Comics So JMS and Joey Q know they screwed up...

[Herr Logan]

Thank you.

I can suspend my disbelief somewhat, but watching Batman strap a bomb to a guy's chest, knock him into a pit, and then, not 2 seconds later, the bomb goes off, that's murder. There is no "Fillin' in th' blanks' " about it. He killed that guy. Even if the guy could have gotten the bomb off in the two seconds he was in the air, he couldn't have done wnything with it. He might have been burned to death or died from the concussion as opposed to being blown to bits.

Did the Batman even witness that guy killing someone else? He's like the freakin' Punisher in that scene, even smiling at what he did.

 

[Herr Logan]

Ya know one thing Herr, I find myself whenever I go to a movie anymore, I just totally distance myself from the book now. Ever Since I saw white fang as a little kid, and was appaled at how much they changed it from the book, I come to movies expecting the worst, and If I'm lucky leave pleasantly surprised. (like V.)

Now I know we shouldn't have to do that when we go to movies, and that the producers are perfectly capable of making movies much more accurate to their source material, but they never are, and when I go to the movies I go to get away from reality for a little while and enjoy myself.

I still did enjoy fantastic four as a movie, I've never been a big FF buff, but I did know enough to realise how badly they buthered Doom's character, but it's like I said. I went to the movie theater because I wanted to see a movie, forget about real life for a little while and enjoy it, and if the movie does screw it up, I can always go rent out one of the essentials if I want to see the characters at their best.

Thats why I still enjoyed the SM movies, despite the glaring changes to parts of his character, and some of those changes still irk me pretty bad, but I suppose I've just gotten to the point now where I can appreciate the movie for it's good parts and what it is. Besidies its not like a movie will ever be able to match the fantasies we paint in our heads of our characters. I may be sounding a little "corporate sheepish" to you at the moment, but that's just my veiw on the matter.

That said, Spidey better tell some more God Damn F*C*ing jokes this time around.

How exactly does stating that you enjoyed a flawed movie make you sound "corporate sheepish?" Is there some direct, unbreakable relationship between enjoying something for what it is and defending something against criticism? Hmm, guess I forgot where I was. It's the Superhero Hype, where it's practically forbidden to actually analyze what people say and make an important distinction between preferences and arguments.

I said it was a stone cold fact that Movie!Doom wasn't nearly close enough to the real one, and that will always be true. That has nothing to do with whether someone has a right to enjoy it for its own sake.

Maybe you should go back to talking about me behind my back or something. I'm not in the mood to explain what I've already explained literally dozens of times on these boards already; something that should have been obvious to begin with, anyway.
Bottom line, you didn't make an argument here, so if you expect me to rant some more on the subject of DDINO for everyone's entertainment, give an opinion (an argument), not a statement of indisputable fact (that you enjoyed the FF movie, which can't be proven by me).

 

[Infinity9999x]

How exactly does stating that you enjoyed a flawed movie make you sound "corporate sheepish?" Is there some direct, unbreakable relationship between enjoying something for what it is and defending something against criticism? Hmm, guess I forgot where I was. It's the Superhero Hype, where it's practically forbidden to actually analyze what people say and make an important distinction between preferences and arguments.

I said it was a stone cold fact that Movie!Doom wasn't nearly close enough to the real one, and that will always be true. That has nothing to do with whether someone has a right to enjoy it for its own sake.

Maybe you should go back to talking about me behind my back or something. I'm not in the mood to explain what I've already explained literally dozens of times on these boards already; something that should have been obvious to begin with, anyway.
Bottom line, you didn't make an argument here, so if you expect me to rant some more on the subject of DDINO for everyone's entertainment, give an opinion (an argument), not a statement of indisputable fact (that you enjoyed the FF movie, which can't be proven by me).

I haven't talked behind your back at least I haven't insulted you. I inquired a while ago wondering where you were because I hadn't seen you around in a while, I'm sorry if you took that as an insult. I just thought you might think me a bit shallow for enjoying the movie despite its numerous flaws, because the first time I told you I thought the SM1 movie wasn't that bad (you probably don't remeber I was a newbie and it was more then a year ago) you basically told me I should re-examine my ideas, but you also did point out many flaws that I had overlooked because my immediate response to the movie was OMG AWESOME!! (I was in 6th grade when it came out so ya, it took me a while to get over the fangboyishness)

I suppose I just felt like I might need to justify myself if I was saying I like the movie, I mean this is the hype, I've gotten attacked for stating simple things like that before. I'm sorry if I offended you, that wasn't my intention.

 

[Herr Logan]

I haven't talked behind your back at least I haven't insulted you. I inquired a while ago wondering where you were because I hadn't seen you around in a while, I'm sorry if you took that as an insult.

Going over the facts again, I may have misinterpreted something you said that was brought to my attention a while ago. For now I'll let it slide.

I just thought you might think me a bit shallow for enjoying the movie despite its numerous flaws, because the first time I told you I thought the SM1 movie wasn't that bad (you probably don't remeber I was a newbie and it was more then a year ago) you basically told me I should re-examine my ideas, but you also did point out many flaws that I had overlooked because my immediate response to the movie was OMG AWESOME!! (I was in 6th grade when it came out so ya, it took me a while to get over the fangboyishness)

Funny, I thought you couldn't understand the fanboy mind.

I suppose I just felt like I might need to justify myself if I was saying I like the movie, I mean this is the hype, I've gotten attacked for stating simple things like that before. I'm sorry if I offended you, that wasn't my intention.

Nobody should have the right to make you feel bad about simply liking or enjoying something. There's no argument for that.

However, when someone says something about a movie that's assertive and goes beyond simply, "I like [whatever]," you can be damn sure I have the right to tear into any weak arguments, and it is my pleasure to do so, as you well know.

There are dozens of people on these boards who have deliberately ignored the distinction between what I do and the hypothetical poster who judges people on their preferences alone. These are the people who like to throw the word "opinion" around like it actually means something coming from them. It means precisely nothing when those simpletons use it, because they're talking about arguments but attempting to forbid others from challenging those arguments, which makes their childish concept of "opinion" even more worthless than the arguments they make.
That is why I got defensive about your earlier post in this thread. It was an overreaction, I'll admit.

 

[Infinity9999x]

Going over the facts again, I may have misinterpreted something you said that was brought to my attention a while ago. For now I'll let it slide.



Funny, I thought you couldn't understand the fanboy mind.


Nobody should have the right to make you feel bad about simply liking or enjoying something. There's no argument for that.

However, when someone says something about a movie that's assertive and goes beyond simply, "I like [whatever]," you can be damn sure I have the right to tear into any weak arguments, and it is my pleasure to do so, as you well know.

There are dozens of people on these boards who have deliberately ignored the distinction between what I do and the hypothetical poster who judges people on their preferences alone. These are the people who like to throw the word "opinion" around like it actually means something coming from them. It means precisely nothing when those simpletons use it, because they're talking about arguments but attempting to forbid others from challenging those arguments, which makes their childish concept of "opinion" even more worthless than the arguments they make.
That is why I got defensive about your earlier post in this thread. It was an overreaction, I'll admit.

It's alright, besides I really posted about nothing anyways. Oh and I followed your advice and picked up some essentials Sm's from my library, and I have to say, I love the death of Gwen stacy story. I was surprised by how simple and yet how extremely complicated those stories could be at the same time.

 

[Herr Logan]

It's alright, besides I really posted about nothing anyways. Oh and I followed your advice and picked up some essentials Sm's from my library, and I have to say, I love the death of Gwen stacy story. I was surprised by how simple and yet how extremely complicated those stories could be at the same time.

Those stories are definitely somethin' special. Glad to have set you on the righteous path.


One day I shall call on you for a favor....

 

[Source]

To be honest I just heard about this topic today!!!.....I find it hard to believe that MJ is the sole reason the Spider-Books are in such disarray.....I'm not opposed to change...but Peter and MJ have been there for decades....they've fleshed her character out more than anyone else in the Books besides Peter....I think losing MJ is going to destroy the books...the old spider man books dont work in these present days and times...society's morals have changeed...some good some bad....I love MJ and I like the influence she has over Spider-Man..all because shes a model doesnt make Spidey's everyman angle disappear....good things happen to everyday guys....if this comes to pass I'm officially done with SpiderMan and I will do everything in my power to see that Marvel never gets over this INSANELY STUPID MISTAKE!!!...I'm actually going to start a petition to show marvel that not everyone agrees with JMS and Joey Q...that being...the ones that pay for them to have a job...the FANS!

 

[Source]

Sorry I just made this into a new thread

 

[SpideyInATree]

To be honest I just heard about this topic today!!!.....I find it hard to believe that MJ is the sole reason the Spider-Books are in such disarray.....I'm not opposed to change...but Peter and MJ have been there for decades....they've fleshed her character out more than anyone else in the Books besides Peter....I think losing MJ is going to destroy the books...the old spider man books dont work in these present days and times...society's morals have changeed...some good some bad....I love MJ and I like the influence she has over Spider-Man..all because shes a model doesnt make Spidey's everyman angle disappear....good things happen to everyday guys....if this comes to pass I'm officially done with SpiderMan and I will do everything in my power to see that Marvel never gets over this INSANELY STUPID MISTAKE!!!...I'm actually going to start a petition to show marvel that not everyone agrees with JMS and Joey Q...that being...the ones that pay for them to have a job...the FANS!

Good luck.

 

[LarryLegend]

To be honest I just heard about this topic today!!!.....I find it hard to believe that MJ is the sole reason the Spider-Books are in such disarray.....I'm not opposed to change...but Peter and MJ have been there for decades....they've fleshed her character out more than anyone else in the Books besides Peter....I think losing MJ is going to destroy the books...the old spider man books dont work in these present days and times...society's morals have changeed...some good some bad....I love MJ and I like the influence she has over Spider-Man..all because shes a model doesnt make Spidey's everyman angle disappear....good things happen to everyday guys....if this comes to pass I'm officially done with SpiderMan and I will do everything in my power to see that Marvel never gets over this INSANELY STUPID MISTAKE!!!...I'm actually going to start a petition to show marvel that not everyone agrees with JMS and Joey Q...that being...the ones that pay for them to have a job...the FANS!

You're doing good work my friend

 

[chris moore]

JoeQ's reasoning behind the spidey marriage being a bad thing for Peter is loosely that Peter isnt supposed to have it good; he's not sposed to be able to get the girl. Peter Parker is supposed ot be the everyman's man, the guy who cant get dates and shrinks his spidey outfit in the wash, and cant hold down a job etc etc.

So with this in mind... why is it that the idea of the everyman (past teenagehood) is to finally settle down with someone you love and struggle through life together? How can they say that the character of spidey is diminished because they cant tell hard luck stories as well as they used to when he was young and single? You cant have a guy get to his mid 20's and never have had a meaningful relationship in his life because the editors think that that is what makes him accessible to the average joe. Its bad enough that there's never been good enough reasoning for him not getting a specific graduate degree, or even attempting to get a research job somewhere. Its bull saying his life as spidey prevents him putting in the hours etc etc. He's now a bloody teacher! Talk about a strict timetable! And people like Tony Stark have managed for years to be the hero and still do one hell of a full work day.

From Wiki: Controversies
According to Stan Lee, Mary Jane was originally intended to be simply a rival for Gwen Stacy for the affections of Peter Parker. Lee had always intended for Gwen Stacy to be Spider-Man's one true love, but fans vocally supported the feisty Mary Jane over the non-offensive Gwen Stacy. The pairing of Mary Jane and Peter Parker has become one of the true classic romances of the comic medium and the couple are considered to be one of the comic genre's most beloved "super-couples".

However, many professional writers, artists, and editors at Marvel dislike the pairing and the Mary Jane character. They feel that Mary Jane, being an attractive female figure, should never be attracted to Spider-Man and often consider her relationship and marriage to Peter to be highly unrealistic. Many of these critics include Alex Ross, former Editor-In-Chief Bob Harras, and current Marvel Editor-In-Chief Joe Quesada.

Fans (or shippers) of the Mary Jane/Peter Parker relationship often are very vocal about criticism about the relationship, especially online. Besides pointing out the natural way in which the Peter/Mary Jane relationship evolved as a natural and realistic relationship, many comic fans eagerly point out that people like Bob Harras and Joe Quesada have a tendency to use Mary Jane as a "scapegoat" for problems with the Spider-Man franchise, rather than admitting to real problems like bad writing and over-exposure of certain characters like Venom and Carnage as the reason why sales are down. To many fans of the character, the portrayal of Mary Jane by top members of Marvel's editorial staff as an "Emmanuel Goldstein"-type figure has been used as a major example of how out of touch many Marvel editors are with the people reading their comics.