Justice League Justice League Box Office Prediction - Part 7

[JerseyJoker]

My bad KalvinEllis, i wasnt trying to personally attack you or any DC fan. I want JL movies and DCU movies to do as well as Marvel like any sane and reasoned comic book fan.

But i was just pointing out the sadness almost of how the failing of WB/DC to its core audience just resounds harsher this weekend, when the OTHER superhero team is just preforming on a bigger level and how JL fans were left in the dust.

I think its kinda important to remember the failures or this anger from wanting more, its way more healthy to discuss, examine, laugh at even, the bomb of Justice League than be in a hive mind wanting a #SnyderCut and living in denial that some extended cut changes facts.

I didnt mean to piss you off on purpose at all, dude.

 

[KalvinEllis]

Like I said, I think I overreacted about this whole thing. Fans should discuss whatever they like and WB obviously deserves the ridicule. I have no loyalties towards WB, especially after they turned my favorite DC character into a laughing stock in 2011.

 

[FunkMiller]

JL's failure has been pointed out time and time again and we've all accepted it long ago. There's nothing to achieve by coming to this thread to specifically brag about how much better your favorite franchise is doing over another franchise that otherwise you act like isn't even worth your attention. I'm not saying you're breaking any forum rules, I'm asking you to grow up.

You mean Man Of Steel, Batman V Superman, Suicide Squad, and Justice League’s failure...

 

[JerseyJoker]

To be fair, Suicide Squad is a story structural failure in most parts cause of bad editing, but as a whole, audiences enjoyed that one. Came out strong for Suicide Squad and had a great word of mouth after, especially Harley blowing up in popularity.

If you go back the last three films, people were mixed but liked SS, loved Wonder Woman, kinda turned their back on JL, and right now i think there is more optimistic outlook to what Aquaman can deliver.

That just points me to a curve of people not liking Snyder's vision or his trilogy of movies.

 

[FunkMiller]

Instead of peddling the same outdated cliches about DC characters, why don't you actually do some basic research on DC characters that aren't Batman? Wikipedia and Google are your friends.

And for one thing, Marvel has nothing as critically acclaimed and transcendent as Watchmen or The Dark Knight Returns.

Perfect response. You put it much better and more succinctly than I did.

 

[FunkMiller]

That just points me to a curve of people not liking Snyder's vision or his trilogy of movies.

Well, there’s your elephant in the room. The only people I really see still complaining about the comparison of Marvel’s successes to DC’s failures these days are the Snyder fans. The rest of us DC fans are quite happy to turn the screw on it as much as possible, because we hate what has been done to our favourite characters, and think the relevant fortunes of both companies are thoroughly deserved.

Never mind. Things will turn again one day.

 

[Jekecy]

Well, there’s your elephant in the room. The only people I really see still complaining about the comparison of Marvel’s successes to DC’s failures these days are the Snyder fans. The rest of us DC fans are quite happy to turn the screw on it as much as possible, because we hate what has been done to our favourite characters, and think the relevant fortunes of both companies are thoroughly deserved.

Never mind. Things will turn again one day.

Ha! Yeah, one day...

 

[KalvinEllis]

Well, there’s your elephant in the room. The only people I really see still complaining about the comparison of Marvel’s successes to DC’s failures these days are the Snyder fans. The rest of us DC fans are quite happy to turn the screw on it as much as possible, because we hate what has been done to our favourite characters, and think the relevant fortunes of both companies are thoroughly deserved.

I'm impartial towards Snyder, I just get tired of the comparisons. lol Especially when I'm so happy about the MCU's success.

Never mind. Things will turn again one day.

Yeah, but with WB everything is uncertain. There's no other studio that has announced so many movies in development and fans don't have a clue if even a quarter of them will get made.

 

[FunkMiller]

Yeah, but with WB everything is uncertain. There's no other studio that has announced so many movies in development and fans don't have a clue if even a quarter of them will get made.

I’m still hoping and praying the AT&T merger falls through, and they end up selling DC to someone who knows what to do with it (see my sig). Wishful thinking... but I can dream.

 

[brandeezy89]

I’m still hoping and praying the AT&T merger falls through, and they end up selling DC to someone who knows what to do with it (see my sig). Wishful thinking... but I can dream.

Yeah....that AT&T merger is pretty much a done deal based on recent articles i've read and will be announced next week. Which is probably why T-Mobie and Sprint waited to merge. It's gonna be a merging spree everywhere soon.

 

[Iceman]

A forum like this is one of the most public places a fan can complain. If they do it the right way (as in not attacking other posters or being an outright nuisance) I think it can help the right people see. Any conscientious guy in control of these films will court opinion and where will they find it if not places like this. MCU villains have been complained about everywhere on the internet for years for eg, and recently they have started to show significant improvement, and now we finally get a really great one. I've been shouted down many times over the years for complaining about this issue but after Thanos I'm glad that I didn't stay quiet. I would have felt a lot worse if I read 10 years later someone in charge saying we never knew fans had an issue with our villains as we checked online and no one ever said anything.

 

[JeetKuneDo]

I say IW's success is good for DC too.

They are growing the audience for CB movies. That's good for DC as well.

They are doing something different. That's good for DC as well.

Didn't the success of Superman and Batman onscreen give Marvel characters something to build upon? Well that works in reverse too. At some point, people at WB have got to see they need to think outside their box. We've already gotten WB to stretch their legs outside the Batman/Superman family. Now maybe JL was a mistep (I liked it), but it's a step.

Don't be surprised if DC makes a big comeback soon and it will partly due to what Marvel is doing. It's one genre after all and Marvel is helping make the genre strong.

 

[Jekecy]

Didn't the success of Superman and Batman onscreen give Marvel characters something to build upon?

Not really. In the height of the Reeve and Keaton era, Marvel was nowhere to be found (apart from really low-budget affair). The modern era got kicked off thanks to Blade, X-Men, and Spider-Man. All Marvel.

DC actually would have to thank Marvel for reigniting the fan flame again. They were late to the party.

Don't be surprised if DC makes a big comeback soon and it will partly due to what Marvel is doing. It's one genre after all and Marvel is helping make the genre strong.

Had Marvel been reigning this whole time and DC were the newcomers, I'd agree. But the brand has been somewhat established. Quite recently. Kinda have to when you've had 5 films on your record already. The general response has been...unpleasant. That's not going to help them in the near-future. These films don't work off a vacuum. With each movie, you're building/destroying the reputation for which your sequels will depend on.

 

[Johnglen]

Instead of peddling the same outdated cliches about DC characters, why don't you actually do some basic research on DC characters that aren't Batman? Wikipedia and Google are your friends.

And for one thing, Marvel has nothing as critically acclaimed and transcendent as Watchmen or The Dark Knight Returns.

One of your examples is more Alan Moore than typical dc , was already made into a film and flopped. Your second example, why doesn’t Warner dare to make films using the exact story of the dark knight returns ? Are they so stupid or maybe they know that it would flop too (an old Batman fighting an evil Superman) ?

Whatever, this is stctly subjective so no back and forth debate will come to anything but my personal opinion is that marvel comics throughout the years is far better material than dc ones.

 

[The Batman]

One of your examples is more Alan Moore than typical dc

Watchmen is a DC Comic. Period.

Once again, do some basic research on DC characters before you spout off about them. I don't even know why you're hanging out on a DC forum when you clearly don't know anything about the characters, and clearly don't even like most of them.

 

[Tra-El]

Not really. In the height of the Reeve and Keaton era, Marvel was nowhere to be found (apart from really low-budget affair). The modern era got kicked off thanks to Blade, X-Men, and Spider-Man. All Marvel.

DC actually would have to thank Marvel for reigniting the fan flame again. They were late to the party.

Spider-Man reignited the modern day superhero flick into an adventure that was fresh for the genre and successful enough for comic book movies to be takin' seriously. X-Men rode that wave for a good bit but still stumbled along the way.

It wasn't until Batman Begins and The Dark Knight that truly transcended the mayhem into the second phase modern day superhero blockbuster where the audience truly latched on to something special. The Dark Knight Trilogy transcended the genre to a height that transformed the audience into craving more. By the time Iron Man hit, Nolan's Batman was hitting the one billion milestone. Iron Man was a sleeper that eventually started to build good-will and came at the perfect time where the audience was primed since Nolan's Batman eventually came to an end.

If WB could have convinced Nolan to use his Bat-Trilogy to begin the DCCinematicUniverse as one shared universe and build from there when the audience was there then this could have been entirely different and dare I say the other way around. But, once The Dark Knight Trilogy was closed for business, forcing WB to go elsewhere and start over while Marvel was rounding 1st base, Marvel never looked back and here we are.

DC can find their mojo again. The success of Marvel Studios and Infinity War will only help other studios line their ducks in a row because superhero fatigue isn't going anywhere anytime soon...or so I hope.

 

[MbJ]

The success of Marvel Studios and Infinity War will only help other studios line their ducks in a row because superhero fatigue isn't going anywhere anytime soon...or so I hope.

IW shows that the concept of superhero fatigue is overhyped, IMO. Almost every time there's a film people point to for being an example of superhero fatigue, it's a film that had other, far more tangible reasons for underperforming.

 

[Hammer!]

If the MCU weren’t around, superhero fatigue would be real and here now.

 

[brandeezy89]

One of your examples is more Alan Moore than typical dc , was already made into a film and flopped. Your second example, why doesn’t Warner dare to make films using the exact story of the dark knight returns ? Are they so stupid or maybe they know that it would flop too (an old Batman fighting an evil Superman) ?

Whatever, this is stctly subjective so no back and forth debate will come to anything but my personal opinion is that marvel comics throughout the years is far better material than dc ones.

So your argument is that since DC didn't adapt a lot of their iconic storylines into movies, that they don't have good source material?

What does not making a movie out of TDKR & the reception of Watchmen have to do with the fact that they're two of the greatest Graphic Novels of all time?

 

[Captain Marvel]

It's amazing that Infinity War will nearly match the entirety of Justice League's run in its very first opening weekend alone.

The sad part? Justice League could've had that level of success, if not for the short-sightedness of Warner Bros. and incompetence of Zack Snyder.

 

[KalvinEllis]

It's amazing that Infinity War will nearly match the entirety of Justice League's run in its very first opening weekend alone.

The sad part? Justice League could've had that level of success, if not for the short-sightedness of Warner Bros. and incompetence of Zack Snyder.

I'm still thinking that WB rushing their universe would've led to smaller profits compared to Marvel's, even if the DCEU had been better received. Obviously they would've been way more successful, but the reason Marvel is selling out the world right now is because they had a 10 year plan to get to where they are. They have long been a well-oiled machine and the public clearly has faith in the brand due to years and years of delivering. If that wasn't the case and Disney rushed the MCU like WB did with the DCEU, I don't think IW would be outselling TFA right now. Great JL movie would have certainly made over a billion, but if there wasn't a good build-up, I'm not sure it would've done as well as IW.

 

[Bruce Malone]

A Batman vs Superman or Justice League movie that actually retained Bale's Batman with Cavil post MOS and with Nolan still guiding the project even if not actually directing. Would have been an almost guaranteed billion.

 

[Ultra Nolanite]

I think some people are confusing DC fans with DCEU fans.

While it hurts me as a DC fan to see these characters reputations destroyed by WB, and make no mistake, that IS what's happening here, it gives me great pleasure to see Marvel snapping their fingers and basically wishing away the DCEU in the box office. Putting those that would tarnish the DC brand in their place. Marvel fights for DC more than WB ever did.

I'm a firm believer of "play stupid games, win stupid prizes." And this whole DCEU just needs to go away and start from scratch with new management.

So I say never stop posting about how much of a failure the DCEU has been. Because when I see 5 Harley Quinn/ Joker movies on the horizon I dunno, something just tells me that WB somehow still hasn't gotten the message.

 

[Captain Marvel]

I'm still thinking that WB rushing their universe would've led to smaller profits compared to Marvel's, even if the DCEU had been better received. Obviously they would've been way more successful, but the reason Marvel is selling out the world right now is because they had a 10 year plan to get to where they are. They have long been a well-oiled machine and the public clearly has faith in the brand due to years and years of delivering. If that wasn't the case and Disney rushed the MCU like WB did with the DCEU, I don't think IW would be outselling TFA right now. Great JL movie would have certainly made over a billion, but if there wasn't a good build-up, I'm not sure it would've done as well as IW.

Justice League could've definitely used some more movies in its release schedule before getting to a Justice League movie, like a solo Batman and Flash movie, at the very least. Maybe a Green Lantern movie as well as a Superman sequel (Instead of Batman V Superman, and a sequel to an original Superman film far better than what Man of Steel turned out to be).

Look at Wonder Woman, though. It made $821 million. And Batman has already proven itself to be a potential billion dollar franchise. IMO, this goes to show that the DC Universe characters are worth more than their Marvel equivalents. Put them in equivalently good movies, and they'll tend to bring in more.

Here, too, is where the success of the MCU could've been to their advantage, as the popularity of the MCU has grown the superhero movie going audience. If the audience were presented with a second superhero cinematic universe, one with some of the most popular superheroes of all time in Superman, Batman, Wonder Woman, and the Flash, if they were given the opportunity to relive the excitement they felt when they first saw the MCU open up, and it were actually GOOD?!? The DCEU would've been setting the box office on fire a lot sooner than Marvel did at an equivalent point in its history.

Instead, we have a situation where a B-List character like Black Panther made over twice what the Justice League made in his first solo film outing, and in which Infinity War nearly made as much money in its opening weekend alone as Justice League did throughout its entire theatrical release. It's utterly horrendous how woefully WB has mishandled the DCEU.

And yes, I do continuously mock the box office totals of Justice League, but you know what? Vindication is nice. I've been sounding the warning gong since I first heard rumors about what Man of Steel was going to be like. As soon as I saw that movie, it wasn't just the case that I disliked it. I more than disliked it. I instantly recognized it for the poisoned apple which it represented. I've said that with Suicide Squad, with Batman V Superman, and with Justice League. All the reasons for Justice League's failure can be found right there in the DNA of Man of Steel. I sure wish WB had listened to fans like me, because if they had, and had put a stop to that train wreck before it ever pulled out of the station, then who knows what the DCEU would look like today? It might actually be good and successful?

 

[FunkMiller]

One of your examples is more Alan Moore than typical dc , was already made into a film and flopped. Your second example, why doesn’t Warner dare to make films using the exact story of the dark knight returns ? Are they so stupid or maybe they know that it would flop too (an old Batman fighting an evil Superman) ?

Whatever, this is stctly subjective so no back and forth debate will come to anything but my personal opinion is that marvel comics throughout the years is far better material than dc ones.

You’re entire argument was predicated on the idea that DC did not have any culturally relevant, or socially conscious pieces of work. That argument has been comprehensively blown out of the water - and even further, you’ve been unable to cite even one Marvel comic book that is better at those themes than DC’s work.