James Bond: 007 - Spectre - Part 5

[Roose Bolton]

He'd still be British, so nothing truly changes. Same would go for Spidey, Supes, etc.

Nothing "truly" changes? It cuts out a big part of who he is and reduces him as a unique character. It makes him a broad outline of a spy and not the man Ian Fleming created.

 

[Silvermoth]

Why? If you can change one aspect of a character surely you can change another.

Theres so few really great british superhero type roles so I definitely think something would be lost if he suddenly became american for example

No im sorry but as a black british guy i want bond to stay white. Hollywood need to stop race swapping everything. It brings unessary heat on black people and negativity, just because a few folks want to upset the established order, just because these roles are swapping for black roles don't think we are jumping for joy with this pc bullcrap. Minor roles don't really bother me as is the case with moneypenny(that still caused the boat to rock) some of you that want a black bond have lost your damn mind.

Um yes comments like these are exactly why we need more diverse casting options.

I mean seriously? "The established order"? That's just creepy

 

[craigdbfan]

I would be equally as furious if they decided to make Spawn white. Race isn't "important" to the character in the most technical sense but if they make him White, Asian, Hispanic (even a black Hispanic actor) etc it completely kills the character for me.

While anyone of any race could play a highly trained CIA agent who then questions the morality of his job but finds out too late in death/hell, it just wouldn't be Al Simmons/Spawn to me, no matter how they try to color it (no pun intended). Not just any "black" either but an African-American male. I don't know, I'm just super anal when it comes to things like this.

By the way Spawn needs a new film.

 

[Daywalker89]

All of this! In light of the last five years ranging from Oscar Grant to Trayvon Martin to the recent Mike Brown and Eric Garner, the world really hasn't changed so why must Hollywood promote a lie when the suits in charge are just as racist as the criminals who got away with these four noted deaths above.

In the end, EON's not going to dance to that tune regardless of a certain airhead executive and those who just love the idea of their flavor of the moment playing a specific iconic role (see Michael B. Jordan). Speaking as an African American male, I want more new characters of color, not racebend the canonical ones and pretend to be progressive, same with genderswapping; with the latter, I side-eye Marvel's animation division for Petra Parker for USM's Spider-Verse episodes when the could've used Mayday/Spider-Girl. Same goes for Doctor Who regarding the recent drastic change to the Master (and with 0 reason in story as to why just so Steven Moffat can give the two finger salute to his feminist critics and with using Michelle Gomez to do it no doubt).

Want to be progressive? Just give us new orginal POC characters and stop taking the lazy route; its cheating.

Well said brother, just to say im actually black british as my OP comes off abit heavly one sided if it was written by a caucasion person.I just wanted to give an opinion from the other side to all this race swapping as the majority think black people in general are jumping for joy over these changes, as i said my black circle of friends and family don't like what's going on. It's as simple as that.

 

[Daywalker89]

Um yes comments like these are exactly why we need more diverse casting options.

I mean seriously? "The established order"? That's just creepy

No it really isn't mate. Ive highlighted why this is wrong as clearly as i can. Ive told it from a black person's point of view and laid it on the floor. Some guys on here may be thinking " why is he putting down his race like that " but at the end of the day it does not pay tribute to the source material, the way ian fleming wrote bond. He did not tell the story from a black person's POV. People in general see the world differently and i for one don't like all the whitewashing,blackwashing crap thats happening in films. Ive been vocal about annie and FF also a few of the anime's that have been done with a white cast when it should be a japanese cast. Its not right ,there's an agenda to it.

 

[craigdbfan]

No it really isn't mate. Ive highlighted why this is wrong as clearly as i can. Ive told it from a black person's point of view and laid it on the floor. Some guys on here may be thinking " why is he putting down his race like that " but at the end of the day it does not pay tribute to the source material, the way ian fleming wrote bond. He did not tell the story from a black person's POV. People in general see the world differently and i for one don't like all the whitewashing,blackwashing crap thats happening in films. Ive been vocal about annie and FF also a few of the anime's that have been done with a white cast when it should be a japanese cast. Its not right ,there's an agenda to it.

This is the unfiltered truth.

Anyone who has been around here a bit should know how I completely tore the Akira adaptation that WB was planning from the ground up. It was a goddamn abomination.

 

[DarthDorranceBane]

we need to break the law because it is the established order.

 

[The Endless]

Wouldn't making Bond black be kinda patronising anyway? Like throwing black people a bone? Why cast Elba as Bond when they can create an original character specifically for him?

Changing the characters skin colour is a superficial change. Why not create a black character from the ground up with his own unique traits and background?

 

[Donut]

Why cast Elba as Bond when they can create an original character specifically for him?

That would require Hollywood 2 use their brain & they don't like thinking

 

[DKDetective]

When is the last time that Bond's class played a major role in these films? Because it certainly hasn't during the Brosnan/Craig eras. There's nothing in Brosnan or Craig's Bond that scream's "I need to be a white guy."

Every ****ing time either one of them orders a drink or opens their mouth. The character's class comes through in his snobbery, way he ties his tie, and accent at very least. Just the basic way the character carries himself in essence. And no, that sort of snobbery can't be explained based on the character simply liking nice things. There is more to it than that as anyway who has ever watched Downtown Abbey or read one of Jane Austen's comedies of manners well knows.

EDIT:
Also, anyone who says that Bond can be any race because Britain has been multiracial long enough now has absolutely no understanding of history and historic prejudice. Minority Britons do not have the sort of long history of both presence and affluence in the country that is incumbent in Bond's character, like being descended from Sir Thomas Bond of the 17th century or being educated in places like Eton and Fettes back in the day. Those were not inclusive schools.

 

[Mr_336]

That would require Hollywood 2 use their brain & they don't like thinking

Yup and the leaked e-mails confirmed that.

 

[chamber-music]

Lol, there have been enough different ethic backgrounds in Britain for years now that it doesn't make a difference.

I mean at the end of the day, Bond is a bloody scott, so you could even argue he aint a brit! :b

Scotland is a part of Britain. Britain is not only England.

Bond's mother being Swiss and him spending most of his early years overseas in continental Europe before his parent's death would be a better example

 

[Hunter Rider]

ANNOUNCEMENT!

Sorry to make this guys but just a heads up not to post any set pics.

 

[terry78]

Sigh, it's like reading a book without pictures. My attention span can't take it.

 

[StevieNicks1988]

With an increasing number of white actors out there screaming potentially good Bond; Dan Stevens, Tom Hardy, James Frecheville (who looks almost TOO MUCH like a Fleming/Bond) it's pretty much positive discrimination and calculated marketing aimed at an untapped ethnic audience to cast a black man who'll be too old when the time comes.

The character has no ethnic relevance or story to tell, so the approach would be to not really play on the color of the mans skin, but rather that the color doesn't matter, which makes you ask 'why cast a black Bond at all, then if color doesn't matter? Why shake the pot at all if you're not trying to prove a point?'


We literally JUST got back to Fleming's Bond with the Craig era, the way Bond is supposed to be with the likes of Casino Royale and it's not just critically successfully, it's MAJORLY financially successful as well so why take that big of a risk?


The answer doesn't come down to "Elba is a great actor. Period." It is marketing/finance departments doing research that may or may not suggest a potential increase in revenue by tapping into that marginalized ethnic audience, i.e. good old fashioned greed. Movie execs sure know how to kill a franchise rather by changing the characters in unnecessary ways or running it completely into the ground.


Here's the real issue; why the hell can't a character just be the character the way it was intended to be anymore? Why does everything suddenly need to be 'updated' or 'changed' when there is absolutely nothing wrong with them in the first place? Change just for the sake of change urks me off more than anything else in this 'debate'.

 

[Jason Kane]

With an increasing number of white actors out there screaming potentially good Bond; Dan Stevens, Tom Hardy, James Frecheville (who looks almost TOO MUCH like a Fleming/Bond) it's pretty much positive discrimination and calculated marketing aimed at an untapped ethnic audience to cast a black man who'll be too old when the time comes.

The character has no ethnic relevance or story to tell, so the approach would be to not really play on the color of the mans skin, but rather that the color doesn't matter, which makes you ask 'why cast a black Bond at all, then if color doesn't matter? Why shake the pot at all if you're not trying to prove a point?'


We literally JUST got back to Fleming's Bond with the Craig era, the way Bond is supposed to be with the likes of Casino Royale and it's not just critically successfully, it's MAJORLY financially successful as well so why take that big of a risk?


The answer doesn't come down to "Elba is a great actor. Period." It is marketing/finance departments doing research that may or may not suggest a potential increase in revenue by tapping into that marginalized ethnic audience, i.e. good old fashioned greed. Movie execs sure know how to kill a franchise rather by changing the characters in unnecessary ways or running it completely into the ground.


Here's the real issue; why the hell can't a character just be the character the way it was intended to be anymore? Why does everything suddenly need to be 'updated' or 'changed' when there is absolutely nothing wrong with them in the first place? Change just for the sake of change urks me off more than anything else in this 'debate'.

Ditto on Frenchville. He definitely look as if Bond walked off the pages of Fleming's books.

And double ditto to the 4th paragraph. Its that old fashioned greed that put Sony in the financial doghouse in the first place with their fling crap on the wall to see if it sticks approach which compared to the WB's similar approach during the 2004-2010 period (i.e. Catwoman, Constantine, Superman Returns, & Jonah Hex) look like a labor of love. That's not saying much for either studio

 

[Black Narcissus]

Black Bond stand up!

 

[Jason Kane]

Black Bond stand up!

Put down the mushrooms.

 

[cronosred]

Black Bond stand up!

And wave your hands in the air.

 

[vanson]

ANNOUNCEMENT!

Sorry to make this guys but just a heads up not to post any set pics.

why is that ? there are other movies who have threads solely devoted to posting set pictures ..

 

[Black Narcissus]

Put down the mushrooms.

Oh, I'll be there when you rage.

--------------------------

I will rewatch On Her Majesty's Secret Service.

 

[The Batman]

Um yes comments like these are exactly why we need more diverse casting options.

I mean seriously? "The established order"? That's just creepy

Most of the arguments against Idris as Bond are baffling. Most value emotion over logic, strawman arguments (we don't know why Pascal wants Elba as Bond, so I don't see any facts in the whole "greed" argument) and basically arguments that sound like a sugarcoated version of the phrase "Raping my childhood".

 

[Octoberist]

Honestly, pages and pages of this sort of this is interesting but yet, it's also it's getting uncomfortable.

 

[Daywalker89]

That would require Hollywood 2 use their brain & they don't like thinking

 

[cronosred]

Um yes comments like these are exactly why we need more diverse casting options.

I find that people who say they want diverse changes made to well established characters still have a line they don't want crossed which often makes them appear to be hypocrites. Why not an overweight Superman that people can relate to, or a gay James Bond, a transgendered Spider-Man, Batman with prosthetic limb, a four foot Wonder Woman? Why should open minded diversity basically end up meaning to change a white characters color? If Hollywood wants to make well established characters more diverse than they better go all the way because there's a lot of people not being represented like they should be, not just black people.