Sequels Question for those who didn´t like the movie...

[I Am The Knight]

Watchmen can't be compared to JLA. Watchmen is an adult social/politcal satire. It is hardly the epic flag ship movie Warners needs with the Harry Potter era coming to an end.

Yeah, certainly. God forbid they try to make any sequels from THAT. Plus I don't see it making more than 150M. As for JLA, while I see what you mean, I think it's gonna turn out to be a mess... Especially if they want to include all the DC A-Listers.

 

[Matt]

Yeah, certainly. God forbid they try to make any sequels from THAT. Plus I don't see it making more than 150M. As for JLA, while I see what you mean, I think it's gonna turn out to be a mess... Especially if they want to include all the DC A-Listers.

Its a gamble. Granted, but the pay offs are far bigger than the potential risks, that is why I think Warners should try it.

 

[Motown Marvel]

i think disowning the potential sequel merely because you didnt dig SR is a bad idea. thats like saying you didnt dig the latest story arc in the superman comics, so you're gonna not ever give any future story arcs a chance. theres little reason to believe that a sequel cant be a phenominal superman film. whether or not you believe singer can deliver that is one thing (i think he can)....but its undeniable the potential is always there.

 

[Mr. Socko]

Making a JLA film will be a mess

Making a SR sequel by 09 will be a mess

 

[ultimatefan]

lets be careful not to turn this thread into "what would you rather see, MOS or JLA"...enough of that crap is going on elsewhere and it wasnt the intentions of this topic.

but singer and crew has admitted to planning for the changes posted by the topic starter. i think singer is well aware of the criticisms, recognized the flaws of SR and is willing to work to remedy them in the sequel. and i dont see how anyone could really say "this is what i didnt like about SR" then not go see the sequel where all the things they didnt like are fixed....i mean, isnt that what you wanted? im thinking a lot of people here are gonna be turned off by singer returning, then once they get a whiff of what he's producing down the line, they'll slowly become interested and check it out.

Yeah, I really don´t get this incondicional hatred against Singer... A lot of fans agree with me that FF sucked and Hulk was a mixed bag and yet we opened our minds to the FF sequel and the new Hulk movie... It didn´t pay off that much in FF´s case, but that´s because they got cocky with the commercial success of the first and didn´t really change much, in this case all points they´re listening to criticism, and I think they did a far better job in the first place. Making a good superhero movie is about more than following generically details from the comics, and to me FF is the best proof of it.

 

[ultimatefan]

i think disowning the potential sequel merely because you didnt dig SR is a bad idea. thats like saying you didnt dig the latest story arc in the superman comics, so you're gonna not ever give any future story arcs a chance. theres little reason to believe that a sequel cant be a phenominal superman film. whether or not you believe singer can deliver that is one thing (i think he can)....but its undeniable the potential is always there.

Yeah, I didn´t see fans giving up on Superman comics or even a Superman writer because they didn´t like a particular storyline, I really, really don´t get what goes on here.

 

[ultimatefan]

You can only address the elements so far. The foundation which they are based upon is laid. It is still going to be a sequel to a mediocre movie. That is like building a house and saying "well, we built the foundation really weak, but as long as we decorate it nicely, it shouldn't collapse."

Second Ultimatefan, I have always liked you, you are one of the best posters on the Hype, but will all respect...who the hell are you to tell us we need to change because we didn't like something? Maybe the problem isn't with us but with what Singer gave us.

First of all, I disagree that the foundation is weak. It certainly doesn´t block the possibility of a better movie if the elements I mentioned are addressed, and they can perfectly well be addressed.
I didn´t say you NEED to change, I said if nothing changes even if the franchise is improved, I will not be interested in these boards anymore. You don´t think you need to change, don´t change. But why it´s that way, is beyond me.

 

[Grinder]

The comics reboot all the time. If something sucks, it gets redone or vanishes completely. That's no problem 'cause there are enough comics with Supes available and the budget to develope a comic is nothing compared to a movie. Not even talking about the impact and aftermath of a little comic story and a multi-million dollar movie.
Make a sequel to a crappy movie the whole world watched (or at least heard of) and see the bomb coming. Guess why Marvel reboots the Hulk!?

Whatever Singer tries to fix, there's no way to switch from pre to post crisis and redo everything using the same actors and following the plot of SR.

WB is better of just forgetting this up*uck and move on with the franchise after Smallville ends. New origin, new cast and a clear plan where they want to go with it.

 

[ultimatefan]

The comics reboot all the time. If something sucks, it gets redone or vanishes completely. That's no problem 'cause there are enough comics with Supes available and the budget to develope a comic is nothing compared to a movie. Not even talking about the impact and aftermath of a little comic story and a multi-million dollar movie.
Make a sequel to a crappy movie the whole world watched (or at least heard of) and see the bomb coming. Guess why Marvel reboots the Hulk!?

Whatever Singer tries to fix, there's no way to switch from pre to post crisis and redo everything using the same actors and following the plot of SR.

WB is better of just forgetting this up*uck and move on with the franchise after Smallville ends. New origin, new cast and a clear plan where they want to go with it.

Again, as much as some fanboys want so bad to convince themselves of it, most moviegoers didn´t think it was a "crappy movie". And a lot of the franchise DOES NOT come from pre-crisis - where´s Krypto? Where´s Superboy? Where´s Luthor blaming Supes for being bald? and many fans don´t think that´s the most important either.

 

[BrollySupersj]

I loved the first movie (and its game). All those in the sequel are much wanted though. As my dad says, "It's time for Superman to get his ass kicked." I agree, I want some mass destruction in the fight scenes.

 

[Grinder]

Again, as much as some fanboys want so bad to convince themselves of it, most moviegoers didn´t think it was a "crappy movie".

Your argument is 100% the same that the HULK fans had for a couple of years till they had to face the truth. And that movie even made enough money to warrant a direct sequel but still never got one. But keep up the hope if it makes you feel better.

Your other "points" are hardly anything important like the rest used from that time. The display of Clark and Superman is "backwards" to what I (and many others) since the 80s grew up on reading and watching on tv. It's Singer's vision of the characters of Clark/Superman that killed my interest in the whole movie beforehand. I don't want Clark to be a useless disguise. In SR, Clark is a hollow nothingness and has a about 0,0% need to appear on screen whatsoever. The love story is solely about Superman and Lois, Clark is just an entity without meaning, hence why no one cared that he returned. That's exactly what the pre crisis lacked of and what was corrected later in a very successful way. Hence why they even made a tv show based on Lois and Clark and had huge success with it.
DC didn't give Clark a real characterisation just for fun. It was necessary the same way it was to have Lex doing intelligent things instead of goofing around, wearing wigs or screaming "WROOOOOOOONG!" in people's faces.
Sure he still ends up in jail in the end, he's the villain, it's his job to fail. But how he fails is the most interesting thing in every story. A story about a hero without a worthy villain is boring. And with that I mean muscles and intelligence. That's were most comic hero movies fail.

The introduction of the kid just gave Singer's story the rest. There's no way to redo all the mistakes in a direct sequel.

 

[Venom'sDad]

... Let´s say, hypothetically - and there are lotsa statements pointing in that direction - that the sequel to SR fills all or most of these items...

- It has more action and actual superhero/supervillain fight scenes
- It has a popular villain from comics that hasn´t been used on the movies yet, like Brainiac, Darkseid or Doomsday
- It´s shorter and tighter
- It has less emphasis on romance and the kid thing
- It has less scenes and plot points that pay homage to Donner

Before you say, "Singer´s not gonna do that", or "I want a reboot", remember that a lot of statements from Singer and the writers point in that direction and that a reboot in the short term is not a realistic scenario right now. Above it all, speaking just hypothetically, if the sequel has those elements, would you be open to give Singer a second chance and look at MOS without preconceived negativity?

That's a great ?, but I think we are going to get Singer regardless of what my brotheren who dislike him, as I do, say and the rest of the many fans who blindly believe a sequel wont happen say. I wish he would have done most of those things, minus the "less emphasis on the romance" thing, in SR as a reboot. I hate to say it, but I will see the sequel regardless what WB decide because I'm a Superman fan period.

 

[Matt]

First of all, I disagree that the foundation is weak. It certainly doesn´t block the possibility of a better movie if the elements I mentioned are addressed, and they can perfectly well be addressed.
I didn´t say you NEED to change, I said if nothing changes even if the franchise is improved, I will not be interested in these boards anymore. You don´t think you need to change, don´t change. But why it´s that way, is beyond me.

But to us the foundation is flawed. Would you pay attention to or see a sequel to a movie you did not like? I didn't like Resident Evil. Therefore I didn't see Apocolypse and I can guaruntee with 95 % certainty I will not see Extinction. No matter how much Singer changes, it will still be a follow up to a story and characters I didn't give two damns about. Therefore, why would I bother?

 

[Motown Marvel]

But to us the foundation is flawed. Would you pay attention to or see a sequel to a movie you did not like? I didn't like Resident Evil. Therefore I didn't see Apocolypse and I can guaruntee with 95 % certainty I will not see Extinction. No matter how much Singer changes, it will still be a follow up to a story and characters I didn't give two damns about. Therefore, why would I bother?

i thought the first spider-man and x-men movies were decent movies at best with their fair share of flaws. i saw both sequels, both of which proved to be far better films.

 

[Matt]

i thought the first spider-man and x-men movies were decent movies at best with their fair share of flaws. i saw both sequels, both of which proved to be far better films.

I didn't think Superman Returns was a decent movie though. So there is the difference.

 

[Motown Marvel]

I didn't think Superman Returns was a decent movie though. So there is the difference.

but thats just your opinion. but the fact is, most people did find it to be a decent movie, at the least. and decent movies can be built into even greater sequels.

 

[Mr. Socko]

i thought the first spider-man and x-men movies were decent movies at best with their fair share of flaws. i saw both sequels, both of which proved to be far better films.

I agree there and all I can hope is that Singer pulls an X2.


I thought X1 was mediocre but X2 was brilliant. Hopefully MOS can have the same effect.

 

[Matt]

but thats just your opinion. but the fact is, most people did find it to be a decent movie, at the least. and decent movies can be built into even greater sequels.

No one's opinion is more valid than another. This thread asks the question "If you didn't like the movie, will you give the sequel a chance?" I am answering as someone who didn't like the movie. If the movie was good, in my perception, why would I dislike it?

 

[Motown Marvel]

No one's opinion is more valid than another. This thread asks the question "If you didn't like the movie, will you give the sequel a chance?" I am answering as someone who didn't like the movie. If the movie was good, in my perception, why would I dislike it?

fair enough.

i guess to me it seems: what the topic starter posted were most peoples general issues with the film and the reasons they didnt like it. which would mean, if those issues were remedied, then it'd theoretically be a good film that they'd enjoy. so, if those issues were sorted out in the sequel, then the sequel would be a good film (given everything else worked). and despite your feelings on SR, if MOS is a good superman film, dont you want to see it?

 

[superbaby]

I feel you. I'm still on the fence about him. I need to see what he has up his sleeve for it before really deciding.

As of right now, i'm leaning toward the J.L. side of the fence, but I havent fell over just yet..

me think the same.

and as soon as i heard KRYPTONITE again, MOS i'm done with.

 

[superbaby]

Yeah, I really don´t get this incondicional hatred against Singer... A lot of fans agree with me that FF sucked and Hulk was a mixed bag and yet we opened our minds to the FF sequel and the new Hulk movie... It didn´t pay off that much in FF´s case, but that´s because they got cocky with the commercial success of the first and didn´t really change much, in this case all points they´re listening to criticism, and I think they did a far better job in the first place. Making a good superhero movie is about more than following generically details from the comics, and to me FF is the best proof of it.

it's a very different case here. you know it's just like most of us still looking for a new superman movie even though SIII & SIV are really bad.
but in SR's case, the movie itself isn't bad, but all the main characters have been badly screwed up and we can't afford to see it screwed up any further. you get what i mean?

 

[deemar325]

... Let´s say, hypothetically - and there are lotsa statements pointing in that direction - that the sequel to SR fills all or most of these items...

- It has more action and actual superhero/supervillain fight scenes
- It has a popular villain from comics that hasn´t been used on the movies yet, like Brainiac, Darkseid or Doomsday
- It´s shorter and tighter
- It has less emphasis on romance and the kid thing
- It has less scenes and plot points that pay homage to Donner

Before you say, "Singer´s not gonna do that", or "I want a reboot", remember that a lot of statements from Singer and the writers point in that direction and that a reboot in the short term is not a realistic scenario right now. Above it all, speaking just hypothetically, if the sequel has those elements, would you be open to give Singer a second chance and look at MOS without preconceived negativity?

Sure, I didn't like SR at all, but Singer is a good director he has it in him to make a good Superman movie. Bryan just needs to get off of Dick Donner's well...D---k?@! and just make a kick-ass Superman movie with a villian other than Lex Luther.

All the ingredients are there, he just gotta up the action and realize it's not 1977 anymore and butch up his storyline and keeps his soap opera tendencies in check.

 

[Motown Marvel]

^^i liked SR, but i agree with that.

 

[Mr. Socko]

I think we all agree there!

 

[hammy]

... Let´s say, hypothetically - and there are lotsa statements pointing in that direction - that the sequel to SR fills all or most of these items...

- It has more action and actual superhero/supervillain fight scenes
- It has a popular villain from comics that hasn´t been used on the movies yet, like Brainiac, Darkseid or Doomsday
- It´s shorter and tighter
- It has less emphasis on romance and the kid thing
- It has less scenes and plot points that pay homage to Donner

Before you say, "Singer´s not gonna do that", or "I want a reboot", remember that a lot of statements from Singer and the writers point in that direction and that a reboot in the short term is not a realistic scenario right now. Above it all, speaking just hypothetically, if the sequel has those elements, would you be open to give Singer a second chance and look at MOS without preconceived negativity?

No, I wouldn't. I would prefer to see him gone. I don't like his style of direction, I haven't liked ANY of his movies, including the X-Men movies or even Usual Suspects.

And for me, even correcting the things you mentioned still isn't enough. I burned with a white hot hatred for the mutilation of the characters .. and that's the director's fault, as well. Even if all the things you mentioned, were changed, that still wouldn't save the film with such a boring, complacent Chief and an even more boring, lifeless Lois.