SteveDeKnight

[triplet]

You know what's interesting, I usually hate his writing. He does have some winners (Mortal, Onyx) but when he's off(Ageless, Tomb) he's really off.

From what he said about both of those on his blog, I don't think the problems with those episodes were entirely his fault....

He's blamed the different system on Smallville on a lot of the problems. The problems, he implied, that wouldn't have happened on the shows he'd worked on previously (BtVS and Angel).

Joss Whedon apparently gave the writers more control over the final product than Smallville does... Too bad too.

I wasn't a buffy or Angel fan, but my sis who is said that some of the best episodes from those shows were written by Steven...

As is the case here. Mercy is an extremely strong episode, probably one of my favorites.... Top Ten anyway. I shoulda scored it higher in the ranking thread...

I have to give him much respect for this effort though. How many writers of a show with such a opinionated fan base actually have the gall to face the masses as it were? His credo as a writer went up alot in my book.

I hope he listens and delivers some of the more thought out feedback to the writer's room. Maybe our say will make a difference, but probably not. When it deals with the bottom line, and the dollar sign, they will end up doing what they want anyway.

But bravo on his part.

You should take a gander at his blog... The responses he's made so far are highly educational into the process, so I'm enjoying reading them...

BTW: you don't need to be a member of myspace to read his posts, just to reply to them.

 

[Brainiac 8]

From what he said about both of those on his blog, I don't think the problems with those episodes were entirely his fault....

He's blamed the different system on Smallville on a lot of the problems. The problems, he implied, that wouldn't have happened on the shows he'd worked on previously (BtVS and Angel).

Joss Whedon apparently gave the writers more control over the final product than Smallville does... Too bad too.

I wasn't a buffy or Angel fan, but my sis who is said that some of the best episodes from those shows were written by Steven...

As is the case here. Mercy is an extremely strong episode, probably one of my favorites.... Top Ten anyway. I shoulda scored it higher in the ranking thread...

I agree with you...Mercy was a great episode. Also one of my favorites from this season. I just didn't want to try and mention all of his I liked.

I agree with you though, great episode!

You should take a gander at his blog... The responses he's made so far are highly educational into the process, so I'm enjoying reading them...

BTW: you don't need to be a member of myspace to read his posts, just to reply to them.

I havn't really had time to yet, but I will check out his blogs soon. Like I said when it comes to the dollar sign, and what the producer's "Think" us fans want, they get the final say in the end. So we get trash like "Lucy" while probably much better ideas stay on the cutting room floor. They think we want skin instead of proper characterization. (I know that some want the skin, and I certainly don't cover my eyes, but that is not what holds a show.)

The actuall writers probably don't say a whole lot in argument because it doesn't hurt their wallets when a bad episode is made. I do still applaud DeKnight's efforts to reach the fans, and give them some insight into the process that is the "writer's room".

I just don't agree with corporate politics and I also don't agree with being forcefed what producer's think we want, when I think the writers could come up with much better stories.

Sorry, got into rant mode for an instant.

Still love the show though.

 

[triplet]

From what he's said, he would probably agree with you but I don't think I want to speak for him... I repect him more as a writer now that I've seen what he's said of the drek he's produced for Smallville.

He recognizes the problems and knows things shoulda been done differently, so I have hope that things will get better next year.



Hopefully no more Tombs and Hypnotics... *shudder*

 

[avidreader]

I thought his thoughts on Lana were interesting. Its been speculated across the board as to whether Lana has been aware of some of Lex's evil doings. Without coming right out and saying anything, he has basically implied that Lana should know better than to get into a relationship with Lex and that unfortunately for her she will probably learn her lessons the hard way.

Which has me wondering still as to what her exact motivations are.

 

[triplet]

Hmmm...

Interesting observations, avid... I didn't think of what he said in those terms, but I think you're right... makes me wonder too.

 

[avidreader]

Hmmm...

Interesting observations, avid... I didn't think of what he said in those terms, but I think you're right... makes me wonder too.

I'm holding onto a glimmer of hope that the beautiful sweet Lana couldnt possibly fall for Lex Luthor.


Anyway, I was reading a thread over at Sweet titled Craig from Ksite wants to know what you want, or something like that. In the Thread it says that Craig is doing this for "someone". Made me wonder if that "someone" was Steve DeKnight.

Here's what Craig said.

I'm collecting opinions for someone who's trying to get a hold of what the fans are thinking, and if the people at Sweet aren't represented it'll be awfully one sided. Whoever sees it would think Smallville is a secret title for the Chloe Sullivan Show

Mythica, I really liked your post, you hit so many things on the mark and I'm sorry if any of your past K-Site experiences have been bad ones. Wordy McWord on Non-Angst Clana. I think part of the issue anyone ever has with it is just that it's so depressing half the time - especially when they break up like six episodes in a row.

So yeah, if anyone turns it into a debate thread their posts will be deleted and there shall be a smack down I really appreciate your posting there... I promise it's not just a ploy to get people to come to the forum. And Rockamaniac thanks for letting people know.

I find it amusing that 90% of everyone all agrees that Grandma just isn't cutting it. Ugh at the anvils, too. It was especially painful last week, that whole "I want to meet a guy like Jonathan" thing. Lois should be made her own character, and quit with the foreshadowing or go away.

-- Craig

If you want to post your opinions on the matter, then you should go here.

http://kryptonsite.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=55454

P.S. Can someone please tell me how to post a link using just one word?

 

[BaK]

Which has me wondering still as to what her exact motivations are.

I think they have done a pretty good job this season in hinting, explaining and building up to a point where a girl like her would start to have feelings for someone like Lex..
It's also possible that they somewhat slowed down/wavered this whole transformation to evil Lex - for her to still be able to see something good there - something the "rebound Smallville way" can take her to/put her in an ultimate "learn the hard way about truth and lies" situation..

Should she know better, of course, but hey, this just might be more "fun" storywise and Clark wise, at least for me..

 

[avidreader]

I think they have done a pretty good job this season in hinting, explaining and building up to a point where a girl like her would start to have feelings for someone like Lex..
It's also possible that they somewhat slowed down/wavered this whole transformation to evil Lex - for her to still be able to see something good there - something the "rebound Smallville way" can take her to/put her in an ultimate "learn the hard way about truth and lies" situation..

Should she know better, of course, but hey, this just might be more "fun" storywise and Clark wise, at least for me..

Good point. It is more fun this way, to have her learn the hard way that secrets and lies are not the be all and end all to life and happiness.

However, just reading through the posts over at Ksite, everyone wants a Lana that is let in on the secret.

 

[AgentPat]

...I find it amusing that 90% of everyone all agrees that Grandma just isn't cutting it. Ugh at the anvils, too. It was especially painful last week, that whole "I want to meet a guy like Jonathan" thing. Lois should be made her own character, and quit with the foreshadowing or go away.

Who's "Grandma," what's this about "anvils," and WTF is he talking about when it comes to Lois and foreshadowing? Helllllllooooooo? Lois Lane is only the second most important character in the entire Superman mythos after Clark himself.

The hell?





As to DeKnight (the topic of this thread after all), I found a few more quotes from him that are interesting...

Regarding Mercy's elevator scene:

Ah, yes, the elevator. You know back in my early days, I wanted to be a biochemist. I loved science, and still do. So why would I write that Clark catches the elevator, even though I know in the real world it would still kill Martha and Lionel? One simple word:

MONEY.

That's right. The green stuff. The elevator idea was the brainchild of the director, James Marshall, and I think it was a brilliant addition. Originally, Clark was going to burst through a wall ABOVE the plummeting elevator, drop down on top, and slow it down with his bare hands. Unfortunately this proved to be way outside the budget. So we changed it Clark bursting through the wall at the bottom of the shaft, leaping up several stories, latching onto the bottom of the elevator, then again slowing it down with his hands before it hit bottom. Sadly, again too expensive with all the CGI.

So that's how it went from physically plausible to physically impossible. We have to work within the constraints of time and money, and sometimes logic gets sacrificed in the bloodletting.

Still kind of a cool moment, though, wasn't it?

And Clark's confrontation with Lionel at the end:

That final scene was a blast to write. Originally, Clark's last line was "Stay away from my mother, or I'll show you how much damage a Kryptonian can really do." We thought that might be a little too much, so we toned it down just a hair.

Regarding the S5 DVD:

Question: Do you know if Tom Welling will be doing any commentary this year? Perhaps for Reckoning or Fragile?

I'm not sure. It's hard for Tom to do commentary because we generally do them early now to get the DVDs out right around the time the new season premiers. That means Tom is either still working or is just recovering.

How's that for a none answer?

 

[avidreader]

Who's "Grandma," what's this about "anvils," and WTF is he talking about when it comes to Lois and foreshadowing? Helllllllooooooo? Lois Lane is only the second most important character in the entire Superman mythos after Clark himself.

The hell?

You should go and make a post, actually I'd really enjoy reading your post. Lois is really getting bad.

 

[AgentPat]

You should go and make a post, actually I'd really enjoy reading your post. Lois is really getting bad.

Getting bad? How? She's not any more annoying than....

 

[avidreader]

Getting bad? How? She's not any more annoying than....

Dont worry she's getting it bad too.

There's no debating going on, its really just a place to express your likes, dislikes and wishes.

 

[BaK]

However, just reading through the posts over at Ksite, everyone wants a Lana that is let in on the secret.

Me too, and I beleive it still will be done in a trully amazing way, something that will outshine, build on, and make up for sort of a "letdown" Reckoning (to a lot) was..

 

[BaK]

Getting bad? How? She's not any more annoying than....

Even Lucy was less annoying then her..

 

[AgentPat]

Dont worry she's getting it bad too.

LOL

Actually, I like the new direction for Lana. She *was* annoying (to me), but the dialog between her and Lex is a lot more crisp and interesting now. It's... I dunno... different. She still pisses and moans about Clark, but at least she's not doing it to his face any more. Well, not as much. The fact that Lex is playing her as much as he is genuinely interested in her (I see it as half and half) makes it MUCH more interesting. And Clark can FINALLY move on. Hallelujah.

It's all good.

But seriously, who's "grandma?" I've never heard that before, and are the "anvils" just foreshadowing dialog? Like um... the stuff that Clark has been saying since the Pilot? Is THAT what Craig is moaning about? If so, I'm stunned. That's the best part about the show!

Well... that and TW of course.

 

[avidreader]

LOL

Actually, I like the new direction for Lana. She *was* annoying (to me), but the dialog between her and Lex is a lot more crisp and interesting now. It's... I dunno... different. She still pisses and moans about Clark, but at least she's not doing it to his face any more. Well, not as much. The fact that Lex is playing her as much as he is genuinely interested in her (I see it as half and half) makes it MUCH more interesting. And Clark can FINALLY move on. Hallelujah.

I thought I could handle it, but I dont like Lana with Lex.

But seriously, who's "grandma?" I've never heard that before, and are the "anvils" just foreshadowing dialog? Like um... the stuff that Clark has been saying since the Pilot? Is THAT what Craig is moaning about? If so, I'm stunned. That's the best part about the show!

Well... that and TW of course.

I thought you were kidding. He's talking about Lois. I dont think Craig hides the fact that he thinks Lois would be more suitable as Clark's grandmother than his future wife.

Me too, and I beleive it still will be done in a trully amazing way, something that will outshine, build on, and make up for sort of a "letdown" Reckoning (to a lot) was..

I hope you're right.

 

[AgentPat]

I thought I could handle it, but I dont like Lana with Lex.

Y'know, part of the reason I like her with Lex? This is gonna sound sadistic mind you, but I want to see her get burned (metaphorically), especially after that crack in Fade about not needing Clark to protect her, when just hours before, he intercepted a bullet headed straight for her pretty little head.

Yeah. I want to see her learn a painful lesson. Don't play with matches around rocket fuel. Clark warned her about not trusting Lex, and she equated that with a lack of trust of Clark. Owwwwch! That stung. It really, really did. When the show comes to an end, seeing her realize what she lost in Clark when he moved on will be the ultimate catharsis. It'll be Greek Tragedy at its best. I can't wait!!

I thought you were kidding. He's talking about Lois. I dont think Craig hides the fact that he thinks Lois would be more suitable as Clark's grandmother than his future wife.

Gawd!

I KNEW there was a reason I avoided K-Site. I thought it was because of all the Buffy fans and the ridiculous Chloe-becomes-Lois theories.

Lois acts like that because it's in her character to be that way. Simple as that.

 

[Serene]

Damn... looks like I should start hanging around K-site more.

 

[rumpuso]

Craig is a huge Allison Mack fan. Not sure if he's a proponent of that crazy theory running rampant on KSite and TWOP, but it wouldn't surprise me. So there are lots of subtle and not so subtle knocks about Lois as well as the writers beating the fans over the head with anvils, and finally how old (grandma) Erica looks. It's too bad people say things like that, but he isn't the only one over there saying things like that.

 

[Serene]

Y'know, part of the reason I like her with Lex? This is gonna sound sadistic mind you, but I want to see her get burned (metaphorically), especially after that crack in Fade about not needing Clark to protect her, when just hours before, he intercepted a bullet headed straight for her pretty little head.

Sure.. because you wouldn't expect someone to be angry at all at a boyfriend who recently broke up with her saying that he no longer loved her.

Maybe I was just dumped in more painful ways than some of you. Anger is very typical, regardless of the good times that were shared in the past.

I just don't find her reaction so strange. It's disturbing, and very painful to see (trust me, as a Clana fan, it KILLS me more than those of you who are reveling in it) But as much as *we* know who he is and why he did it.. to her, he's just the ex-boyfriend who dumped her. For him to then presume to tell her who she should or shouldn't date is not advice that is going to be welcome with open arms at this point.

I don't know why she went over there in the first place anyway. That made no sense to me.

Yeah. I want to see her learn a painful lesson. Don't play with matches around rocket fuel. Clark warned her about not trusting Lex, and she equated that with a lack of trust of Clark. Owwwwch! That stung. It really, really did. When the show comes to an end, seeing her realize what she lost in Clark when he moved on will be the ultimate catharsis. It'll be Greek Tragedy at its best. I can't wait!!

Wow.. I never realized how much you hated her character.
If it's any consolation, I'm fairly sure you will be getting your wish on this one. There is no happy ending to be had for Clark and Lana, two or three eps top was it for them....

Ah, vell, moving on... bring on the Chlark. :-/

 

[Serene]

Who's "Grandma," what's this about "anvils," and WTF is he talking about when it comes to Lois and foreshadowing? Helllllllooooooo? Lois Lane is only the second most important character in the entire Superman mythos after Clark himself.

The hell?

But should she have that same importance in Smallville? I always thought one of the things that made this show special was that it paved its own path and wasn't a slave to the mythos. While this drives the fanboys absolutely insane.. I've always enjoyed the "elseworlds" quality of the show.

Do you want this to become another "Lois and Clark?" I don't.

I'd love to see this show make a progression, not so much to Metropolis.. but to an interim time focusing on Clark exploring the Planet and helping people on a personal, but global level.. touching base with regulars back home on occasion. Sort of in the same vein as "Birthright" only taken to a more extreme degree.

When Al and Miles call me up, that's what I'm voting for.

 

[Brainiac 8]

Y'know, part of the reason I like her with Lex? This is gonna sound sadistic mind you, but I want to see her get burned (metaphorically), especially after that crack in Fade about not needing Clark to protect her, when just hours before, he intercepted a bullet headed straight for her pretty little head.

Yeah. I want to see her learn a painful lesson. Don't play with matches around rocket fuel. Clark warned her about not trusting Lex, and she equated that with a lack of trust of Clark. Owwwwch! That stung. It really, really did. When the show comes to an end, seeing her realize what she lost in Clark when he moved on will be the ultimate catharsis. It'll be Greek Tragedy at its best. I can't wait!!

You know Pat, I agree with you. I have enjoyed the whole Clark/Lana thing up to season three. Since then though Lana many times has been overly harsh and mean to Clark when the worst thing he did to her was save her life time after time. Yes he has kept things from her, but it's all been to keep her safe, and we saw proof of that in "Reckoning". I think they just need to spill the beans about him to Lana and all the Lana/Clark angst that drags some of the show down will stop.

Lana really needs a taste of what she has been doing to Clark to realize that what he put her through is not so bad. I think that is where the story is heading too. When it happens though, I'll feel bad for her; no doubt.

Gawd!

I KNEW there was a reason I avoided K-Site. I thought it was because of all the Buffy fans and the ridiculous Chloe-becomes-Lois theories.

Lois acts like that because it's in her character to be that way. Simple as that.

Their bashing of Lois, I'm sure is because of the whole Chloe/Lois business. Having Lois there effectively kills their theory, and we can't have that, they've worked too hard on it.

Personally, they have her their, so TV/comic continuity is destroyed already, so they just need to hook those two puppies up. I enjoy their witty banter much more than ANY conversation he has with Lana.

But should she have that same importance in Smallville? I always thought one of the things that made this show special was that it paved its own path and wasn't a slave to the mythos. While this drives the fanboys absolutely insane.. I've always enjoyed the "elseworlds" quality of the show.

Do you want this to become another "Lois and Clark?" I don't.

I'd love to see this show make a progression, not so much to Metropolis.. but to an interim time focusing on Clark exploring the Planet and helping people on a personal, but global level.. touching base with regulars back home on occasion. Sort of in the same vein as "Birthright" only taken to a more extreme degree.

When Al and Miles call me up, that's what I'm voting for.

You know what, this is what I try telling comic loyalists constantly. It's an elseworlds tale, just like Birthright. We should enjoy the unique view into Superman they portray, it has been one heck of a ride so far. I haven't ever had one bad thing to say about their continuity choices they have made. I enjoy Lois and Lex being there, as well as his meeting heros he really shouldn't meet for years. It's all gravy! Great stuff!

I still call for a pre JLA hookup to take on the Kryptonians again. The two and Brainiac vs. Clark,Bart,AC, and Cyborg. How cool would that be?!?

 

[AgentPat]

Craig is a huge Allison Mack fan.

Well, I like her too.

Wait... strike that. Lemme be more specific... I like Chloe. I wouldn't go out of my way to see Allison Mack in another show or movie, just like I wouldn't do that for Erica, Michael, KK or any of the other cast, with one exception.

That's not to say I don't like the actors and actresses. I'm just not interested in them enough to follow them to other material. Again, with one exception.

Not sure if he's a proponent of that crazy theory running rampant on KSite and TWOP, but it wouldn't surprise me.

It's really, REALLY silly. If Lois never showed up in the series, and Chloe only referred to her as "her cousin," I would DEFINITELY be suspicious. In fact, I might really be into the idea. It's a unique twist. But the fact of the matter is, Lois Lane IS on the show. She's a real character who's had dreams of a guy wearing a red cape, is turned on by men who want to save the world, and even though she gives Clark endless grief for his "bumbling" nature, she still thinks she'd be lucky to end up with someone as honorable as him someday.

So there are lots of subtle and not so subtle knocks about Lois as well as the writers beating the fans over the head with anvils, and finally how old (grandma) Erica looks. It's too bad people say things like that, but he isn't the only one over there saying things like that.

*sigh* Well, Lois is older than Clark to begin with, but she's FAR from looking like "grandma." Craig WISHES he had a grandma who looked like Durance. What's worse? Having an actress who's a year younger than the STAR but actually looks a little older, verses one who's 23, yet looks like she's just out of high school, but is *supposed* to be a seasoned reporter? Gah! Don't get me started. LOLOLOL

As to the foreshadowing, has Craig forgotten how much we got in the first season alone between Clark and Lex? That's one of the fun aspects about doing a PREQUEL.

I can't believe I'm justifying this stuff to Craig in absentia. I think I'll stop now.

 

[rumpuso]

But should she have that same importance in Smallville? I always thought one of the things that made this show special was that it paved its own path and wasn't a slave to the mythos. While this drives the fanboys absolutely insane.. I've always enjoyed the "elseworlds" quality of the show.

Do you want this to become another "Lois and Clark?" I don't.

I'd love to see this show make a progression, not so much to Metropolis.. but to an interim time focusing on Clark exploring the Planet and helping people on a personal, but global level.. touching base with regulars back home on occasion. Sort of in the same vein as "Birthright" only taken to a more extreme degree.

When Al and Miles call me up, that's what I'm voting for.

Personally, I'd like the show to focus more intently on the journeys of Clark and Lex primarily, and Lana's role in both their lives. I would much rather keep Chloe and her super computer and Lois and her undetermined storylined in the WAY back. I don't find that they hold the same importance in this universe, other than as bit players moving the plot along.

Chloe and Pete as Clark's friends was all sorts of cute in earlier seasons. Chloe now seems to have pushed aside most everyone else in order to hold the most valuable position in Smallville, and that's just weird to me.

Lois has been random at best. They should have introduced her in Crusade, leave an impressive mark, then exit after Gone. OR, they should have held off on introducing her until Season 5, having her introduction come by way of Chloe via The Daily Planet which would have felt like a more plausible solution rather than having her live at the Kent farm, then the Talon.

Oh well...

 

[AgentPat]

Wow.. I never realized how much you hated her character...

I don't hate *her*, I hate how she acts (the character, not the actress) and some of the biting things she says. And she's inconsistent. She said she can tell when Clark is lying, but didn't know when he said that he didn't love her in Hypnotic, when just weeks before, he said that he did, and always will. It's frustrating. He's saved her countless times - and that actually annoys her (Precipice) - which has culminated in her insisting she doesn't need his protection. Clark doesn't want or need validating accolades, but at the same time, it's heart wrenching to see him continue to be a selfless hero for somebody he loves so deeply, only to have her turn around and basically say screw you; I don't need you. It's tragic. And Greek Tragedy is all about teaching people lessons through parable. "Remember: The lessons that we learn from pain are the ones that make us the strongest." This applies to both Clark *and* Lana.

I try to avoid "Lana" discussion because I know it can offend people when it comes across as bashing, but know that my intent is not to bash. I just tend to see things from Clark's POV because he is the one that sacrifices in the name of love, even if he does so in poorly planned ways. Clark doesn't always think before he acts; it's one of his flaws. It's a not-so-venerable defining characteristic that will follow him for the rest of his life.