The Amazing Spider-Man The Amazing Spider-Man General Discussion & Speculation Thread - - - - Part 14

[DarthSkywalker]

This is the problem with reboots to series that already have origins. They try so hard to not do the same thing, they change unnecessary things.

It is annoying thinking that the origin has to leave out bits because they have already been done before.

 

[Picard Sisko]

This is the problem with reboots to series that already have origins. They try so hard to not do the same thing, they change unnecessary things.

It is annoying thinking that the origin has to leave out bits because they have already been done before.

People will always complain. As long as the movie entertains...

 

[Picard Sisko]

I'd be more annoyed by the fact that it is cliche' storytelling. They're adding elements that basically make Peter's transition to super being inevitable in order to connect his arc to the villains, and I think it is a weaker story than the one about a guy who got them out of random chance. This is Joker creating Batman by killing the Waynes and Batman dropping Napier in the acid all over again. For the record, I like but don't love Batman 89. But, it's an example of basically the same movie in that regard.

I like the idea of Peter having a connection to the villains. It makes everything feel more purposeful, rather than just random. How does both Spider-Man and Green Goblin get their powers on the same night randomly?

 

[DarthSkywalker]

People will always complain. As long as the movie entertains...

I don't agree. It should be about making the best film possible.

 

[arana_cito]

I'd be more annoyed by the fact that it is cliche' storytelling. They're adding elements that basically make Peter's transition to super being inevitable in order to connect his arc to the villains, and I think it is a weaker story than the one about a guy who got them out of random chance. This is Joker creating Batman by killing the Waynes and Batman dropping Napier in the acid all over again. For the record, I like but don't love Batman 89. But, it's an example of basically the same movie in that regard.

Agreed.

 

[Picard Sisko]

I don't agree. It should be about making the best film possible.

... in other words, it should be entertaining.

 

[Spider-Fan]

I like the idea of Peter having a connection to the villains. It makes everything feel more purposeful, rather than just random. How does both Spider-Man and Green Goblin get their powers on the same night randomly?

They were not directly tied to each other. They were destined to be enemies, and the way they handle their powers they get simultaneously is thematic. Their tangible connection was Harry. In this case, the heroes and villains create each other. This is not even remotely the same dynamic.

 

[Picard Sisko]

They were not directly tied to each other. They were destined to be enemies, and the way they handle their powers they get simultaneously is thematic. Their tangible connection was Harry. In this case, the heroes and villains create each other. This is not even remotely the same dynamic.

There was still too much coincidence.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

... in other words, it should be entertaining.

Not really. There are plenty of films that have been short changed by the studio and talent involved that are still entertaining.

 

[Spider-Fan]

There was still too much coincidence.

It's hard to avoid that coincidence when the reason they work as rivals in the comics is their personal connection. That thread had to be kept. This didn't have to happen with the Lizard, yet they're doing it anyway and the tie is more tenuous. It's much poorer writing if this is how it plays out, IMO.

 

[Picard Sisko]

Not really. There are plenty of films that have been short changed by the studio and talent involved that are still entertaining.

We can't really say that the plot to the Avengers was grade A writing material. Almost everything was very predictable, and the entire film was full of one liners:

"I'm bringing the party to you guys." "I'm always angry!" "There's only one god and he doesn't look like that!" "He's adopted."

But it was entertaining.. very entertaining, and that's why it did so well.

 

[arana_cito]

c what u mean in the similarities... Richard and Connors are partners, his research ultimately creates spiderman, in the quest for info about his father Peter finds Connors, Peter works with Connors to create lizard... Bla bla bla

 

[Picard Sisko]

It's hard to avoid that coincidence when the reason they work as rivals in the comics is their personal connection. That thread had to be kept. This didn't have to happen with the Lizard, yet they're doing it anyway and the tie is more tenuous. It's much poorer writing if this is how it plays out, IMO.

It is different, but I don't see how it makes it "poorer" writing. So what if there is a bigger connection to the villain?

 

[Picard Sisko]

c what u mean in the similarities... Richard and Connors are partners, his research ultimately creates spiderman, in the quest for info about his father Peter finds Connors, Peter works with Connors to create lizard... Bla bla bla

I think its cool that Peter helps create the Lizard, and now he has to stop it. People complain too much.

 

[Web face]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Nolan tried to tie the villain to the hero in Batman Begins by making Ra's Al Ghul Bruces mentor, and that is still one if the better origin movies I have seen. I really think it is all about the execution of the idea.

 

[mayo23]

I don't agree. It should be about making the best film possible.

So what goes into making the best film?

 

[Picard Sisko]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Nolan tried to tie the villain to the hero in Batman Begins by making Ra's Al Ghul Bruces mentor, and that is still one if the better origin movies I have seen. I really think it is all about the execution of the idea.

It's all about execution.

 

[arana_cito]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think Nolan tried to tie the villain to the hero in Batman Begins by making Ra's Al Ghul Bruces mentor, and that is still one if the better origin movies I have seen. I really think it is all about the execution of the idea.

Good point.

 

[Picard Sisko]

Ang Lee's Hulk had a good idea, it just was executed poorly because it moved too slowly.

 

[Spider-Fan]

It is different, but I don't see how it makes it "poorer" writing. So what if there is a bigger connection to the villain?

Because it is a less creative method of telling a Spider-Man vs Lizard story than many other ones. This one is retro-fitting the Lizard and Spider-Man into things they're not in order to make the dynamic work, and I see this making the plot too conveniant and complicated. Hope the movie is good, just not convinced and when I see people hating on other people not into the idea that Parker was a child experiment, I have to voice my concerns for the movie as well.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

We can't really say that the plot to the Avengers was grade A writing material. Almost everything was very predictable, and the entire film was full of one liners:

"I'm bringing the party to you guys." "I'm always angry!" "There's only one god and he doesn't look like that!" "He's adopted."

But it was entertaining.. very entertaining, and that's why it did so well.

That says nothing of quality though. I really, really enjoyed the Avengers. That doesn't make it one of my favorite films or one a find abnormally well made.

I mean Avatar and Die Another Day made plenty of money. I don't find them entertaining in the least bit.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

So what goes into making the best film?

In this case, I suggest not changing things unnecessarily to avoid comparison to the original film.

 

[Picard Sisko]

In this case, I suggest not changing things unnecessarily to avoid comparison to the original film.

Well they ARE changing a lot of things, so either accept it or stick with the Raimi films. I'm happy they are making a different movie.

 

[DarthSkywalker]

Well they ARE changing a lot of things, so either accept it or stick with the Raimi films. I'm happy they are making a different movie.

First, not a fan of the Raimi films really. Even Spider-Man 2 which I use to like hasn't really aged all that well for me.

Second, I didn't know you were the arbitrator of discussion on this board. I don't want the same movie, but I do want a Spidey origin done right imo. Changing elements just to change elements does not work for me.

 

[Web face]

I still think some changes are necessary if they want to do the origin again, and the origin is necessary if they want to make a whole new world from the ground up.