Shang - Chi

Discussion in 'Marvel Films' started by Blitzkrieg, Dec 3, 2018.

  1. psylockolussus

    psylockolussus well-known Mutant

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2004
    Messages:
    37,054
    Likes Received:
    315
    Trophy Points:
    83
    They probably want something different and not just go with bigger characters. Luke Cage, Daredevil and Iron Fist were pretty much wasted in the Netflix shows as those were just a dragging mess and they held back a lot in terms of embracing the look of the comics, and in terms of public recognition, those shows aren't as popular as the mcu films. So I'm glad Shang Chi is getting a shot in a live action film.

    How about the Kung Fu Panda films?
     
    #176
  2. Dark Raven

    Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    48,040
    Likes Received:
    629
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I don't really think Donnie Yen suits Shang Chi anyway. He could play a villain though.

    Also, I don't think being able to create doubles is the way to go. It takes away some of the suspense, because if he can just have multiple versions of himself, he can use them to fight crowds of people. You don't get to see one guy going up against dozens of people the way Bruce Lee would have in Enter the Dragon, and defeating them all.

    If Shang Chi can create duplicates, then he can always resort to that and overpower people or outnumber them. There's no need even for a good Kung Fu fight when you can just beat someone by sheer force of numbers. I think that would be a mistake. Also, it would be too much of a special effect.
     
    #177
  3. moped

    moped Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2014
    Messages:
    33
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    Fun fact about Donnie Yen, he can breakdance! Mismatched couples was probably the first film I've seen him in.
     
    #178
  4. SyntaxError

    SyntaxError Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2014
    Messages:
    701
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    18
    My pick for Shang Chi is Eddie Peng. Wanted him as Namor but since that isn't happening and this is being fast-tracked, I think he'd be the best fit. Has martial arts experience (real, chinese martial arts), is fluent in English, a MASSIVE star in China, and a great actor.
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]

    Also the crew behind the camera, including director, cinematographer, costume design, and ESPECIALLY choreographer have to have roots/experience in the chinese martial arts film industry. BOATLOADS of talent in the chinese industry, particularly from Hong Kong. The movie needs to be told from that perspective instead of the 'white American gaze'. Watch some HK martial arts films and you'll see what I mean. Dream Director for me would be Wong Kar-wai.

    As others have said, I hope they are able to mobilize the big Chinese names in the industry to join the cast, ala Black Panther. Jackie Chan, Donnie Yen, Jet Li, Michelle Yeoh, Chow Yun-fat, Sammo Hung should all have roles, even if just cameos/bit-parts.
     
    #179
    Silvermoth likes this.
  5. Dark Raven

    Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    48,040
    Likes Received:
    629
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I haven't seen him in anything.

    Anyway, I agree that we should get all the big Chinese actors in this. It should be like Crazy Rich Asians with their all-Asian cast. Although I bet we would get a few Westerners still. As long as they aren't the POV characters or any kind of white saviour. No black saviours either. No black or white "sidekicks" like Rush Hour or Shanghai Noon. We don't need any of those to make it more palatable to western audiences.

    It's a shame Marvel have already used up Gemma Chan in Captain Marvel, otherwise she could've been in this movie too.
     
    #180
  6. SyntaxError

    SyntaxError Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 20, 2014
    Messages:
    701
    Likes Received:
    5
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Honestly, I don't think Marvel should look to CRA as a model for this film. The reason why CRA flopped in China is because the film did not represent Asia. There has been a lot of blowback against the film in Asia. Its been a massive success in America because its the first of its kind: Asian-American cast telling an Asian-American story. BUT there's a significant difference between Asian-American and Asian, and that did not translate well abroad in Asia. At the end of the day the film was perceived as a Hollywood movie told from American eyes. Thats why I hope Marvel has the foresight to bring on crew from the Asian film industry with experience in martial arts films to produce this movie. You can never represent a culture without living it.
     
    #181
    Blitzkrieg likes this.
  7. CaptainWagner

    CaptainWagner Cool. Cool cool cool.

    Joined:
    May 29, 2014
    Messages:
    7,403
    Likes Received:
    114
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I can't imagine they exclude any and all of his various white partners from this. If Ross made it into Black Panther, I guarantee you that we get one of Shang-Chi's "side kicks". It has nothing to do with being "palatable" and everything to do with just telling the story.
     
    #182
  8. Silvermoth

    Silvermoth Avenger

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2006
    Messages:
    14,926
    Likes Received:
    364
    Trophy Points:
    83
    I could see him working well. He’s got buckets of charisma and a nice profile here and in the east
     
    #183
  9. Chance Jackson

    Chance Jackson Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2, 2013
    Messages:
    1,302
    Likes Received:
    3
    Trophy Points:
    38
    I think it was the subject matter that doomed the movie, prior to the release of the movie in China there were a number of high profile criminal cases of super rich Chinese celebrities getting caught evading taxes perhaps that had an impact.
     
    #184
  10. moped

    moped Active Member

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2014
    Messages:
    33
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    6
    No idea if it had any impact or not , but I agree with what SyntaxError said. That movie was just kinda terrible in my opinion. Felt like watching how Chinese people are through the eyes of Americans and the rich in awe of even richer people. I don't know anything about African culture but at least to me Black Panther felt authentic, the actors behaved and sounded like they are from that region. This one had almost everyone talking like they were British or from the US or something. And if they are suppose to be a very traditional family in Singapore, then why are they Christians and not Buddhist? I think it bombed in China and other parts of Asia as well ( if I'm not mistaken? ) because the plot is just very shallow and just a bad and unauthentic representation of Chinese culture. And where are the Japanese , Koreans , Vietnamese etc ?
     
    #185
  11. Iceman

    Iceman Daffy Duck Vs The Joker

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2005
    Messages:
    127,780
    Likes Received:
    7,572
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I hope they really get ambitious with the martial arts here so that it’s one of the best films of that type in a good while.
     
    #186
  12. Dark Raven

    Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    48,040
    Likes Received:
    629
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I don't think the title of that film was supposed to refer to absolutely every Asian. It was just called that, but perhaps set only in Singapore. I'm not sure what the book was like and how faithful it was to the source material.

    The thing about the movie in China is that they already have plenty of Chinese dramas covering all kinds of subjects. They're not just martial arts movies. So CRA was not something new to them seeing an all Chinese cast. They get this every day. It's just that they don't get such a huge and lavish Hollywood budget.

    As for being a traditional family in Singapore and why they are Christians rather than Buddhists, well that doesn't quite follow. They can be traditional in culture and values, because of their upbringing and heritage, but this family can easily have either been raised as Christians or become Christians at some point. Each individual family is different, and their personal experiences shape their lives and beliefs. Now the family didn't particularly behave as Christians, especially in the way the mother (Michelle Yeoh) was so unaccepting and judgmental of Constance Wu's character. But that's beside the point here. All I'm saying is that it is very possible for a Chinese family to be very traditional but not be Buddhists. I can tell you that from experience.

    And as for everyone sounding like they were British or from the US, I can see what they were doing. They were trying to overcome typical stereotypes that Westerners have of Asians that they all speak with accents, are all a bit goofy, nerdy or subservient. They were trying to show that they are just as cool and acceptable as anyone else and can be considered attractive as well.

    In fact, the reason that many spoke in this way was because they were brought up either in England or the US, according to the story. So a lot of this film was about cultural clashes. If you recall Awkwafina's line to Constance Wu about being a banana (yellow on the outside, white on the inside), that was something very significant here, and also significant for a lot of Chinese who are either born or raised elsewhere other than China itself. There is always that constant dilemma and struggle about not fitting in because they're too Asian-looking to be considered white, but too white in mentality, upbringing and culture to be considered Asian.

    Now admittedly, many of those in CRA, particularly the older generation or those who were raised in China, should've sounded more Asian. But it wasn't completely out of place for there to also be Chinese who sounded Western. It's not quite the same as Black Panther and Wakanda, where they were an isolated and hidden nation that had barely had any exposure to the outside world. There, it was natural for them to all speak only with African accents.

    Bringing this back on topic (although the above is not so much just a discussion of CRA but of Asian culture), when it comes to Shang Chi, it will all depend on whether he's been raised exclusively in China, or whether he was brought up (or even born) in America or even England. I'm sure there will be a mix of different types in the film.
     
    #187
  13. Dark Raven

    Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    48,040
    Likes Received:
    629
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Depends on what you mean by "ambitious". If you mean being more fantastical, well that's what Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon did. And all of that wire work looks dated and unimpressive compared to classic Kung Fu films from the 1970s where they had to rely purely on fight choreography and pure skill. If someone did some fancy move, it was because they were doing it in real life as a practical stunt. There was none of this gravity-defying ridiculousness like in Crouching Tiger or House of Flying Daggers etc.

    That's why the Bruce Lee films or earlier Jackie Chan films look far more impressive than anything recently. If you want to see sheer skill and fighting prowess, watch those. Marvel needs to go more practical with Shang Chi than going more fantastical. If the fights in Shang Chi were anything like Drunken Master (Jackie Chan's masterpiece), then that would be better than any Crouching Tiger type of film out there. It won't have the visual spectacle of flying through the air and never touching the ground, but it still ultimately looks way better and more breathtaking when you see all the actual skill involved.
     
    #188
  14. Iceman

    Iceman Daffy Duck Vs The Joker

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2005
    Messages:
    127,780
    Likes Received:
    7,572
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I guess I mean both ambitious in terms of getting the very best martial arts practitioners/stuntmen working today and then also having something extra like having some sparks and glowing stuff come off when he uses his moves. :cwink:
     
    #189
  15. Silvermoth

    Silvermoth Avenger

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2006
    Messages:
    14,926
    Likes Received:
    364
    Trophy Points:
    83
    Hey you know what would be great for this? Setting it in madripoor. They’ll own the rights to that soon
     
    #190
  16. Iceman

    Iceman Daffy Duck Vs The Joker

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2005
    Messages:
    127,780
    Likes Received:
    7,572
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I hope they get a top martial arts co-ordinator for the action scenes. I think this guy could be good:

    [​IMG]
     
    #191
  17. Damkac

    Damkac Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2018
    Messages:
    127
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I hope action scenes looks as good as in the Winter Soldier. I prefer to keep it quite realistic, no flying people please.
     
    #192
    Dark Raven and Iceman like this.
  18. Iceman

    Iceman Daffy Duck Vs The Joker

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2005
    Messages:
    127,780
    Likes Received:
    7,572
    Trophy Points:
    113
    That's probably the MCU film that has the best close quarters hand-to-hand action. :up:
     
    #193
  19. Dark Raven

    Dark Raven The Gal from Themyscira

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2010
    Messages:
    48,040
    Likes Received:
    629
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I don't mind flying if it looks truly acrobatic and as if it can actually be done by someone in real life. So like when you see gymnasts or acrobats leaping about.

    What I don't want is someone defying gravity, because even if someone thinks that looks wicked, it just looks silly and unrealistic. What's so impressive about seeing someone being suspended or walking in mid air? But if you see actual skill, even if they use a springboard to boost their jumps, that looks impressive.
     
    #194
  20. SPO2 Dalisay

    SPO2 Dalisay Vigilante

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2017
    Messages:
    997
    Likes Received:
    15
    Trophy Points:
    18
    The problem with the quasi wire fu flying martial arts is now we have the UFC and the my martial arts is better than yours questions have been largely answered so audiences are more likely to buy more real world looking take downs and fights as what the best would do.
     
    #195
  21. BarryAllen

    BarryAllen ey b0ss

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2014
    Messages:
    1,461
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    38
    They aren't redundant though. Iron Fist has a bigger lore, with powers and dragons and such. Shang-Chi is more espionage and Bruce Lee stylized action.

    I will say it boggles the mind what Marvel Television and Jeph Loeb were thinking choosing someone like Iron Fist for Netflix (probably knowing that TV couldn't be enough for a proper adaptation) while Shang-Chi would've fit that medium far better. It's like they set themselves for failure (samething with Inhumans on TV).
     
    #196
    Iceman likes this.
  22. Iceman

    Iceman Daffy Duck Vs The Joker

    Joined:
    Dec 27, 2005
    Messages:
    127,780
    Likes Received:
    7,572
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Yep, you can really feel the budget limitations in the Iron Fist show. I would have preferred him to appear in films. But these series should be fine if they want to try the character again.
     
    #197
  23. Darkprime

    Darkprime Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2014
    Messages:
    1,006
    Likes Received:
    220
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I will be surprised if this ever makes it past the script stage tbh. its just so random and seems like that type of project to get stuck in development hell.
     
    #198
  24. CaptainWagner

    CaptainWagner Cool. Cool cool cool.

    Joined:
    May 29, 2014
    Messages:
    7,403
    Likes Received:
    114
    Trophy Points:
    63
    I would be shocked. That would be completely unlike anything that has happened with the MCU before. They don't start work on something if they aren't sure they want it.
     
    #199
  25. Silvermoth

    Silvermoth Avenger

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2006
    Messages:
    14,926
    Likes Received:
    364
    Trophy Points:
    83
    I reckon there’s a good chance. In fact, marvel tend to have a policy of waiting for a great script to come to them rather than going out and chasing people up. That’s how they got the script for guardians of the galaxy after all. I reckon if they’re seriously considering it, they probably have a script already that they like very much.

    Plus there’s tons of interest from people who want to play the lead. The important bit will be finding the right director. I would love to know who the favourites are
     
    #200

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"