Joker "The Joker" in development with Todd Phillips and Martin Scorsese attached? - Part 2

Honestly, and maybe this is a big “hot take”, but I find TDKR to be really dated. And I honestly would have no interest in a straight up adaptation of it. I felt the best part of the story is the opening, through him capturing Two-Face. The idea of the aging Batman, seeing him really struggle with his own morality in the no kill rule, the montage of everyone seeing him return, great stuff.

From there, the political commentary is very much a product of its time, and we see many of the over the top elements of Miller’s writing that would later dominate his work popping up. The need to make any prevalent female hero/anti-hero a hooker, the weirdly militant Batman towards the end with him adopting the formerly murderous gang members into his fold, etc.

It’s a book I’ll always appreciate for its huge influence and what it did for the genre, but I much prefer things like TLH, or even Miller’s Year One over TDKR.

I think the character has evolved beyond the book at this point, and taking the time to do a direct TDKR adaptation would be a step back in many ways. I’m fine with homages to it here and there, or taking elements, but I think it’s a story that is more important for the tone it introduced rather than its actual content, if that makes sense.

I would simplify it down even further:

The Dark Knight Returns worked brilliantly, as a satire. The problem is, we have now spent decades with almost no one actually realizing it was a satire.
 
When it comes off as a comic book geek fantasy it's hard to shake that.
 
The Adams/O’Neill stuff is fantastic and very serious, but it’s nowhere near as dark as Miller’s stuff
 
I would simplify it down even further:

The Dark Knight Returns worked brilliantly, as a satire. The problem is, we have now spent decades with almost no one actually realizing it was a satire.
The Dark Knight Returns wasn't a satire. It had elements of it, but the overall arc of Bruce Wayne in that story was taken very seriously to be considered a satire.
 
I expect WB is gonna push this hard, if the ulterior motive is to lure prestigious filmmakers towards this supposed DC Black label.

Unless it premieres at the festival and tanks, in which case never mind. :funny:
 
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The Dark Knight Returns wasn't a satire. It had elements of it, but the overall arc of Bruce Wayne in that story was taken very seriously to be considered a satire.

I mean, it is possible to be both. I think a major reason why DKR continues to be so venerated is that Miller was able to successfully walk the tightrope between satire and operatic drama. There are real pathos to the deconstruction of Bruce and his world, and there's also a Reagan caricature that pops up from time to time. Those elements are able to coexist.
 
Well...not sure the work was intended to be satire (though it certainly poked at a couple of issues of the day.) Miller has said that the comic series' plot was inspired by Dirty Harry, specifically the 1983 film Sudden Impact. He probably was going for noir more than satire.
 
All Star B&R can EASILY be seen as satire.

TDKR on the other hand seems more like a straightforward story. Although the political elements can definitely be seen as satirical of the climate at the time it came out
 
Among the more surprising titles in the galas lineup is “Joker,” directed by Todd Phillips and starring Joaquin Phoenix as the notorious villain from the DC Comics gallery of characters. Being part of TIFF brings an air of respectability to the filmmaker behind “The Hangover” trilogy and also adds gravitas to a movie with origins in the superhero universe.

Speaking from Toronto on Monday, both executive director Joana Vicente and artistic director Cameron Bailey, co-heads of TIFF, had nothing but praise for the movie.

“It’s a fabulous film,” said Vicente. “We all love it.”

“We went in not knowing exactly what to expect, but it is a really original vision of this character,” said Bailey. “It’s not based on existing DC canonical work and so that allows Todd Phillips to go in a new direction. And Joaquin Phoenix is just phenomenal in it.
Meryl Streep, Tom Hanks and Joaquin Phoenix films top Toronto's lineup of galas and premieres
 
"North American Premiere" all but confirms that it's headed to Venice too. Damn, Venice and TIFF. We might live in a world where this character is the new King Lear for actors:
17961604883_94f3d66b4a.jpg
 
That's a lot better than the official poster. Very clever.
 
Well, there have been bad Hamlet performances too.
 

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