Poll: Should Doctor Doom Be In The First MCU Fantastic Four film?

[metaphysician]

I say "yes", with a proviso: he should not be the *villain* of the first movie. He should be a supporting cast member, and possibly only actually seen in the epilogue/stinger. The purpose of Doom's presence in the first movie, should be to foreshadow his existence and potential future actions. Not to provide someone for the FF to punch.

 

[Drunken Rider]

I'm going with the idea of "HELL NO" because we have him as the main antagonist in the 3 previous-non-MCU films in a row. Just use someone Fox never give a diddly "shate" about like Mole Man, The Frightful Four, etc.

 

[Fluedd]

Just use someone Fox never give a diddly "shate" about like Mole Man, The Frightful Four, etc.

The Mole Man doesn't seem to come off as a real threat, but maybe they could do something like a Penguin/Danny DeVito vibe with him.

The Frightful Four I like, but maybe not for a first movie. I'm also afraid that having eight characters onscreen with powers would eat up the budget quickly, and we wouldn't get the kind of battles we'd like. This has been a problem with FF movies in general IMO. I always feel like the action scenes are disappointing and there are too few of them.

Namor would be awesome, he's a threat plus he's a rival love interest for Sue. Again, not sure I'd start with him first film, but maybe. Galactus definitely should wait. Super Skrull we've "sort of seen before", but not really. Annihilis might be the best compromise, but not with a negative zone/origin tie in.

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

I think Matt Reeves proved with his Batman reboot that the hero’s antithesis does not need to initially be included as a main villain. I’d rather Doom cameo, then have his origin in a limited series on Disney Plus. THEN have him as the main antagonist in the sequel.

 

[Stark Bauer]

I think Matt Reeves proved with his Batman reboot that the hero’s antithesis does not need to initially be included as a main villain. I’d rather Doom cameo, then have his origin in a limited series on Disney Plus. THEN have him as the main antagonist in the sequel.

im probably gonna get flack for this but even the sequel might be too soon. Its like dating. Doom should wait for at least the third date before running towards home.

FF1 = Mole Man
FF2 = Annihilus
FF3 = finish strong with Doom
FF4 = Galactus with Doom as a reluctant ally/anti hero

 

[Spider-Fan]

FF3 ain't gonna be until like 2032-2035. I have never seen a good FF vs Doom movie. If this isn't an origin film, then yes. Doom needs to be the villain

 

[Mr. Peanut]

It's weird hearing people talk about the past Fantastic 4 movies as if they actually mattered in the same way the pre-MCU Spider-man movies did. The Fantastic 4 movies were never anywhere close to as big or well-known, so I don't think Feige is gonna be as reluctant to reuse Dr. Doom as he was about reusing Spider-man villains.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Exactly. If we had all these great FF vs Doom movies like he was Fox Magneto or something, then I would get it more. But because they tried and failed with Doom 3 times, I should wait until 2035 to see the FF fight Doom in a film that isnt trash like i have wanted my entire life, and maybe in the meantime Doom should be a BP villain or something? I wholesale reject that thesis

 

[Frodo]

Spoiler: POSSIBLE WAKANDA FOREVER SPOILER

If we the rumors are true, Doom is already turning up in Wakanda Forever, so I think there's a pretty strong chances he'll at least make an appearance in the first F4 film.
That doesn't mean he'll be the villain of the film, but I wouldn't be surprised if he does show up in a post credits scene.

That said, the answer is no, Doom doesn't need to be the big bad of the first F4 film.

I do wonder if Kang will be the big bad of the first film given the films proximity to Avengers : Kang Dynasty.

But aside from that, there are other F4 villains they could exploit first before Doom.

 

[Johnny Richards]

Exactly. If we had all these great FF vs Doom movies like he was Fox Magneto or something, then I would get it more. But because they tried and failed with Doom 3 times, I should wait until 2035 to see the FF fight Doom in a film that isnt trash like i have wanted my entire life, and maybe in the meantime Doom should be a BP villain or something? I wholesale reject that thesis

Doom is an Avengers-level villain. The FF can't handle him alone. And honestly that's a breath of fresh air. To have him treated right.

Doom will be in FF (2024) but he won't be the main villain. He'll be what Thanos was in GOTG. A secondary villain. The main villain will be someone like Moleman or Annihilus.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Doom is an Avengers-level villain. The FF can't handle him alone. And honestly that's a breath of fresh air. To have him treated right.

Doom will be in FF (2024) but he won't be the main villain. He'll be what Thanos was in GOTG. A secondary villain. The main villain will be someone like Moleman or Annihilus.

The FF have had encounters with Doom for 60 years and beaten by themselves. Countless times. Doom is a FF villain. He sometimes gets elevated to larger threat, but he is at his core a FF villain. Same with Loki. He is a Thor villain that is sometimes an Avengers level threat.

 

[Johnny Richards]

The FF have had encounters with Doom for 60 years and beaten by themselves. Countless times. Doom is a FF villain. He sometimes gets elevated to larger threat, but he is at his core a FF villain. Same with Loki. He is a Thor villain that is sometimes an Avengers level threat.

Yeah but we've seen him as an FF villain in three major summer popcorn movies already (one unreleased movie as well). Do we really need to see that again now that the FF are finally getting GOOD reception from the masses due to their MCU rebirth?

I think it's time for Doom to get treated better. As more than just the go-to FF villain. As the Thanos of Phase VI. You want the general audience to see him the way they see Thanos. Feared and respected. Deemed by some as the ultimate villain.

Same goes for Magneto. I don't want him as the villain of MCU X-Men again. Give me Sinister. Give me Proteus. Give me Lilandra. Let's make Magneto a larger threat. Let's make Apocalypse a larger threat.

Doom got his ass kicked by the FF three times in the FOX movies. Enough. Time for God Emperor Doom to kill Kang and defeat the Avengers.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Yeah but we've seen him as an FF villain in three major summer popcorn movies already (one unreleased movie as well). Do we really need to see that again now that the FF are finally getting GOOD reception from the masses due to their MCU rebirth?

People keep throwing this argument out there, but the answer to me is a resounding YES that we need to see it. Yes, we saw this in 3 movies. All of which were bad movies with poor versions of Doom. So now we are getting ideally a better version of Doom, you bet your bottom dollar THAT is what I want to see more than Psycho-Man, Mole Man, or anyone else. This argument would have merit if the prior FF releases were not garbage or had a satisfying take on Doom. But we have never gotten a satisfactory FF vs Doom movie. Therefore, this has no merit.

I think it's time for Doom to get treated better. As more than just the go-to FF villain. As the Thanos of Phase VI. You want the general audience to see him the way they see Thanos. Feared and respected. Deemed by some as the ultimate villain.

Same goes for Magneto. I don't want him as the villain of MCU X-Men again. Give me Sinister. Give me Proteus. Give me Lilandra. Let's make Magneto a larger threat. Let's make Apocalypse a larger threat.

Doom got his ass kicked by the FF three times in the FOX movies. Enough. Time for God Emperor Doom to kill Kang and defeat the Avengers.

Doom isn't Thanos. You cannot build him the same way. Also, Thanos was in 3 projects in the Infinity Saga before IW. The Marvel content has increased 100 fold. Doom is going to probably appear more than that in a much smaller period. He cannot be Dr. Klaw forever. He has to make a physical appearance before a 3rd FF movie or whatever. It is a 4-6 year turn around for sequels. So 2024 + 12 years we are talking 2034 if we wait until FF3, and Avengers movies are now Saga cappers. Secret Wars caps this Saga. So let's say Kang is Secret Wars villain. You are likely looking at a similar 2034 time frame to end the next Saga. Doom cannot be looming threat for 10 years when Marvel is doing 40 projects a Saga. That is way too long. As a lifelong FF fan, I also don't think waiting until 2034 to get what we want is the best way to go.

Now let's say Doom IS the villain of Secret Wars. No one knows Doom like Reed. So it is the best film to give us backstory on the reaper faced guy with the green cape people have been seeing for years.

 

[Johnny Richards]

People keep throwing this argument out there, but the answer to me is a resounding YES that we need to see it. Yes, we saw this in 3 movies. All of which were bad movies with poor versions of Doom. So now we are getting ideally a better version of Doom, you bet your bottom dollar THAT is what I want to see more than Psycho-Man, Mole Man, or anyone else. This argument would have merit if the prior FF releases were not garbage or had a satisfying take on Doom. But we have never gotten a satisfactory FF vs Doom movie. Therefore, this has no merit.

Most of us hardcore fans [posting on an FF forum] would love to see "Doom done right" as the villain of a new FF movie. Unfortunately all the general audience will see is ANOTHER Fantastic Four movie where they fight Doom AGAIN. That's why Vaughn urged FOX to make Magneto the villain at the END of First Class. He felt the audience woild be fatigued by Magneto as the villain again and pushed for Sebastian Shaw thus making Magneto an anti-hero for 90% of the film. It worked really well because the general audience had Magneto fatigue by the time First Class came out. Right now the general audience is starting to really dig the Fantastic Four. Krasinski played a good role in that. You don't wanna have them yawn when they hear Doom will yet again be the villain specially considering that he'll be revealed to be the true villain of Wakanda Forever and end up being the Multiverse Saga's big bad in two Avengers movies that come out a year after Fantastic Four (2024).

Doom isn't Thanos.

Let's agree to disagree. For me, Doom is another Thanos. An extremely brilliant, powerful supervillain with plans that exceed humanity and basic human aspirations.

You cannot build him the same way. Also, Thanos was in 3 projects in the Infinity Saga before IW.

I think Doom and Kang will both mimic Thanos' build up from 2012 - 2018 in less time. I think Doom's intro in Wakanda Forever will be followed up by a supporting role in something next year and then a secondary villain role in Fantastic Four (2024). Thanos had 2 cameos and one secondary villain role before Infinity War. I think Doom & Kang will have the same.

The Marvel content has increased 100 fold. Doom is going to probably appear more than that in a much smaller period. He cannot be Dr. Klaw forever. He has to make a physical appearance before a 3rd FF movie or whatever. It is a 4-6 year turn around for sequels. So 2024 + 12 years we are talking 2034 if we wait until FF3, and Avengers movies are now Saga cappers. Secret Wars caps this Saga. So let's say Kang is Secret Wars villain. You are likely looking at a similar 2034 time frame to end the next Saga. Doom cannot be looming threat for 10 years when Marvel is doing 40 projects a Saga. That is way too long. As a lifelong FF fan, I also don't think waiting until 2034 to get what we want is the best way to go.

Now let's say Doom IS the villain of Secret Wars. No one knows Doom like Reed. So it is the best film to give us backstory on the reaper faced guy with the green cape people have been seeing for years.

I think Doom will be in Fantastic Four (2024). I just don't think he'll be the main villain. I'll be pleased to see him in a supporting role in it but the general audience will be pleased to see him NOT play the film's primary antagonist for once.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Most of us hardcore fans [posting on an FF forum] would love to see "Doom done right" as the villain of a new FF movie. Unfortunately all the general audience will see is ANOTHER Fantastic Four movie where they fight Doom AGAIN. That's why Vaughn urged FOX to make Magneto the villain at the END of First Class. He felt the audience woild be fatigued by Magneto as the villain again and pushed for Sebastian Shaw thus making Magneto an anti-hero for 90% of the film. It worked really well because the general audience had Magneto fatigue by the time First Class came out. Right now the general audience is starting to really dig the Fantastic Four. Krasinski played a good role in that. You don't wanna have them yawn when they hear Doom will yet again be the villain specially considering that he'll be revealed to be the true villain of Wakanda Forever and end up being the Multiverse Saga's big bad in two Avengers movies that come out a year after Fantastic Four (2024).

No one is gonna yawn. They are building this thing up for 2 years. That is building hype and making people want to see it.

Let's agree to disagree. For me, Doom is another Thanos. An extremely brilliant, powerful supervillain with plans that exceed humanity and basic human aspirations.

Doom isn't Thanos anymore than Lex Luthor is Darkseid. Completely different villain types. Doom is dangerous cause of his intellect and lust for power. He isn't inherently stronger than anyone. He just has advanced tech. Thanos is a being who dwarfs other people in power level just by natural power and skill. They are not the same in anyway

I think Doom and Kang will both mimic Thanos' build up from 2012 - 2018 in less time. I think Doom's intro in Wakanda Forever will be followed up by a supporting role in something next year and then a secondary villain role in Fantastic Four (2024). Thanos had 2 cameos and one secondary villain role before Infinity War. I think Doom & Kang will have the same.

I think Doom will be in Fantastic Four (2024). I just don't think he'll be the main villain. I'll be pleased to see him in a supporting role in it but the general audience will be pleased to see him NOT play the film's primary antagonist for once.

Again, you are building hype to see Doom in these post credits sequences. You are doing that to build interest. If the goal was to save Doom for later, then I wouldn't introduce him in this phase at all. But if he is coming on the sooner side, he just cannot be Dr. Klaw and doing things in the background. He has to get his hands dirty otherwise people won't care about him if that is all he is doing until Secret Wars. You cannot just have him on the sidelines and then toss him into Secret Wars as the main villain. That worked for Thanos going into IW cause he was the villain of both parts of a 2 part story and IW kind of serves the role of a Thanos solo movie. Part 1 of this story is Kang Dynasty. Which will be about Kang. I am sure Doom will BE there, but he still needs a presence before this. Fantastic Four makes the most sense for that since Kang Dynasty won't be ABOUT him. Do people groan that Batman has fought the Joker many times in film? No. If it is well done, no one will yawn or complain. It is all about telling a good story. Given how the phases are playing out, not using Doom I do think would be unwise to the grander story.

 

[Fluedd]

Do people groan that Batman has fought the Joker many times in film?.

The difference here is that Batman doesn't only fight the Joker. He has other villains, as does the FF. I agree we've seen FF vs Doom enough for the time being, let's see something else. FF vs. Doom needs to happen, but it can wait for another movie.

 

[Stark Bauer]

Most of us hardcore fans [posting on an FF forum] would love to see "Doom done right" as the villain of a new FF movie. Unfortunately all the general audience will see is ANOTHER Fantastic Four movie where they fight Doom AGAIN. That's why Vaughn urged FOX to make Magneto the villain at the END of First Class. He felt the audience woild be fatigued by Magneto as the villain again and pushed for Sebastian Shaw thus making Magneto an anti-hero for 90% of the film. It worked really well because the general audience had Magneto fatigue by the time First Class came out..

i second this. Do Fantastic Four similar to First Class by having a decoy villain like Mole Man or Annihilus. Have Reed and Victor somewhat on the same side only to have a falling away at the end and then we see him turn into a villain as a cliffhanger? Or just have Doom as Doom the villain at very end setting up either FF2 or Doom as a possiblr rival to Kang in Avengers Secret Wars

 

[Kirk Langstrom]

Doom is an Avengers-level villain. The FF can't handle him alone. And honestly that's a breath of fresh air. To have him treated right..

WHAAAAT? The FF have been handling Doom alone for over sixty years worth of comics, lol. Hell, Reed Richards beat Doom by all himself back in FF #200.

 

[Mr. Peanut]

Yeah but we've seen him as an FF villain in three major summer popcorn movies already (one unreleased movie as well).

Who's "we"? Haven't you seen the box office for those films, especially the only one that released in the past decade (and even that will be almost a decade old when the new F4 releases)? Most people never even saw those films (including me, and superhero films are practically the only films I ever watch in theaters), and they are way old.

 

[Johnny Richards]

WHAAAAT? The FF have been handling Doom alone for over sixty years worth of comics, lol. Hell, Reed Richards beat Doom by all himself back in FF #200.

Feige's interested in Hickman's FF, where Doom became God Emperor Doom during Secret Wars which is being adapted for the second 2025 Avengers movie Feige greenlit.

Feige sees Doom as WAY more than just an FF villain.

And I think that's wonderful.

 

[Spider-Fan]

Feige's interested in Hickman's FF, where Doom became God Emperor Doom during Secret Wars which is being adapted for the second 2025 Avengers movie Feige greenlit.

Feige sees Doom as WAY more than just an FF villain.

And I think that's wonderful.

Again, Doom is a FF villain that at times becomes a larger threat. Secret Wars was one such example of being a larger threat. Loki was the villain of Thor, and then he was the villain of the 1st Avengers film. Further, we don't know Feige's plans for Doom, so this is a faulty assumption.

 

[Spider-Fan]

The difference here is that Batman doesn't only fight the Joker. He has other villains, as does the FF. I agree we've seen FF vs Doom enough for the time being, let's see something else. FF vs. Doom needs to happen, but it can wait for another movie.

Because Batman had good movies that kept those franchises going. The FF have not had good movies. No one even saw the last one they released, so the last time most MAY have seen Doom vs the FF on screen was 2007. I think 18 years later for the last time most people remember that happening is enough time for another try. Especially if they are hyping it for a few years by giving us glimpses at a Doom who isn't trash

 

[Johnny Richards]

Again, Doom is a FF villain that at times becomes a larger threat. Secret Wars was one such example of being a larger threat. Loki was the villain of Thor, and then he was the villain of the 1st Avengers film. Further, we don't know Feige's plans for Doom, so this is a faulty assumption.

Michael Waldron, the writer for MoM revealed that it was Feige's directive to have Krasinski's Reed be based on Hickman's Reed. His dialogue in the film pretty much confirmed [for me at least] that they were indeed heading in the Hickman Secret Wars direction.

The announcement of "Avengers: Secret Wars" was no surprise to me after watching MoM and hearing Reed talk.

I won't be surprised at all if Doom is the villain of Secret Wars. I expect Doom to kill Kang at the end of Kang Dynasty.

 

[Mr. Peanut]

Feige's interested in Hickman's FF, where Doom became God Emperor Doom during Secret Wars which is being adapted for the second 2025 Avengers movie Feige greenlit.

Feige sees Doom as WAY more than just an FF villain.

And I think that's wonderful.

But isn't the whole point of Secret Wars that it takes place in a crossover mishmash world? Wouldn't it make more sense if Dr. Doom is a returning villain from a previous MCU film?

 

[chamber-music]

Yes to introducing Doom but not as the primary villain. As others have said, Doom has been a foe in all three if the previous FF movies and that a fourth movie with him as the top villain is too much.

I would prefer Mole man, Annihilus, Frightful Four or even Blastaar as the main foe in the first MCU FF movie.