James Bond: 007 - Spectre - - Part 11

[Vaibow]

Reboot again? and again?

like they did after Connery, Lazenby, Connery, Moore, Dalton, Brosnan??

and before anyone starts, let's not have the whole 'it's the same character debate' or is oo7 and james bond a code name.

 

[Lord]

I think though, continuity has never really been the series strong point - with each new actor you just go with what you are given/told, in regards to his backstory. CR was obviously a reboot. Where as other actors you feel are just reimagined as it were.

I have to disagree there, while the original Sean Connery films had some errors in between film, the 4 first ones had a very strong continuity, and You Only Live Twice to Diamonds are Forever still relied on a bit of continuity. Seein the Spectre arc progress during those classic films was one of my favorite parts of the series, it's only a shame Diamonds are Forever was so weak.

The Roger Moore films ran aimlessly for 7 films without an arc (besides Jaws reapearing now and then) and they were not stronger for it. I think the main problem is that they never realy plan their arcs well. Whenever a new actor comes in, i think they should make a 5 films plan or something like that, with a main storyline and possibly a non-related one-shot story to be put in between (a la Goldfinger and Skyfall, before Skyfall was forced into being part of the Spectre story).

 

[Golgo-13]

I disagree it left the franchise in a mess. There are plenty of good ideas as to how Bond 25 can play out. They never explicitly state Bond retired - and if he did, it doesn't matter. He merely drives off with Madeleine. They can twist that plot any way they like. And the 00 section was not dismantled, but it was going to be replaced by Nine Eyes. Bond, Q and M averted that from happening.

It was never explicitly said whether the 00 section was saved due to the apprehension of Blofeld and his plan. Denbigh still convince the intelligence community that drones was the way to go and that the section was outdated. There was no manipulation done there. They all agreed with his rationale. So as far as i'm concerned Spectre finished with MI6 being dissolved into that other agency and the 00 section aborted.

 

[Vaibow]

I have to disagree there, while the original Sean Connery films had some errors in between film, the 4 first ones had a very strong continuity, and You Only Live Twice to Diamonds are Forever still relied on a bit of continuity. Seein the Spectre arc progress during those classic films was one of my favorite parts of the series, it's only a shame Diamonds are Forever was so weak.

The Roger Moore films ran aimlessly for 7 films without an arc (besides Jaws reapearing now and then) and they were not stronger for it. I think the main problem is that they never realy plan their arcs well. Whenever a new actor comes in, i think they should make a 5 films plan or something like that, with a main storyline and possibly a non-related one-shot story to be put in between (a la Goldfinger and Skyfall, before Skyfall was forced into being part of the Spectre story).

That's kinda what i mean tho, each actor has his 'story' and it doesn't really cross into the next actors chapter - what i mean is, you can view as what has gone on before as loose history. You said yourself, Moore era never really had an arc or continuity.

It's not like they recast, but try and keep it really similar - thats what i meant by continuity - but it does confuse the issue with keeping the same Q and other actors.

 

[Warhammer]

That's kinda what i mean tho, each actor has his 'story' and it doesn't really cross into the next actors chapter - what i mean is, you can view as what has gone on before as loose history. You said yourself, Moore era never really had an arc or continuity.

It's not like they recast, but try and keep it really similar - thats what i meant by continuity - but it does confuse the issue with keeping the same Q and other actors.

Like Lord said, the first Connery films as well as Lazenby's film had a strong sense of continuity. The Craig films have share an even stronger sense of continuity as Quantum of Solace and Spectre are direct sequels.

The films between Moore's first film and Brosnan's last have a loose continuity, but a continuity none the less. There are references all throughout. Moore's Bond visits Tracy Bond's grave is the one that kills Blofeld (albeit, in a throwaway scene). Brosnan's Bond references the jetpack from From Russia With Love. It's all connected and it's the same dude. Casino Royale is the only film that firmly established that it was a reboot. Bond films #2 through #20 are all sequels.

 

[Vaibow]

Like Lord said, the first Connery films as well as Lazenby's film had a strong sense of continuity. The Craig films have share an even stronger sense of continuity as Quantum of Solace and Spectre are direct sequels.

The films between Moore's first film and Brosnan's last have a loose continuity, but a continuity none the less. There are references all throughout. Moore's Bond visits Tracy Bond's grave is the one that kills Blofeld (albeit, in a throwaway scene). Brosnan's Bond references the jetpack from From Russia With Love. It's all connected and it's the same dude. Casino Royale is the only film that firmly established that it was a reboot. Bond films #2 through #20 are all sequels.

Same difference, it's just you reworded it different. It's all loose history. You cannot possibly expect Brosnan's and Moore's to be the same time line.

Anyways - any word on why the studio will do next and does Craig have a busy schedule?

 

[Kahran Ramsus]

That's kinda what i mean tho, each actor has his 'story' and it doesn't really cross into the next actors chapter - what i mean is, you can view as what has gone on before as loose history. You said yourself, Moore era never really had an arc or continuity.

They don't have arcs, but they do have continuity. For example, Bond is introduced to Frederick Gray and General Gogol in The Spy Who Loved Me and they remain Bond allies into the Dalton films.

 

[AnneFan]

It was never explicitly said whether the 00 section was saved due to the apprehension of Blofeld and his plan. Denbigh still convince the intelligence community that drones was the way to go and that the section was outdated. There was no manipulation done there. They all agreed with his rationale. So as far as i'm concerned Spectre finished with MI6 being dissolved into that other agency and the 00 section aborted.

With Denbigh exposed, I'd say it's a safe bet Nine Eyes was never implemented. Bombing South Africa to convince them to sign up isn't going to go down well. Without a suitable replacement, the 00 section would still be there. Maybe still at risk with it's future still debated by 'the powers that be', but nonetheless, still operational.

 

[Vaibow]

They don't have arcs, but they do have continuity. For example, Bond is introduced to Frederick Gray and General Gogol in The Spy Who Loved Me and they remain Bond allies into the Dalton films.

Sorry to keep on, but i think with that as an example, is it builds a world, in one movie and then uses it as cannon - i guess also the books are source material to, but what i am saying.... agh it's cool... i know what i mean, probably just not expressing it well.

I still would love to see a younger Bond, as he gets tapped up by the government - his first missions, then his first kills, how it effects him - basically the bond we saw in CR, i would have liked to have seen one, maybe two films pre CR era - where it doesn't have all the expected bond elements, but alluded to them - that's why i loved Cr so much, it was building this world we have known, but wondered how he got there. Don't get me wrong, i don't want James Bond Jnr, but i do want to see Bond on his first mission, working alongside a oo agent, learning, maybe being cocky, getting put down a peg or two, his motivations for wanting that specific job, to being a oo etc. His relationships from his Navy days, having to move on in life when people die etc.

Someone once said, what's the point in a pre oo film where he doesn't kill - i say just because he doesn't have a license to kill, doesn't men there aren't fatalities at least, not directly by him. It would be a good opportunity to see his intellect etc.

 

[elgaz]

I wouldn't mind seeing Craig back as Bond for one more. And after that, I'd like to see Henry Cavill get the job. Cavill already has the looks and charm for the role, and he'll be hitting late 30s at that point so will have enough maturity also to make it believable that he's a 00 agent with considerable field experience.

Hard to know where they'll go with the storyline after Spectre. CR felt very fresh and different, QOS felt like it lacked any meat by comparison. I loved Skyfall, but both it and Spectre were fairly personal films for Bond in terms of storyline - both are exploring his roots (his ancestral home in Skyfall, and elements of his childhood in Spectre) and both have characters (in the form of M and Blofeld) with emotional ties to Bond. I think the next film actually needs to be less personal. I liked it when Bond had more of air of mystery about him - as in, we don't always need to know what made him into the cold killer he is.

 

[DarkKnight88]

Definitely want to see Daniel Craig for one last ride. He's the best Bond since Connery and thus should go out in a great movie.

I doubt they're looking at Cavill. He's already Superman so they probably want their Bond associated solely with them. Like Craig, I bet their choice will be a controversial one that shocks people.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Yeah I want Craig and Mendes back for one more, then go with someone else, just complete the Craig arc with a movie more people liked. I really enjoyed Spectre personally, but I think Blofield and Bond need a final showdown to end their rivalry.

 

[Golgo-13]

I think Mendes' run is done. I don't want him rehashing the music from Skyfall..yet again......

 

[Gold Samurai]

He was a one hit wonder. Paying homage to Nolan only got him so far.

 

[Tacit Ronin]

He was only paying homage to Bond film history in Spectre though.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

I think Mendes' run is done. I don't want him rehashing the music from Skyfall..yet again......

I would like him to do one more personally.

 

[A Necessary Evil]

I think Mendes' run is done. I don't want him rehashing the music from Skyfall..yet again......

The re-use of Skyfall's score is GREATLY exaggerated. On the entire soundtrack album, there are a few variations and reprisals of themes- yes...but considering 10/10 returning composers use existing music and bring it back in the sequels, I don't understand what is so controversial about SPECTRE doing it....also, Mendes is the director, not composer. That would be Newman.

 

[Supernova]

Tried watching this again since seeing it in the theater and It still just didn't work for me personally. very boring and forgettable like most weak bond films.

 

[Marvolo]

I think Mendes' run is done. I don't want him rehashing the music from Skyfall..yet again......

Yeah because none of the previous Bond composers ever reused and developed themes and leitmotifs in more than one film.

This is an ongoing series. Carrying musical themes and beats through the series isnt a bad thing.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Yeah because none of the previous Bond composers ever reused and developed themes and leitmotifs in more than one film.

This is an ongoing series. Carrying musical themes and beats through the series isnt a bad thing.

if anything it adds to the experience, I love hearing familiar music in sequels.

 

[Golgo-13]

The re-use of Skyfall's score is GREATLY exaggerated. On the entire soundtrack album, there are a few variations and reprisals of themes- yes...but considering 10/10 returning composers use existing music and bring it back in the sequels, I don't understand what is so controversial about SPECTRE doing it....also, Mendes is the director, not composer. That would be Newman.

Ah, you go realize that the director is the one who likely chooses what music goes in their movie, right?

Yeah because none of the previous Bond composers ever reused and developed themes and leitmotifs in more than one film.

For example? I can't think of one other set of Bond movies where the music was re-used in such a lazy way.

This is an ongoing series. Carrying musical themes and beats through the series isnt a bad thing.

To each his/her own. The re-use of 'Grand Bazaar, Istanbul' track completely took me out of the action sequences.

 

[Dave McFly]

I loved the movie but I HATED the opening theme song if it had a better song I would have given it a strong 9/10 but as of now 8 tops

 

[Chesterfield]

People still championing cavill can keep on dreaming. He'll never be Bond.

 

[TheVileOne]

Tom Hardy will also never be Bond.

 

[Roose Bolton]

I couldn't see Hardy, even if he was younger and not as well known, taking on the sort of public persona required to be James Bond. At the best of times he's very skittish with interviews and that aspect of filmmaking.