Justice League Ray Fisher - WB Investigation Updates Thread

[Mysteryman]

Whedon has never been an issue, most of us know he’s a POS, it’s more his attempts to go after Johns, Berg and then how he suddenly dragged Hamada in. Also Charisma provided a details of which Fisher still hasn’t on Johns & Berg. His beef with Hamada seems to be over an apology.

Yeah,The Charisma Carpenter Revelations do not change my opinion about Ray Fisher at all.
However, more power to Carpenter and her costars for speaking out.

 

[Eddie Dean]

Various people talking about how Whedon regularly targeted and bullied cast and crew members doesn't change your opinon on a guy who previous said that Whedon regularly targeted and bullied cast and crew members ?

 

[Comicbookguy339]

Various people talking about how Whedon regularly targeted and bullied cast and crew members doesn't change your opinon on a guy who previous said that Whedon regularly targeted and bullied cast and crew members ?

Some serious mental gymnastics going on in this thread.

 

[Da-Scribe]

Ive said Whedon is a POS, I’ve always known he was likely an arrogant prick on set.

I still would like to know details of what happened with Johns & Berg. Do I think they likely sided with Whedon? Yeah probably. But I think that was cause they were trying to get a movie made in record time under immense studio pressure & I think Ray was likely resistant to changes. That’s my view on it.

So Whedon is a POS who misbehaved on set, but it’s understandable that WB sided with him because they were trying to make a movie? That doesn’t sound like bad leadership to you? Not even like a lil?

 

[SupermanFan]

So Whedon is a POS who misbehaved on set, but it’s understandable that WB sided with him because they were trying to make a movie? That doesn’t sound like bad leadership to you? Not even like a lil?

Not at all what I ****ing said

 

[Da-Scribe]

Not at all what I ****ing said

Well it’s what you typed. So damn mad lol.

 

[KalvinEllis]

It's crazy how with all the stuff that has come out recently on Whedon, people still think Fisher is doing this for attention. They believe the allegations of SMG and others but for some reason, Fisher is an attention seeker despite having his Justice League costars back him up. I wonder why........

I don't see him as an attention seeker, it's the lack of detail that's been rather annoying. Calling someone an abhorrent racist isn't the same as describing what specific kind of behavior he was being subjected to. Carpenter didn't make blanket statements, she gave a detailed description about her experiences with Whedon and other cast members corroborated that kind of behaviour from him. Hence, unlike with her, we have to keep guessing what exactly Ray must be referring to in his comments. His statements have been about "This guy was abusive, those 2 other guys enabled his behaviour, this 4th guy tried to protect one of them by throwing the others under the bus, and oh by the way one of those 2 guys is an abhorrent racist, too". Ray can express himself however he likes, he doesn't owe me or anybody else more details or explanations, but I need something more than what he's given so far to make up my mind about this whole thing. I believe that's why a lot less people are questioning Carpenter and others as compared to him. She went into specific detail, while he hasn't yet.

 

[SupermanFan]

Well it’s what you typed. So damn mad lol.

Nope!

So go ahead with your twisting words and then saying lol at the end like you aren’t triggered.

From this point on I won’t be engaging you again on this forum.

 

[Eddie Dean]

N
D
A

 

[Mysteryman]

NDA or no NDA, the only thing that I know about Ray's allegations is that he appears to pissed off that he was yelled at on the set ofJL. He wants not only Whedon, but Johns and Berg to be held accountable.

 

[Eddie Dean]

Everything that's come out and that's what you take away?

 

[Da-Scribe]

Nope!

So go ahead with your twisting words and then saying lol at the end like you aren’t triggered.

From this point on I won’t be engaging you again on this forum.

I’m triggered? Look at your posts and try saying that with a straight face.

You come in here day after day whining about this whole situation and doing your damndest to make excuses for abuse and bad leadership.

And now you’re lashing out because you are being asked to, dare I say it, explain yourself.

It’s a bad joke.

 

[Docker2.0]

I don't see him as an attention seeker, it's the lack of detail that's been rather annoying. Calling someone an abhorrent racist isn't the same as describing what specific kind of behavior he was being subjected to. Carpenter didn't make blanket statements, she gave a detailed description about her experiences with Whedon and other cast members corroborated that kind of behaviour from him. Hence, unlike with her, we have to keep guessing what exactly Ray must be referring to in his comments. His statements have been about "This guy was abusive, those 2 other guys enabled his behaviour, this 4th guy tried to protect one of them by throwing the others under the bus, and oh by the way one of those 2 guys is an abhorrent racist, too". Ray can express himself however he likes, he doesn't owe me or anybody else more details or explanations, but I need something more than what he's given so far to make up my mind about this whole thing. I believe that's why a lot less people are questioning Carpenter and others as compared to him. She went into specific detail, while he hasn't yet.

Maybe he can't just yet. But you don't think it's strange that Gadot and Mamoa backed him up rather than stay neutral like Affleck and Cavill did? Also Carpenter and SMG mirroring stories of his but yet somehow his story is unbelievable? And why hasn't Whedon or any of them sued Fisher for slander? I can answer that: because there is indeed smoke and they are hoping it blows over. In Whedon's case it has not and I'm sure John's and Hamada are hoping that theirs do. It is still early and who knows who else may come forward.

 

[TheFuture]

The NDA argument has certainly increased in credibility with the Buffy cast speaking out. Fisher has probably been tied up in knots legally.

 

[Greenlite]

So Whedon is a POS who misbehaved on set, but it’s understandable that WB sided with him because they were trying to make a movie? That doesn’t sound like bad leadership to you? Not even like a lil?

Imagine the same WB execs team made a distressed father who just lost his daughter to suicide to make an exclusive interview announcing that he’s leaving the project he intended to dedicate to his late daughter, so they can get the movie made in time to get their bonuses. How terrible would that be.

So. Much. Pressure.

 

[batdude]

Maybe he can't just yet. But you don't think it's strange that Gadot and Mamoa backed him up rather than stay neutral like Affleck and Cavill did? Also Carpenter and SMG mirroring stories of his but yet somehow his story is unbelievable? And why hasn't Whedon or any of them sued Fisher for slander? I can answer that: because there is indeed smoke and they are hoping it blows over. In Whedon's case it has not and I'm sure John's and Hamada are hoping that theirs do. It is still early and who knows who else may come forward.

The thing with Fisher is he appears to be blaming three guys for something one guy did. Gadot and Momoa just went after Whedon and SMG and Carpenter were nowhere near Justice League. I bet there will be lawsuits though.

 

[Greenlite]

Kinda like how people and law enforcement went after all 4 cops when it was one that suffocated George Floyd to death right? The others were just standing there

How unfair of them to do that. How dare Ray went after the guy who brought the abuser in then supervised the whole thing, and then attacking the next guy trying to sweep the whole thing under the bus. That’s totally drama Queen idiocracy, supported by a bunch of Buffy stars

He should have stopped at the Joss firewall in the interest of WB PR, his Hollywood career and rich suits’ reputation

#TeamBuffyStandWithRayFisherattackonWhedonButNotStandwithRayFisheronDramaQueenCrapOverJohnsAndHamada

 

[super85]

I dont think those things compare at all.

 

[KalvinEllis]

People now compare producers "enabling" a director to act like a dick on a movie set to cops being complicit in the murder of a defenseless man...

I get it, Whedon doesn't need to be Roman Polanski to be considered an abusive monster and Johns and Hamada don't need to be Weinstein to be seen as power abusers, but people are going way too far with some of this stuff. Best thing to do is wait for more details to come out before making wild comparisons to the kind of power abuse that led to senseless loss of life.

 

[SupermanFan]

People now compare producers "enabling" a director to act like a dick on a movie set to cops being complicit in the murder of a defenseless man...

I get it, Whedon doesn't need to be Roman Polanski to be considered an abusive monster and Johns and Hamada don't need to be Weinstein to be seen as power abusers, but people are going way too far with some of this stuff. Best thing to do is wait for more details to come out before making wild comparisons to the kind of power abuse that led to senseless loss of life.

Yet point these things out and some people on here act like you’re a terrible person.

You can’t even wait for details or facts before making your mind up without some people on here acting like your racist or something.

 

[chamber-music]

The NDA argument has certainly increased in credibility with the Buffy cast speaking out. Fisher has probably been tied up in knots legally.

I get the feeling Fisher probably wants to say more but is legally advised or bound not to say too much.

Publicly making specific allegation against powerful people you might struggle to prove can open you up to a slander suit.

I'm sure Fisher's representatives such as agent, publicist, lawyer, ect have probably advised him against speaking out.

 

[Docker2.0]

The thing with Fisher is he appears to be blaming three guys for something one guy did. Gadot and Momoa just went after Whedon and SMG and Carpenter were nowhere near Justice League. I bet there will be lawsuits though.

Bruh didn't John's have a side convo with Fisher and threaten his career? Hamada,I have no clue what's up with him but Fisher does indeed have a gripe with Johns. But again, he may not be able to talk about it just yet. Again, it's crazy how when Fisher came out against Whedon people were killing him saying he is doing it for attention but now that more people have come forward, they STILL say he is doing it for attention. You're right though. SMG and Carpenter were nowhere near the set but they just confirmed that it all happened with them as well. But I wonder why SMG and Carpenter get a pass but Fisher doesn't despite having coworkers back up his story........

 

[Da-Scribe]

People now compare producers "enabling" a director to act like a dick on a movie set to cops being complicit in the murder of a defenseless man...

I get it, Whedon doesn't need to be Roman Polanski to be considered an abusive monster and Johns and Hamada don't need to be Weinstein to be seen as power abusers, but people are going way too far with some of this stuff. Best thing to do is wait for more details to come out before making wild comparisons to the kind of power abuse that led to senseless loss of life.

@Greenlite obviously was not saying they’re the same thing. His point was that if you’re complicit in abuse then you are part of said abuse.

 

[Chesterfield]

People now compare producers "enabling" a director to act like a dick on a movie set to cops being complicit in the murder of a defenseless man...

I get it, Whedon doesn't need to be Roman Polanski to be considered an abusive monster and Johns and Hamada don't need to be Weinstein to be seen as power abusers, but people are going way too far with some of this stuff. Best thing to do is wait for more details to come out before making wild comparisons to the kind of power abuse that led to senseless loss of life.

Obviously the circumstances are different but the principle is still the same. A clear dereliction of duty is in play; and it seems to me like there's a lot of unconscious bias going on and some people have no grasp of what leadership and management entails. To trivialise, make light of and discredit the gravity of Fisher's position is just vehement ignorance.

 

[Aurakles]

A few of my previous posts on the lack of details issue.

“The people that have shared their stories with me have put themselves at great risk, both personally and professionally. I will protect them at any cost,” Fisher said. “Hollywood is one of the most retaliatory businesses in the world. One word of you being “difficult” or “uncooperative” could be the end of your career, especially if you’re black.”

This is why he's not giving out full details, because it's not just his story.
Other people have spoken to him and asked him not to reveal their identities. Should he break their trust, publicly reveal things told in confidence and risk these peoples livelihoods to satisfy our curiosity?

Every time I see the phrase "doesn't know how Hollywood works" a chill goes down my spine. The idea that abuse should be excused because it is built into a system is horrifying.

Fisher has said that between the filming of JL and him coming out about this, he had been speaking to people and trying to get other witnesses to speak out. Some did on the condition of anonymity, suggesting that they are afraid for their jobs if they come forward.
If Fisher is responsible for protecting these people's livelihoods, it makes sense he would very cautious about the integrity of the investigator.

I don't think Fishers goal is to send people to prison or get them fired. I think his problem is that abusive behaviour is treated as simply par for the course, that it happens regularly and isn't seen as a problem. He seems to be aiming not at an individual, but a culture. That bad behaviour will not result in action to correct the behaviour but to cover it up.

At Justice Con Fisher said he brought this public now because it took him this long to gather up accounts from others who were there.
From the way he talked there and in his recent video, he's suggesting this isn't about him.
I think much of this happened to lower profile cast and crew who wouldn't be able to gather the kind of public attention Fisher has. It may be that Fisher wasn't so much a victim of abuse as a witness to it. That would explain him not going into detail because he would be exposing others who want to stay anonymous for fear of losing their jobs.

I think when it comes to wanting Fisher to give details, we need to remember this isn't entirely his story to tell.
He has repeatedly referred to other witnesses he got to come forward who want to stay anonymous. My feeling is that Fisher was not the victim of the worst of this but a witness to it.
Fisher is respecting their privacy by not giving details to the public.

These explain why Fisher might not go into detail on Whedon. However, Fisher has actually explained quite clearly what the others did;
Johns and Berg being aware of and complicit in Whedons abuse, Hamada trying to derail an investigation and protect them.

I can understand the belief that Whedon is innocent and being lied about because the cast and crew are super-loyal to Snyder. I don't agree with it, but I can understand it.

I don't however, understand the belief that Whedon was abusive, but somehow hid it from all the producers. That no one helped him, covered for him or even noticed him doing it. If Whedon did it, someone must have enabled him up, by action or inaction. If Whedon was abusive, then some higher ups were either incompetent to the point of negligence, or willingly party to it.