Justice League: self contained continuity, or epic crossover?

[Drz]

Define leader? JLA doesn't have a single man leading everyone but a "council". Did you mean in combat? Yeah Batman can shout commands and observe the situation, thats about it.

 

[EliteF50]

It should be conntected whit other movies. Bale should be Batman. Batman should be leader.

No. I don't want Bale to play Batman in a JL movie.

I want an actor that will give us that epic, manly Kevin Conroy Batman we had in the JL animated series. If it's Bale, we're gonna have a growly robot on screen with 6 other normal people.

 

[ClarkLuther55]

A Batman in his own movie like Nolan's Batman loses importance as soon as it is reveled that there is a Superman who can solve most of the problems in an instant. For example, Joker is threatening to blow up ferries? No problem Superman takes out the bomb and saves everyone in matter of minutes.

To integrate movie Batman into the Justice League, I think they should take a pointer from the DCAU. Make Batman the first superhero. The Nolan trilogy (so far) has basically been Year One. Yet it has already done scifi tech.

And I don't even think the Nolan trilogy Batman even needs to be the one in Justice League. But it's pretty dumb to have the post-Nolan Batman be separate, along with Henry Cavill.

None of us should even be talking about a Justice League movie right now. Their focus should be on Flash and Wonder Woman. They want the Avengers team up without the Avengers build up.

 

[Timstuff]

Why can't they just show that Batman evolves to keep up with a changing world? What is so hard about that?

 

[jmc]

There is actually a simple solution to all of this. Keep the same actors, but have it a completely different universe, the solo film remain separate worlds. Make JL an elseworlds movie.

 

[Karelia]

There is actually a simple solution to all of this. Keep the same actors, but have it a completely different universe, the solo film remain separate worlds. Make JL an elseworlds movie.

That's what I was thinking as well. They don't have to say anything about what's happened to their solo films or anything like that.

Plus DC hasn't said they were getting different actors yet. Snyder said that the JL movie would have "their own version of Batman & Superman" Which I guess could possibly mean new actors, but who knows at this point anyways?

 

[jmc]

It solves the problem of having to worry about interconnecting pre existing movies, plus fans get the same actors on board. Any subsequent WW or Flash spin-offs would also contain the respective actors but also be their own universe, win-win as far as I'm concerned.

 

[EliteF50]

But I want to see a new take on Batman. I sure as hell don't want to see the same one for the next 6-8 years.

 

[TheVileOne]

So how will they deal with Green Lantern in the movie?

If Green Lantern is a hit, they are just not going to put Ryan Reynolds in it?

 

[EliteF50]

Ryan is still brand new. He can be put into the movie no problem. Just like the new guy playing Batman in the reboot should be put into the JLA film.

However, I don't see that happening. So a new GL is probably going to happen. Maybe John Stewart?

 

[TheVileOne]

That's ****ing idiotic. It would be idiotic if Green Lantern is a huge hit and Reynolds is suddenly a huge draw and box office star and you are going to put a different Green Lantern in there? People will be like WHERE IS RYAN REYNOLDS?!

 

[EliteF50]

That's ****ing idiotic. It would be idiotic if Green Lantern is a huge hit and Reynolds is suddenly a huge draw and box office star and you are going to put a different Green Lantern in there? People will be like WHERE IS RYAN REYNOLDS?!

It's a completely different movie with a completely different universe. It's not hard to understand. Especially if they use John instead of Hal.

 

[TheVileOne]

It's a completely different movie with a completely different universe. It's not hard to understand. Especially if they use John instead of Hal.

It will be if it's done at the same time as a series of Green Lantern movies.

It's not hard for you or me to understand because we are fanboys on a message board. Audiences in 2005 didn't know what the hell Batman Begins was. People thought it was a prequel to Batman in 1989. People didn't know what Incredible Hulk was in 2008 because the marketing was so vague about the connections.

Joe moviegoer has no idea who John Stewart is.

 

[BH/HHH]

That's ****ing idiotic. It would be idiotic if Green Lantern is a huge hit and Reynolds is suddenly a huge draw and box office star and you are going to put a different Green Lantern in there? People will be like WHERE IS RYAN REYNOLDS?!

Thats why I think they'l use John Stewart

 

[Timstuff]

As I've said before, if they don't use the stars from the solo films, people are going to feel gypped. It would be like going to a reunion concert for your favorite band, and none of the original members show up. I can understand not getting Bale since he's done with Batman after #3, but they could at least use the guy who will be in the next movie.

Why should the solo movies have the best actors for the job while the Justice League movie has the second-rate substitutes? Instead of getting the best that each franchise has to offer, we're expected to settle for a group of imitations lumped together. If the actors they're using weren't good enough to carry the solo films, then why should we be excited when they combine them? Instead of the cream of the crop, we'll probably end up getting the cream of the crap, and that's what almost happened with Justice League Mortal.

 

[Timstuff]

The only way I can see a separate cast and continuity working out well is if they do something radically different from the solo films, like setting it in the 1950s Silver Age like New Frontier did. That way there's no confusion as to why the actors are different, and why it has no connection to the solo films. I'd still rather have a real crossover set in modern continuity, though.

 

[Timstuff]

I can understand the concern with a "DC Movie-verse" that once you've poured cream into your coffee you can't unmix them, but in this case I don't think that's really that big of an issue. If you had Superman and Captain Marvel in the same world I could definitely see where problems would start, since you'd more or less have two Supermen sharing the same world, but each of the Big Five have pretty distinct motivations and skill sets that keep them separate outside of the Justice League just as much as their geographical locations do.

Superman: He has super-human strength, can fly, is bullet-proof, can shoot heat blasts from his eyes, has powerful, icy breath, is fast, and has X-ray vision. He's the most powerful of DC's heroes, but the challenges that he deals with are usually physical in nature, whether it's fighting a super-powered monster or shoving an asteroid away from the earth.

Batman: Has super intelligence, is a master martial artist, can make himself virtually invisible with his stealth training, has a wide array of gadgets and technology that he can use to fight his enemies and solve crimes. His challenges are usually mysteries that put himself an others in physical danger. He's a detective who can beat the crap out of most non-powered foes. If there's a madman with his finger on a red button, or Batman is the one who can stop them.

Wonder Woman: A highly trained Amazonian demigodess who has immense physical strength and agility. She is not as strong as Superman nor is she as invulnerable, however she can still throw cars and block bullets with ease. She is also better able to defend herself against supernatural energy than Superman, since her armor is was made by the Olympians. She knows how to use just about any weapon, she has the lasso of truth, and she is an excellent negiotiator. Her challenges deal largely with ending conflicts and finding the truth, preferably by peaceful means but by force when necessary.

The Green Lantern: Has a super-powered ring that can create constructs out of solid light from his imagination, as well as flight and sustenance in space. He is more or less a space-faring beat cop who hunts down galactic criminals who fall under his jurisdiction. He's a powerful member of the League, however he spends much of his time in space.

Flash: Can run much faster than Superman (under enough stress he can run faster than light), has split-second reflexes, and is physically athletic. His challenges usually involve him beating a clock or defeating something that is as fast as he is, which is usually faster than what any other superhero can deal with.

While there is some overlap between the various heroes' hypothetical "turf," for the sake of the movies it's pretty negligible. As for questions like "if Batman exists in the same world as Flash, why didn't they have Flash rescue Harvey Dent and Rachel Dawes?", first of all, we can assume that like the animated DC universe, Batman was the first costumed hero in this world. Second of all, the Flash cannot be everywhere at the same time, even if he is the fastest man alive. No superhero is aware of everything happening in the world at all times, and that's why they usually stay in one city.

When they heroes do fight a global crisis, it's usually one that only they can stop. If there's a secret plot to destroy the earth, Superman probably won't know about it, but Batman will. Batman may not know how to end a war, but Wonder Woman does. Wonder Woman may not be powerful enough to stop a meteor from hitting the earth, but Superman is. When there's a crisis that none of them would be able to solve on their own, that's when we need a Justice League, and that's what the movie's focus should be. The reason why DC's Big Five are the Big Five, is because they are DC's most iconic characters who have the least amount of redundancy.

 

[jmc]

Just make it an elsewords film and all will be good. Fewer hassles.

 

[BH/HHH]

Just make it an elsewords film and all will be good. Fewer hassles.

yeah probably if you think about it there are several versions of the characters in the comics all at once.

 

[jmc]

^ And whilst I hate that comics do that it's probably the easiest workaround for a film. All you gotta do is emphasize that whilst the same actors are portraying the same characters, the JL film is simply a JL film, not a massive cross pollination of various franchises, just a JL film that exists in it's own right and isn't part of some wider universe. The main issue I think for fans is that they want the same actors playing the roles more than anything else, creating an elsewords JL film solves that problem, it might not mean a 'DC universe' on film (which imo is unsustainable in the long run anyway), but you've got the same actors playing the same parts.

 

[theMan-Bat]

The fun of a Justice League movie for a lot of fans would be getting to see Ryan Reynolds' Green Lantern meet, interact and team up with Henry Cavill's Superman, etc. If their new solo movies are successful and loved and the public actually accepts them as these characters then the public will want to see only Ryan Reynolds as the Hal Jordan Green Lantern rather than some other guy that's suddenly suppose to be him in a team up movie and people would want to see Henry Cavill as Superman team up with the other superheroes rather than some other guy.

 

[Timstuff]

How many franchises can you think of where they changed actors for a role and then went back to the original in the next one? If things go as speculated, we'll be seeing Cavill as Superman in MOS, someone else in JL, and then Cavill again is MOS2. The same can be said of Reynolds, unless they use Jon Steward in JL. If the guy playing Batman does not show up in the next Batman solo film, he's sure to be the George Lazenby of the Batman franchise since he'll be sandwiched between Christian Bale and whoever headlines the next solo movie. The whole thing seems like a waste to me if they're not even going to try to use the actors from the solo films and just settle for second rate right from the start.

 

[BH/HHH]

How many franchises can you think of where they changed actors for a role and then went back to the original in the next one? If things go as speculated, we'll be seeing Cavill as Superman in MOS, someone else in JL, and then Cavill again is MOS2. The same can be said of Reynolds, unless they use Jon Stewart in JL. If the guy playing Batman does not show up in the next Batman solo film, he's sure to be the George Lazenby of the Batman franchise since he'll be sandwiched between Christian Bale and whoever headlines the next solo movie. The whole thing seems like a waste to me if they're not even going to try to use the actors from the solo films and just settle for second rate right from the start.

Yeah thats the bizarre thing, I feel like we're back were we were years ago and that project got shelved. I do think its strange that they have Henry for MOS and then are not planning on using him in Justice League. And as far as I can tell from the reports isn't the Justice League film gonna then lead into solo films? so does Cavill only get one shot at Superman? Unless they're waiting to see how he does or more likely what kind of numbers MOS does? I really do think JL will end up getting shelved again it just seems its been rushed into production

Another thing I was gonna say was what do people think should they called the Justice League or the Justice League of America? I just think if they were gonna shorten it down JLA sounds better than JL

 

[Timstuff]

The whole situation is a huge mess, and darned if I know whether or not Warner Bros. will ever figure it out. I thought that was the whole point of expanding DC Comics into DC Entertainment, but apparently it is not very effective so far if Warner Bros. still can't figure out how to put more than one of their characters into the same movie. It's all owned by the same company so you'd think this would not be that hard for them, seeing as the moment Marvel started producing their own films, some of their first thoughts were how to reach an Avengers film. They probably would have started a lot sooner if their rights weren't scattered across so many studios.

 

[jmc]

The only example I can think of of two actors play the same character at around the same time is Sean Connery and Roger Moore playing James Bond in the 1983 films Never Say Never Again and Octopussy respectively, and both were reasonably successful movies. Just something to think about.