The Iran Thread

[Darth Elektra]

Yes,but believe me Europe and Isreal want allow Iran to get nuclear weapons.

 

[8Ball2/JanG5]

Yöu wanna get drunk, jack?

 

[Spider-Bite]

Yes,but believe me Europe and Isreal want allow Iran to get nuclear weapons.

yes but it is also a chance for us to repair broken alliances with our allies. I'm not saying we should deploy troops today. We should do everything we can without going to war to try and stop Iran from building these, but war could become inevitable.

something I haven't given much thought yet is that maybe we should allow them to build them for right now, so long as we are allowed to inspect heavily to make sure their security is tight and there is no chance of their weapons falling into the wrong hands.

 

[psychocheeseman]

Isreal isn't a defenseless baby. They can take care of themselves.

Damn stright, they already got nukes, while Iran has only just managaed 3% uranium enrichment (you need about 80% for a nukes). And Iran isn't under any current treaties or sanctions to prevent them from having such weapons even if they did decide to get them.

Thats probably the best way to go. Just have Israel say straight up, "They were threatening us and we defended ourselves." Keeps us out of another mess.

Silly me, i thought blind fury was pointing out that isreal wasn't all innocent and sweet, but it seems demogoblin took it to mean isreal should kill a **** load of innocent people just because one day Iran might be able to weild some power in teh region. Sad thing is, Isreal would have precedent to do so, thanks to the US's justification of a pre emptive attack, which we all know was not just illegal, but f'*cking Bogus to begin with.

I think that Iran might be bound and determined to go to war. They are a powerful country.

Pardon?.....A POWERFUL COUNTRY? ..they don't even have an efficient energy source at the moment....why do u think they're so keen on nuclear power in the first place. For Years the US has been going on about it being a safe and efficient source of energy, then as soon as a poorer nation tries to use it for them selves it's all like "no we can't let them, they're foreign looking'

 

[Sandman138]

^ Not all muslims are bad, but that culture is seriously ass backwards.


semantics? Alright you got me there (Native Americans and all.)

This is somewhat orientalist.

In terms of Iran, it seems that they are attempting to put us in a situation where we have to go to war. The problem is that we are not equipped to attempt another regime change. We're still in over our heads in Iraq, and Afganistan has taken certian recent actions that are not reassuring. We don't have the manpower to take Iran on if the end result would be yet another occupation. Normally this would be a stituation where the UN would be willing to help, but since the UN is built on political grudges, it would be an upwards battle to get them to work with us. Right now it does not look like the cards are in our favor, whereas Iran can simply go about distabalizing any country it wants to but more fire under our asses.

 

[Spider-Bite]

Damn stright, they already got nukes, while Iran has only just managaed 3% uranium enrichment (you need about 80% for a nukes). And Iran isn't under any current treaties or sanctions to prevent them from having such weapons even if they did decide to get them.


Pardon?.....A POWERFUL COUNTRY? ..they don't even have an efficient energy source at the moment....why do u think they're so keen on nuclear power in the first place. For Years the US has been going on about it being a safe and efficient source of energy, then as soon as a poorer nation tries to use it for them selves it's all like "no we can't let them, they're foreign looking'

well according to Harball with Chris Matthews it's 90% and they are a powerful military. Obviously they aren't like us, but they certainly aren't like Iraq either.

 

[CConn]

Pardon?.....A POWERFUL COUNTRY? ..they don't even have an efficient energy source at the moment....why do u think they're so keen on nuclear power in the first place.

Dude...Iran holds 10% of the world's oil reserves, and has the second largest natural gas reserves. They're literally standing on a "safe and efficient source of energy."

For Years the US has been going on about it being a safe and efficient source of energy, then as soon as a poorer nation tries to use it for them selves it's all like "no we can't let them, they're foreign looking'

That of course doesn't account for the fact both Pakistan and India are allowed to have nuclear weapons.

 

[Addendum]

Iran has signed the NPT (Nuclear Non-Proliferation Treaty) that allows countries to develop nuclear power for peaceful reasons, but doesn't allow them to develop nuclear weapons.

Also, the Supreme Leader of Iran Seyyed Ali Hosseini Khamenei has issued a fatwa forbidding the production, stockpiling and use of nuclear weapons.

The IAEA (International Atomic Energy Agency) has not presented any proof of a nuclear weapons program in Iran.

And while Iran does have a large amount of oil, the best estimates have it being exhausted in 100 years.

 

[Liquid Snake]

Oh let the sun beat down upon my face, stars to fill my dream
I am a traveler of both time and space, to be where I have been
To sit with elders of the gentle race, this world has seldom seen
They talk of days for which they sit and wait and all will be revealed

I came up with the riff for that song, and than i realized it sounded so familiar. It was led zeppelin. damn it was one of the first really nice sounding riffs I found for myself. well atleast geat minds think alike.

 

[Liquid Snake]

Thats the problem with Muslims and all religions. The culture gets intertwined with the religion.

As a Muslim-American the things that I hear some Muslims believing in and practicing in other parts of the world that is like from another planet. (Where the Quran doesn't teach it or support it)

Iranian or any other culture doesn't define Islam. In theory Islam is suppose to define them and anyone who accepts it. However, there is hypocrisy in everything. In other words, MINO

Im a muslim too (was i guess) living in US. ANyway I can assure you that even 90% of muslims in the west have the same opinions as people in Iran or Pakistan. Only educated people secular or not are smart enough to know and they dont speak out (I dont really because i know what kinda (even my family) religious people Im dealing with, even trying to argue with reason gives me headaches). Im moving back to pakistan soon and I am afraid it will be bad for a person like me, seriously one of the hardest things in my life right now, i cant live with such backward thinking people.

 

[dpm07]

People need to chill out. Nothing is going to happen. Iran is not going to attack Israel, and we are not going to attack Iran with airstrikes or ground forces. Nothing will happen. Iran is just blustering right now, and there will be some backroom deal that causes all sides to quiet down.

Anyone who is educated will tell you that the likelihood of a conflict with Iran is highly unlikely, and they will unlikely attack Israel or the US.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

the next person to spell it "Isreal" is headed for annihilation.

 

[dpm07]

the next person to spell it "Isreal" is headed for annihilation.

I agree.

If an individual is going to make a thread (on a subject that's been done to death) or any other subject, have the dignity and grace to at least spell the topic correctly and illustrate a sense of literacy that is more becoming. It is rather tiresome to view a thread and see words misspelled that should not be. It really indicates a behavior that is not pleasing.

 

[Hobgoblin]

Silly me, i thought blind fury was pointing out that isreal wasn't all innocent and sweet, but it seems demogoblin took it to mean isreal should kill a **** load of innocent people just because one day Iran might be able to weild some power in teh region. Sad thing is, Isreal would have precedent to do so, thanks to the US's justification of a pre emptive attack, which we all know was not just illegal, but f'*cking Bogus to begin with.

Have you even been paying attention? Iran has been calling for Israel to be "wiped off the map" and "annihilated." What should Israel do? Stand there and wait to be nuked? The people building nuclear technology in the nuclear facilities are hardly innocent. I never said that Israel should go and kill average Iranians. And by all accounts, Iran will likely have the bomb in a few years time, hardly "one day Iran might be able to weild some power in the region." Stop being naive.

 

[Palpadious]

Israel has far too much influence on us. The only reason we think we have to defend it is because it's the "holy" land. Israel is far from being a great friend, haven't we caught them spying on us?

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

maybe you're thinking of how their intelligence warned us about 9/11 but our gov't. ignored the warning.

 

[Spider-Bite]

Blowing up the Holy Land could cause some chayass over there. It might not be a good thing.

 

[Darthphere]

All I got to say is, its about time!

 

[Spider-Bite]

maybe you're thinking of how their intelligence warned us about 9/11 but our gov't. ignored the warning.

Somehow I missed that. Do you know when that happened?

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

get out your google. It's old, old news and I'm not gonna research it for you.

 

[Wilhelm-Scream]

Blowing up the Holy Land could cause some chayass over there. It might not be a good thing.

When I leeuved in the deep sayouth I was captin of the chayass team.

 

[Darthphere]

When I leeuved in the deep sayouth I was captin of the chayass team.

YEEEE-HAW!

 

[raybia]

Im a muslim too (was i guess) living in US. ANyway I can assure you that even 90% of muslims in the west have the same opinions as people in Iran or Pakistan. Only educated people secular or not are smart enough to know and they dont speak out (I dont really because i know what kinda (even my family) religious people Im dealing with, even trying to argue with reason gives me headaches). Im moving back to pakistan soon and I am afraid it will be bad for a person like me, seriously one of the hardest things in my life right now, i cant live with such backward thinking people.

I take it that you are Pakistani.

I'm African-American and was born and raised in the U.S. so I feel the Islam that I have learn isn't bogged down with over 1400 years of culturalism and dogmatic religious rhetroic that is common with many immigrant Muslims, but I 'm learning it in its purest sense. (The key to this is learning to comprehend Quranic Arabic so that I don't rely on someone else's interpretation of it.)

My understanding has come from my own personal study and reflections of both the Quran and the life example of Muhammad. Anything else that I may use to further my understanding, I scrutize with the Quran. If I cannot find its basis in the Quran then I rejected it. Even the Hadiths.

I do agree with you that education is a big part of it. I think the most progressive Muslims, especially in the U.S. tend to be highly educated which I define as not only completing high school but also at least some college in a society that has a good quality of education offered.

I think social/economic factors play a big role of the mindset of the Muslim ummah. Its seriously in need of reform.

Its still hard to accept though your claim that 90% of Western Muslims feel like those in Iran or Pakistani.

I know many Pakistanis who don't feel that way and even my wife who is Pakistani doesn't have that kind of mentality, nor does anyone in at least her immediate family. Pakistan appears to becoming westernized.

How did you come to have a different mentally from most Pakistanis?

 

[raybia]

raybia, bad time to be off topic, but your avatar is off the hook

Thanks! Likewise!!

 

[Liquid Snake]

I take it that you are Pakistani.

I'm African-American and was born and raised in the U.S. so I feel the Islam that I have learn isn't bogged down with over 1400 years of culturalism and dogmatic religious rhetroic that is common with many immigrant Muslims, but I 'm learning it in its purest sense. (The key to this is learning to comprehend Quranic Arabic so that I don't rely on someone else's interpretation of it.)

My understanding has come from my own personal study and reflections of both the Quran and the life example of Muhammad. Anything else that I may use to further my understanding, I scrutize with the Quran. If I cannot find its basis in the Quran then I rejected it. Even the Hadiths.

I do agree with you that education is a big part of it. I think the most progressive Muslims, especially in the U.S. tend to be highly educated which I define as not only completing high school but also at least some college in a society that has a good quality of education offered.

I think social/economic factors play a big role of the mindset of the Muslim ummah. Its seriously in need of reform.

Its still hard to accept though your claim that 90% of Western Muslims feel like those in Iran or Pakistani.

I know many Pakistanis who don't feel that way and even my wife who is Pakistani doesn't have that kind of mentality, nor does anyone in at least her immediate family. Pakistan appears to becoming westernized.

How did you come to have a different mentally from most Pakistanis?

I've seen heard many of my family friends and even my friend( hes going to college whos a religous nut, partly because of his mother controlling him like an animal). I mean most muslims dont even pick up a book to understand more than just the quran (again from my knowlegde of people aroudn me thats more than just my family).

In pakistan and even here, it is required to read the quran in ****ing arabic (even though none of the pakistani understand it) and the same goes on here in Islamic school for the most part. Arabic is just a goddamn language and people have made it gods language. I mean I hope Im not the only one who sees it as just plain pathetic.

90% might be an exagerration but I wouldn't doubt atleast 70% sharing the same views. If you doubt one thing than everything goes down the drain, atleast it did for me. I respect the religion but western religions are the same and there isn't that much trouble made in the name of god.