On Reading Reviews: A Different Vision for Us?

The evidence is there. The quotes from James Marsden and Ben Foster. The pictures of them in costume in posters. Their shooting schedules. The ambiguity of Cyke's "death." The flood of reviews casually spilling the biggest kept secret in Hollywood of all time two weeks in advance of the film's official release. We shall see. :D
 
PhoenixRisen said:
The evidence is there. The quotes from James Marsden and Ben Foster. The pictures of them in costume in posters. Their shooting schedules. The ambiguity of Cyke's "death." The flood of reviews casually spilling the biggest kept secret in Hollywood of all time two weeks in advance of the film's official release. We shall see. :D

I have to agree, I thought critics aren't supposed to release spoilers and reviews till like a few days or a week before the film hits?
 
I missed this from the reviews...did anyone mention what Storm's balcony scene was about?
 
ShadesOfRedd said:
I agree with most of this but didn't Kinberg later say something about the surprises not referring to Scott?

I know what you're talking about, and no.

Simon specifically said Cyclops had some surprises.

The quote you're referring to, Simon was actually talkiang about surprises not related to Cyclops. Someone asked if they did relate to him, and Simon said no.

But check post #4 in Simon's archive on the xverse. I believe I even posted it in this thread. Simon says that Scott has "many surprises"
 
There has to be another version... It doesn't make any sense... All the things they've promised... Didn't say iceman there were 5 different versions of the film??? And of course, seeing magneto keepping his powers diminshed at the end isn't a surprise...unless it means they're gonna do another one soon. And i do think it's gonna be the last one, so for sure there's another version where there'll be some huge surprises
 
another thing...Lets think about the long trailer...
1) they show too little about cyclops, so i suppose the surprise will be about him, caused they promised
2) we see phoenix face shot and she was iluminated like ligthnings were around here and a storm shot like if they were about to fight...another ting they promised
3)storm's tidal wave was in, and it looked spectacular, so it's well done to keep it out
4)rogue also seemed to have a good part in the film, specially with the love triangle, so i am sure it will be on the film
5)doesn't make any sense not having phoenix effect, if it was a little bit on x2
6)although they're making a good promotion of the film, it seems like the film is on the net already with that amount of clips, tv spots...they're gonna make a big surprise
and finally, angel seemed an important addition to the cast, so he will go to the final battle and fight, just like cyclops, and probably rogue..It's they final one and everybody wants their fav carcacthers in that battle.
 
Nell2ThaIzzay said:
Here's my theory:

Disclaimer: I do know that there are a lot of things that could go against this, but with everything we've been getting thus far about an "alternate" version (as has been all but proven with conflicting advance screenings), I believe that there is a hint to possibility here

Fox is using this whole "unfinished effects" and "cut effects scenes" as an excuse to show a near final version, but not quite.

They could use the excuse that effects were needed to still be tweaked.

Warning: I will post spoilers, if you don't know of the details we've gotten regarding the end of the film, and don't want to know, do not continue reading, as I will not use spoiler tags

Simon Kinberg did say more mutants would join the battle, if I recall correctly. And really, the only mutants left to join the battle are Cyclops, Angel, and Rogue. None of which we've seen any kind of footage of at the final battle, and no reports have come in saying they were there. Nightcrawler was never officially an X-Men team member, and was never promoted in a team uniform, however, Angel is being promoted that way. It does imply that he will join the team.

I believe that these extra mutants, whoever they are, all come in at once, and will be at least Angel and Cyclops.

The whole Dark Phoenix seducing Wolverine thing could actually work in the storyline. She continues to seduce him, and spiral out of control, and he believes that his love for her is growing stronger and stronger. She thinks that she killed Scott (as does everyone else), so with someone else not there, it's easier to give into your desires in the case of Wolverine, and play with someone else's desires in the case of Jean Grey / Phoenix.

The writers have stated "many surprises" for Cyclops. Well, we all knew he was gonna get blown up at Alkali Lake, and they knew we knew that.

There was one TV spot that showed, what appeared to me, to be Angel inside of the Mansion.

So work with me here...

Not shown in these press screenings are:

-Cyclops coming back to the mansion
-Meets Angel
-Angel briefs Cyclops on what the X-Men are up to
-Cyclops gives Angel a uniform (people at one point talked about Angel wearing Scott's uniform... perhaps they could pull a remake of a deleted scene from X-Men when Scott gave Logan one of his old uniforms)
-Angel and Cyclops go to Alcatraz

For an even more dramatic entrance, we don't see anything of that until Angel flies Scott into Alcatraz.

Cue TOB's theory:

After Wolverine stabs Phoenix with his claws, thinking he killed her, she rises again. Afterall, if rushing waves of flooding water, and being submerged underneath said waters of a period of months, doesn't kill her, how could being stabbed by some metal claws?

She rises again, but this time Cyclops is here to bring her back.

I honestly think that killing off Phoenix again is redundant. As much as they make an attempt, I don't think it will have the lasting emotional impact, because it will be thought by the general audience "won't she just come back again? She died once already"

I think for the purposes of good storytelling, she MUST come back.

But they could use the excuse of any effects needed for Phoenix re-rising, Angel flying Cyclops into Alcatraz, or any optic blasts, being incomplete as to why they were cut.

Fox toyed with us once already. I wasn't around for X2, but the word is that they pulled a fast one with Jean Grey. And granted, that was a much larger plot point than whether or not Cyclops dies, the fan hysteria over Cyclops' supposed death has caused an overwhelming impact.

I find it hard to believe that people who talk such a big game about being such big fans, could be attacked with the outrage from the fans over the fate of a particular character, with time to change it, and still not make any changes to it and leave him dead in the water. Adn then have the nerve to talk about how great of allies they've been to the fan community.

We never saw the AICN 3rd act... scenes are obviously being cut and / or tweaked for these screenings. Fox has a perfect oppourtunity to pull a fast one on us, when they've been playing the super secret game for so long.

I can't give up all hope yet. I mean, honestly, I know it's not very likely, all this fuss over one character that obviously isn't even a major player. But I refuse to believe that the parameters were to just up and kill Cyclops, and get him out of the way so Hugh Jackman's Wolverine can shine, when we have just as small name actors playing characters who ARE getting their moments.

There has got to be something going on with Cyclops that everyone but us knows about. Fox, Simon, Zak, Brett, Lauren, they all must just be thinking "Neener neener neener, we know something you don't!" about this whole Fox situation.

I mean, we never see him killed?! That's just SCREAMING for a return later on in the movie.

There's an oppourtunity there to keep us all in suspense, and it just might be working. I just can't believe that with everything else these guys are getting right (fixing Storm, Beast's character, continuing the brilliance of Magneto's character, the great Cure plotline, Angel's introduction, the final battle) that they'd **** up something so major in the most beloved story arc in X-Men history in the Phoenix Saga, and one of it's most important characters in Cyclops.

To me, something like that is a role that the writers are proud of, within the parameters, and something the fans will be proud of.

It might not be what we want, in Cyclops being the movie's leading man, but it'd at least be what we need, in keeping the basics of the storyline intact (the strength of Jean & Scott's love)

We've had James talk about wearing the uniform. We've seen a picture that heavily implies him in uniform in the Alcatraz complex. We've seen Patrick Stewart talk about how Scott & Jean's relationship is different from Logan & Jean's, or Xavier & Jean's. We've seen the writers talk about surprises for the character, being proud of the performance, and the fans being pleased with the character. And we've seen them make comments about not all fates being what they appear.

Again, I know it's not likely. But I think there's a chance. And the death of Cyclops, never to return for the rest of the movie, does in fact conflict with things we've seen and heard.

Call me a sucker. Call me naiive. And say I'll be disappointed come May 26th for thinking like this.

But I just CAN'T give up the good fight. I've been beaten, I've been bruised, and I've pulled the white flag out of the closet. But I'll be damned if I've waved it yet. I'm gonna hold on for dear life by my fingernails if I have to, but just like Scott would never give up on Jean, I won't give up on Scott.

great post and it opens up hope for rogue too. i hope they don't ruin the pheonix saga story. and with the short running time being said it also gives hope those scenes will be added in the final.
 
Nell2ThaIzzay said:
Here's my theory:

Disclaimer: I do know that there are a lot of things that could go against this, but with everything we've been getting thus far about an "alternate" version (as has been all but proven with conflicting advance screenings), I believe that there is a hint to possibility here

Fox is using this whole "unfinished effects" and "cut effects scenes" as an excuse to show a near final version, but not quite.

They could use the excuse that effects were needed to still be tweaked.

Warning: I will post spoilers, if you don't know of the details we've gotten regarding the end of the film, and don't want to know, do not continue reading, as I will not use spoiler tags

Simon Kinberg did say more mutants would join the battle, if I recall correctly. And really, the only mutants left to join the battle are Cyclops, Angel, and Rogue. None of which we've seen any kind of footage of at the final battle, and no reports have come in saying they were there. Nightcrawler was never officially an X-Men team member, and was never promoted in a team uniform, however, Angel is being promoted that way. It does imply that he will join the team.

I believe that these extra mutants, whoever they are, all come in at once, and will be at least Angel and Cyclops.

The whole Dark Phoenix seducing Wolverine thing could actually work in the storyline. She continues to seduce him, and spiral out of control, and he believes that his love for her is growing stronger and stronger. She thinks that she killed Scott (as does everyone else), so with someone else not there, it's easier to give into your desires in the case of Wolverine, and play with someone else's desires in the case of Jean Grey / Phoenix.

The writers have stated "many surprises" for Cyclops. Well, we all knew he was gonna get blown up at Alkali Lake, and they knew we knew that.

There was one TV spot that showed, what appeared to me, to be Angel inside of the Mansion.

So work with me here...

Not shown in these press screenings are:

-Cyclops coming back to the mansion
-Meets Angel
-Angel briefs Cyclops on what the X-Men are up to
-Cyclops gives Angel a uniform (people at one point talked about Angel wearing Scott's uniform... perhaps they could pull a remake of a deleted scene from X-Men when Scott gave Logan one of his old uniforms)
-Angel and Cyclops go to Alcatraz

For an even more dramatic entrance, we don't see anything of that until Angel flies Scott into Alcatraz.

Cue TOB's theory:

After Wolverine stabs Phoenix with his claws, thinking he killed her, she rises again. Afterall, if rushing waves of flooding water, and being submerged underneath said waters of a period of months, doesn't kill her, how could being stabbed by some metal claws?

She rises again, but this time Cyclops is here to bring her back.

I honestly think that killing off Phoenix again is redundant. As much as they make an attempt, I don't think it will have the lasting emotional impact, because it will be thought by the general audience "won't she just come back again? She died once already"

I think for the purposes of good storytelling, she MUST come back.

But they could use the excuse of any effects needed for Phoenix re-rising, Angel flying Cyclops into Alcatraz, or any optic blasts, being incomplete as to why they were cut.

Fox toyed with us once already. I wasn't around for X2, but the word is that they pulled a fast one with Jean Grey. And granted, that was a much larger plot point than whether or not Cyclops dies, the fan hysteria over Cyclops' supposed death has caused an overwhelming impact.

I find it hard to believe that people who talk such a big game about being such big fans, could be attacked with the outrage from the fans over the fate of a particular character, with time to change it, and still not make any changes to it and leave him dead in the water. Adn then have the nerve to talk about how great of allies they've been to the fan community.

We never saw the AICN 3rd act... scenes are obviously being cut and / or tweaked for these screenings. Fox has a perfect oppourtunity to pull a fast one on us, when they've been playing the super secret game for so long.

I can't give up all hope yet. I mean, honestly, I know it's not very likely, all this fuss over one character that obviously isn't even a major player. But I refuse to believe that the parameters were to just up and kill Cyclops, and get him out of the way so Hugh Jackman's Wolverine can shine, when we have just as small name actors playing characters who ARE getting their moments.

There has got to be something going on with Cyclops that everyone but us knows about. Fox, Simon, Zak, Brett, Lauren, they all must just be thinking "Neener neener neener, we know something you don't!" about this whole Fox situation.

I mean, we never see him killed?! That's just SCREAMING for a return later on in the movie.

There's an oppourtunity there to keep us all in suspense, and it just might be working. I just can't believe that with everything else these guys are getting right (fixing Storm, Beast's character, continuing the brilliance of Magneto's character, the great Cure plotline, Angel's introduction, the final battle) that they'd **** up something so major in the most beloved story arc in X-Men history in the Phoenix Saga, and one of it's most important characters in Cyclops.

To me, something like that is a role that the writers are proud of, within the parameters, and something the fans will be proud of.

It might not be what we want, in Cyclops being the movie's leading man, but it'd at least be what we need, in keeping the basics of the storyline intact (the strength of Jean & Scott's love)

We've had James talk about wearing the uniform. We've seen a picture that heavily implies him in uniform in the Alcatraz complex. We've seen Patrick Stewart talk about how Scott & Jean's relationship is different from Logan & Jean's, or Xavier & Jean's. We've seen the writers talk about surprises for the character, being proud of the performance, and the fans being pleased with the character. And we've seen them make comments about not all fates being what they appear.

Again, I know it's not likely. But I think there's a chance. And the death of Cyclops, never to return for the rest of the movie, does in fact conflict with things we've seen and heard.

Call me a sucker. Call me naiive. And say I'll be disappointed come May 26th for thinking like this.

But I just CAN'T give up the good fight. I've been beaten, I've been bruised, and I've pulled the white flag out of the closet. But I'll be damned if I've waved it yet. I'm gonna hold on for dear life by my fingernails if I have to, but just like Scott would never give up on Jean, I won't give up on Scott.
Great post Nell:up: though i think you'll be disappointed on May 26 about Cyclops and Angel. I hope i'm 100% wrong of course.:(
 
Stuff like this is just misleading....

x3sb0827qz.jpg



Source: http://www.thexverse.com/gallery_image.php?image=864&parent=42
 
Retroman said:

Hmm...

See, when Nightcrawler never wore the suit in X2, his promotional shots were all still in the garb that he wore in the movie.

So with Angel, if he were never to join the team, and fight alongside them, in uniform, why would they need to market him as a member of the team?

Even if Cyclops never wore the uniform, I could understand why he'd still wear it in promos.

But if Angel never fights with the team, never becomes an X-Men member, he's just a small role to help tell the cure storyline, why would they market him as a member of the X-Men?

There is something up here, something that we haven't been told. I'm almost positive that we'll see more Angel than we're being told, and if that is indeed the case, then I think there's a good chance we may see a bit more Cyclops than we're being led to believe.

Look, I know that the core fanbase isn't what makes all the profits of these movies, but they are still a big part. It's not just the comics that make X-Men fans, many people are fans through the cartoons, and most people have at least some kind of knowledge of the X-Men (before the movies, I'm talking)... the fanbase does make up a larger percentage of this audience than we will acknowledge, even if it's an extended fanbase. In my life, I've only ever met one person who didn't even know who the X-Men were, and most people I've come across, have some level of fandom to them, even if it's just through the cartoons.

Here on these message boards, we are the die hards. And even here on the boards, we are a small percentage. Not every die hard X-Men fan is gonna be on these boards. I sure as hell wasn't for X-Men or X2, and I've been a die hard fan since well before the first movie.

The fans are important.

And here on the internet, we've had the luxury of being able to voice our concerns directly to the creative forces behind this movie. Even when it was just a leaked script early in the process, our voices were heard.

I just can't imagine that our outcry over the fates of certain characters (Cyclops, for example), fell upon deaf ears. The writers and director claim to be fans. Rothman claims to be all about the source material. And when a major outcry is made, I find it hard to believe that these people (fans or not, about the source material, or not) would just ignore it and say "despite the fact that a large number of people dislike it, we're gonna do it anyways", when it's that large number of people that are the major factors for these movies being made.

I know that stuff has been bastardized before, and will be bastardized again... but there was uproar to certain events, early enough to make changes, and that uproar was heard. I refuse to believe that it was totally ignored.

Something is up... really up.
 
It's funny. Nell's basically re-written the movie to what he THINKS it SHOULD be.

It was sort of like reading fan fiction.
 
TheVileOne said:
It's funny. Nell's basically re-written the movie to what he THINKS it SHOULD be.

It was sort of like reading fan fiction.

And?

You've stated you won't watch the movie at all because it's not what you think it should be...
 
Hi Nell,
Even if the points you made are not in the movie, I for one think they should be, it would definitely make excellent viewing and a great climax to the trilogy.

-SB
 
I don't know if it was discussed, because I skipped that last batch of post, to avoid spoilers... :p
But Kinberg said in thexverse that some theories from the users here in the Cyclops thread of the SHH boards were really close to what really happened to Scott in the movie. Why would he say that if every "non-believer" (a lot of people) were talking about what now seems to be the truth? That's the kind of thing you say if 1 or 2 persons are close to the outcome, not half the boards...
 
Kanon said:
I don't know if it was discussed, because I skipped that last batch of post, to avoid spoilers... :p
But Kinberg said in thexverse that some theories from the users here in the Cyclops thread of the SHH boards were really close to what really happened to Scott in the movie. Why would he say that if every "non-believer" (a lot of people) were talking about what now seems to be the truth? That's the kind of thing you say if 1 or 2 persons are close to the outcome, not half the boards...
Yup. I guess the "hot" theory is he dies lololol!! :D
 
Nell2ThaIzzay said:
Hmm...

See, when Nightcrawler never wore the suit in X2, his promotional shots were all still in the garb that he wore in the movie.

So with Angel, if he were never to join the team, and fight alongside them, in uniform, why would they need to market him as a member of the team?

Even if Cyclops never wore the uniform, I could understand why he'd still wear it in promos.

But if Angel never fights with the team, never becomes an X-Men member, he's just a small role to help tell the cure storyline, why would they market him as a member of the X-Men?

There is something up here, something that we haven't been told. I'm almost positive that we'll see more Angel than we're being told, and if that is indeed the case, then I think there's a good chance we may see a bit more Cyclops than we're being led to believe.

Look, I know that the core fanbase isn't what makes all the profits of these movies, but they are still a big part. It's not just the comics that make X-Men fans, many people are fans through the cartoons, and most people have at least some kind of knowledge of the X-Men (before the movies, I'm talking)... the fanbase does make up a larger percentage of this audience than we will acknowledge, even if it's an extended fanbase. In my life, I've only ever met one person who didn't even know who the X-Men were, and most people I've come across, have some level of fandom to them, even if it's just through the cartoons.

Here on these message boards, we are the die hards. And even here on the boards, we are a small percentage. Not every die hard X-Men fan is gonna be on these boards. I sure as hell wasn't for X-Men or X2, and I've been a die hard fan since well before the first movie.

The fans are important.

And here on the internet, we've had the luxury of being able to voice our concerns directly to the creative forces behind this movie. Even when it was just a leaked script early in the process, our voices were heard.

I just can't imagine that our outcry over the fates of certain characters (Cyclops, for example), fell upon deaf ears. The writers and director claim to be fans. Rothman claims to be all about the source material. And when a major outcry is made, I find it hard to believe that these people (fans or not, about the source material, or not) would just ignore it and say "despite the fact that a large number of people dislike it, we're gonna do it anyways", when it's that large number of people that are the major factors for these movies being made.

I know that stuff has been bastardized before, and will be bastardized again... but there was uproar to certain events, early enough to make changes, and that uproar was heard. I refuse to believe that it was totally ignored.

Something is up... really up.

Well, I hope your right . . . . . . if not, I will be none too pleased . . . . . . you optimists.
 
Kanon said:
I don't know if it was discussed, because I skipped that last batch of post, to avoid spoilers... :p
But Kinberg said in thexverse that some theories from the users here in the Cyclops thread of the SHH boards were really close to what really happened to Scott in the movie. Why would he say that if every "non-believer" (a lot of people) were talking about what now seems to be the truth? That's the kind of thing you say if 1 or 2 persons are close to the outcome, not half the boards...

A lot of people theorized that they didn't change jack crap and Cyclops bites it in the first 15 minutes. So I wouldn't try to read too much into Kinberg's responses right now.

Nell, as much as I want that to be right, I do not want to get my hopes up again. I'll be in the seat at midnight on May 25th to see the truth for myself.
 

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