The Best and Worst Moments of Infinite Crisis

[BrianWilly]

making me think that maybe there was something else going on originally that DC decided to nix at the last minute and go with this idea instead

I don't know what plans might have been changed by DC at what point, but we know for certain that Alex Luthor was always going to be the main villain, and that Superman-2 and Lois-2 were always going to be a major factor in the Crisis. The evidence is that in Countdown to IC, Blue Beetle was shown a vision by the Wizard Shazam of Lex Luthor being instrumental in the Crisis, which didn't make sense at the time because there's nothing magical or otherworldly about Lex, but now we know that the Lex that was shown was actually Alex Luthor in disguise. Also, Mr. Mxy enigmatically told Lois and Clark of this Earth that everything that happens, happens because of them.

Anypoop...
Best
-"This looks like a job for SUPERMAN."

-Purple Death Ray and Themyscira's last stand.

-Flashes vs. Superboy-Prime.

-Infinite Earths in the night sky.

-The heroes in mass, led by Zauriel.

-Fckstorm in space.

-Batman breaking down in #3.

-Batman's scenes with Nightwing, Booster, Green Arrow, and Green Lantern.

-Showdown with Brother Eye.

-Of course, Superboy vs. Superboy-Prime and Conner's sacrifice.

-Far, far more.

Worst
- "But the only thing you haven't been for a very long time...is human."
That's just...inaccurate.

-Superman vs. Superman was a pretty big disappointment.

-Alex needed magic to be a certain way to power his tower so he...had Psycho Pirate manipulate the Spectre into destroying all magic?
WTF? Of all the catalysts for the Countdown minis, this one made the least sense. And by "least sense," what I actually mean is "none at all."

-The hazy status of Tempest. At this point I don't even care if they did kill him off, I just want to know if he's dead or alive!
Okay, so I'd care very, very much if they killed him off, but the point remains.

 

[The Leaguer]

Zauriel's appearance was f***ing incredible.

 

[Spike_x1]

Anypoop...
Best
-"This looks like a job for SUPERMAN."

Am I the only one who heard Bud Collyer's voice from the Fleischer cartoons when reading that line?

 

[Pksoze]

I forgot

Seeing this was very cool.

 

[Darthphere]

Zauriel's appearance was f***ing incredible.

I gotta agree, shall I say orgasmic?

 

[The Question]

-Alex needed magic to be a certain way to power his tower so he...had Psycho Pirate manipulate the Spectre into destroying all magic?
WTF? Of all the catalysts for the Countdown minis, this one made the least sense. And by "least sense," what I actually mean is "none at all."

No, you see, he needed magic, but since he's not a sorcerer, he can't manipulate magic unless it's in it's raw, unrefined form. So, he had Psycho Pirate manipulate the now hosteless Spectre into destroying all magic. Since magic cannot be destroyed, it simply reverted into a more basic, chaotic form.

 

[Darthphere]

No, you see, he needed magic, but since he's not a sorcerer, he can't manipulate magic unless it's in it's raw, unrefined form. So, he had Psycho Pirate manipulate the now hosteless Spectre into destroying all magic. Since magic cannot be destroyed, it simply reverted into a more basic, chaotic form.

I dont think Psycho Pirate is at all that powerful.

 

[Pksoze]

I dont think Psycho Pirate is at all that powerful.

Its not really hard to give Spectre an excuse to kill someone.

 

[The Question]

The Spectre was without a host. It's basicaly an instinctual animal without a host.

 

[Darthphere]

The Spectre was without a host. It's basicaly an instinctual animal without a host.

Its a force of God.

 

[The Question]

Yeah. But without a host, said force is just that. A force. No real thought processes or goals besides filling out it's fucntion. Vengance. And, without a host, it can't properly decide who's deserving. Psycho Pirate manipulated that.

 

[Emerald Knight]

I thought Psycho Pirate manipulated Eclipso/Jean Loring in Arkham to get Spectre to do all the killing.

 

[Darthphere]

Yeah. But without a host, said force is just that. A force. No real thought processes or goals besides filling out it's fucntion. Vengance. And, without a host, it can't properly decide who's deserving. Psycho Pirate manipulated that.

Hes still a force of God, with what youre telling me Psycho Pirate could tell a Hurrican to destroy France. I just dont think its as simple as youre presenting it and that Psycho Pirate would be powerful enough to do that.

 

[The Question]

The Spetre has a mind. But it's basic. Instinctual. Like an animal. Psycho Pirate can manipulate an animal.

 

[Emerald Knight]

Hes still a force of God, with what youre telling me Psycho Pirate could tell a Hurrican to destroy France. I just dont think its as simple as youre presenting it and that Psycho Pirate would be powerful enough to do that.

without a human host to differentiate kinda sorta wrong from REALLY wrong, we see Spectre going all out on everybody committing ANY sort of crime. Hell, he buried a child under coins for taking a few bucks out of his mother's purse. Eclipso (thanks to Pycho Pirate) just gave Spectre (seduced him "to the dark side") a focus as to what was the "true root of evil" in the universe: magic.

 

[Darthphere]

The Spetre has a mind. But it's basic. Instinctual. Like an animal. Psycho Pirate can manipulate an animal.

You keep doing that animal comparison and it doesnt work. Its like telling a Christian Jesus was just some guy. Even without a host the Spectre is an instrument of God. I dont think some b-list villain like Psycho Pirate could do what youre saying he does, when look what Black Adam did to him. WOuld you say Black Adam is more powerful than the Spectre, host or not?

 

[Darthphere]

without a human host to differentiate kinda sorta wrong from REALLY wrong, we see Spectre going all out on everybody committing ANY sort of crime. Hell, he buried a child under coins for taking a few bucks out of his mother's purse. Eclipso (thanks to Pycho Pirate) just gave Spectre (seduced him "to the dark side") a focus as to what was the "true root of evil" in the universe: magic.

Fine, I got that. I just dont think its possible or has been explained properly.

 

[The Question]

You keep doing that animal comparison and it doesnt work. Its like telling a Christian Jesus was just some guy. Even without a host the Spectre is an instrument of God. I dont think some b-list villain like Psycho Pirate could do what youre saying he does, when look what Black Adam did to him. WOuld you say Black Adam is more powerful than the Spectre, host or not?

It's not a question of power. It's a question of willpower. And hostless, The Spectre has no will of it's own. Only it's function. It's instinct.

 

[Spike_x1]

Fine, I got that. I just dont think its possible or has been explained properly.

Obviously it is possible since that's what happened.

 

[Darthphere]

Obviously it is possible since that's what happened.

You know what I mean.

 

[CAPT. MARVEL]

By the way, they've been f**king things up all year, we just didn't allude to it at all (making me think that maybe there was something else going on originally that DC decided to nix at the last minute and go with this idea instead).

Ths isn't true. The clues are just well-hidden. Go back and re-read The Future is Now arc of Teen Titans(if you have it). Brainiac makes a comment about someone beating on the walls of reality. I believe there are others, but I can't remember them off the top of my head.

 

[Spike_x1]

You know what I mean.

Not really. The Question and Emerald Knight already explained quite thoroughly how Psycho Pirate did it. It's not their responsibility if you refuse to believe any of it.

 

[Darthphere]

Not really. The Question and Emerald Knight already explained quite thoroughly how Psycho Pirate did it. It's not their responsibility if you refuse to believe any of it.

Are you having a bad day or being an ass on purpose. I never asked them to convince me of anything. Im just syaing why I think its wrong. "Oh Aunt May beat Galactus its true because it happened." Sorry, I just dont think all these big events in this book have been explained properly, especially the Superboy banging on the wall changed reality crap. If you want to buy into that thats fine, but dont come off with an attitude.

 

[Dr. Mid-Nite]

Zauriel's appearance was f***ing incredible.

Agree with this post, hope he joins the new JLA haha.

 

[Spike_x1]

Are you having a bad day or being an ass on purpose. I never asked them to convince me of anything. Im just syaing why I think its wrong. "Oh Aunt May beat Galactus its true because it happened." Sorry, I just dont think all these big events in this book have been explained properly, especially the Superboy banging on the wall changed reality crap. If you want to buy into that thats fine, but dont come off with an attitude.

You seem to be the one freaking out in anger here. Not me. I'm simply stating what's right in front of you.

The situation in question has been explained very well, both in the comics and in this thread. It has been shown to be within the characters' abilities to do what they have done. It's your problem if you can't come to believe that a magical mind controller is capable of manipulating the Spectre, who has only the most instinctual concept of right and wrong without a host, and thus very easily manipulated.