BvS Is anyone else not excited about Superman and Batman? I feel nothing but dread. - Part 2

[Dr. Thanos]

It's one of the things the movies don't do well to convey...Marvel humanity aren't afraid of mutants because of their powers...they are afraid of mutants because they are the next step in human evolution. Once mutants become the top species humans were afraid that they would be second or third class citizens.

That's an important point to consider. Mutants are a new species, which will one day replace humanity. "Normal" superhumans are just people who had a weird, one-in-a-million happenstance occur to them, which they say as less of a threat to the species as a whole.

It does bring in an issue, though: how does the public know which superheroes are humans and which ones are mutants? Some of them, like the Fantastic Four or Captain America, have well-known origins, and any mutant that goes to Xavier's school is obviously painting a huge target on their back. But how do you know Spider-Man isn't a mutant? I recall someone suspecting him of being one in a comic once, but it's very inconsistent with how actual mutants are always suspected of being so even if they reveal just as much as Spidey. How do you know Hulk isn't a mutant? Or Wonder Man? Or Captain Marvel?

This kind of thing can be explained with some reaching, but the X-Men have never really gelled with the rest of Marvel, and it's not just because of the prejudice angle. I like that they have their own movie universe. And you could make a dozen good X-Men movies before you even started to run out of material.

 

[regwec]

Let's try to steer this back on topic: by analogy with the Marvel stuff, do you think that the (movie's) public will assume that Batman, Wonder Woman and Aquaman are of the same species as Superman?

 

[hafizbat]

You got that right! DC heroes for JL own Marvel's Avengers, said it.

 

[Pickleweasel]

Let's try to steer this back on topic: by analogy with the Marvel stuff, do you think that the (movie's) public will assume that Batman, Wonder Woman and Aquaman are of the same species as Superman?

What?

 

[Llama_Shepherd]

Let's try to steer this back on topic: by analogy with the Marvel stuff, do you think that the (movie's) public will assume that Batman, Wonder Woman and Aquaman are of the same species as Superman?

No. I imagine by the time BVS rolls around Superman will have "had his story told" and that Batman is likely to be known as a man in a suit if he's been active for years.

I don't think it will be a factor with Wonder Woman and Aquaman. I'm not expecting them to be established until Justice League, at which point they'll be known as different human species.

 

[Reiter]

Let's try to steer this back on topic: by analogy with the Marvel stuff, do you think that the (movie's) public will assume that Batman, Wonder Woman and Aquaman are of the same species as Superman?

Not necessarily. WW and Aquaman could reveal their origin to people. However that could positively affect batman who could now actually pass as a bat monster and the mobsters will never get "wise to his act" because they live in a world filled with monsters, aliens and sea people.

 

[Reiter]

No. I imagine by the time BVS rolls around Superman will have "had his story told" and that Batman is likely to be known as a man in a suit if he's been active for years.

I don't think it will be a factor with Wonder Woman and Aquaman. I'm not expecting them to be established until Justice League, at which point they'll be known as different human species.

Yes, but he's someone who is part of the JL and those guys are gods. He must be supernatural too right?

 

[Dr. Thanos]

Let's try to steer this back on topic: by analogy with the Marvel stuff, do you think that the (movie's) public will assume that Batman, Wonder Woman and Aquaman are of the same species as Superman?

In-universe, I think that will depend on how public these heroes are. If the Justice League gets medals or whatever and shares basic information with the public, then sure I can see people knowing that Aquaman is Atlantean and Wonder Woman is Amazon. Otherwise they could definitely suspect they're of the same species.

 

[metaphysician]

All signs of an impending Marvel apocalypse. But no worries, the scorched earth of the MCU immolation will simply clear the way for our true lords and saviors in 2016. It's in Revelations people!!!

 

[KRYPTON INC.]

For the LONGEST time that's statement wouldn't have been controversial in the least and some could make the argument that it's still true. Stan and the bullpen's approach was to give the characters far more limits, weaknesses and foibles than the DC characters which were far more like idealized fantasy gods often capable of feats on a whim only Thor using his "Omni powered" hammer or the Silver Surfer were. There really wasn't the level of parity assumed today, as DC's big guns have been down graded or given more limitations over time and with reboots and Marvel has escalated their characters' power levels and scope of influence in their world. While there's parity with some characters from the start (Cap and Batsphysical ability and strategic and tactical prowess and Clint and Ollie's marksmanship being roughly equivalent) Hulk was not even in Superman's strength level, and probably still isn't. Flash was always a sci fi Mercury that would leave Quicksilver eating dust and still is. Looking at the films this also seems what we'll get. Superman in MOS looked to be far stronger and durable than either Thor in all of his live action outings combined or INCREDIBLE/A1 Hulk. If Aquaman and the others are to keep up they can't be presented as characters that an MCU Super Soldier could easily handle. Now I do hope Batfleck has some combat skill parity with Cap as seen in Winter Soldier.

Now, the question is why does this matter? I love GL. Love Hal, The Corps. the whole shebang... But as a character, and taking in the general quality of the stories from the start, Peter Parker's Spidey is a better character with better stories, trading marriages with the devil excepted. Do I generally think that in a serious fight that the full roster of the JLA would wipe the floor with the Avengers? Yeah, without plot induced stupidity or plot contrivances, yeah. So what? If this was about power levels Marvel's best seeling book would be THE ADVENTURES OF ETERNITY, BEING OF ALL THAT IS! I don't think outside of understandable story mechanics (i.e. You can't have Snapper Carr one puch knock out Darkseid) that those types of comparisons yield much when it comes to thinking about these characters.

 

[Boy Scout]

Let's try to steer this back on topic: by analogy with the Marvel stuff, do you think that the (movie's) public will assume that Batman, Wonder Woman and Aquaman are of the same species as Superman?

Yes, assuming they choose not to be forthcoming about their origins.

 

[metaphysician]

Indeed.Meanwhile WW and GL are regressing to C list stage....if they havent already.Lets hope JL changes that

Since when has GL *not* been C list? His only exposure prior to the 21st century was as guest star on a few Funimation cartoons. He barely appeared as more than a background cameo in Superfriends, for instance.

Iron Man, by comparison, was one of the main characters in a cartoon in the 60s, got a cartoon of his own in the 90s, plus various guest starring and team appearances elsewhere. He also was enough of a pop culture presence to appear in popular music, too ( "I am Iron Man" ). And he still was only B list.

 

[metaphysician]

It's one of the things the movies don't do well to convey...Marvel humanity aren't afraid of mutants because of their powers...they are afraid of mutants because they are the next step in human evolution. Once mutants become the top species humans were afraid that they would be second or third class citizens.

Which makes no sense if you give it even a moments thought. Mutants are only "replacing" 'humans' in the same sense that your children replace you. Humanity won't be second class citizens because humanity will *be* mutants.

 

[Joeyjojo72]

Actually my post was sort of one big eye roll. Oh well.

 

[The Endless]

I knew where you was coming from lol

 

[Joeyjojo72]

Thank you! Lol

 

[regwec]

Lol! Lol

 

[I Am The Knight]

Dc save us

 

[LaughingMage]

Urch I HATE that scene, hate hate hate it!!! Everything in that scene is wrong. From Costner's acting to Pa's characterization down to the very physics of what is going on!

 

[LaughingMage]

He doesnt go beat dictators in other countries because:
1) he cant enforce his will on other people and their countries if they dont want to
2) because of the real life ***storm that would emerge if there was a comic that said that it is ok to go to war and enforce your brand of government to other countries (who incidentally have oil. Poor Egypt and Syria dont, so nobody cares about their protestors getting shot with live ammo).

Oh come on, everyone knows the true reason. It's the same reason why Batman doesn't kill the Joker. It's because it is serialized fiction. If Superman would be a character in a medium with closure and a definitive ending then you can bet that all gloves would be off in terms of how he would take out dictators and prevent wars and all that. But since it is serialized fiction that represents a world reflecting our own they had to come up with a way to explain why Superman doesn't interfere... and it is a huge glaring plot hole when you think about it but for the sake of serialized story telling most people put up with it. Just like they do with the Joker still breathing.

 

[The Batman]

Actually my post was sort of one big eye roll. Oh well.

DC fans are acting like Marvel fans circa 2008-2011

 

[lc23]

Urch I HATE that scene, hate hate hate it!!! Everything in that scene is wrong. From Costner's acting to Pa's characterization down to the very physics of what is going on!

We get it. You hate the scene. Take a chill pill, Kefka.

 

[LaughingMage]

We get it. You hate the scene. Take a chill pill, Kefka.

No No No.. kill it with fire, nuke it from orbit, burn that travesty to the ground!!1111!!!

Gawd, I'd take the TF2 enemy scrotum scene over that one. It completely ruined MOS for me.

 

[Rowsdower!]

Good God. Overreact much? I don't like the scene either but to say it's worse than ANYTHING in Transformers 2 is blowing it out of proportion.

Also, Costner's acting is great in that scene, despite the absurdity of the whole thing.

 

[Bathead]

Urch I HATE that scene, hate hate hate it!!! Everything in that scene is wrong. From Costner's acting to Pa's characterization down to the very physics of what is going on!

Disagree. It's a perfect setup for the Zod neck snap scene.
"He who hesitates is lost."