The Force Awakens Rey's Origin (Speculations) *Spoilers*

[Horhey]

I still think Lucasfilm wants the revelations of her origin to be another "Luke, I am your father" moment. Something no one expects.

 

[X Knight]

I still think Lucasfilm wants the revelations of her origin to be another "Luke, I am your father" moment. Something no one expects.

then they shouldn't have dropped so many clues/nods/hints that point towards her being a Skywalker.

and they could still pull another "I am your father" moment with the reveal of Rey's mom.

 

[Horhey]

then they shouldn't have dropped so many clues/nods/hints that point towards her being a Skywalker.

and they could still pull another "I am your father" moment with the reveal of Rey's mom.

Can't argue with that.

 

[godisawesome]

Okay, here's some long term story reasons why I want Rey to be Luke's kid. I think we've established that there's circumstantial evidence that can be interpreted either way in regards to her parentage, but I think there are good storytelling reasons for such a lineage to her, reasons good enough that they lend more credence to the popular assumption that she is a Skywalker.

Firstly, having Rey be another descendant of Anakin/Vader makes the struggle for that man's legacy much more explicit in the sequel trilogy. On the side of the nightmare that was Vader, there's Ren in all his dark armor, abandonment of his birth name, and general fanboy approach to ancestor worship. On the side of Luke and Anakin's heroism, there could be Rey, acting as the final proof that the Jedi will be a returning power to the Galaxy. It even adds some symbolism to them fighting over the old saber; Ren wants to use it to keep murdering people like Anakin dud with it, while Rey wants to use it to defend her friends.

Secondly, Luke's breakdown after Kylo's recent betrayal makes even more sad sense if he had a chance at a family, and then that chance disappeared. If, like his father, he is initially unaware of his child, then he'd probably over invest himself in training his nephew and his students, and losing a family for effectively the third or fourth time in his life would break him. With Rey back, he gets one more chance to be a father, and thus even more reason to pull out of his funk.

Thus, I think making Rey his daughter makes the story stronger than if she's just another random force user. I'm not saying that's a bad option, but it would lack some of the dramatic, operatic punch.

 

[X Knight]

Okay, here's some long term story reasons why I want Rey to be Luke's kid. I think we've established that there's circumstantial evidence that can be interpreted either way in regards to her parentage, but I think there are good storytelling reasons for such a lineage to her, reasons good enough that they lend more credence to the popular assumption that she is a Skywalker.

Firstly, having Rey be another descendant of Anakin/Vader makes the struggle for that man's legacy much more explicit in the sequel trilogy. On the side of the nightmare that was Vader, there's Ren in all his dark armor, abandonment of his birth name, and general fanboy approach to ancestor worship. On the side of Luke and Anakin's heroism, there could be Rey, acting as the final proof that the Jedi will be a returning power to the Galaxy. It even adds some symbolism to them fighting over the old saber; Ren wants to use it to keep murdering people like Anakin dud with it, while Rey wants to use it to defend her friends.

Secondly, Luke's breakdown after Kylo's recent betrayal makes even more sad sense if he had a chance at a family, and then that chance disappeared. If, like his father, he is initially unaware of his child, then he'd probably over invest himself in training his nephew and his students, and losing a family for effectively the third or fourth time in his life would break him. With Rey back, he gets one more chance to be a father, and thus even more reason to pull out of his funk.

Thus, I think making Rey his daughter makes the story stronger than if she's just another random force user. I'm not saying that's a bad option, but it would lack some of the dramatic, operatic punch.

agreed. especially the part about the dual symbolism of Vader and how that would be reflected in both Kylo and Rey.

 

[jmc]

The biggest issue I have is if Luke indeed left Rey on Jakku then it goes completely against his character. Why would Luke, of all people, leave his daughter on a planet of scavengers who have to fight for survival every single day? That is one of the biggest red flags to me as to why I think she's not, I can't see Luke leaving his daughter on such an inhospitable world with no-one there to look out for her. Luke at the very least had a loving aunt and uncle along with Obi-wan looking out for him on a crappy desert planet, it may have been a difficult life but it wasn't a fight for survival. Rey has no-one. She has to work her arse off every day for half a ration of food if she's lucky. She's living a delusional fantasy that someone is coming for her and that's the biggest problem. That's the best Luke could do for her? If Luke's solution to Ben Solo turning bad is to do some something worse than what Obi-wan did then that is a stain against the character, because frankly he, of all people, should have known better than to put her in that type of environment. No love, no-one looking out for her, she's just left to fend for herself. To me that's hard to forgive.

 

[WonderTwin]

The biggest issue I have is if Luke indeed left Rey on Jakku then it goes completely against his character. Why would Luke, of all people, leave his daughter on a planet of scavengers who have to fight for survival every single day? That is one of the biggest red flags to me as to why I think she's not, I can't see Luke leaving his daughter on such an inhospitable world with no-one there to look out for her. Luke at the very least had a loving aunt and uncle along with Obi-wan looking out for him on a crappy desert planet, it may have been a difficult life but it wasn't a fight for survival. Rey has no-one. She has to work her arse off every day for half a ration of food if she's lucky. She's living a delusional fantasy that someone is coming for her and that's the biggest problem. That's the best Luke could do for her? If Luke's solution to Ben Solo turning bad is to do some something worse than what Obi-wan did then that is a stain against the character, because frankly he, of all people, should have known better than to put her in that type of environment. No love, no-one looking out for her, she's just left to fend for herself. To me that's hard to forgive.

Exactly. I have a few other reasons for not wanting Luke to be Rey's father:

1. Haven't we done the "every major character is related to every other major character" bit already? A couple of times? Give it a rest, writers. This is getting worse than "Guiding Light." Can't a character have significance without being related to one of the Big Three?

2. As stated above, it makes Luke worse than irresponsible. He basically ditched his daughter and ran. Thanks for nothing, dad!

3. For Rey to have been one of Luke's students (which she pretty much has to be), if she's related to Luke, why don't Han or Leia act like they know who she is? Obviously they'd know her. Yet they don't.

And before you say, "Luke wiped their minds too, for Rey's protection", c'mon, that's BS. Did Luke wipe EVERYBODY'S mind? And if he could do that, why couldn't he control Ben Solo's snotty little ass? That couldn't be harder than erasing peoples' memories...

I know Rey is too young to be Obi-Wan's daughter, but she's not too young to be his granddaughter, and I'd accept that scenario more readily than her being Luke's child.

 

[Horhey]

I could've sworn I heard someone in authority in the First Order propose clones. Its a played out concept and I doubt it is so, but what if Rey was conceived from Vader's DNA like the clone of Galen Marek? Just throwing that out there.

 

[Mightmitenot]

She is 19. It is literally impossible.

Carbonite freezing?

 

[writer0327]

I actually like the Rey is a Kenobi theories the best.

Rey hears the voice of Obi Wan during the flashback sequence, not Luke's voice.

Rey doesn't struggle with light and dark like other Skywalkers.

Leia doesn't seem to have any feeling towards Rey at all, like she would if Rey was a daughter or niece.

If you want to connect Rey to someone in the Star Wars universe, Kenobi seems to be the best option.

 

[jaqua99]

I stand by my theory that she is Kylo Ren's little sister and also a student of Luke's. She was put on Jakku when Ben revolted, which in guessing was about 10-15 years prior to the start of the movie, and her memories were repressed by use of The Force. This helps explain a lot!
-Why Kylo Ren was so emphatic when he asked, "What girl?" when he was told who helped Finn.
-Why she knew her way around the Millennium Falcon.
-Why she was even aware of the Jedi mind trick.
-How she was proficient with the lightsaber.

She knew who the Jedi were as well. Hell, I bet she never met her dad, but has been told before that Luke is her father. Too many little moments happened in the movie

 

[jaqua99]

I actually like the Rey is a Kenobi theories the best.

Rey hears the voice of Obi Wan during the flashback sequence, not Luke's voice.

Rey doesn't struggle with light and dark like other Skywalkers.

Leia doesn't seem to have any feeling towards Rey at all, like she would if Rey was a daughter or niece.

If you want to connect Rey to someone in the Star Wars universe, Kenobi seems to be the best option.

No feelings for Rey? When the hugged? No feelings there? That scene screamed "relatives".

Plus how would she be a Kenobi? She's not Obi Wan's; too young. So she's the daughter of one of Obi Wan's children? Not only would they have to explain WHO Obi wan had relations with, but why. THEN they would have to address an entire generation of Kenobi, while still being mindful of Ren's past, who Snoke is, and every other unknown.

 

[Zatanna]

I differ in that I don't feel Obi-Wan is the best option lol.

 

[Smilodon]

Eh, would not prefer the new films to be all about the Skywalkers. I do like having Rey be this nobody who turns out to be Force Sensitive and has to defeat a villain of Skywalker blood. Like someone else before here with regards to Kylo and Rey's duel - I want her seizing of Anakin's lightsaber to be a rejection of Kylo's claim to it by birthright. Not her assuming her destiny as some long-lost Skywalker.

In a way these films can still be about the Skywalkers given Kylo, but I think it'd be cool to expand it just a bit? Would also be a way to kinda expand the Jedi Order besides Skywalkers.

But I mean if Kylo and Rey are cousins, whatever. Ain't gonna necessarily ruin it for me.

 

[NewYorkSpider]

I've read so many theories in the last 10 days that my head is spinning. I still think it's Han and Leia's daughter or possibly she's a Kenobi. I think we're being led to believe that it's Luke's daughter, just as we were led to believe that Darth Vader killed Luke's father.

Luke was training a new generation of Jedi. Why would he have time to fall and love and have a kid? Luke was taught by Obi-Wan that attachment could be used against him in his fight against Vader with Leia. So I think Luke would be smarter than that.

Let's look at another thing. We see Rey get dropped off on Jakku when she's 5 and we see an unidentified ship leaving. I think she was dropped of in the Millennium Falcon and then whoever dropped her off left in another ship. It's no accident that the Falcon is there. I also believe that it's no accident that Han and Chewie were right near by when they found the Falcon.

There's gonna be a lot to digest in the next year and half. I'm sure some of us we'll be disappointed, some happy and some shocked.

 

[jaqua99]

Eh, would not prefer the new films to be all about the Skywalkers. I do like having Rey be this nobody who turns out to be Force Sensitive and has to defeat a villain of Skywalker blood. Like someone else before here with regards to Kylo and Rey's duel - I want her seizing of Anakin's lightsaber to be a rejection of Kylo's claim to it by birthright. Not her assuming her destiny as some long-lost Skywalker.

In a way these films can still be about the Skywalkers given Kylo, but I think it'd be cool to expand it just a bit? Would also be a way to kinda expand the Jedi Order besides Skywalkers.

But I mean if Kylo and Rey are cousins, whatever. Ain't gonna necessarily ruin it for me.

See I disagree, I think she HAS to be a Skywalker. The main villain of this series is a Skywalker, And his boss, wants another Skywalker dead. It's ALREADY about the Skywalkers.

Secondly, Rey's abilities. A random force user who can defeat a Skywalker? The possibility of her being Luke's daughter makes that acceptable. Without that, she's Ahsoka on steroids. If Rey is just s random force user, then she goes from an interesting character to a complete Mary Sue.

Let's make no mistake, she was a Mary Sue and she herself was a plot device, who used the force as a plot device. Having her be of the Skywalker lineage, directly, justifies that. Without it, she's a Mary Sue.

But let's not get surprised if it turns out to be true. WAY too many factors point to it, and the filmmakers aren't gonna tease something SO impactful as a red herring. Luke's Daughter

 

[Sithborg]

She is as Mary Sue as Luke or Anakin.

 

[X Knight]

See I disagree, I think she HAS to be a Skywalker. The main villain of this series is a Skywalker, And his boss, wants another Skywalker dead. It's ALREADY about the Skywalkers.

Secondly, Rey's abilities. A random force user who can defeat a Skywalker? The possibility of her being Luke's daughter makes that acceptable. Without that, she's Ahsoka on steroids. If Rey is just s random force user, then she goes from an interesting character to a complete Mary Sue.

Let's make no mistake, she was a Mary Sue and she herself was a plot device, who used the force as a plot device. Having her be of the Skywalker lineage, directly, justifies that. Without it, she's a Mary Sue.

But let's not get surprised if it turns out to be true. WAY too many factors point to it, and the filmmakers aren't gonna tease something SO impactful as a red herring. Luke's Daughter

I have to agree with this.

whether or not you want to call her a Mary Sue, I don't know if I'd go that far.

but, she was "conveniently" so good at this and so good at that, that if she's not a Skywalker, it would start bordering on the ridiculous.

As a Skywalker, you can accept it in the context of SW - since it runs in the family.

and not only that, critics of TFA say it's a "derivative" copy-cat film of ANH.

well, if Rey turns out not to be a Skywalker, then she would indeed feel like a derivative and copy cat character.

She's so similar to Anakin and Luke in terms of where she grew up ( desert ) and what she's good at ( pilot, mechanic ) and what she's capable of ( powerful Force user ).

If she's a new, unrelated character, why make her so similar?

why not give her different qualities?

 

[jmc]

No feelings for Rey? When the hugged? No feelings there? That scene screamed "relatives".

Plus how would she be a Kenobi? She's not Obi Wan's; too young. So she's the daughter of one of Obi Wan's children? Not only would they have to explain WHO Obi wan had relations with, but why. THEN they would have to address an entire generation of Kenobi, while still being mindful of Ren's past, who Snoke is, and every other unknown.

This is all basically coming down to perception and what we are choosing to believe. The facts are simply Rey's story is too vague at this stage to say one way or another, but people are making conclusions based on past movies. We're dealing with circumstantial evidence. There are two characters with mystery pasts in the film, Rey and Snoke, everyone else is more or less black and white with who they are.

I said this in another thread but it doesn't make a lot of sense to hold the Skywalker reveal until Epsiode VIII. If Luke is her father then that's the perfect way to end Episode VII, thematically and emotionally that reveal would signify that the first part of her journey over. It also means you kickstart Episode VIII without having to address it further. The only reason you don't reveal it is if she's not a Skywalker.

 

[jmc]

I have to agree with this.

whether or not you want to call her a Mary Sue, I don't know if I'd go that far.

but, she was "conveniently" so good at this and so good at that, that if she's not a Skywalker, it would start bordering on the ridiculous.

As a Skywalker, you can accept it in the context of SW - since it runs in the family.

and not only that, critics of TFA say it's a "derivative" copy-cat film of ANH.

well, if Rey turns out not to be a Skywalker, then she would indeed feel like a derivative and copy cat character.

She's so similar to Anakin and Luke in terms of where she grew up ( desert ) and what she's good at ( pilot, mechanic ) and what she's capable of ( powerful Force user ).

If she's a new, unrelated character, why make her so similar?

why not give her different qualities?

The simple answer is to give audiences a sense they are watching a Star Wars movie and give them what they've wanted. Rey is influence by Luke Skywalker but that doesn't make her Luke Skywalker. TFA has a lot of the same elements as ANH, both in characters and in story, it's essentially a $200m fan film that intentionally harkened back to ANH. But like ANH it's also a very simple story. We learned far more in ESB about the characters than we did in ANH because Episode IV was for the most part a simple story. TFA is the same. Rey's story being vague gives the writers options. They know you're going to believe she's a Skywalker. Why? Because we've been down this road before, we expect it. It's an easy path to take people down. But that's also the perfect opportunity to do something different, to throw a curve ball no-one saw coming. Luke saying 'I'm not your Father' would have as big a shock as Vader saying 'I am you're Father' - and they know it. That would be just as big a revelation.

 

[X Knight]

here's an interesting video comparing motifs in Rey's music to other SW motifs that might offer "clues" as to her lineage.

[YT]qlWC2KWtjJc[/YT]

I find the Vader bit interesting. didn't catch that before, but now I can sort of hear it.

 

[X Knight]

The simple answer is to give audiences a sense they are watching a Star Wars movie and give them what they've wanted. Rey is influence by Luke Skywalker but that doesn't make her Luke Skywalker. TFA has a lot of the same elements as ANH, both in characters and in story, it's essentially a $200m fan film that intentionally harkened back to ANH. But like ANH it's also a very simple story. We learned far more in ESB about the characters than we did in ANH because Episode IV was for the most part a simple story. TFA is the same. Rey's story being vague gives the writers options. They know you're going to believe she's a Skywalker. Why? Because we've been down this road before, we expect it. It's an easy path to take people down. But that's also the perfect opportunity to do something different, to throw a curve ball no-one saw coming. Luke saying 'I'm not your Father' would have as big a shock as Vader saying 'I am you're Father' - and they know it. That would be just as big a revelation.

idk.....I just think if they wanted to keep Rey's background mysterious and vague, they should have done that. instead of dropping clues and hints ( and some quite obvious and powerful ) to lead us in one direction only to swerve us later on.

 

[jmc]

idk.....I just think if they wanted to keep Rey's background mysterious and vague, they should have done that. instead of dropping clues and hints ( and some quite obvious and powerful ) to lead us in one direction only to swerve us later on.

But that's the brilliance of it. You're already heading down the path she's a Skywalker, then wham, the rug is pulled out from under you. Everything you thought was going to happen just blew up in your face, you become more invested then because you suddenly don't know what's going to happen.

 

[godisawesome]

Eh, would not prefer the new films to be all about the Skywalkers. I do like having Rey be this nobody who turns out to be Force Sensitive and has to defeat a villain of Skywalker blood. Like someone else before here with regards to Kylo and Rey's duel - I want her seizing of Anakin's lightsaber to be a rejection of Kylo's claim to it by birthright. Not her assuming her destiny as some long-lost Skywalker.

In a way these films can still be about the Skywalkers given Kylo, but I think it'd be cool to expand it just a bit? Would also be a way to kinda expand the Jedi Order besides Skywalkers.

But I mean if Kylo and Rey are cousins, whatever. Ain't gonna necessarily ruin it for me.

To me, that's a theme that the film's have already embraced. Regardless of Rey's lineage, she is representing the light side part of Anakin's legacy. And I respect the opinion that making this series a Skywalker family feud would seem played out. My reason why I really want nay it to still be a Skywalker family feud is so that we don't immediately think of the entire family tree as being largely cursed with one white sheep in Luke. The fight over Anakin's legacy feels more real to me if it's his blood on both sides.

This is all basically coming down to perception and what we are choosing to believe. The facts are simply Rey's story is too vague at this stage to say one way or another, but people are making conclusions based on past movies. We're dealing with circumstantial evidence. There are two characters with mystery pasts in the film, Rey and Snoke, everyone else is more or less black and white with who they are.

I said this in another thread but it doesn't make a lot of sense to hold the Skywalker reveal until Epsiode VIII. If Luke is her father then that's the perfect way to end Episode VII, thematically and emotionally that reveal would signify that the first part of her journey over. It also means you kickstart Episode VIII without having to address it further. The only reason you don't reveal it is if she's not a Skywalker.

Even the phrase "circumstantial evidence" is a bit of an overstatement; there's an implied specificity to it that often involves more cohesive names and history, circumstantial evidence to me would be to establish that Luke did have at least a lover, or have Rey remember some fragment of who left her behind. Right now, I'd argue that it's more "thematic parallels" between Rey, Anakin, and Luke; all three are the main Jedi protagonists of their trilogies, all three have used the same lightsaber, and all three are prodigies with the Force.

And it's that parallel that I think is making the Rey Skywalker theory the biggest to the mainstream audience. All my friends and family who have commented on it have said something like "She's Luke's kid, right?" The qualifier at the end shows that they know there's no substantial evidence and that even the circumstantial evidence is thin.

And that ties into my argument against your last point. To geeks, there has to be more of a twist coming; this is JJ Abrams on Star Wars, we basically expect some kind of brilliant play on a Kansas Co Shuffle in one way or another. But to most other people, there's no need for the twist. And I'd argue that there's a great dramatic reason to both use thematic parallels with Rey to hint at a Skywalker connection without stating it outright even toward the end, as you have noted: the reveal is the Lightsaber-In-The-Snow sequence, and it's the best way to execute the moment for emotional resonance without clouding up the rest of the story, and provides a great hook to the next film.

Think about this argument this way:

1) Revealing too many hints that Rey is a Skywalker ruins the fun of her escalating Force powers towards the end of the film, and distracts from Finn's more complete (for this film specifically) character arc. If we know she's a Skywalker, or have any huge reasons to feel that's implied, than its no surprise at all that she takes on and defeats Kylo Ren. We know that they kind of wanted that idea kept secret; Boyega's still a co-lead, but they gave him more clear advertisement space because they wanted people to go "OHHHHHHH..." When she grabs the lightsaber, like people did in my theater. Twice.

2) Luke and Rey's meeting is more emotionally powerful without dialogue. As much as some of us complain about Hamill getting zero lines, it might have taken some of the magic away from the moment to have them reveal some kind of family connection through blunt dialogue; the moment was about having two skilled thespians wordlessly communicate deep feelings and internal conflict while an Oscar winning composer scores the scene beautifully. It also goes directly against one of the primary flaws of the Prequels, that of saying instead of showing.

3) It adds one more powerful tug to the next installment for viewers. This film was all about leaving the situation more destabilized and cliff hanging than any film in the franchise. Finn and Kylo are down, Han's dead, the Republic's military might is shattered, and we leave not just on a questionable training scenario, but also having just had the second possible hint at Rey's parentage with her dream island matching Luke's hideout. The fact we have a thread dedicated to discussing the possible implications of who her parents were or weren't speaks to the success of that strategem. And honestly, even if the reveal is just a quiet and quick one towards the start of the film like Kylo's parentage, it'll be worth it.

 

[jaqua99]

She is as Mary Sue as Luke or Anakin.

Right. Which is why I think it's acceptable if she's Luke's, the daughter of Anakin's child.

A random force user who is THAT powerful and that good doesn't work in my opinion. But since being a "Skywalker" has held the quality you've stated for years, I have no issue with what she did if she's a Skywalker