Discussion in 'DC Comics Films' started by Fudgie, Nov 9, 2012.
The film didn't disappoint but it doesn't hold up to scrutiny, which TDK did.
I wouldn't necessarily say that as scrutiny is never brought on the table. People look at Ledger's Joker and they seem to just forget about the huge plot holes with Joker's plan even.
Late to this party....
The Dark Knight Rises was absolutely NOT a letdown for me.
I found the first hour or so to be a bit slow when I saw the film for the first time in the theatre. The last hour, however, was absolutely fanstastic. The stakes were much higher than in The Dark Knight, and ending was so gripping and emotional for me.
The film has become even more enjoyable with repeated viewings on blu-ray. Now the ENTIRE film feels coherent to me, as I now obviously understand everything the filmmakers were tyring to convey. This was the story of a broken man, learning through pain and failure, to rise in the end because he has rediscovered his will to live. A classic and very powerful theme that resonates on so many levels. I think that is the reason why I can watch this blu-ray over and over again......because it is so uplifting and emotional to experience.
And yes, it helps that the DTS HD Master Audio track on the blu-ray is reference quality, making Hans Zimmer's powerful score so involving and drawing you into the film. Anybody who has not watched this film on blu-ray with a decent home theatre system is missing out BIG TIME.......Standard DVD is just not good enough......t:
The Dark Knight was also a great film, with a more clever story and twists along the way, but it doesn't create the same emotional impact for me as the The Dark Knight Rises. Nolan and company set up to make TDKR "bigger" and "grander" than TDK, and I think they succeeded.
For me it comes down to consistency.
In The Dark Knight, The Joker was able to set up elaborate plans filled with hundreds of explosives and careful coordination off screen and the movie stuck with that. We don't see him rig up the explosives in the hospital but we also don't see him set up ANY of his plans. We don't see him talk to the bus driver about just what time he should burst through the bank wall, we don't see him sneaking on to the ferries, etc. The movie sets up its own rules and sticks with them throughout, which is why it's so effective and why by the time the ferries scene rolls around most people aren't focusing on "wait, how did he rig those barrels?", they're focusing on the dramatic moment in the scene.
The Dark Knight Rises, by comparison, does things like taking the time to set up how impossible it is to get in or out of Gotham only to then magically transports Bruce into it. That moment was not consistent, especially in a franchise where we're used to seeing how Bruce operates in detail, and thus draws people out of the movie. Even if they managed to rationalize it, I guarantee that at least 75% of all adult people who saw the film had a "huh, what?" moment when Bruce first appeared back in Gotham.
I will never understand the complaint of Bruce getting back to Gotham...ISN'T he somewhat of a ninja since having been trained by the League of Shadows? I would think it's quite possible for someone like Bruce Wayne to sneak into Gotham while others can't.
It's an excuse to nitpick. He's a ninja, and he's the goddamn batman..that should be enough. He even tells Selina that he has a way in and out. He hints that there's some way to do it but only he knows. Put two and two together. It's because he's a goddamn ninja. Don't forget he's been a billionaire for a long time and Wayne Manor is on the outskirts. Surely there's a special way around that area.
Saying he's a goddamn ninja is as redundant as saying he's the goddamn Batman. How does being a ninja make him able to get back to Gotham?
So... being a ninja he is able to sneak on board an airplane without a passport?
Besides being a ninja, and just as someone with experience interacting with the criminal underworld and surviving with nothing...I think he could get his hands on a fake passport.
being an austrian, arnold has done it many times in film.
The whole "How did Bruce get back to Gotham thing" isn't as relevant as "How did Bruce get into Gotham without getting everyone blown up"?. The fact that, as has been pointed out, the movie goes to great lengths to show how hard it is to get in and out of Gotham, and the immense stakes of that. It would have made Batman look like an unbelieveable badass and a smart fellow to show how, that's all. I don't think of it as a plot hole, just wasted potential.
Yes. It would have been so cool to throw a scene like that on the film. I don't know, perhaps there was too much going on. But I just pictured in my head, and it could have been great. Though Bruce only needed to get to the mansion, which was outside of Gotham. There he could have gotten access to some of his technology, and it would be alot more easier for him to get inside.
That is one thing i would like to see, how he got back. Showing him sneaking in on the outskirts and possibly beating the living crap out of Bane's mercenaries without a suit. Kind of like in TDK, in the penthouse when Jokers goon calls him a pretty boy and Bruce f's him up with his own gun.
I should have worded it better for it to make more sense for others, but The Guard pretty much worded it out better:
Never felt like a plot hole and only adds to the quality of who Bruce Wayne is and what he's become ever since he was trained by the League of Shadows and the things he went through such as becoming "invisible". More or less, though, they should have at least shown it as there was some potential to it. But, no, saying he's a "goddamn ninja" is definitely not redundant seeing as how Bruce IS, period.
I just seriously don't get how he got back in. Maybe others have explained it and I have not seen it but really how? How many bridges were there? Wasn't there just one? I don't know it's not a plot hole as much as it just doesn't make much sense
Special forces went undetected crossing the bridge. They also carried guns. lol. Bruce finding cracks at security is an easy task.
I told myself I wouldn't get into this but, I can't resist.
We have the Special Forces agents sneak into Gotham using the supply trucks. What other purpose did these people serve besides showing us that there is a way into the city?
Very true as well. Bruce could have easily stowed away in a food truck as well, lol, but I would like to think Bruce took a more 'ninja' route.
Amen Rusty Cage, Amen.
The other thing is, we got to see Bruce in combat as Bruce in the previous two films. Not so in TDKR. It just seems like a missed opportunity.
I wouldn't call knocking one thug out with his own gun "combat", though.
But speaking of TDKR, I think once Bruce climbed out of the Pit, he should've been met by some LoS members that were guarding the Pit and take them out.
In retrospect, yes. TDKR is a bunch of wasted potential.
Definitely wasted potential.
I still think it had an extremely emotionally resonant central story though; one that sticks despite all it's flaws.
It's ambition, of which it succeeds a fair amount, sends it above much of the competition for me.
That being said, if it reached it's full potential....my god...the universe would not be able to handle.
I thought it was okay. Kind of threw the whole "realism" thing out the window though. Bruce survives a nuclear bomb with 5 seconds to go (auto pilot or not, it ain't happenin'), rope fall that kills a man that doesn't kill Bruce, even though his back was broken a few weeks ago and is still healing, the prison "chiropractor" punching Bruce's back and fixing it, Bane leaves Gotham to make a round the world trip to drop Bruce in a well...BLAKEMAN BEGINS...Blake knows Wayne is Batman by a "look in his eye", yeeeeeeeet...Gordon still doesn't. And he's had 3 movies to figure it out come on now, movie. No fair to give it to this completely new character, who's had 5 minutes of screen time and not Gordon. And Batman is in it twice, 10 min at the beginning, 15 at the end. In fact, most the Batman footage was all used in the trailer there's so little of it. Catwoman was great though.
But yeah. Could have been much better, easily the weakest in the "trilogy". Not the direction I'd have gone...redeeming Riddler would have been great. Or even Penguin for that matter. But Sean Connery talking out of the Darth Vader mask, err "Bane" wasn't too bad I guess. Actually, I think it's a great movie, just not a great Batman movie. It's the Nolan equivalent of Batman Returns, where Tim Burton got all up his own ass and away from the source material. It's a good example of what happens when a director thinks he is greater than the characters, Nolan decided it'd be better to give us 3 hours of socio-political commentary than a damn good Batman movie. Bruce quitting over Rachel....only in the Nolan U.
Aaand last but not least. NO reference to the Joker. Not even a picture. The hell. I wonder if Ledger had lived if they'd have brought him back or not...I'd have loved to have seen that. I'm sure most would agree.