Justice League Ray Fisher Is Victor Stone/Cyborg

[Da-Scribe]

Yeah I mean, people being investigated are never gonna be unbiased. The goal is to present the best possible case for yourself, not the most even for you and the other person.

 

[KalvinEllis]

He isn't making a request, he's demanding the investigator to either speak to them first, or he won't speak to him otherwise. Still don't understand how he gets to make demands like that in the first place. As I said, "key witnesses" can potentially mean different things and investigators are aware of that before they choose how to proceed. Starting to think the goal is to get the investigator replaced if that's still the same person who he originally claimed was hired by WB rather than Warner Media.

The part about an "implicated individual" calling him to apologize also got my attention. That has to allegedly be either Hamada, Johns or Whedon, right? Since Berg already publicly disputed the accusations.

 

[heatvision38]

But that's what I'm wondering about, if it's supposed to be a truly independent investigation how come he gets to choose which people should be interviewed and then refuse to speak to the investigator unless he's talked to them first? Can that in itself be seen as a potential form of bias since someone in his position could be sure the specific individuals he demanded to be interviewed would speak in his favor? Not accusing him of trying to manipulate the investigation for his own benefit, it's the part about an accuser demanding which people an independent investigator should or should not interview is what doesn't make much sense to me.

Unless he thinks they are not really acting as an independent investigator. An independent investigator that has no skin in the race would have no reason not to interview all parties that were provided by both sides. If they are not, then it's fair to assume that they are not actually acting with the impartiality that they claim.

 

[chintai80]

momoa just called out WB and how they were using the frosty the snowman thing to distract from ray's situation.
it's on ig, i can't post it here because of language.
jason says "serious stuff went down" during the JL reshoots.

 

[MbJ]

 

[Mr. E Nygma]

 

[spideyfan77]

Honestly, this whole thing has completely destroyed my excitement for zack snyders justice league. Im just done with this drama. Everything is just a **** show. Even when we finally got our movie...this happens and continues on to drag.

Beginning to just not care anymore and move on to new movies that are upcoming like the batman.

 

[Da-Scribe]

Momoa included himself in that accusation. Did not expect that. Whoa.

Honestly, this whole thing has completely destroyed my excitement for zack snyders justice league. Im just done with this drama. Everything is just a **** show. Even when we finally got our movie...this happens and continues on to drag.

Beginning to just not care anymore and move on to new movies that are upcoming like the batman.

All this just makes me more excited to see the film they were happy about making. I don’t care if it’s to my taste or not. I just am happy that all these folks are going to get something released that actually brought them joy. All while fighting for justice in real life.

 

[chintai80]

i'm still hyped thru the roof for the snyder cut and for me personally, this isn't a distraction at all.

i see this as a separate thing.
this is toxic workplace culture that happened during the reshoots.

whenever more info comes out, i'll be there:

 

[KalvinEllis]

I don't know about Henry, but at this point Gal and Ben have to speak out as well. If they do, WB is toast. So just do that cause frankly and no offense to anyone, I'm tired of being bombarded with this. Take every precaution necessary to make sure the investigation is conducted properly to expose what really happened so everyone can move on with their lives. The cast and crew deserve that and so do the fans.

 

[spideyfan77]

i'm still hyped thru the roof for the snyder cut and for me personally, this isn't a distraction at all.

i see this as a separate thing.
this is toxic workplace culture that happened during the reshoots.

whenever more info comes out, i'll be there:

Wish I could say the same. Probably just tired of behind the scenes bull****. Ill just log off until the movie finally comes out so I can just focus on the product instead of how the product was made.

 

[chintai80]

Wish I could say the same. Probably just tired of behind the scenes bull****. Ill just log off until the movie finally comes out so I can just focus on the product instead of how the product was made.

i get u, but thats the thing: all this stuff ray and jason are speaking bout is about how the theatrical cut was made.

this isn't about how the snyder cut was made.

two separate and different products, to me.

like knowing that lot of drama happened bts, i don't wanna watch the theatrical cut no more.
but then again, before knowing bout the drama, i still probably didn't wanna watch it.
but i don't wanna watch it even more now.

 

[KalvinEllis]

It's ironic that Cyborg was my favorite character in the TC.

 

[chintai80]

It's ironic that Cyborg was my favorite character in the TC.

mines too.
this is what i look the most forward to with the SC, we get to see a more substantial arc for him!

 

[KalvinEllis]

mines too.
this is what i look the most forward to with the SC, we get to see a more substantial arc for him!

You know what just hit me, imagine having the balls to create a "toxic environment" on set with Ben Affleck on the cast. And this was Ben during some of the worst times of his personal life so if he chimes in, they're done. He was both going through a divorce and had fallen off the wagon again at the time, imagine going through all of that while having to deal with some d-bags on set. And while filming some reshoots. All this drama for some freaking reshoots? I don't get it man, this whole thing seems SO unnecessary.

 

[kguillou]

Im just catching up on all this guys. I read Mamoa’s post and OHHH S*** this is NOT good. And it basically confirmed Jason’s absence from Fandome and the whole Frosty thing. Wow. Hoo boy? WB has some cleaning up to do. This thing is escalating guys.

 

[chintai80]

You know what just hit me, imagine having the balls to create a "toxic environment" on set with Ben Affleck on the cast. And this was Ben during some of the worst times of his personal life. He was both going through a divorce and had fallen off the wagon again at the time, imagine going through all of that while having to deal with some d-bags on set. And while filming some reshoots. All this drama for some freaking reshoots? I don't get it man, this whole thing seems SO unnecessary.

we need a documentary bout all this some day.
it would make for an awkward but entertaining one.

 

[KalvinEllis]

Im just catching up on all this guys. I read Mamoa’s post and OHHH S*** this is NOT good. And it basically confirmed Jason’s absence from Fandome and the whole Frosty thing. Wow. Hoo boy? WB has some cleaning up to do. This thing is escalating guys.

To what end though. That's been my main question from the get go. Just how are these people going to be held accountable in the end? This doesn't seem like it's going to be taken to court or at least Fisher hasn't given any indication he wants to sue them, Berg is basically irrelevant to WB, Johns will still get paid tons of royalties even if they do fire him since he practically created the modern DCU they base the majority of their movies on, Whedon doesn't work for WB, and Hamada is part of this now too, so I'm guessing he would get fired too? Then what? If you accuse someone of criminal behavior without taking them to court for it, how are these people going to be truly held accountable. I previously gave John Lasseter as an example and he had way more serious accusations thrown his way, to which he admitted, and lo and behold, after he was fired by Disney, he's been running another animation studio for a while now. Does that seem like someone who was held accountable for their behavior. So what can be done here.

 

[Arachnerd]

This has been nothing but an absolute s***show.

 

[chintai80]

jason probably not afraid to speak out now, cuz he got aquaman 2 and dune in the bag.
he made them a ton of $ with the first aquaman.

 

[heatvision38]

momoa just called out WB and how they were using the frosty the snowman thing to distract from ray's situation.
it's on ig, i can't post it here because of language.
jason says "serious stuff went down" during the JL reshoots.

So we WERE right. Frosty WAS involved.

By the way, I thought he was talking about Frosty from Collider and I was really confused until I came here. Anyone else? No? Just me? Ok then.

 

[Dar]

To what end though. That's been my main question from the get go. Just how are these people going to be held accountable in the end? This doesn't seem like it's going to be taken to court or at least Fisher hasn't given any indication he wants to sue them, Berg is basically irrelevant to WB, Johns will still get paid tons of royalties even if they do fire him since he practically created the modern DCU they base the majority of their movies on, Whedon doesn't work for WB, and Hamada is part of this now too, so I'm guessing he would get fired too? Then what? If you accuse someone of criminal behavior without taking them to court for it, how are these people going to be truly held accountable. I previously gave John Lasseter as an example and he had way more serious accusations thrown his way, to which he admitted, and lo and behold, after he was fired by Disney, he's been running another animation studio for a while now. Does that seem like someone who was held accountable for their behavior. So what can be done here.

Maybe Ray (and others) just want WB leadership to publicly acknowledge that the cast and crew were wronged and that he wasn't making stuff up. It doesn't have to be criminal behavior, it could just be hostile work environment which is the employer's responsibility. Maybe it's enough for someone to say mea culpa, we know, we understand, we're taking measures so it (and I still want to know what it is) doesn't happen again.

 

[Da-Scribe]

To what end though. That's been my main question from the get go. Just how are these people going to be held accountable in the end? This doesn't seem like it's going to be taken to court or at least Fisher hasn't given any indication he wants to sue them, Berg is basically irrelevant to WB, Johns will still get paid tons of royalties even if they do fire him since he practically created the modern DCU they base the majority of their movies on, Whedon doesn't work for WB, and Hamada is part of this now too, so I'm guessing he would get fired too? Then what? If you accuse someone of criminal behavior without taking them to court for it, how are these people going to be truly held accountable. I previously gave John Lasseter as an example and he had way more serious accusations thrown his way, to which he admitted, and lo and behold, after he was fired by Disney, he's been running another animation studio for a while now. Does that seem like someone who was held accountable for their behavior. So what can be done here.

I think it’s less about punishing anyone and more about creating systemic change in the studio system. Preventing these instances of abuse from going unchecked on future projects.

 

[heatvision38]

To what end though. That's been my main question from the get go. Just how are these people going to be held accountable in the end? This doesn't seem like it's going to be taken to court or at least Fisher hasn't given any indication he wants to sue them, Berg is basically irrelevant to WB, Johns will still get paid tons of royalties even if they do fire him since he practically created the modern DCU they base the majority of their movies on, Whedon doesn't work for WB, and Hamada is part of this now too, so I'm guessing he would get fired too? Then what? If you accuse someone of criminal behavior without taking them to court for it, how are these people going to be truly held accountable. I previously gave John Lasseter as an example and he had way more serious accusations thrown his way, to which he admitted, and lo and behold, after he was fired by Disney, he's been running another animation studio for a while now. Does that seem like someone who was held accountable for their behavior. So what can be done here.

It doesn't necessarily have to be about punishments, per se, but about people standing up for what's right, pushing the line of what's acceptable closer to the side of of the workers. Every time people stand up for what's right, when enough people get on that train, change happens. It's basically this:

One way or another, you have to stand up for what you believe and hope that also helps others. Every act is an act of self-definition: Who am I? Who are we? What will we tolerate and what won't we tolerate? And that's what we are seeing in this country right now, a fight for what this country stands for going forward. This is just one small piece of that and that's why people are invested.

 

[Aurakles]

I think the aim of this is to try to change the culture.
Assuming Fisher is telling the truth, there was abusive behaviour and those responsible were not reprimanded for it, but instead were protected. WB's allowed it to happen and covered it up, are still covering it up.
During discussion of this I've seen posts referring to things that happened on other films, comments suggesting that that's just how it goes in Hollywood. That people are treated horribly and always have been, as if that excuses it.
I think Fisher is aiming at the very notion that this is how things are, I think he has a problem with the status quo, with the idea that cast and crew are expected to shut up and deal with it.

Maybe Fisher would have been satisfied if WB's had simply admitted that people were mistreated and apologised.
Maybe all he wants is for the studio to admit there was a problem.

I think his aim is to make it harder for this to happen again. I think he wants to make it easier for people to speak out when they are mistreated. I think he wants to prevent further abuses of power. I think he wants to change the culture.