The Dark Knight Joker's Mob History /That Head Tilt

[JaD]

After viewing the Joker Prologue something has always stood out to me (other than my first glimpse of Heath Ledger's eerie and unforgettable presence as the Joker). And that was the moment after the Joker shoots the bank manager in the shoulder. He tilts his head and stares at him on the ground for just over 3 seconds. Why does the director choose to put so much emphasis on this moment? Is the Joker just observing the manager like a wounded animal?

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Or is it possible that the Joker has a history with the mob, and that him tilting his head at the bank manager was a hint of familiarity with the man he just shot? The tilt was clearly emphasized after he shot him as the camera zoomed in on his mask and remained on him for about 3 1/2 seconds, and then he is seemingly interrupted by his henchmen and looks the other way.

Could it be that this is the reason the Joker chooses not to kill him, even after placing a grenade in his mouth? Also, after he removes his mask...Was this a way of saying "Hey remember me? I want you to tell all your friends back home I'm still alive and that I have their money"

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Could this give the quote "Whatever doesn't kill you, simply makes you...stranger" a new meaning or reference? As in maybe it refers to him almost being killed and disfigured by the mob in the past (for whatever reason) and that he's returned with a new mindset, or psychopathic disorder so to speak.

What do you think?


Edit: A lot of factors to consider at this point. Just something to think about I guess,

How is it that the Joker even knows that is a mob bank in the first place while his henchmen are just catching on during the robbery?

Was Heath simply putting a Michael Myers-like nod in that moment, or was Nolan trying to insert a subtle hint for us to decipher?

What do you think the Joker's facial expression is under his mask while he's staring at the manager on the ground? Grinning? Blank? Curious? Intrigued?

Would the Joker's quote have more or less meaning if you took into account the idea of him being disfigured by the mob in the past?

Does the fact that the Joker pulled off his mask as he said the quote make it seem like he's referring to his own past? Rather than just taunt the manager? (Couldn't he have just left his mask on to conceal his identity? Was he re-introducing himself in a sense, or was he simply trying to frighten him?)

What do you think the Joker's first line to Sal Maroni in the film is? (Any hint of past relationship?)

Could there be a scene after the robbery where Sal Maroni himself comes to the crime scene and talks to the manager who is being treated by paramedics?

If you were to watch the Prologue for the first time, and were asked to focus on that moment, would you either say "What the heck was that all about? Does he know him?" or "Wow, that's a creepy Michael Myers-like gesture right there." or something else entirely?

 

[DaddyGrayson]

After viewing the Joker prologue something has always stood out to me (other than my first glimpse of Heath Ledger's eerie and unforgettable presence as the Joker). And that was the moment after the Joker shoots the bank manager in the shoulder. He tilts his head and stares at him on the ground for just over 3 seconds. Why so much emphasis on this head tilt?

Is it possible that the Joker has a history with the mob, and that him tilting his head at the bank manager was a hint of familiarity with man he shot. The tilt was clearly emphasized after he shot him as the camera zoomed in on his mask.

Could it be that this is the reason the Joker chooses not to kill him, even after placing a grenade in his mouth. Was this a way of saying "Hey remember me? I want you to tell all your friends back home I'm still alive and that I have their money"

Could this give the quote "Whatever doesn't kill you, simply makes you...stranger" a new meaning or reference? As in maybe it refers to him almost being killed and disfigured by the mob in the past (for whatever reason) and that he's returned with a new mindset, or psychopathic disorder so to speak.

What do you think?

That's a very interesting theory actually. Very well thought out.

 

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

That's actually a pretty cool idea.

 

[BAILY]

very interesting indeed... kudos to you for that .... i dunno though.. i can't see Nolan exploring that in the movie though

 

[JaD]

That's a very interesting theory actually. Very well thought out.

I can't take all the credit for it though actually, someone somewhere else had a pretty similar theory and I just tried to expand on it the best I could

 

[p.marlowe]

I like your theory. It fits really well. However, we may never find out for sure. I read that we won't be seeing a whole lot of Joker "origin" in TDK. But what you wrote makes a lot of sense to me. Well done!

 

[The Battousai]

That's what I had thought back when I started writing the old comic idea I had.

Good eyes

 

[Killing Joke926]

After viewing the Joker Prologue something has always stood out to me (other than my first glimpse of Heath Ledger's eerie and unforgettable presence as the Joker). And that was the moment after the Joker shoots the bank manager in the shoulder. He tilts his head and stares at him on the ground for just over 3 seconds. Why so much emphasis on this head tilt?

Is it possible that the Joker has a history with the mob, and that him tilting his head at the bank manager was a hint of familiarity with man he shot. The tilt was clearly emphasized after he shot him as the camera zoomed in on his mask.

Could it be that this is the reason the Joker chooses not to kill him, even after placing a grenade in his mouth. Was this a way of saying "Hey remember me? I want you to tell all your friends back home I'm still alive and that I have their money"

Could this give the quote "Whatever doesn't kill you, simply makes you...stranger" a new meaning or reference? As in maybe it refers to him almost being killed and disfigured by the mob in the past (for whatever reason) and that he's returned with a new mindset, or psychopathic disorder so to speak.

What do you think?

Interesting JaD, indeed very interesting; you could actually have a point. He may have a personal vendetta with him; think about it, why would he take the time to plan out robbery on mob bank? Why not just any other bank? And could this also go along with Joker's quote, "It's all apart of the plan"? Good topic.

 

[bkey]

I like it JaD. There won't be a Joker "origin" or anything like that. He is an absolute. But I definitely think there may be some subtle hints and nods to where the Joker came from throughout the film. We know he has at least one scene with Maroni, so maybe there will be more than just a hint, but I don't think we will actually see "pre-Joker" on screen.

 

[Why Are You Crouching Spock?]

I like your theory. It fits really well. However, we may never find out for sure. I read that we won't be seeing a whole lot of Joker "origin" in TDK. But what you wrote makes a lot of sense to me. Well done!

They could continue it on or do back story prequels outside the movie (like the startrek books did with DS9), but in comic form I guess. The ds9 books tied in well with the end of show, but the movie tie in comics of BB have sucked from what i read.

 

[Nepenthes]

Nice thinking but I don't think the bank manager has any use beyond that scene. I definitly noticed the head tilt and thought it was a nice moment but to me it was a "Joker contemplating life and death" type thing, the way you'd watch a struggling animal after you've wounded it. He just gets pleasure from hurting people. It contrasts well with the way he unceremoniously executes the bus driver moments later.

The stuff about returning with new mindset is bang on; Joker will definitly be shown to have a histroy with the mob (the scars speak louder than any words can) but I don't think that past has to involve the bank manager to make itself clear.

 

[Anjow1060]

or he was mimicking a technique that warwick davis used for the ewoks in ROTJ.

His dog used to tilt his head was he was confused or intrigued by something. I'm pretty sure the Joker was just intrigued to watch this man die for someone else's money.

- Jow

 

[ArkhamAsylum]

ive always thought of that bit as J liking to watch...as a sadist...after wounding, cutting,shooting, etc... someone...he takes pleasure in watching the blood..or the pain...almost in a trance for a second...before the other goon snaps him out of it...just my thoughts...

 

[tadamz]

I always saw it as him looking at the manager like it was a lower form of life that he hadn't even acknowledged existed before it started addressing him. Almost like a dog looks at something that confuses it. It showed that he's barely human. Thats what I took out of it atleast.

 

[Loneranger]

He takes great pleasure and enjoyment watching people suffer. This is why he stares at him; he enjoys watching the bank manager suffer. Nolan has stated this saying that the Joker finds joy in wacthing and inflicting pain.

 

[Beanjuice]

ooo this theory makes my mind tingle. i like it

 

[Loneranger]

ive always thought of that bit as J liking to watch...as a sadist...after wounding, cutting,shooting, etc... someone...he takes pleasure in watching the blood..or the pain...almost in a trance for a second...before the other goon snaps him out of it...just my thoughts...

Exactly. Nolan talked about this in an interview. I think it was the wizard magazine interview.

 

[deathfromabove]

he knows its a mob bank so maybe he does know the bank manager from before. he also seems to know his way around gotham's underbelly.


interesting theory

 

[Yurka]

or he was mimicking a technique that warwick davis used for the ewoks in ROTJ.

His dog used to tilt his head was he was confused or intrigued by something. I'm pretty sure the Joker was just intrigued to watch this man die for someone else's money.

- Jow

Thats what I assumed.

 

[Dark Knigh7]

I like your theory, I really do. However, I do have to say that I've noticed all of Jokers gestures that he's done so far, and I'm extremely impressed by all of them. Heath has put a lot of thought on the way Mr.J talks, moves, reacts, etc etc. I noticed the head tilt, the licked lips, to the creepy clap, and all of them emphasise how sadistic The Joker is going to be in TDK. I seriously can't wait for this movie. Good theory

 

[Shoemeister]

Good theory, JaD. It's very possible.

 

[Sandouras]

Guys, i think that the joker has left his pants zipper open. I think that this might imply that he went to the bathroom before the robbery, possibly implying him killing the WC cleaner guy. Maybe he is a mob snitch?

Great idea. I hadnt thought of that!

 

[Luchastyle]

very nice JaD. it fits pretty well. good job. also, the head tilt reminds me of michael myers =)

 

[JaD]

very nice JaD. it fits pretty well. good job. also, the head tilt reminds me of michael myers =)

Oh yeah, haha

 

[Luchastyle]

but even if it were a michael myers reference, it wouldn't be for no reason. i think he shoots the guy, then is like "ah...it's you." that makes sense. and of course, the "what doesn't kill you, makes you stranger" line is kind of pointless unless something had happened to him. so a whole mob hit idea works very well. and that would be why he's targeting the mob's money. it's revenge. and they don't notice it, because they probably don't even realize who this guy is.