The Incredible Hulk - What went wrong?

I disagree, F91. The general audience doesn't care a whole lot about CGI like the typical fanboy does. The SFX in TIH was just as good or bad as many films from the last five years, many of which were comic book films and have made a lot of money.

So, I am still extremely confident that this movie just couldn't deliver because people just aren't interested in this character. They feel that there's nothing The Hulk can offer because he's so familiar to everyone and specifically pretty scary to the younger audience.

-TNC
 
i am now only waitiing for someone to writte ''people like big mechanical monsters...but they dont like living green monsters''.

TF. plain and simple. TF is you proof that GP will eat big fights.
you raise a good question with the TransFormers. yes, there was a lot of CGI in that movie, and people seemed to love it. and furthermore, that movie made a ton of money.
first of all, i personally did not like the movie. it was too long and the plot sucked, and the acting was horrible, and the music score was monotonous, and it was just plain boring to me. i'll be honest, i've never been able to stay awake thru the whole thing! altho, i do have the dvd becuase i'm a sucker. i've tried watching that movie a total of 5 times, and i seriously haven't made it thru the whole movie without falling asleep. including the one time i saw it in the theater.
i'm assuming the movie did so successfully because it was a fresh new movie. (not a sequel, like TIH). and i'm sure there was a huge following of TransFormer fans. whether it be the 1980s era(with the toys and cartoon), or the 90s era with the re-boot of the toys and a new cartoon. there's a wide audience for this movie.

i loved The Incredible Hulk. i have no problem with the CGI. i think it looked as real as it could be. the Hulk movements were better in this film than in Ang Lee's. in that film, you couldn't quite get the feel of the "mass" of the Hulk. while in this new film, you could feel his "mass". and it was jaw-droppingly convincingly more real. especially during the fight in the college campus. out in the open in broad daylight. it looked awesome.
 
my opinion on what went wrong....

First off, hulk is my favorite superhero comic book character.....

Here is my reason on why hulk has a hard time getting mega blockbuster success....

For one, hulk is a character that speaks very little, more dark and grittier. than most other hero like Spiderman and Iron Man.

Those guys are colorful character, and who is played by human actor, giving them life personality and witty-ness to them (if that is a word). They joke they talk and interact and the general audience laugh and connect with that... Of course that is only half of the reason the other half is how good the movie and story is and the acting.

Personally I think if the Hulk talked more in the movie and interact more and throw in some funny lines, that would made it more welcoming to the general public. Hulk is by no mean mute, and talking and responding with dialogue would make it so much better and cooler....like in the cave, or in Harlem when fighting Abom.... I know the hulk is not much of a talkative character, but the more the better IMO.
 
Hulk is my absolute favorite character EVER, but this movie was not up to snuff..it just wasn't. And it's not because of bad word of mouth, or a negative stigma held from the first one, it just wasn't that great.
Now it wasn't BAD, no the there were some redeeming qualities, such as the first act in Brazil(very well done) But the rest of the film was far too shallow, and I can't help but say, CHEESY. I know they were going for action action action, and the action was top notch, but if you don't care for the characters you just can't really care what happens to them. And without a good plot, it's impossible to do connect with the people involved.

Such as Betty, much too flat a character, and at some points i found myself confused about why she was screeching the army to stop when she knew full well military action wouldn't stop the Hulk. General ross was pretty off. I like William Hurt but his motivation was dead wrong. I did like Emil Blonsky but even his reasoning behind fighting the hulk didn't provide enough muscle to motivate an entire film.

The music was sort of bland, again after the Brazil scene, and to marvel, the best comic movies have been the one's that had credible directors making them, (ie spiderman/ sam raimi, xmen/ brian singer, and Batman/ chris nolan.) When you pick an action director who's only made cheesy action you can bet pretty heavily you might end up cheesy filmmaking, even with an actor as involved as Edward Norton, although i think Norton should definitely stick to acting. If you want a good chase movie hire a director like that guy who did the second two Bourne movies, then I guarantee you no one will be disputing the who the strongest one there is was.
 
they showed that Banner is able to control now the transformation.
so he is ablle to transform when he wants and IMO at the same imte he can transform back to Banner again.
if he can control it then he will not change again in the supermarket.
so no more hulk-outs in the future.

Able to control it... AND... to at the same time he can transform back to Banner again?!?!?!?!?

WHAT!?!?!? Tell me you're kidding... PLEASE!!

Shoot, I can see it now, the Hulk sitting with legs crossed on the floor in the Lotus position ( (or whatever it is called) in Yoga... Breathing slowly, a calm cool collect HULK!!!... able to transform back to Banner... SHEEESHHHH

Does anyone get the storyline to the Hulk? I think the writers of this movie STILL DID NOT get it.

Why stop there, heck, we can give him a big ole honkin Mighty Morphin Ring to transform with. lol... he can hold it up in the air and yell HULK OUT!!! to transform to the Hulk... then I guess lol... "HULK IN"??? to transform back to Banner.

Or heck... let's just give him some big Honkin glasses and he can stay the Hulk all the time, but be can be incognito as Banner with the glasses... HEY.. it works for Supes. :cwink:

All kidding aside... ARE YOU SERIOUS!?!?!?!?!

lol... Sorry, but the BEST part of the Banner/Hulk Storyline IS the Man on the Run, the Struggle to Contain the Beast that Rages within, and the consequences HE MUST LIVE WITH since HE CANNOT control the Beast... the Rage.

Sorry... but NOT buyin it.
 
Able to control it... AND... to at the same time he can transform back to Banner again?!?!?!?!?

WHAT!?!?!? Tell me you're kidding... PLEASE!!

Shoot, I can see it now, the Hulk sitting with legs crossed on the floor in the Lotus position ( (or whatever it is called) in Yoga... Breathing slowly, a calm cool collect HULK!!!... able to transform back to Banner... SHEEESHHHH

Does anyone get the storyline to the Hulk? I think the writers of this movie STILL DID NOT get it.

Why stop there, heck, we can give him a big ole honkin Mighty Morphin Ring to transform with. lol... he can hold it up in the air and yell HULK OUT!!! to transform to the Hulk... then I guess lol... "HULK IN"??? to transform back to Banner.

Or heck... let's just give him some big Honkin glasses and he can stay the Hulk all the time, but be can be incognito as Banner with the glasses... HEY.. it works for Supes. :cwink:

All kidding aside... ARE YOU SERIOUS!?!?!?!?!

lol... Sorry, but the BEST part of the Banner/Hulk Storyline IS the Man on the Run, the Struggle to Contain the Beast that Rages within, and the consequences HE MUST LIVE WITH since HE CANNOT control the Beast... the Rage.

Sorry... but NOT buyin it.
you can not always have the same story with a different colored villain.
 
Seems to have worked pretty well for the comic for all these years.

Without that storyline, you have no Hulk.

It was a stupid idea, just like the idea to have the Thing in F4 to be OK with being a monster, being the Thing. They had forgot the very storyline that made his character (just like Banner's) so compelling to begin with. :down:
 
It's a shame that a great movie like this will not get the recognition it deserves with the general audience of movie goers.

But thinking about it, I'd definitely have to say that the limited lack of marketing strategy didn't work. You didn't have quite as many people pumped for this movie as you did for Marvel Studio's other film Iron Man which had quite a bit of marketing. No early teaser trailers, no posters.

The ambiguity of whether this was a reboot, sequel or remake didn't help, maybe they should have out right promoted it as a new start. It could have been done without making mock of or discrediting Ang's Hulk film.

Yet still all in all, when this movie makes it to DVD and pay TV, people will see what they missed out on.
 
The first hulk movie was OK
They should have continue with the same cast
Same idea
That’s all!
 
Able to control it... AND... to at the same time he can transform back to Banner again?!?!?!?!?

WHAT!?!?!? Tell me you're kidding... PLEASE!!

Shoot, I can see it now, the Hulk sitting with legs crossed on the floor in the Lotus position ( (or whatever it is called) in Yoga... Breathing slowly, a calm cool collect HULK!!!... able to transform back to Banner... SHEEESHHHH

Does anyone get the storyline to the Hulk? I think the writers of this movie STILL DID NOT get it.

Why stop there, heck, we can give him a big ole honkin Mighty Morphin Ring to transform with. lol... he can hold it up in the air and yell HULK OUT!!! to transform to the Hulk... then I guess lol... "HULK IN"??? to transform back to Banner.

Or heck... let's just give him some big Honkin glasses and he can stay the Hulk all the time, but be can be incognito as Banner with the glasses... HEY.. it works for Supes. :cwink:

All kidding aside... ARE YOU SERIOUS!?!?!?!?!

lol... Sorry, but the BEST part of the Banner/Hulk Storyline IS the Man on the Run, the Struggle to Contain the Beast that Rages within, and the consequences HE MUST LIVE WITH since HE CANNOT control the Beast... the Rage.

Sorry... but NOT buyin it.

I agree. That's taking the whole drama out of Hulk. It'd really be a stupid move.
 
I think the Incredible Hulk is a really underrated movie, I think it's one of the best comic book movies and it's every comic book geeks fantasy.
 
This is nonesense. Look at the bond franchise pretty much redoing itself all the time with different bonds.

when one fizzles out, the next one doesn't take it on the chin when they do cast again.

Die another day was horrible and it had no effect on Casino Royale what so ever.

People are old enough to watch a film on its own merits without 'carryover feelings'. It's been five years already, no one even cares except for us fans.:o

only thign i am hearing is people saying 'why didn't they just do a sequel to the other one', I haven't heard a single person going 'the first one was crap so i'm not seeing this one'. Probably exactly the same people who saw the first one saw the second.

This ang lee thing is a complete myth that has no physical grounds.

unless you can provide some survey of all those put off by the new film as a sample of the population then it really just sounds like fans of TIH being bitter.
THANK YOU!!!
 
I think the Incredible Hulk is a really underrated movie, I think it's one of the best comic book movies and it's every comic book geeks fantasy.


Easily one of the best and it's a shame that it's not getting the numbers it deserves, but neither did Batman Begins. The respect factor came later only after a slow start and the DVD hit.
 
Batman begins had good legs and reached 200mil. The two are not comparable.
 
I really hope this film stomps the market on DVD and that people realize just what kind of quality superhero film they missed out on in the theater... i hope they continue with the hulk into an Avengers film
 
I know this is an ugly thing to say on a Hulk forum, but plain and simple, Hulk is not an interesting enough character to build a smart, well-made movie around. When fighting he is a dumb, gigantic beast entirely lacking in complexity. As a human, he is constantly fighting the same inner battle, one that grows stale and tired about 20 minutes into any movie, that isn't easy for most people to relate to (outside of those with anger management issues perhaps), and continues down the same path over and over.

Batman is a completely human character who struggles to maintain a very ambiguous moral line with his actions.

Spiderman is someone who grapples with unexpected powers and the responsibility that comes with it.

Iron Man, in a similar vein, is a character that abused power and is trying to redeem those abuses.

Hulk I suppose you could argue is a case of someone who cannot control their inner demons, but because that inner demon has the subtlety of a toddler playing drums on steel bowls and pots, the translation of this story is too simplistic, too boring and too uninteresting.

So sure, Hulk can make for a pretty decent thrill ride as a movie, but unless a Hulk movie is made with a really strong story at its core (like Iron Man, Batman Begins, Spiderman etc.) people will not care.

(I'd also like to note that the Doc Samson character in the movie clearly seems to have had a good 5-10 minutes of screen time left on the cutting room floor and I almost wonder if Roth/Norton hadn't perhaps created something a little more interesting that got left behind.
 
I know this is an ugly thing to say on a Hulk forum, but plain and simple, Hulk is not an interesting enough character to build a smart, well-made movie around. When fighting he is a dumb, gigantic beast entirely lacking in complexity. As a human, he is constantly fighting the same inner battle, one that grows stale and tired about 20 minutes into any movie, that isn't easy for most people to relate to (outside of those with anger management issues perhaps), and continues down the same path over and over.

Batman is a completely human character who struggles to maintain a very ambiguous moral line with his actions.

Spiderman is someone who grapples with unexpected powers and the responsibility that comes with it.

Iron Man, in a similar vein, is a character that abused power and is trying to redeem those abuses.

Hulk I suppose you could argue is a case of someone who cannot control their inner demons, but because that inner demon has the subtlety of a toddler playing drums on steel bowls and pots, the translation of this story is too simplistic, too boring and too uninteresting.

So sure, Hulk can make for a pretty decent thrill ride as a movie, but unless a Hulk movie is made with a really strong story at its core (like Iron Man, Batman Begins, Spiderman etc.) people will not care.

(I'd also like to note that the Doc Samson character in the movie clearly seems to have had a good 5-10 minutes of screen time left on the cutting room floor and I almost wonder if Roth/Norton hadn't perhaps created something a little more interesting that got left behind.


If you want to minimize Hulk's character, you can feel free to. Just be aware that Batman, Iron Man, and Spider-Man can all be made to look bland by simplifying who they are into one line statements as well. No one can relate to Hulk and he has a boring character, that's why he had a hit TV show that ran for several years. :whatever:


It isn't so much Hulk's character that was the issue. Nor was it the film's quality, in my opinion. At the end of the day, it was the stigma left behind by Ang's Hulk (people can defend Ang's Hulk all they want - I heard many, many, "They're making another one? Why are they making another one?" reactions to TIH's trailer, something I never even saw in regards to the sequel to Fantastic 4's trailer) and the utter lack of early marketing that led to this film's underperformance. It wasn't that people were seeing the movie and not liking it - its that people didn't even bother seeing it. They needed to build hype for months like what Iron Man or TDK did, not bombard us with the Tony Stark cameo TV spot the week before it opened.
 
I know this is an ugly thing to say on a Hulk forum, but plain and simple, Hulk is not an interesting enough character to build a smart, well-made movie around. When fighting he is a dumb, gigantic beast entirely lacking in complexity. As a human, he is constantly fighting the same inner battle, one that grows stale and tired about 20 minutes into any movie, that isn't easy for most people to relate to (outside of those with anger management issues perhaps), and continues down the same path over and over.
Except, that, they've already done that. But you do come close to raising an interesting point. The best films in this genre have consistently been those with a strong focus on adapting the central thems and concepts that these characters themselves are based upon. (This is often counterintuitive when weighed against the primary concern of the average fanboy, notably a fixation on superficial, ancillary details ["The red is too dark!", or "He doesn't have the right chin!"].) You've touched on that here:
Batman is a completely human character who struggles to maintain a very ambiguous moral line with his actions.

Spiderman is someone who grapples with unexpected powers and the responsibility that comes with it.

Iron Man, in a similar vein, is a character that abused power and is trying to redeem those abuses.
In all these cases, the directors were able to pare down 40/50+ years of convoluted comic book history and reestablish the basic archetypes and motifs in a contemporarily relevant setting. Which, when viewing these characters and their worlds within the context of cultural mythology, is exactly what happenswith common thematic material through success generations of interpreters.

Now, the Hulk is different from his superhero compatriots, in some fundamentally (and potentially off-putting ways). Yes, he is ultimately the good guy, but it's a different type of heroism; flashes of good and happy coincidence (the bad guys happen to be the ones pissing him off, yeah!) emerging from a generally misunderstood monster. Hulk's a good guy, and he's content to go about his merry way, if only those annoying tanks and helicopters would just leave him alone. Of similar interest is the character of Bruce Banner, and the dichotomy between the psychologically damaged man and limitlessly-empowered ****** who inhabit the same body.

One of the problems with the Hulk, in creating stories for him, is the desire to make him too overtly the hero; too much Superman, not enough King Kong. This was partly the issue with TIH, in that the set-up to the final confrontation didn't quite ring true for the character. It's a difficult matter to balance the necessity of the the typical good guy/badguy superpowered action sequence with the proper characterizations. Leterrier thought the action would speak for itself, but, apparently that isn't the case (and he isn't a particularly imaginative action director either; he wasted the Abomination).

But I will concede that the character of the Hulk may simply not resonate with the target summer audience. This is evidenced by the lack of interest in the proper Hulk film of 2003 - though I personally was thoroughly entertained, even in the parts of my brain that crave adrenaline and spectactle. (Surprising, maybe, that the "talky, pretentious, ponderous" Ang Lee crafts a better action sequence than the supposed-"action guy" Louis Leterrier :o.) But the lack of interest in this new film, I think, boils down to it's mediocre quality, and the subsequently apathetic word of mouth.

I wonder if an Ang Lee crafted sequel, able to introduce the Hulk sooner into the film (though, hopefully retaining the the juicier psychological themes that are at the heart of the story), would have been more or less successful than TIH - by retaining those who appreciated the first film whilst drawing back those interested in a more "popcorn" feel. We'll nevedr know.
 
The Hulk is indeed the most complex character in comicx history... he has something like 4 different, completely uncontrollable, personality cohabiting.
 
Hmm.. I saw The Incredible Hulk last week, and it was okay. Better than the first one. But it could have more depth to it. More "soul searching" if you will. And the biggest flav imo was that the story structure was too similar to Iron Man's. There was even a similar scene! Bruce Wayne falling and saying "Oh *****!". If I remember correctly, Iron Man said the same thing when he was testing the Mark 2 suit and it melfunctioned in the air. So anyway, too similar to Iron Man's storyline. But the CGI was incredible. Very good. The rain scene was most impressive.
 
I'm not sure where else to post this so I choose here.

Maybe I'm not overanalyzing or not suspending my imagination, but when Tony Stark showed up at the end of the movie, did anyone else think:

"Hey, how come Iron Man didn't save the hundreds of people who fell victim to the destruction caused by the Hulk and Abomination? I mean isn't that his job?"

I haven't really started getting into super heros until recently, and have never really read comics, but I still felt thought that made the whole Stark scene a bit silly...
 
I'm not sure where else to post this so I choose here.

Maybe I'm not overanalyzing or not suspending my imagination, but when Tony Stark showed up at the end of the movie, did anyone else think:

"Hey, how come Iron Man didn't save the hundreds of people who fell victim to the destruction caused by the Hulk and Abomination? I mean isn't that his job?"

I haven't really started getting into super heros until recently, and have never really read comics, but I still felt thought that made the whole Stark scene a bit silly...

Maybe the events of what happened to him in his movie happened concurrently in the Hulk movie. Stark already had his hands full doing what you saw in his movie.
...or it could just all be make believe.
 

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