Legend of Zelda Offical The Legend of Zelda Thread - Part 1

[Thundercrack85]

It makes sense to spread the Zelda's out. Overexposure is never a good thing.

 

[X Knight]

the core titles should be spread out.

but I wouldn't mind more spinoffs in between.

cough.....Zelda spinoff........cough......

 

[Thundercrack85]

I think any game that stars Zelda should be a main title.

 

[Mad Ones]

I agree with that, but I don't think Nintendo does unfortunately.

I've always wanted a LoZ game starring Zelda where it makes it clear why exactly this franchise is called the Legend of Zelda.

 

[X Knight]

I think any game that stars Zelda should be a main title.

I agree with that, but I don't think Nintendo does unfortunately.

I've always wanted a LoZ game starring Zelda where it makes it clear why exactly this franchise is called the Legend of Zelda.

yeah. that's one reason why, for that brief period, I was actually getting excited for the possibility that was really Zelda in the trailer and she'd be the star of the new game.

they talk about wanting to shake up the conventions........

well, that would have been a bold move to make Zelda the main character in the new game instead of Link.

play the story from Zelda's perspective. make her the protagonist, and not the damsel in distress.

 

[Thundercrack85]

I think Zelda being playable will happen one day.

I don't think Nintendo has to be too worried about fan reaction for once.

Though I suspect even if they had her be playable, there would also be a Link storyline.

 

[Thundercrack85]

I agree with that, but I don't think Nintendo does unfortunately.

I've always wanted a LoZ game starring Zelda where it makes it clear why exactly this franchise is called the Legend of Zelda.

The legend is actually explained in Zelda II, and Skyward Sword borrows some elements from that.

 

[Mad Ones]

Right. Zelda is integral to the mythology for sure. Even OoT Zelda creating the split timeline. I just want something a bit more.

And I can't stand Zelda II lol.

 

[zenith16]

1. This first one is from Day 3 of the tree house from twitch sorry couldn't find another one on Youtube at all that didn't have this kid have a nerdgasium since one esle ahs put one up.
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   Play! Nintendo Treehouse Day 3 LIVE! Hyrule Warriors
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   and this is just from the shows floor.
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    E3 2014 Hyrule Warriors Gameplay Playing as Zelda
    • by Nintendo Enthusiast
    • 4 days ago
    • 1,139 views
    
    Hyrule Warriors raw footage from the e3 show floor.
    
    • New
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[DarthSkywalker]

Is there any reason to want Zelda as the main character other then she is a female? Seriously, The Legend of Zelda is Link's tale. Has been from the first, will be until the end. This is like wanting to replace Samus with a dude just cause.

 

[Mad Ones]

Nintendo doesn't even see "Link" as a definitive character or anything. There are many statements saying that Link is pretty undefined since he's just a stand-in for the player. And women also play video games... therefore...

I'm personally interested in Zelda as a character and I think there's potential there. Nintendo states they are ready to embrace change and break convention. Also having Zelda being the main character prevents her from being a damsel in distress again.

 

[X Knight]

Nintendo doesn't even see "Link" as a definitive character or anything. There are many statements saying that Link is pretty undefined since he's just a stand-in for the player. And women also play video games... therefore...

I'm personally interested in Zelda as a character and I think there's potential there. Nintendo states they are ready to embrace change and break convention. Also having Zelda being the main character prevents her from being a damsel in distress again.

^ this.

 

[HighFivingMF]

Is there any reason to want Zelda as the main character other then she is a female? Seriously, The Legend of Zelda is Link's tale. Has been from the first, will be until the end. This is like wanting to replace Samus with a dude just cause.

Read, like, any post in favor of it. None of them are "Playing as a girl! Yeah!"

And Legend of Zelda isn't Link's tale. It's been, like, 8 different dudes named Links' tales.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Is there any reason to want Zelda as the main character other then she is a female? Seriously, The Legend of Zelda is Link's tale. Has been from the first, will be until the end. This is like wanting to replace Samus with a dude just cause.

Well, it would be an interesting angle to say the least. Link is usually a nobody, who becomes a somebody. Zelda is heir to the entire kingdom, that makes her background rather unique.

I think the Metroid analogy is rather silly. Zelda has been in virtually every single Zelda game (unsurprisingly), and her name is in the title. You have even been able to sort of play as her in Spirit Tracks. Not to mention the upcoming Hyrule Warriors.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Nintendo doesn't even see "Link" as a definitive character or anything. There are many statements saying that Link is pretty undefined since he's just a stand-in for the player. And women also play video games... therefore...

I'm personally interested in Zelda as a character and I think there's potential there. Nintendo states they are ready to embrace change and break convention. Also having Zelda being the main character prevents her from being a damsel in distress again.

Except their last 4 console games go against that. And women play games, ok? I guess I can't play Bayonetta, Metroid, or Beyond Good and Evil anymore.

Zelda hasn't been a damsel in distress since OoT. We explore her character all the time. Arguably more then Link. I'd suggest another playthrough of Skyward Sword, Twilight Princess, Wind Waker or OoT.

Read, like, any post in favor of it. None of them are "Playing as a girl! Yeah!"

And Legend of Zelda isn't Link's tale. It's been, like, 8 different dudes named Links' tales.

Each Link is basically a reincarnation as established in Skyward Sword. It is most definitely his tale. "The spirit of the Hero".

Every post in favor seems to miss that entire structure established in Skyward Sword that sets out exactly what the series is about. Link is the Hero, who is the champion of the Goddess' (Zelda) bloodline, destined to defeat Demise (Ganon).

It is literally all explained in Skyward Sword.

Well, it would be an interesting angle to say the least. Link is usually a nobody, who becomes a somebody. Zelda is heir to the entire kingdom, that makes her background rather unique.

I think the Metroid analogy is rather silly. Zelda has been in virtually every single Zelda game (unsurprisingly), and her name is in the title. You have even been able to sort of play as her in Spirit Tracks. Not to mention the upcoming Hyrule Warriors.

As the original "Ganon" put it...

"Those like you... Those who share the blood of the goddess and the spirit of the hero... They are eternally bound to this curse. An incarnation of my hatred shall ever follow your kind, dooming them to wander a blood-soaked sea of darkness for all time!" — Demise (Skyward Sword)

That is the cycle of Zelda. Zelda is based on "Legend" and has followed that structure ever since. The young hero who saves the world from darkness. Now if there was ever a female Link, fair enough. But Link is is the hero of the tale. Not Zelda.

The Master Sword/Fi is linked to the Hero's Spirit (Link). It is Link's weapon. It is what is able to banish Demise (Ganon). Now Link can be a woman, I have no problem with this. But that role is Link's, not Zelda's.

 

[Thundercrack85]

I didn't care for Skyward Sword.

Too damn many retcons.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

It tried to give a reason for all the different incarnations of Link/Zelda/Ganon. Which I don't blame them for wanting to do, it was just unnecessary.

 

[Mad Ones]

I liked Skyward Sword, and I was pretty happy with the mythology. However: a) nowhere does it state that the hero has to be a man (women can have the "spirit of the hero" too) and b) who wouldn't want to play as a reincarnated goddess?!

Zelda gets kidnapped or loses agency in OoT, WW, TP, and SS. It's somewhat more developed than Peach getting kidnapped, for example, but it doesn't make it any less frustrating when as soon as Zelda gets rid of her Sheik disguise she gets kidnapped, or can't defeat Demise herself and gets kidnapped by Ghirahim.

I like a lot of Zelda's role in the franchise, but I do not want to have to save her in the last act of the game again. She's a big enough deal to warrant her own adventure.

And women play games, ok? I guess I can't play Bayonetta, Metroid, or Beyond Good and Evil anymore

Congratulations, you just named 80 percent of games that have a female protagonist. Your argument might be more valid if women were in the same position as men in gaming culture.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I didn't care for Skyward Sword.

Too damn many retcons.

How is it in anyway a retcon? It changes nothing, it just puts confirmation to what was already established. You are simply dismissing it because you don't like it. That doesn't make it a retcon nor does it change what it confirms.

I liked Skyward Sword, and I was pretty happy with the mythology. However: a) nowhere does it state that the hero has to be a man (women can have the "spirit of the hero" too) and b) who wouldn't want to play as a reincarnated goddess?!

a) correct the hero dies not have to be a man. But the "spirit of the hero" is Link, male or female. Not Zelda.

b) I adore Bayonetta, so yeah I like it. But that isn't what main series, or really any Zelda is about. It is about Link.

Zelda gets kidnapped or loses agency in OoT, WW, TP, and SS. It's somewhat more developed than Peach getting kidnapped, for example, but it doesn't make it any less frustrating when as soon as Zelda gets rid of her Sheik disguise she gets kidnapped, or can't defeat Demise herself and gets kidnapped by Ghirahim.

Why is it frustrating? Does it frustrate you when Ganon gets his butt kicked in the end every time?

I like a lot of Zelda's role in the franchise, but I do not want to have to save her in the last act of the game again. She's a big enough deal to warrant her own adventure.

She can have her own adventures. But they should not be main series Legend of Zelda games imo. The console main series games belong to Link.

Congratulations, you just named 80 percent of games that have a female protagonist. Your argument might be more valid if women were in the same position as men in gaming culture.

So why is your answer to play with an established franchise with an established mythos? By the way, if you think that equals 80% of games with female protagonist, I'd suggest a calculator or the playing of more games.

I myself just finished Transistor and Child of Light. Both games with female leads, both fantastic. Also just had my second run through on the latest Tomb Raider. Not Uncharted 2, but quite good imo.

 

[Mad Ones]

I love Tomb Raider! Excellent game. But if you can't see that the gaming world is extremely dominated by men and male characters then I don't know what to say.

[YT]85M3LnoHz6o[/YT]

I'd also recommend you watch Feminist Frequency's videos.

Why would Ganon getting his butt kicked frustrate me? Yeah it annoys me seeing a strong woman getting captured just so the male hero has someone to save. Especially when there's no reason for it whatsoever (Twilight Princess anyone?). SS didn't establish that Zelda was always destined to be kidnapped.

I'd rather not have a Zelda led game be in the periphery.

The conventions of this franchise are already being played with, and we don't even know the extent yet. Playing as Zelda doesn't change the mythology. Also a game can be set way after SS where that cycle is broken. There are possibilities.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

I love Tomb Raider! Excellent game. But if you can't see that the gaming world is extremely dominated by men and male characters then I don't know what to say.

[YT]85M3LnoHz6o[/YT]

I'd also recommend you watch Feminist Frequency's videos.

I never said games weren't dominated by male characters, like all fiction. That doesn't mean we need to mess with an established franchise to add more female leads. You make new IPs and make more games where a female lead is already established. That or you take a series like Final Fantasy, where the lead changes from game to game.

Why would Ganon getting his butt kicked frustrate me? Yeah it annoys me seeing a strong woman getting captured just so the male hero has someone to save. Especially when there's not reason for it whatsoever (Twilight Princess anyone?)

Zelda's strength lays in her magic and her wisdom. In many ways she is Obi-Wan to Link's Luke. She cannot confront Ganon 1v1, just like Link can't take on Ganon without Zelda's tutelage.

And my point is your problem isn't with established tropes, but one very specific idea.

I'd rather not have a Zelda led game be in the periphery.

Then I suggest no Zelda-led game.

The conventions of this franchise are already being played with, and we don't even know the extent yet.

Well we already know the lead is Link and that he is a male. As to the playing with the conventions of the franchise, I'd be looking at gameplay mechanics and design.

 

[Mad Ones]

Tradition has been an excuse to exclude women for centuries. Zelda games didn't traditionally have motion controls. Things change.

Zelda isn't wise enough to not get herself captured. Princess = Kidnapped victim (because tradition! I guess).

The protagonist defeating the antagonist isn't an offensive trope. They're not even comparable. The antagonist has to be defeated in order to conclude the game. A woman doesn't have to get kidnapped at all.

A female/Zelda leading the Zelda franchise is coming one day. It might not be the next game, but there was a lot of reaction to just the possibility. And Nintendo would be stupid to not explore the potential.

 

[Thundercrack85]

Zelda is one of those franchises where I think there might actually be as many female fans as male fans.

I don't really see what the issue is. Zelda was kicking ass solo in Ocarina of Time and Wind Waker (well, really more implied with the former). She also did some fighting in Twilight Princess and Spirit Tracks.

She has her own quest in Skyward Sword.

The real question isn't if she should be playable. It should be: pirate, ninja, mage or lady of war?

 

[Klank]

What if Link's more androgynous appearance in the trailer is deliberate.

Perhaps a cool idea for the game would be that you can customize the character down to the gender.

Despite a few personality traits Link isn't really a character, he's an avatar. His name isn't really Link it's whatever you as a player choose to call him. Maybe in an attempt to make this new world more interactive you make Link however you want him (or her) to be.

I'm probably way off as it could potentially remove any romantic tension between Link and Zelda but it strikes me there's never been all that much of that in the games themselves so would it be a big deal?

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Tradition has been an excuse to exclude women for centuries. Zelda games didn't traditionally have motion controls. Things change.

How you play the Legend of Zelda has evolved over the years. The characters haven't changed. Link is the hero, Zelda the princess, and Ganon is darkness.

Zelda isn't wise enough to not get herself captured. Princess = Kidnapped victim (because tradition! I guess).

Well The Legend of Zelda is based on Legend. If you have seen the movie, you'd understand.

Also, since when did getting captured equal incapable? Are James Bond, Indiana Jones, or Han Solo incapable?

The protagonist defeating the antagonist isn't an offensive trope. They're not even comparable. The antagonist has to be defeated in order to conclude the game. A woman doesn't have to get kidnapped at all.

It is if you consider the fact that Ganon is quite oftent clearly a minority. But I am not about to make Zelda a social question.

A female/Zelda leading the Zelda franchise is coming one day. It might not be the next game, but there was a lot of reaction to just the possibility. And Nintendo would be stupid to not explore the potential.

A female Link does not equal a Zelda led franchise. And if there is a Zelda led franchise, I seriously doubt it is the main series, as that would mean a decade at least. After all, there are years between main console LoZ games.

Zelda is one of those franchises where I think there might actually be as many female fans as male fans.

I don't really see what the issue is. Zelda was kicking ass solo in Ocarina of Time and Wind Waker (well, really more implied with the former). She also did some fighting in Twilight Princess and Spirit Tracks.

She has her own quest in Skyward Sword.

The real question isn't if she should be playable. It should be: pirate, ninja, mage or lady of war?

It doesn't. The amount of male to female gamers establishes that as extremely unlikely.

And the issue is ignoring that the Legend of Zelda is Link's series. Once again, Skyward Sword tells us this.