Justice League Justice League Box Office Prediction - Part 1

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Oh wow, that guy (I've heard of him before) is ripping it up there! Thanks for all this, very interesting. :up:

I think OdinSon summed it up really well on why 'Dangal' in particular did gangbusters in China. The movie was about parental sacrifices and overcoming seemingly impossible odds against a patriarchal society that scoffs at the thought of equal rights for women. All of this resonated extremely well with the Chinese audience as the two countries are grappling with similar issues and the content of the movie was very topical and relevant in China.
 
Bad reviews: $750 - $850 Million range.
Good reviews: $850 - $1 Billion range.
Great reviews: $900 - $1.1 Billion range.

That's how I see it.

That's what makes these so tough to judge. Reception and WOM goes a LOOOONG way to how much it makes.
 
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Yeah true. A lot of people want to see the new guys too, but I guess a lot of those audiences might be the same.

There will be people who want to see it because it's the JL.

There will be people who want to see it for WW, Batman, or Superman, or some combination of each.

There will be people who will find Ezra Miller's Flash funny and endearing and make the movie more fun and worth watching and re-watching.

There will be people who want to check out Mamoa and those pecs and abs.

So, I do I think there is a lot of potential there. It just depends on the quality of the movie.
 
I should clarify a bit about SW in Asia. I wouldn't say SW isn't popular at all because it sounds really harsh but compared to other franchises and especially CBMs, SW isn't that big. SW is unbelievably powerful in NA and Europe and compared to that it would seem SW is a non-factor in Asian countries. But that's not the whole picture. SW does decent numbers here, just nowhere close to the level of NA & Europe.

I can only talk about my home country (India) and Spider-Man and Avengers movies reigns supreme when it comes to BO collections.

SM3, TASM and SM:H are ranked 6th, 7th and 13th in the all time highest grossing Hollywood movies' list while AoU, Avengers and Civil War are ranked 4th, 11th and 14th respectively. While the biggest Warner Bros. movie in my country is The Conjuring (2013) while Wan's F7 (Universal) is 2nd in the all time list behind Disney's TJB (2016) in the top spot. WB doesn't have a foothold in my country while Disney and Sony has great marketing and considerable clout in our BO. I have little to no hope for JL in India. I'm hoping for the best but really not holding my breath for something amazing.
 
I should clarify a bit about SW in Asia. I wouldn't say SW isn't popular at all because it sounds really harsh but compared to other franchises and especially CBMs, SW isn't that big.

Precisely. And that's exactly why Star Wars isn't much of a threat for JL or other CBM's in Asia.

As far as India is concerned, Spiderman obviously is a really big brand because of his past movies and animated series. There is also a lot of unmet pent up demand for good DC movies because of extremely popular Justice League and Superman animated series. That is something Star Wars wouldn't be able to match any time soon.
 
Precisely. And that's exactly why Star Wars isn't much of a threat for JL or other CBM's in Asia.

That's true but by the time TLJ arrives in theaters, JL will already pocket the bulk of it's BO returns. So the competition doesn't really matter in this particular case.

As far as India is concerned, Spiderman obviously is a really big brand because of his past movies and animated series. There is also a lot of unmet pent up demand for good DC movies because of extremely popular Justice League and Superman animated series. That is something Star Wars wouldn't be able to match any time soon.

I sure hope that we can show up in droves for JL. I mean BvS and Skwad didn't do too bad here all things considered. I just hope luck will be with JL. I remember my city had way more screenings/showtimes for Jason Bourne than Skwad in their OW (they opened simultaneously here). It was even more skewed in favor of JB all over the country. JB ended up with more than 2 times the number of screens than SS. Skwad did beat JB quite comprehensively tho and it wasn't even dubbed in the regional languages. If WB play their cards right (which they never manage to do here), JL will be a huge hit.
 
That's true but by the time TLJ arrives in theaters, JL will already pocket the bulk of it's BO returns. So the competition doesn't really matter in this particular case.

That's an excellent point. I just checked the release date for TLJ and it's releasing four weeks after JL. CBM's usually do vast majority of their business during first 3-4 weeks. Hence, Star War's shouldn't be much of a factor even in North America/Europe.
 
Yeah, The Last Jedi opens on Justice League's 5th weekend. Justice League will already have made close to 90% of its box office by then(OS probably even more). While it will impact late legs to a degree, it won't have a huge impact on JL's overall box office.
 
That's true but by the time TLJ arrives in theaters, JL will already pocket the bulk of it's BO returns. So the competition doesn't really matter in this particular case.

It's important for lengthy runs. Sure, it'll make the bulk of its money within that timeframe. But had it been a relatively dead December, JL would've reaped from it as audiences always seek to go out for entertainment.
 
That's what makes these so tough to judge. Reception and WOM goes a LOOOONG way to how much it makes.

Yeah. Predictions are based on an assumption of how the film itself will turn out. If you get the numbers bang on but are wrong on how good the film will be you'll still be wrong.
 
It's important for lengthy runs. Sure, it'll make the bulk of its money within that timeframe. But had it been a relatively dead December, JL would've reaped from it as audiences always seek to go out for entertainment.

I already made a post on this very topic, here you go

Ummmm...... I just want to point out that TFA didn't really have a huge effect on MJ1 back in 2015 and Rogue One didn't really crash Fantastic Beasts or Moana in 2016.

Fantastic Beasts made 86.6% of it's domestic BO before Rogue One came out. Plus FB managed a further 31.35 million in the rest of it's run.

MJ1 already made 88.3% of it's domestic BO by the time TFA released. The JLaw starrer was still able to extract a further 32.94 million.

So why is everyone saying that JL will be absolutely destroyed by TLJ?? It may very well happen but the 4th film in a notoriously front-loaded YA franchise held it's own against TFA so I don't see any reason why JL wouldn't put up a good fight against TLJ if it is a crowd pleasing entertainer.
 
Checking the Numbers The 3 DCEU movies that opened in China had

Wonder Woman, $90 million total

MOS, $63 million total

BVS, $95 million total

Wow, so much more popular than Star Wars! :whatever:
 
Put it this way, SW is Rafa Nadal, and is amazing at the French Open (US), not as amazing in the other 3 Majors, but still one of the best in history.

Its release OS isn't going to impact JL as much as in US, though for JL it's really the loose change that's affected (~5-10%?), especially with the Thanksgiving weekend making some of it up, we all know JL's is going to be frontloaded and nobody is expecting legs like Diana

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I already made a post on this very topic, here you go
What does that have to do with my point? I'm saying movies with exceptional legs are helped from lack of succeeding competition. So if JL were the type of film with potential in a lengthy run, it would have been cut short by the behemoth that is Star Wars.

Your percentage report is simply an assessment of its performance prior to SW hitting the scene, but you can't ignore the numbers after it hits too. Those films don't do the same numbers if that spot were left vacant. What would have been the opening weekend for SW is going to be split amongst all the established releases. That's the unknowable number I'm referring to which is going to be left on the table.
 
What does that have to do with my point? I'm saying movies with exceptional legs are helped from lack of succeeding competition. So if JL were the type of film with potential in a lengthy run, it would have been cut short by the behemoth that is Star Wars.

Your percentage report is simply an assessment of its performance prior to SW hitting the scene, but you can't ignore the numbers after it hits too. Those films don't do the same numbers if that spot were left vacant. What would have been the opening weekend for SW is going to be split amongst all the established releases. That's the unknowable number I'm referring to which is going to be left on the table.
Justice League isn't the type of movie that gets a exceptional legs though. The characters have such a huge fanbase, tons of people are going to rush to see it on opening weekend. I would be very surprised if it gets a 3x multiplier, even if it gets very good reviews.

Since Star Wars will only affect the last ~10% of Justice League domestically, and even less OS(that ~10% isn't just made up btw, look at movies that got multiplier of about 2.3-2.8x, they make close to 90% of their money in the first 4 weeks even without a huge release like Star Wars on their 5th weekend), it won't really have a huge impact. It will still only affect a fraction of the overall number. Being generous, it might cost it about $15M domestically.

Obviously it would make more without Star Wars in those last few weeks, but the effect won't be huge, and even without Star Wars, another big release would probably have taken its release slot, so its not like the effect of competition would have disappeared completely either.
What would have been the opening weekend for SW is going to be split amongst all the established releases.
It definitely wouldn't. The vast majority of people who are going out to see Star Wars would have just stayed home if nothing was coming out. The total weekend gross would just go down by a huge margin.
 
What does that have to do with my point? I'm saying movies with exceptional legs are helped from lack of succeeding competition. So if JL were the type of film with potential in a lengthy run, it would have been cut short by the behemoth that is Star Wars.

But JL most likely won’t have exceptional legs. I mean look at the legs of the movies that released in the same spot in the last few years:

Fantastic Beasts – 3.14
Mockingjay Pat II – 2.74
Mockingjay Part I – 2.77
Catching Fire – 2.69
Breaking Dawn Part II – 2.07
Breaking Dawn Part I – 2.03
Deathly Hallows Part I – 2.36
New Moon – 2.07
Twilight – 2.76

FB is the odd one here as it basically behaved like an original movie. It’s legs were like Philosopher’s Stone and not like the other HP /Wizarding World movies.

The later Twilight films were heavily front-loaded YA movies. Their legs were only relegated to them and it doesn’t mean anything for other movies in the list.

So the wiggle room for legs is between (2.35 – 2.85) IMO. This is a fairly standard range for legs when it comes to blockbusters during any time of the year. I don’t think there is much of a chance for JL to sprout exceptional legs.

Your percentage report is simply an assessment of its performance prior to SW hitting the scene, but you can't ignore the numbers after it hits too. Those films don't do the same numbers if that spot were left vacant. What would have been the opening weekend for SW is going to be split amongst all the established releases. That's the unknowable number I'm referring to which is going to be left on the table.

But I didn’t ignore the number that a Thanksgiving live-action releases will make after a SW movie is released. I specifically mentioned how much MJ2 and FB managed to achieve even after a ‘SW’ movie hit the theaters and those numbers are not tiny fractions and they add a substantial amount to the final domestic tally.

I understand the point you're trying to make here about SW being a behemoth and cutting down the overall life of all films that will be in theaters around the same time. I don’t disagree with you. Plus it happens with each and every movie that gets released in theatres. Blockbuster movies are dime a dozen these days. The release schedule is chock a block with big budget FX heavy movies. X movie will always suffer because of Y movie coming out in a week or two. But the movies that’ll display extra-ordinary legs will withstand everything like a boss, i.e Wonder Woman. But WW is a freak of nature and replicating it’s success will be insanely difficult for other blockbusters, impossible even.

Here’s the thing, no one in their right mind will disagree with you and say that SW wouldn't hurt JL or the other films when it gets released. All the movies will get pulverized in TLJ’s opening week. The Friday will look appalling for all the movies and Saturday will be hit really hard as well. So will the rest of the week starting from TLJ’s opening Friday. But I think normalcy will start getting restored after that step by step. The whole Christmas week will see decent to very good drops going into the New Year and there will be further small drops one week before MLK weekend .That’ll be when movies get back to the usual standards. So the effect is there but it’s also overestimated to an extent when folks say that other movies will hafta shut shop because of SW.

The 2nd and 3rd Hunger Games movies were affected by Hobbit movies and the final one up against TFA in 2015 but I wouldn't a say lot were left at the table. In fact all the HG movies performed in and around the same ballpark even against varying degrees of the strength of the competition.

Let’s look at the legs of the Hunger Games movies,

THG – 2.67 (the only HG movie that release in Nov.)
CF – 2.69
MJ1 – 2.77
MJ2 – 2.74

We can observe that the Hunger Games movies had a ceiling and a base when it comes to legs. The range would be between (2.67 – 2.78) and even with TFA tearing it up in the domestic market and breaking records left and right, MJ2 still managed to go past the base and achieved to get very close to the ceiling of the franchise. So did TFA actually cut very heavily into MJ2’s run??

CF and MJ1 did manage to post much better absolute figures than MJ2 when the Hobbit movies hit them in their respective years but both of those movies were accumulating bigger dailies and were coming of much bigger prior weekends.

Plus if we are to assume* that MJ2 would have reached the franchise peak if it weren’t for TFA, it still would have made [2.77x102.65] = 284.35 million
That’ll be a difference of just [284.35-281.65] = 2.7 million. I wouldn’t really call that a lot of money left at the table.

*Nao that assumption in not a bad one to make under the circumstances. The legs were getting better for the HG movies with each passing one so it’s fair to say that MJ2 would have continued the trend. Nao one reason for the slightly bigger legs would be a smaller OW. Smaller OW means less upfront demand and better prospect for legs with good WoM. So with the lowest OW among all the HG movies, we could have gotten a slightly better multiplier for MJ2. So when MJ2 didn’t reach franchise best multiplier, we can say that TFA did hurt the movie. So if we make a linear extrapolation of MJ2’s legs compared to CF’s legs, we get (2.83xOW). That’ll give us 290.5 million. 8.9 million more than the actual final total.

But this calculation is entirely based upon the theory is if the OW is lower, the subsequent legs will be better. But JL won’t have a low OW. It’s OW will be closer to Catching Fire than Mockingjay Part II. JL will have more upfront demand and it’ll also behave like a front-loaded CBM. So there’s a solid chance that JL will make bulk of it’s domestic BO share within the opening 4 weeks. HG movies made low 80’s in the opening 4 weeks but I wouldn’t be surprised if JL breaks the 90% mark during the same time-frame.
 
Justice League isn't the type of movie that gets a exceptional legs though. The characters have such a huge fanbase, tons of people are going to rush to see it on opening weekend. I would be very surprised if it gets a 3x multiplier, even if it gets very good reviews.

Since Star Wars will only affect the last ~10% of Justice League domestically, and even less OS(that ~10% isn't just made up btw, look at movies that got multiplier of about 2.3-2.8x, they make close to 90% of their money in the first 4 weeks even without a huge release like Star Wars on their 5th weekend), it won't really have a huge impact. It will still only affect a fraction of the overall number. Being generous, it might cost it about $15M domestically.

Obviously it would make more without Star Wars in those last few weeks, but the effect won't be huge, and even without Star Wars, another big release would probably have taken its release slot, so its not like the effect of competition would have disappeared completely either.

It definitely wouldn't. The vast majority of people who are going out to see Star Wars would have just stayed home if nothing was coming out. The total weekend gross would just go down by a huge margin.

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Put it this way, SW is Rafa Nadal, and is amazing at the French Open (US), not as amazing in the other 3 Majors, but still one of the best in history.

Its release OS isn't going to impact JL as much as in US, though for JL it's really the loose change that's affected (~5-10%?), especially with the Thanksgiving weekend making some of it up, we all know JL's is going to be frontloaded and nobody is expecting legs like Diana

fxh4Jzi.gif

Yeah SW is not that big in most OS countries ( sans Europe) and who knows, OS it may have some legs.
 
Thanksgiving is the best thing it has going for it.

Last time we talked about BvS having no competition and clear sailing for weeks and it received huge drops anyway. It got knocked off by the Melissa McCarthy movie and lost so much of the audience after 4 weeks it did not matter what movie came next. The damage had already been done.
 
Bad reviews and B Cinemascore. Yeah those were some dark days. I have no idea what reactions to JL are gonna be, but just from going by the trailers and promotions, it seems to be heading in the right direction to be a more critic and crowd pleasing film.

But it remains to be seen if it'll be executed well.
 
Gal's legs doe... My oh my... :)
 
Eh Maybe says that early tracking on JL has "been really good", according to his colleagues, but has the caveat 'take it with a grain of salt until official tracking drops next week'.

Maybe a $130M-$150M opening weekend is in play?
 
Eh Maybe says that early tracking on JL has "been really good", according to his colleagues, but has the caveat 'take it with a grain of salt until official tracking drops next week'.

Maybe a $130M-$150M opening weekend is in play?

The guy at boxofficetheory who I shall not name said 150M+ and the movie is "fine"
 
Well those kind of numbers would also be fine!
 
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