Man, make one comment about not likin' someone's art and I get put on trial!...
Southerners, I said that I have talent because i can actually draw the stuff!! I think thats just as good as your so-called "taste", And i'll be glad to post my original art once I get my website organized...
And Lemon, it's not a weird stipulation, that's just where i think his art fits with superheroes, golden age stories and stuff. I could see him doing the art on a more kid-friendly series, but keep him away from Cap and my other faves, thats all I ask...
My point was that talent and opinion are two separate things. We all have opinions on movies, but is every last one of us a talented filmmaker? I highly doubt it. Whether you can draw or not is irrelevant to your opinions on art. That's all I'm saying. I hate that argument because it's ridiculous. Just a little pet peeve of mine.
My point was that talent and opinion are two separate things. We all have opinions on movies, but is every last one of us a talented filmmaker? I highly doubt it. Whether you can draw or not is irrelevant to your opinions on art. That's all I'm saying. I hate that argument because it's ridiculous. Just a little pet peeve of mine.
fair enough, but it wasn't opinion, it was my taste that was questioned. Everybody has their opinion, which is fine, and that was what started this.... I just wanted to know, In all your opinions, WHY do you like his art, specifically?
I like his art because I think he's the best natural storyteller in comics today, hands down. He also draws some of the most dynamic action scenes since Kirby.
I find his style to be really expressive and dynamic without being overdrawn. Like when he draws the Hulk, he can draw a Hulk that looks big and menacing and inhumanly powerful and generally as scary as ****, at the same time without having to detail all six trillion of the Hulk's muscles and neck-veins or making every drawing flawlessly photorealistic.
It's just extremely competent comics artwork. A lot of people dig that kind of thing.
"Numerous" and "everyone" aren't the same thing. Many people didn't misread the book, and subsequently, didn't criticize the book based on your totally erroneous premise.
But much more like not actually at all like that, in any way, shape, or form, except possibly if you define "extremist liberal" as "anywhere to the left of Rush Limbaugh."
Hey, I'm a registered Democrat and when I read ULTIMATES 2 I found many issues where the plot was buried behind some sort of drive to hit home Millar's belief that America under Bush after 9/11 and the invasion of Iraq is the worst nation that has ever existed on the face of the earth, full of propaganda-brainwashed jack booted thugs who bully smaller nations, kick children when they are down and use morals as an excuse for violence, and that any act of terrorism on U.S. soil is justified because we asked for it. The Liberators were presented as being far more heroic and justified than the Ultimates were until the end, which naturally the Ultimates had to win because they were American. If you read it now with the Democrats on the cusp of controlling the Presidency and Congress and Bush a lame duck, it only shows how knee-jerk it all was.
Just a shame that Loeb & Joe Mad made U3 so bad it made you WISH for the political hackwork of Millar.
No, Dread pretty much nailed it on the head. Civil War was the same, though to a lesser extent.
I don't mind if Millar is an (admittedly) ultra-liberal, but I do mind when he so obviously implements his politics into his stories, e.g. Ultimates 2.
If you read it now with the Democrats on the cusp of controlling the Presidency and Congress and Bush a lame duck, it only shows how knee-jerk it all was.
"In the name of oil, this administration is stirring up a hornet's nest... My own belief is that there'll be a couple of nuclear attacks in the States, the multinationals will move elsewhere, the American economy will completely collapse and make the 30s look like the 80s and the Middle East will be occupied by drafted teenagers from your home town."
And that was from four years ago. So yeah, I think knee-jerk is the perfect way to describe it.
Here is a repost of my thoughts on KICK-ash #1, with spoilers:
Dread said:
KICK-ash #1: A new ICON launch from Millar and Romita Jr., this is almost exactly what I thought it would be. It was promised it would be a "realistic" take on a superhero. Even the cover tagline seems sarcastic before you even open the book, and it is. I expected this to be violent, vulgar, and bleak, and so far it is. It is as if Millar needed to write something to get the stink of FANTASTIC FOUR esque "light-ness" off his fingers. Why Romita Jr. is along for the ride, who knows. Considering what a pedigree he is, that is like Alan Moore writing porn. Oh, wait, nevermind.
The story starts out in a "real world" type world where superheroes are media creations, y'know, like real life. We first meet Dave Lizewski as he is tied to a chair, having his nuts electrocuted by mobster types. Yeah, I SO didn't see that coming, a hero getting beaten down by Millar. Naturally, Dave is a high school schlub who fails in his social life and has a broken home who comes across the idea to be a superhero. Of course this goes horribly wrong as he stumbles into a fight with three gang-bangers of the sort who go, "How d'ya like THEM apples?" after they stab someone, which is the worst attempt by a white guy to write ghetto slang this year, or even decade. Anyone who is in a street gang who said that would be immediately pummeled to death. Naturally Dave, who is nicknamed "Kick-ash" by the thugs is immediately run over by a car and left for dead. So, who doesn't feel like hanging themselves yet? Because I sure did.
There's positive. Romita's art is great as always. There's Millar's cynical sense of humor which has it's moments, although I didn't appreciate him using Dave as a mouthpiece to accept some of the crap in movie adapations (he basically defends "Gas-Lactus" from FF2 for instance). Dave's costume looks pretty lame, but that is intentional.
But, god, the last time I read something this bleak, it was FOOLKILLER #1, which I happly abandoned thereafter. The question is whether I will give KICK-ash more of a shot merely because of the A-List creative team? I mean, that's shallow, but, that's life. Which, in Millar's eyes, is a cesspool of cynical violence where no one has any morals and those that do are always doomed to eternal torture and misery. There's a chance this could be different, but I seriously doubt it. The fact that Millar sees this as uncontested brilliance is the sort of self-congratulation that gets irritating. Please, I could have written **** like this in high school if I had a good artist friend.
The vibe from KICK-ash? This is Millar & Romita's version of ULTIMATE ADVENTURES, only rated R. And more bleak. Part of me is interested in seeing if Millar really will be as predictable as I fear, but that logic has kept me on a few irritating works. Whether I get issue #2 or not will depend on a whim whatever given week. It is a shame to read this alongside his FF debut.
I wasn't planning on picking this up, but Diamond screwed up a shipment with my shop and they ended up getting about 100 copies that they didn't order. Instead of returning them, they kept their mouths shut and gave them away with every purchase.
It's not horrible. It's not particularly good, but it's not bad. It reads like a 15 year old wrote it. That's about as good a description as I can give it. The JRJR art is good, but but I thought the art in X-Men: Legacy looked better.
It's not horrible. It's not particularly good, but it's not bad. It reads like a 15 year old wrote it. That's about as good a description as I can give it. The JRJR art is good, but but I thought the art in X-Men: Legacy looked better.
Well, the guy telling the story is supposed to be about 15 years old, he is in high school, so...isnt that a good thing that he has a voice that suits his age?
It was pretty different then the stuff I read. I actually thought it was great and definitely picking up the next issue. I've always been on the fence as far as Romita Jr.'s art is concerned. Sometimes it looks good and other time's it just looks rushed. However, his art works in this title.
Hey, I'm a registered Democrat and when I read ULTIMATES 2 I found many issues where the plot was buried behind some sort of drive to hit home Millar's belief that America under Bush after 9/11
I'm fairly sure this is a gross exageration and somewhat blinkered view of some relatively minor political commentary the book contained, which regardless of how you wish to swing it, the ultimates were RIGHT in what they done (ie they could actually find WMDS..).
Even with thor reality had literally been altered, they can't be held accountable for that.
The Liberators were presented as being far more heroic and justified than the Ultimates were until the end, which naturally the Ultimates had to win because they were American.
Completely disagree. Pretty much becuase the liberators tried to appear reasonable and when things turned started killing anything and everything (ie all the innocent people around them).
That and the irony of calling themselves the liberators but amongst the first things they do is topple the statue of liberty.
I'm fairly sure this is a gross exageration and somewhat blinkered view of some relatively minor political commentary the book contained, which regardless of how you wish to swing it, the ultimates were RIGHT in what they done (ie they could actually find WMDS..).
Even with thor reality had literally been altered, they can't be held accountable for that.
Completely disagree. Pretty much becuase the liberators tried to appear reasonable and when things turned started killing anything and everything (ie all the innocent people around them).
That and the irony of calling themselves the liberators but amongst the first things they do is topple the statue of liberty.
I asked for something in the issues. That's completely irrelevant to the discussion. You're taking something millar has said and claiming it applies as if he has said it in the comic book series. I know the internet is full of people taking qutoes out of context but this is impressive.
Pro american messages in the ultimates 2?
1. The americans win
2. Despite all their talk the ACTIONS of the liberators betray them as psycho terrorists
3. At the end despite what's happened the american government lets the ultimates go independant (FREEDOM!!)
4. The americans in the ultimates ACTUALLY FIND wmds
5. In the very first issue cap as the de facto american symbol actually talks terrorists down (well threatens but he doesn't hit them) even though they have hostages
6. Gods come to the aid of the ultimates (turns out people were right god is on americas side!)
Thats 6 examples from the issues, do the same for your point.
Also, with the Ultimates 2, the big joke on the American readership is that whle the Ultimates and the Americans in the book are far, far more humanized and less freakish than the Liberators, Millar really wants us to think that in real life, America is actually the Liberators. I think it is a neat trick and one that shows why Millar is such a great writer. As an American, you can enjoy it because the Ultimates ("your side") wins, and was right, just as Gildea stated above me, but as an American, you can't entirely be comforted because you are the villain in your own arc. And that is the true beauty of the Ultimates.
As far as Kick-ash goes, I gave my review, so you can read it. It wasn't the best issue I've ever read, but it was very good. The next issue should only get better. Everything about the book fired on all cylinders except for the narrative structure and the art. Given that you know he survives the car-crash long enough to be tortured, why end the issue on a "cliffhanger?" Also, the art, I may open up a can of worms but I really can't stand JRjr's art. I've never liked it. I don't mean anything against anybody but I've never liked his art.
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