basically, sacrificing your life for the lives of others is, in my opinion, the best story out there. And I was just trying to make the distinction between it and suicide with Sava. But if you're saying there are positive qualities to the story of suicide - because it's not "easy," as you say - then I firmly disagree. There is absolutely nothing good about suicide, no matter how you tell the story. It's selfishness drawn out to its sad, logical end and nothing more.

Yeah we basically have the same view but sacrificing (your life) is commiting suicide.
Suicide means to kill yourself...its just that people have put the connotation that once someone commits suicide its automatically a bad thing but thats not in the definition of the word but I see where you are coming from.

For me suicide from depression...yeah it hurts but when I think about it philosphically (no religous or moral aspects)...is being selfish really that bad?....but I guess that a discussion for another topic.

But over all I agree, I love stories that involve self-sacrifice of a charecter...but only if its done right. Therefore I guess I cant completely repel this 'cure' idea...if its done differently then perhaps I can enjoy it.

 

[Bannerless Hulk]

Yeah we basically have the same view but sacrificing (your life) is commiting suicide. Suicide means to kill yourself...its just that people have put the connotation that once someone commits suicide its automatically a bad thing but thats not in the definition of the word but I see where you are coming from.

I thought maybe we had the same view, but I'm sorry, I don't think we do. Sacrificing your life is not suicide when it's done on behalf of someone else. I think you overlook the "self" part of suicide and use the words interchangeably, when - if you look up their definitions or consider people who have done one or the other - you'll find they have really quite different meanings.

Look at it this way: Bruce Banner can either a.) choose to sacrifice his life on behalf of New York City or b.) choose to end his life because he can't handle the stress. One is selfless sacrifice; the other is selfish suicide. No one ever applies connotations to them, as you suggest; they simply carry their own meanings. One makes for a great story; the other makes for a depressing story. One is the outworking of good; the other is closer to evil than good. And we can know most of this without ever touching a dictionary or Bible because of our God-given consciences. But then, we can also allow our consciences to become watered down to the point that we can't tell the difference between such things. Bottom line: I wouldn't blur the definitions if I were you.

For me suicide from depression...yeah it hurts but when I think about it philosphically (no religous or moral aspects)...is being selfish really that bad?....but I guess that a discussion for another topic.

We could open another topic, but it would be better if we just settled it here. Yes, it is that bad.

But over all I agree, I love stories that involve self-sacrifice of a charecter...but only if its done right. Therefore I guess I cant completely repel this 'cure' idea...if its done differently then perhaps I can enjoy it.

I hope it's done right also. I kind of agree with those who think that maybe a cure shouldn't be found, but in the event that a cure is found (and come on... we all know it will be), I really like how CJ ties in the cure in this scenario:

The Abomination is on a rampage. The army can't stop him, nothing can stop him. Bruce, holding the cure in his hand, a cure he's been try to develop for year, looks at Betty, tears welling up in his eyes because he knows that this is it, there is no more serum, there's only enough to cure one. Knowing that the Hulk can't kill the Abomination because he has a similar healing factor as The Hulk, Bruce give Betty the serum and say, "When I knock him down shoot him with the serum." An epic battle rages on, Betty and Samuel Sterns look on waiting for the right moment to shoot the Abomination with the cure when the beasts slam into the shelter. There is a huge explosion. Sterns is thrown into a chemical waste storage tank while Betty is thrown clear of the shelter. Picking herself up off the ground Betty shoots the Abomination with the serum......................
​

We're just left to wonder what happens with Abomb and The Leader.

 

[weezerspider]

If it is clearly expressed as "The Hulk is a monster that is hurting people. The only way to avoid more deaths is to kill myself" than it would work, but if it is expressed or easily confused with "I can't take being the Hulk anymore. Poor me, I think I'll just kill myself" then that would suck and may end up worse than Ang's Hulk *shivers*.

 

[EmeraldBeast]

If it is clearly expressed as "The Hulk is a monster that is hurting people. The only way to avoid more deaths is to kill myself" than it would work, but if it is expressed or easily confused with "I can't take being the Hulk anymore. Poor me, I think I'll just kill myself" then that would suck and may end up worse than Ang's Hulk *shivers*.

I agree with Bannerless in saying sacrifice is not suicide. He doesnt want to die but gives his life for that of someone else. That my friend is the ultimate sacrifice.

 

[Sentinel X]

I thought maybe we had the same view, but I'm sorry, I don't think we do. Sacrificing your life is not suicide when it's done on behalf of someone else. I think you overlook the "self" part of suicide and use the words interchangeably, when - if you look up their definitions or consider people who have done one or the other - you'll find they have really quite different meanings.

Look at it this way: Bruce Banner can either a.) choose to sacrifice his life on behalf of New York City or b.) choose to end his life because he can't handle the stress. One is selfless sacrifice; the other is selfish suicide. No one ever applies connotations to them, as you suggest; they simply carry their own meanings. One makes for a great story; the other makes for a depressing story. One is the outworking of good; the other is closer to evil than good. And we can know most of this without ever touching a dictionary or Bible because of our God-given consciences. But then, we can also allow our consciences to become watered down to the point that we can't tell the difference between such things. Bottom line: I wouldn't blur the definitions if I were you.

No I understand the point you are making but we just seem to have a different understanding on the meaning of suicide. I classify suicide as anything were someone kills themselves (I don't see it as a necessarily bad thing) where as I think you classify suicide and sacrifice as two completely different things. We just defy the word differently

We could open another topic, but it would be better if we just settled it here. Yes, it is that bad.

Well I personally don't like selfish people but if I would have to take this on a more philosphical stand point rather than a moral one, no its not that bad. People are responsible for themselves and no one else; we do whatever we can to keep ourselves alive (in most cases)...so in reality a selfish person is really doing what he/she can to survive. Its just that society deems selfishness as a bad thing (I think its a negative quality myself).

I hope it's done right also. I kind of agree with those who think that maybe a cure shouldn't be found, but in the event that a cure is found (and come on... we all know it will be), I really like how CJ ties in the cure in this scenario:

The Abomination is on a rampage. The army can't stop him, nothing can stop him. Bruce, holding the cure in his hand, a cure he's been try to develop for year, looks at Betty, tears welling up in his eyes because he knows that this is it, there is no more serum, there's only enough to cure one. Knowing that the Hulk can't kill the Abomination because he has a similar healing factor as The Hulk, Bruce give Betty the serum and say, "When I knock him down shoot him with the serum." An epic battle rages on, Betty and Samuel Sterns look on waiting for the right moment to shoot the Abomination with the cure when the beasts slam into the shelter. There is a huge explosion. Sterns is thrown into a chemical waste storage tank while Betty is thrown clear of the shelter. Picking herself up off the ground Betty shoots the Abomination with the serum......................​

We're just left to wonder what happens with Abomb and The Leader.

I hope it doesn't go that way but Im pretty sure it will. Abomination will probably be stopped with the cure.

 

[Cracker Jack]

I hope it doesn't go that way but Im pretty sure it will. Abomination will probably be stopped with the cure.

It wont go that way, that's just my Fanboy scenario. The Hulk will put the smack down on Abomy and

Spoiler

the cure will be destroyed or lost

 

[Bannerless Hulk]

No I understand the point you are making but we just seem to have a different understanding on the meaning of suicide. I classify suicide as anything were someone kills themselves (I don't see it as a necessarily bad thing) where as I think you classify suicide and sacrifice as two completely different things. We just defy the word differently

Yes, but it's the meaning behind the act that makes it suicide rather than sacrifice. I don't want to keep this going too much longer, but I urge you to consider the voluntary nature of the two acts, sacrifice and suicide. One is done on behalf of someone other than yourself; the other is done only on behalf of yourself. In fact, sacrifice is so much broader a term that its dictionary definition doesn't say anything about taking one's own life. If the two words essentially mean the same thing, then it stands to reason that the definitions would come together in this important area of killing oneself... but they do not.

Well I personally don't like selfish people but if I would have to take this on a more philosphical stand point rather than a moral one, no its not that bad. People are responsible for themselves and no one else; we do whatever we can to keep ourselves alive (in most cases)...so in reality a selfish person is really doing what he/she can to survive. Its just that society deems selfishness as a bad thing (I think its a negative quality myself).

I see what you mean. But I would argue that, in the vast majority of cases, a person who is selfish is unpleasant to be around and the word doesn't just happen to carry a negative connotation with people for no reason. It's becoming apparent to me, as we discuss these things, that you would like to define the terms yourself rather than appeal to any concensus. Is that not a fair and accurate assessment of the situation?

I hope it doesn't go that way but Im pretty sure it will. Abomination will probably be stopped with the cure.

Awwwwwww, man! Why not?? It's a great story!! Seriously, I think it's great. However, it just occurred to me this morning that it would be Transformers all over again, only - instead of the Witwicki kid thrusting something into the adversary - it's Betty.

 

[Sentinel X]

Yes, but it's the meaning behind the act that makes it suicide rather than sacrifice. I don't want to keep this going too much longer, but I urge you to consider the voluntary nature of the two acts, sacrifice and suicide. One is done on behalf of someone other than yourself; the other is done only on behalf of yourself. In fact, sacrifice is so much broader a term that its dictionary definition doesn't say anything about taking one's own life. If the two words essentially mean the same thing, then it stands to reason that the definitions would come together in this important area of killing oneself... but they do not.

I agree with what you say...just that we have different views on suicide.
But yes sacrificing your life for anothers is much more different than killing yourself because of depression.

I see what you mean. But I would argue that, in the vast majority of cases, a person who is selfish is unpleasant to be around and the word doesn't just happen to carry a negative connotation with people for no reason. It's becoming apparent to me, as we discuss these things, that you would like to define the terms yourself rather than appeal to any concensus. Is that not a fair and accurate assessment of the situation?

I guess, for selfishness...I agree it is a negative quality that no one really likes but when I think about it, its really just preserving yourself the best way you can...which is what your brain is natrually suppose to do.

Awwwwwww, man! Why not?? It's a great story!! Seriously, I think it's great. However, it just occurred to me this morning that it would be Transformers all over again, only - instead of the Witwicki kid thrusting something into the adversary - it's Betty.

I don't know it can work but I'd like to see something different (I can't think of it right now but thats what TIH's creative team is there for, right? ) Whatever it is, I hope it is something original that hasn't been done in CB or SciFi movies before, although I understand that its really hard to come up with a unique idea for these movies nowadays.

 

[Bannerless Hulk]

Here lies post #71.

 

[Bannerless Hulk]

I don't know it can work but I'd like to see something different (I can't think of it right now but thats what TIH's creative team is there for, right? ) Whatever it is, I hope it is something original that hasn't been done in CB or SciFi movies before, although I understand that its really hard to come up with a unique idea for these movies nowadays.

Agreeing to drop/forget about the other part of this conversation. About the movie, Advanced Dark said something about them possibly cross-promoting Captain America to show the unity of the Marvel universe. If true, then I think that could bring something new/different to the movie. Not sure how they would tie it in, but it sounds like a neat idea at face value. Or maybe they could revolutionize the way movies are shown, like the new camera movements in 300 (which I never saw and probably would hate). But most people didn't like Ang Lee's "wipes," so that's probably not a great idea.

But yeah... hard to find something new or innovative. I think there's got to be some great story out there that we just haven't seen with the Hulk before. At the very least, maybe Louis Letterier can turn an average story into some movie-watching experience that engages our senses so much that we don't notice it was an average story. I'm thinking of something like Transformers.

 

[Kevin Roegele]

Agreeing to drop/forget about the other part of this conversation. About the movie, Advanced Dark said something about them possibly cross-promoting Captain America to show the unity of the Marvel universe. If true, then I think that could bring something new/different to the movie. Not sure how they would tie it in, but it sounds like a neat idea at face value. Or maybe they could revolutionize the way movies are shown, like the new camera movements in 300 (which I never saw and probably would hate). But most people didn't like Ang Lee's "wipes," so that's probably not a great idea.

But yeah... hard to find something new or innovative. I think there's got to be some great story out there that we just haven't seen with the Hulk before. At the very least, maybe Louis Letterier can turn an average story into some movie-watching experience that engages our senses so much that we don't notice it was an average story. I'm thinking of something like Transformers.

Ed Norton has re-written the script himself, so there will be some substance.

 

[HULKFish]

Thats good, Abom is Hulk's MAIN physical villain, so killing him off or giving him no chance of returning would be stupid IMO.

I agree... Although I don't think they'll use the "cure" angle on Abomination, I think the cure will be destroyed in the destruction caused by HULK and Abomination's brawl.

 

[SpaghettiHULK]

Deleted

 

[Judson Caspian]

If he finds a cure, that means no sequel.

 

[EmeraldBeast]

If he finds a cure, that means no sequel.

He finds a cure, but doesnt get to use it. Starting his saga all over again. Yes!