Superman Returns Superman Returns lead nominations for the Saturn Awards!

[Showtime]

Like I said, I'm not throwing out any allegations. I am just saying Singer has quite a disporportional ammount of influence over the Saturn Awards Academy. It is just an interesting side note. People can make of it what they would like.

It's cool man, doesn't ruin my day either way. I get no cut of the profits, but it would be cooler if I did.

There will always be conspiracies and Hollywood is all about who you know, so more power to all those rich bastards.

 

[ultimatefan]

Curious, could've fooled me.



Honestly, it appears not much at all.



So critics like it? Great. Whats your point? It is neither here nor there. This thread was made to discuss the Saturn Awards. If people want to use the Saturn Awards as ammunition of how great this movie is, it should be pointed out that Singer has quite a bit of influence over them. That is all I am saying.

I started the thread and I never said the Saturn Awards represent the general audience, I can´t be held responsible for what other people say. I said, and of course you "forgot" to quote that, the intention was never to use it as proof the movie´s great or not, just that it´s yet another example that there´s a much larger approval of the movie than some of its critics want to admit. That´s all I´m saying.

 

[ultimatefan]

Like I said, I'm not throwing out any allegations. I am just saying Singer has quite a disporportional ammount of influence over the Saturn Awards Academy. It is just an interesting side note. People can make of it what they would like.

What exactly is that evidence? If a movie director could directly manipulate the results of an award, that´d be cause for scandal. Other than that, all awards have some level of outside influence, I doubt Singer´s the only one who has some clout with the Saturns. Plus, like I said, there are plenty of places where SR gets positive comments and grades where Singer has zero clout.

 

[Ita-KalEl]

LOL The haters can't accept that Superman Returns can be considered a good movie by someone

Nevertheless

If the WB are desperate and pay millions to buy some awards for Superman Returns (haters theory)...this means that they still strongly believe in the franchise and they are trying to create a positive hype for the sequel.

If Superman Returns is nominated because it is considered a very good movie, it means that there are more chances that the WB will be happy to greenlit a good budget (more than +170m?) for the sequel.

In any case...good news .

 

[Matt]

LOL The haters can't accept that Superman Returns can be considered a good movie by someone

Nevertheless

If the WB are desperate and pay millions to buy some awards for Superman Returns (haters theory)...this means that they still strongly believe in the franchise and they are trying to create a positive hype for the sequel.

If Superman Returns is nominated because it is considered a very good movie, it means that there are more chances that the WB will be happy to greenlit a good budget (more than +170m?) for the sequel.

In any case...good news .

I didn't say they bought the award. I said Singer held a position of clout on the Saturn Academy (which isn't nearly as large as the Film Academy that does the Oscars and is actually relatively small). It isn't some conspiracy theory as you and Ultimatefan are making it out to be. It is quite simply the use of logic and deductive reasoning.

Let me use an analogy. Say I am sitting on a charitable board (for the sake of argument we will call it the XYZ Memorial Charity Fund)...and we have some money to give away. My father for the sake of this argument died of cancer. Does it not stand to reason that I would petition to give the XYZ Memorial Charity money to the American Cancer Society? Now assume for a moment this is a board of about 10 and I am a fairly prominent member of it with friends who sit on it as well. Does it not stand to reason that the money would be given to the American Cancer Society?

The Saturn Award nomination process is similiar. The committee heads of which there are ten decide upon nominations. Singer, a Warner Bros executive, and the writer of Apt Pupil (a Singer film and well known friend of Singer) are all committee heads. Doesn't it make sense that they would endorse their own movie/friend's movie? And on a board that size (ten) while 3 is not a majority it does hold quite a bit of power.

I don't know why you and UF are making it out like some kind of evil conspiracy theory. I am not even debating the quality of the movie. I just think it should be known how Saturn nominations work and that Singer does hold a bit of power on the nomination board. From there it just seems like simple logic that he would vote for his own movie and try to get others to do so. Why are you guys getting so mad about it?

 

[Pickle-El]

I didn't say they bought the award. I said Singer held a position of clout on the Saturn Academy (which isn't nearly as large as the Film Academy that does the Oscars and is actually relatively small). It isn't some conspiracy theory as you and Ultimatefan are making it out to be. It is quite simply the use of logic and deductive reasoning.

Let me use an analogy. Say I am sitting on a charitable board (for the sake of argument we will call it the XYZ Memorial Charity Fund)...and we have some money to give away. My father for the sake of this argument died of cancer. Does it not stand to reason that I would petition to give the XYZ Memorial Charity money to the American Cancer Society? Now assume for a moment this is a board of about 10 and I am a fairly prominent member of it with friends who sit on it as well. Does it not stand to reason that the money would be given to the American Cancer Society?

We get it. You think they 'favor' Singer. And will go the extra mile to please his ego. Can we move on?

The Saturn Award nomination process is similiar. The committee heads of which there are ten decide upon nominations. Singer, a Warner Bros executive, and the writer of Apt Pupil (a Singer film and well known friend of Singer) are all committee heads. Doesn't it make sense that they would endorse their own movie/friend's movie? And on a board that size (ten) while 3 is not a majority it does hold quite a bit of power.

I don't know why you and UF are making it out like some kind of evil conspiracy theory. I am not even debating the quality of the movie. I just think it should be known how Saturn nominations work and that Singer does hold a bit of power on the nomination board. From there it just seems like simple logic that he would vote for his own movie and try to get others to do so. Why are you guys getting so mad about it?

Every time Matt (or lexlives for that matter) makes a statement and can't back it up with conclusive evidence, and conspiracy theories are in no form conclusive.....Supes takes another shot.

Damn look at that. It's a good thing Supes can hold his own.

 

[Matt]

We get it. You think they 'favor' Singer. And will go the extra mile to please his ego. Can we move on?




Every time Matt (or lexlives for that matter) makes a statement and can't back it up with conclusive evidence, and conspiracy theories are in no form conclusive.....Supes takes another shot.

Damn look at that. It's a good thing Supes can hold his own.

The irony is you call other people trolls.

 

[Freddy_Krueger]

"Look! Superman's drunk!"
"LEAVE ME ALONE!"

Sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[Showtime]

Here is how the voting works...

http://www.saturnawards.org/vote.html

Here is a list of the memebers...

http://www.saturnawards.org/leadership.html

Just for reference of course...

 

[Matt]

Here is how the voting works...

http://www.saturnawards.org/vote.html

Here is a list of the memebers...

http://www.saturnawards.org/leadership.html

Just for reference of course...

Thanks Showtime. As you can see, a lot of power is given to committee heads. I'm not being a paranoid conspiracy theorist or anything. I am just stating how the voting works and that Singer holds a bit of clout over the committee head board.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

^Well he didnt hold any clout over the other awards he won, so that says something IMO.

 

[ultimatefan]

I didn't say they bought the award. I said Singer held a position of clout on the Saturn Academy (which isn't nearly as large as the Film Academy that does the Oscars and is actually relatively small). It isn't some conspiracy theory as you and Ultimatefan are making it out to be. It is quite simply the use of logic and deductive reasoning.

Let me use an analogy. Say I am sitting on a charitable board (for the sake of argument we will call it the XYZ Memorial Charity Fund)...and we have some money to give away. My father for the sake of this argument died of cancer. Does it not stand to reason that I would petition to give the XYZ Memorial Charity money to the American Cancer Society? Now assume for a moment this is a board of about 10 and I am a fairly prominent member of it with friends who sit on it as well. Does it not stand to reason that the money would be given to the American Cancer Society?

The Saturn Award nomination process is similiar. The committee heads of which there are ten decide upon nominations. Singer, a Warner Bros executive, and the writer of Apt Pupil (a Singer film and well known friend of Singer) are all committee heads. Doesn't it make sense that they would endorse their own movie/friend's movie? And on a board that size (ten) while 3 is not a majority it does hold quite a bit of power.

I don't know why you and UF are making it out like some kind of evil conspiracy theory. I am not even debating the quality of the movie. I just think it should be known how Saturn nominations work and that Singer does hold a bit of power on the nomination board. From there it just seems like simple logic that he would vote for his own movie and try to get others to do so. Why are you guys getting so mad about it?

I didn´t use anywhere the term "conspiracy theory", but don´t try to deny that when you said it, you wanted at least to raise eyebrows on the fact that SR has many nominations, and that it implies to some extent that the result could be manipulated, to which this evidence you´re pointing out is pretty thin, to say the least. Don´t throw the bait and then play innocent when the fish shows up dead.

 

[Pickle-El]

I didn´t use anywhere the term "conspiracy theory", but don´t try to deny that when you said it, you wanted at least to raise eyebrows on the fact that SR has many nominations, and that it implies to some extent that the result could be manipulated, to which this evidence you´re pointing out is pretty thin, to say the least. Don´t throw the bait and then play innocent when the fish shows up dead.

And there it is folks. The reason Matty and I will never get along......

 

[Showtime]

OK OK...enough of this. Matt has every right to post what he did, you can choose to ignore it, or you can comment on it. Let's not turn this into some big conspiracy or a big argument.

Singer is on the commitee, but there are checks and balances in place in regards to all nominees sent to the board for final approval. It's not as if Singer is running the entire Saturn awards, but it also isn't as if the doesn't have a bit of influence.

 

[Matt]

^Well he didnt hold any clout over the other awards he won, so that says something IMO.

It sure does. It says it was a well made film (which it was). I forget who said it, maybe Bluejake, but there is no denying Superman Returns was well made. Hell, I've pointed out before that as a Martian Manhunter movie I probably would've loved it. My problem is, it wasn't great as a Superman movie.

 

[Matt]

I didn´t use anywhere the term "conspiracy theory", but don´t try to deny that when you said it, you wanted at least to raise eyebrows on the fact that SR has many nominations, and that it implies to some extent that the result could be manipulated, to which this evidence you´re pointing out is pretty thin, to say the least. Don´t throw the bait and then play innocent when the fish shows up dead.

I've already said that I wanted to show the results could be tainted based on Singer's influence, which if you simply look at the Saturn award nomination process and the directors of their committees, which Showtime was so kind to provide you would see plenty of evidence that is not thin in the least. Yet people seem to be making it out like it is more farfetched than the government using satelites to read chips in our head implanted by aliens.

 

[Matt]

OK OK...enough of this. Matt has every right to post what he did, you can choose to ignore it, or you can comment on it. Let's not turn this into some big conspiracy or a big argument.

Singer is on the commitee, but there are checks and balances in place in regards to all nominees sent to the board for final approval. It's not as if Singer is running the entire Saturn awards, but it also isn't as if the doesn't have a bit of influence.

Thank you

 

[ultimatefan]

I've already said that I wanted to show the results could be tainted based on Singer's influence, which if you simply look at the Saturn award nomination process and the directors of their committees, which Showtime was so kind to provide you would see plenty of evidence that is not thin in the least. Yet people seem to be making it out like it is more farfetched than the government using satelites to read chips in our head implanted by aliens.

I never used the sattelites to read chips comparison either, stop putting words on my mouth. If what you imply is Singer got ten nominations because he manipulated results, yes, your evidence is too thin to implicate that. Like Showtime said, there´s plenty of regulation to avoid that. If it was as serious possibility as you so insistently try to suggest, it´d be reason for lawsuits and a showbiz scandal.

 

[Matt]

I never used the sattelites to read chips comparison either, stop putting words on my mouth. If what you imply is Singer got ten nominations because he manipulated results, yes, your evidence is too thin to implicate that. Like Showtime said, there´s plenty of regulation to avoid that. If it was as serious possibility as you so insistently try to suggest, it´d be reason for lawsuits and a showbiz scandal.

A scandal over the Saturn Awards? Come now. And there aren't "plenty of regulations". There are some, but as the nominations rule on the site even say, most of the determination of nominees is done by the committee heads.

And I am not putting words in your mouth. I am using comparrisons, did I ever say you likened it to that? No. I did not.

 

[Kid_Kaos]

Singer doesn't have to actually do something - it's enough that he has very good friends sitting in the big chairs who wouldn't want to ignore the work of him and piss him off or whatever. That's just common sense, no conspiracy needed.

So it's basically the same like the Oscars but Saturn is nowhere near the prestige of it. It's a price from/for Fantasy/Sci-Fi/Horror Fans and looking at the nominees I wouldn't clap my back in joy beeing in the company of X3, Snakes on a Plane or even Tom Cruise for best actor!

But please, if it makes any of you guys feel better.

PS: The list is quite funny, there are so many weird choices mixed with Oscar calibers --> http://www.saturnawards.org/nominations.html

 

[ultimatefan]

A scandal over the Saturn Awards? Come now. And there aren't "plenty of regulations". There are some, but as the nominations rule on the site even say, most of the determination of nominees is done by the committee heads.

And I am not putting words in your mouth. I am using comparrisons, did I ever say you likened it to that? No. I did not.

You were attributing your "comparisons" to me and Showtime.

The awards are important enough for it to be a taint for the artist involved to manipulate results. If the awards were known to be subject to manipulation, they´d totally lose credibility, and the Saturns are actually quite respected by the genre-loving community, which is known to very scrutinizing, to be point of being anal. And again, what´s Singer´s influences on the many other places where SR has positive grades and has award wins and nominations? Does he run Total Film, IMDB, etc.?

You know what´s really hilarious? These are just nominations, they don´t mean it´s gonna win anything. You can bet money, if SR doesn´t win anything, Matt, lexlives, etc. will it´s because it didn´t deserve - which makes the awards "fair"... If it wins anything, it´s cuz Singer dictates the rules on the awards and they´re fixed...

 

[ultimatefan]

Singer doesn't have to actually do something - it's enough that he has very good friends sitting in the big chairs who wouldn't want to ignore the work of him and piss him off or whatever. That's just common sense, no conspiracy needed.

So it's basically the same like the Oscars but Saturn is nowhere near the prestige of it. It's a price from/for Fantasy/Sci-Fi/Horror Fans and looking at the nominees I wouldn't clap my back in joy beeing in the company of X3, Snakes on a Plane or even Tom Cruise for best actor!

But please, if it makes any of you guys feel better.

PS: The list is quite funny, there are so many weird choices mixed with Oscar calibers --> http://www.saturnawards.org/nominations.html

A lot of people find the Oscar´s and Golden Globe´s choices weird too. Because X3 or SOAP is on the list, it invalidates the fact Children Of Men, V For Vendetta, Casino Royale and The Prestige are there too?

 

[Matt]

You were attributing your "comparisons" to me and Showtime.

I accused Showtime of nothing. In fact, he is the one voice of reason on these boards. If anything, I am accusing Pickle-El.

The awards are important enough for it to be a taint for the artist involved to manipulate results. If the awards were known to be subject to manipulation, they´d totally lose credibility, and the Saturns are actually quite respected by the genre-loving community, which is known to very scrutinizing, to be point of being anal. And again, what´s Singer´s influences on the many other places where SR has positive grades and has award wins and nominations? Does he run Total Film, IMDB, etc.?

I've already fielded that question.

You know what´s really hilarious? These are just nominations, they don´t mean it´s gonna win anything. You can bet money, if SR doesn´t win anything, Matt, lexlives, etc. will it´s because it didn´t deserve - which makes the awards "fair"... If it wins anything, it´s cuz Singer dictates the rules on the awards and they´re fixed...

Again have you read the rules? Singer has power over the nominations. During the nomination process as a committee chair his vote is an incredibly powerful one. Yet you fail to acknowledge that. During the regular voting to decide the winner, his vote is the same as everyone elses'.

 

[Pickle-El]

Accuse me of what? I wasn't in this convo. You laid the bait Matt. Ultimate and I simply called you on it.

Don't turn and run the other way after saying, 'Singer's suspicious presence taints the Saturn Awards. The Saturn Awards aren't that prestegious anyway, and SR would only win because of said presence to begin with.'

It's the SATURN AWARDS. Yet, somehow, something has to be said to try and knock down anything pro-SR related in the media or otherwise down a notch.

Dont' believe me? Look at the beginning of this thread, and how it's derailed into what it is now after you started posting.

'Pickle-El the troll!!'

Yeah....

 

[Matt]

Accuse me of what? I wasn't in this convo. You laid the bait Matt. Ultimate and I simply called you on it.

Don't turn and run the other way after saying, 'Singer's suspicious presence taints the Saturn Awards. The Saturn Awards aren't that prestegious anyway, and SR would only win because of said presence to begin with.'

I didn't try to run at all. I am here defending my point.

It's the SATURN AWARDS. Yet, somehow, something has to be said to try and knock down anything pro-SR related in the media or otherwise down a notch.

Dont' believe me? Look at the beginning of this thread, and how it's derailed into what it is now after you started posting.

So I'm not allowed to partake in a conversation? All I have done is pointed out Singer's connection to the Saturn Awards. Am I not allowed to do that now? Did I miss when Mirko added a rule saying you aren't allowed to knock the Saturn Awards? Don't like other opinions...go to a private message board.

'Pickle-El the troll!!'

Yeah....

Yes, you are. Because unlike other people (Ultimate Fan or Showtime) YOU ADD NOTHING TO A CONVERSATION. You call people a name, post a smug comment, post a stupid picture and go away. Defined trolling.