Falcon and Winter Soldier Season 1, Episode 1: New World Order (SPOILERS)

[Sithborg]

Please elaboate.

The big action scene was too long for what it brought to the episode. The pace was also hurt by an excessive amount of table setting. For episode 1, you need to set up what the goal of the series should be. That didn't happen. The trailers do a better job of setting up the series than this episode.

As for the ending, I don't have the technical language for it. Just that it felt more like a high dramatic point in a movie, rather than the cliffhanger ending of an episode.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Saw the episode a 2nd time, it’s seemed to go quicker but I still enjoyed it a lot.

 

[Marvolo]

Just because Steve wanted something doesn't mean Sam has to follow his wishes. I have zero issue with Sam who has been a supporting character until now getting fleshed out. And part of that fleshing out is him having doubts about living up to Cap's legacy.



I don't think it was ever stated he had no regular income, currently. His contract work has only been for the last 6 months. You're not the first person I've seen make reference to him helping to save the universe. Just curious: how does that play into getting a loan approved in your eyes?

He shouldn't need a loan. He shouldn't have trouble finding extremely well paying independent and military contract work at this point. I imagine most governments have issues they'd pay to have dealt with. Our military would have issues that need to be dealt with. CIA, DOD, DHS take your pick. And since Sam's reputation and resume is the stuff of legends at this point, and because he is a one of a kind soldier he can pretty much set his salary.

This is another issue I have with the Sokovia accords. If the government wants to control the Avengers the government should be contracting them and paying them and offering benefits. I know my father had access to special types of loans and other benefits because of his military service. You'd think the accords and the US government and our financial systems would offer benefits to the freaking Avengers

As for the bank, I'd imagine the publicity and advertising boost of having an Avenger as a client would be a PR boost for a bank.

 

[NHawk19]

^ Yeah I would've thought non-traditional route too but Tony's gone. He probably doesn't know Pepper that well.

We don't know how long after the battle at End Game this takes place yet. Probably 3-4 months seeing as how Bucky has been pardoned, and Sam is working as a contractor. Most likely less than a year though.

Remember after Civil War (2016) Sam was on the run with Cap. Then he got snapped (2018) and came back (2023). In that 5-7 year period he probably had no credit record / ruined his existing credit. That's why his loan was denied. Plus in real life if you don't use a bank account for 3-5 years the funds are turned over to the government. Sam will get there working for the government and building equity but it's just to soon. The loan getting denied isn't a surprise given that he went at it like a regular guy.

As for the PR. Sam went to a local branch. He presumably doesn't have a PR manager who can get him an endorsement. Banks don't advertise their regular account holders.

Honestly though if Sam and Bucky start working for the government I hope they make a healthcare and 401K joke at some point though.

 

[javonstokess]

The big action scene was too long for what it brought to the episode. The pace was also hurt by an excessive amount of table setting. For episode 1, you need to set up what the goal of the series should be. That didn't happen. The trailers do a better job of setting up the series than this episode.

As for the ending, I don't have the technical language for it. Just that it felt more like a high dramatic point in a movie, rather than the cliffhanger ending of an episode.

To each his/her own. I think everything was set up quite nicely. The goal of the series was very clear to me: Sam needs to get to a place where he'll take up the Cap mantle, Bucky needs to clear his conscience and both need to stop the Flag Smashers.

We also disagree on the ending. Great cliffhanger to me.

 

[metaphysician]

FWIW, I remember Feige saying somewhere that Steve in the MCU was, power-level wise, was more on par with Ultimate Cap who was damn near super-strong. Cap in the regular MCU is "as strong as a human being at their peak level could be"

Also, I don't think Steve is dead. I don't think you give Steve Rodgers an off-film death.

Why would you need to look for what Feige says out of story, when you can just look at the clear and obvious portrayals on screen to see that, yes, in the MCU, Captain America absolutely has super powers? Which is to say, in the MCU, Steve has *never* been "peak human".

( Also, Ultimate Cap wasn't "damn near super strong", he was also clearly and obviously superhuman. )

 

[Web-Head]

He shouldn't need a loan. He shouldn't have trouble finding extremely well paying independent and military contract work at this point. I imagine most governments have issues they'd pay to have dealt with. Our military would have issues that need to be dealt with. CIA, DOD, DHS take your pick. And since Sam's reputation and resume is the stuff of legends at this point, and because he is a one of a kind soldier he can pretty much set his salary.

This is another issue I have with the Sokovia accords. If the government wants to control the Avengers the government should be contracting them and paying them and offering benefits. I know my father had access to special types of loans and other benefits because of his military service. You'd think the accords and the US government and our financial systems would offer benefits to the freaking Avengers

As for the bank, I'd imagine the publicity and advertising boost of having an Avenger as a client would be a PR boost for a bank.

Sam mentioned he was working with the military to the guy at the bank. Sam's sisters' comment about "there's always a problem with people like us" leads me to believe they were laying the groundwork with the racial stuff that will be handled in the series.

^ Yeah I would've thought non-traditional route too but Tony's gone. He probably doesn't know Pepper that well.

We don't know how long after the battle at End Game this takes place yet. Probably 3-4 months seeing as how Bucky has been pardoned, and Sam is working as a contractor. Most likely less than a year though.

It's been six months

 

[Dark Raven]

Steve literally prevented a helicopter from taking off with one hand.

Even Hulk and Thor can't do that with two hands

 

[Silvermoon]

I mean how exactly is Winter Soldier making money?

Seventy five years worth of backlogged vet benefits? Idk.

My guess is that Winter Soldier is getting some tip money for assisting with those exposure ops for the government.

For me, it wouldn't surprise me if it's a combination, since being pardoned he may have become entitled to some backlogged benefits, he may get some money for his assistance in turning over remaining hydra elements (or elements that Hydra placed into power, such as that senator). I'd also add, T'challa and Shuri may have set him up with some funds while he was living in Wakanda. it's also possible that he has/had knowledge of Hydra stash houses that got missed in the fall of SHIELD/Hydra and - as recompense for the brainwashing and torture they subjected him to for 70+ years - had no qualms about raiding such stash houses and claiming some of the money as payment due him (while he donates the rest of it to to various victims charities and veterans associations.)

That's just my own personal headcanon at the moment though (and subject to change should the series opt to go into further detail )

 

[Prison Mike]

Sam mentioned he was working with the military to the guy at the bank. Sam's sisters' comment about "there's always a problem with people like us" leads me to believe they were laying the groundwork with the racial stuff that will be handled in the series.


It's been six months

I get what they were trying to go for with the racial thing but I think there are other characters that are better suited than Sam to showcase the bank issue. I mean they show that the business hasn’t made any money in the last 5 years so I would think it would be difficult to get a small business loan anywhere. They made it seem like the loan officer was a flat out racist.

 

[Web-Head]

I get what they were trying to go for with the racial thing but I think there are other characters that are better suited than Sam to showcase the bank issue. I mean they show that the business hasn’t made any money in the last 5 years so I would think it would be difficult to get a small business loan anywhere. They made it seem like the loan officer was a flat out racist.

I don't think so. A jerk, yes but not really racist.

 

[Albright]

Is it just me or is there way less news for upcoming episodes for F&WS?
I enjoyed the rumors for WV, though not all of them turned out to be true.
It helped to make the gaps between all those Fridays more comfortable

 

[Dark Raven]

Is it just me or is there way less news for upcoming episodes for F&WS?
I enjoyed the rumors for WV, though not all of them turned out to be true.
It helped to make the gaps between all those Fridays more comfortable

It's not that kind of a show and they said it before. There is no real mystery here for anyone to speculate much about. And certainly no signs or symbols you can try to see within the show where there's probably nothing even there.

Plus this show isn't going to have any theme songs for people to keep listening to over and over or many memes.

 

[Schlosser85]

It's not that kind of a show and they said it before. There is no real mystery here for anyone to speculate much about. And certainly no signs or symbols you can try to see within the show where there's probably nothing even there.

Plus this show isn't going to have any theme songs for people to keep listening to over and over or many memes.

“Zemo All Along” doesn’t have quite the same ring to it.

 

[Schlosser85]

Sebastian and Miki Ishikawa behind the scenes

 

[MessiahDecoy123]

We live in a world where war heroes end up homeless. So a superhero getting rejected for a loan and lacking a 6 figure salary does seem plausible.

I guess he could go the celeb route but that would cheapen Cap's legacy (resembling Cap's early stage shows).

 

[djsunyc]

 

[Zyraquis]

That’s a business idea that might get him a loan approval though. He will smoke competitions.

 

[writer0327]

Sam needs to start an Avengers Gofundme. Now I would actually contribute to that

 

[Dark Raven]

If Falcon gets a real bird he could probably make some money doing tricks together with it.

 

[Sithborg]

I get what they were trying to go for with the racial thing but I think there are other characters that are better suited than Sam to showcase the bank issue. I mean they show that the business hasn’t made any money in the last 5 years so I would think it would be difficult to get a small business loan anywhere. They made it seem like the loan officer was a flat out racist.

Sam made the point that he had done his research, and that on paper, all of what they had qualified them for the debt consolidation. Still denied. Which is the point. Even if you meet all the qualifications for it, you can still be denied for "reasons".

I don't think so. A jerk, yes but not really racist.

C'mon. The banker's first thought of where he recognized him was from football. Not all racism is about putting on your klan hood and getting a tiki torch.

 

[Web-Head]

Sam made the point that he had done his research, and that on paper, all of what they had qualified them for the debt consolidation. Still denied. Which is the point. Even if you meet all the qualifications for it, you can still be denied for "reasons".



C'mon. The banker's first thought of where he recognized him was from football. Not all racism is about putting on your klan hood and getting a tiki torch.

I never said or implied otherwise. LSU football is a huge deal out there so that being his initial question isn't all that absurd.

 

[Legendver2]

I have no idea of the going rates for these types of contract jobs, but I'd imagine that job during the intro should have netted him at least 6 figures. I mean that was some hardcore ****.

 

[TheVileOne]

Sam made the point that he had done his research, and that on paper, all of what they had qualified them for the debt consolidation. Still denied. Which is the point. Even if you meet all the qualifications for it, you can still be denied for "reasons".



C'mon. The banker's first thought of where he recognized him was from football. Not all racism is about putting on your klan hood and getting a tiki torch.

Microaggressions.

 

[P Supreme]

this is why i love this place reading some folks say that this episode didn't grabbed them like the first episode of wandavision which to me is INSANITY LOL cause I was bored to tears with wandavision first episode while this i've already seen 3 times HYPE I LOVE YOU