The Dark Knight The Brian Thread: practice is nothing, will is everything. The will to FIGHT!

[Nepenthes]

Ha ha Ra's Al Ghul is such a dumbarse. If you don't practice then the Joker catches you and you die.

In another thread someone mentioned that the vigilantes might "put a permanent damper on all the Robin talk. When we see what it does and how Bruce caused it, the consequences of taking on a kid should be obvious".

It got me thinking about the vigilantes, what will happen to them, what they mean for the future moavies and WHY the hell do we get ten crappy new threads a day but somehow Brian gets no love? So this here's our thread for anything vigilante related. What do Y'ALL think about the vigilantes, what do you want to see happen, have you ever considered becoming a vigilante? etc etc. I'm guessing as more details become clear there'll be alot to consider. We don't even know how many there are at this point, if they use guns, whether they attach bat-fins onto their Volvos or have secret meetings in the basement or what.



So yeah, Robin. I think it's great how Nolan has addressed the sidekick in his own roundabout way, the concept feels kind of included. Regular people will be thinking of Robin when they see the vigilantes and it will put everything they once assumed about 'Batman' in a new light. A serious and credible type of logic is on display here. This is the kind of realism I like. If you take the concepts seriously you can go nuts with microwave emitters and impossibly convincing flesh body-paint and all will be okay. Of course Batman will inspire copycats, we have Travis Bickles in real life except they don't wear capes or get tortured by clowns. RIP Brian.

But one thing that's particularly interesting is what questions the vigilantes raise about the introduction of a proper sidekick later on. I don't think they'll be putting a damper on the Robin talk at all, quite the opposite in fact. If anything the vigilantes are going to establish how a sidekick can, must and probably will be addressed in the future. I know most are against the idea and I don't mean for this to become a covert 'We need Robin' argument, but how would people feel if a sidekick was introduced as a sensible progression from the vigilantes? How far has Nolan thought this through?

For example, what are regular people going to think about the vigilantes as they're leaving the cinema? I think many will clearly interpret them as a set-up for Robin. Eitherway there needs to be a pay-off or resolution to this subplot, so what has Nolan got planned here for movie 3? I don't think he'll bring in an active sidekick but the odds that Bruce will agree to train an orphan acrobat at the end of movie3 have definitely increased, imo.

And yeah, accepting a kid as partner is probably not a good idea, which was the main point of the comment quoted above I think. Basically, the vigilantes raise Issues and I'm looking forward to seeing them more than I am Dent or Two-Face. I also at least one of them turns out to be a noble character instead of just a fck up.

 

[Monster]

And yeah, accepting a kid as partner is probably not a good idea, which was the main point of the comment quoted above I think. Basically, the vigilantes raise Issues and I'm looking forward to seeing them more than I am Dent or Two-Face. I also at least one of them turns out to be a noble character instead of just a fck up.

I agree, Batman needs more trustworthy characters especially in any further upcoming films.

I thought Robin being introduced in Forever was a bit too unrealistic for me, Nolan could do something and introduce a whole new character to Robin; give him more class etc.

I think TDK will show a lot more action especially as you said with the vigilantes posing to be Batman of the sort.



What do you guys think about it?

 

[Jakk]

I hope it will be so.

...and I just got an idea most will probably hate. Hell, I'm not completely sure of it myself. You said he needs at least 1 honorable Vigilante..... It would be cool, and a completely different take than anything before to my knowledge, if an adult vigilante, with no proper costume or anything, got the idea of calling himself Robin.

....and now the flaming starts.

 

[Monster]

I hope it will be so.

...and I just got an idea most will probably hate. Hell, I'm not completely sure of it myself. You said he needs at least 1 honorable Vigilante..... It would be cool, and a completely different take than anything before to my knowledge, if an adult vigilante, with no proper costume or anything, got the idea of calling himself Robin.

....and now the flaming starts.

:sets Jakk on fire:

Isn't Batman a vigilante? Heck, all superheroes are aren't they?

Anyway, yeah it would be good for Robin to be introduced some other way but with having the same story background as his parents were killed by Two-Face I believe?

I don't think Robin should be introduced anytime soon though because Batman is just starting off again, a re-born as you may call it.

 

[Jakk]

:sets Jakk on fire:

Isn't Batman a vigilante? Heck, all superheroes are aren't they?

Anyway, yeah it would be good for Robin to be introduced some other way but with having the same story background as his parents were killed by Two-Face I believe?

I don't think Robin should be introduced anytime soon though because Batman is just starting off again, a re-born as you may call it.

Yeah. I always prefer Batman with no Robin, especially with this series. And I thought the Two-Face thing was only in the craptastic Forever.

 

[regwec]

Ha ha Ra's Al Ghul is such a dumbarse.

It. Is. On.

 

[TromaFreak64]

what does the first line of the OP's comment mean anyhow!?

 

[DeaDheaD]

I think Nolan is trying to show what would really happen, if someone did what Batman did and was successful at it, you know there would be imitators, plus it the Joker some vulnerable to kill.

 

[jtfaria]

The question the vigilante asks in the sides, "What's the difference between you and me?" (or something like that), is a good one. I'd bet it's a theme Nolan explores in this film.

What DOES give Wayne the right to be a masked vigilante who tells copycat masked vigilantes to get lost? Unacceptable (but inevitable) responses:

1) I got here first.
2) I'm better at this than you are.
3) I'm REALLY rich.
4) Patent pending.
5) I've trained for years.
6) On me, this looks good.
7) Because this DeVries Bat-diploma says so.
8) Bigger car.
9) My lawyers can beat up your lawyers.
10) My suit: Rich Corinthian leather. Your suit: Sears.

 

[TromaFreak64]

Did someone save these sides or still have links to them... I forgot half this stuff.

 

[TromaFreak64]

The question the vigilante asks in the sides, "What's the difference between you and me?" (or something like that), is a good one. I'd bet it's a theme Nolan explores in this film.

What DOES give Wayne the right to be a masked vigilante who tells copycat masked vigilantes to get lost? Unacceptable (but inevitable) responses:

1) I got here first.
2) I'm better at this than you are.
3) I'm REALLY rich.
4) Patent pending.
5) I've trained for years.
6) On me, this looks good.
7) Because this DeVries Bat-diploma says so.
8) Bigger car.
9) My lawyers can beat up your lawyers.
10) My suit: Rich Corinthian leather. Your suit: Sears.

To answer your question, it is number 9.

 

[Citadel30]

The question the vigilante asks in the sides, "What's the difference between you and me?" (or something like that), is a good one. I'd bet it's a theme Nolan explores in this film.

What DOES give Wayne the right to be a masked vigilante who tells copycat masked vigilantes to get lost? Unacceptable (but inevitable) responses:

1) I got here first.
2) I'm better at this than you are.
3) I'm REALLY rich.
4) Patent pending.
5) I've trained for years.
6) On me, this looks good.
7) Because this DeVries Bat-diploma says so.
8) Bigger car.
9) My lawyers can beat up your lawyers.
10) My suit: Rich Corinthian leather. Your suit: Sears.

you forgot the number 1 response!!!!!

"I'm kind of a big deal. People KNOW me"

 

[turtlefocker]

The question the vigilante asks in the sides, "What's the difference between you and me?" (or something like that), is a good one. I'd bet it's a theme Nolan explores in this film.

What DOES give Wayne the right to be a masked vigilante who tells copycat masked vigilantes to get lost?

It raises an interesting question, I cant wait to see how it plays out in the film.

In the call sheet thread Milkman said we had it "all wrong" about the vigilantes or something.

 

[DeathRaven]

The question the vigilante asks in the sides, "What's the difference between you and me?" (or something like that), is a good one. I'd bet it's a theme Nolan explores in this film.

What DOES give Wayne the right to be a masked vigilante who tells copycat masked vigilantes to get lost? Unacceptable (but inevitable) responses:

You bring up a good point. In the comics batman is at a legend status and peopel just kind of bend to his will but in the current films does he have any say over whats happening? It kind of plays with the escalation theme, not only will more villains arise but maybe more violent vigalantes will show up.

Question, has something like this been brought up in the comics before? Besides with kid side kicks?

 

[jtfaria]

knowing Nolan from his movies, I belive he would bring on an equal to Batman, with the same motive, to save Gotham. Until something goes wrong and they have to fight.

That's very interesting. Doesn't Dent, in a way, also fit that description? He's running for office on a pledge to clean up crime, save the city. He's a Gotham celebrity, a blueblood with, apparently, a secret. He's seems to be taking shortcuts, vigilante-style, by making deals with the Joker and/or the mob (depending on which theories proposed on this board are correct) in order to get some headline-making arrests.

And then... something goes wrong.

 

[GhostPoet]

I hate robin. :/ There you have Batman, sulking in the darkness...like a shdow. and right next to him you have Robin...the brightly colored circus carnie.

 

[strikezone89]

I hate robin. :/ There you have Batman, sulking in the darkness...like a shdow. and right next to him you have Robin...the brightly colored circus carnie.

true. but i wouldnt mind nightwing

 

[jtfaria]

I hate robin. :/ There you have Batman, sulking in the darkness...like a shdow. and right next to him you have Robin...the brightly colored circus carnie.

I never did get that either... the creature of the night paired with a creature of the Saturday afternoon matinee.

 

[gwynplaine]

Yeah Robin is a ridiculous character he doesn't work.

 

[Shoemeister]

AMH is playing Brian the vigilante aka Jett aka falafel assistant.

 

[Nepenthes]

So we've got new pictures of the Brians....and so far they look like a bunch of real asshats. I wasn't expecting a Halloween party type costume but something more basic. Army surplus gear and balaclavas. Anyway...

I agree, Batman needs more trustworthy characters especially in any further upcoming films.

I agree but not necessarily *trustworthy*, as in he can share his secret, but rather a vigilante who can actually be somewhat admirable. These guys got to have balls...so I hope they're not treated like total idiots.

I thought Robin being introduced in Forever was a bit too unrealistic for me, Nolan could do something and introduce a whole new character to Robin; give him more class etc.

Yeah that's what I meant about taking the concept seriously in the OP. Robin doesn't just 'happen', there's a whole lot of things to consider and it's best to introduce it slow.

The way it seems to be happening in TDK, the idea of a partner and/or copycats will make itself seem VERY realistic and logical to an audience.

what does the first line of the OP's comment mean anyhow!?

Lol, in BB Ra's says 'Training is nothing, will is everything..etc'. It was inspiring for Bruce, but for Brian it's kind of thinking that will get him killed. Brian is hapless vigilante who gets tortured by the Joker in the side. I think the line sums up the vigilantes quite well.

The question the vigilante asks in the sides, "What's the difference between you and me?" (or something like that), is a good one. I'd bet it's a theme Nolan explores in this film.

Yep. that's why I'm looking forward to seeing the vigilantes even more than I am Two-Face. They're gonna show what Batmans really all about, it's not just money, gadgets, 'anger' and training.

You bring up a good point. In the comics batman is at a legend status and peopel just kind of bend to his will but in the current films does he have any say over whats happening? It kind of plays with the escalation theme, not only will more villains arise but maybe more violent vigalantes will show up.

Question, has something like this been brought up in the comics before? Besides with kid side kicks?

Interesting about Batman trying to control his impact....he's gonna have to lay it down with these guys. In the comics it's just a given, you don;t play hero it Gotham without his permission.

In the comics one similair thing that comes to mind is the SoB's from DKR, but usually copycats get have their own costume/codename from the get go. There's the odd occasion of nutjob dressing up and getting killed though. Vaguely remember a story from Batman Black&White

 

[sasquatchs]

You used my quote But you disagreed with me

Before today I thought just one vigilante was involved in that garage scene, but they're clearly already organising, and progressed to guns. So the public probably doesn't have a good idea of what Batman is about yet. How do they know so well what Batman looks like though? They 're already dressing alot like him, there shouldn't have been any shots of him yet. But then again, how did the papers know Batman saved the day at the end of Begins? Perhaps Gordon leaked it

Clearly he's already an inspirational symbol, I would have liked the ambiguity to last longer. But I'm sure the love affair will end when Joker starts terrorizing, with the explicit purpose of undermining the perception of Batman

 

[Carnotaur3]

What the vigilanties don't understand about Batman is that this is his life, not his hobby. He's prepared both physically and mentally to become the Dark Knight. Even though he's still fallible, Batman is a pro compared to the others which are amatuer. This will be explored.

 

[Doc Samson]

I always thought the concept of Robin could work, just not as a child. A young man, similar to Wayne's age when he started could work. Seeing as how Nolan already stated he wasnt interested in the character, combined with the fact that Batman is going to be pretty young throughout this series, and we can probably forget about Robin for good. The vigilantes are going to be a very interesting plot element though, cause whether Batman likes it or not, he's ultimately responsible for these guys getting hurt or killed...

 

[Tomar-Re]

I'm down with a slick batgirl