"The Joker" in development with Todd Phillips and Martin Scorsese attached?

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Joker movie with Leto I agree is a bad idea. But a Harley movie is a good move. She was one of the most popular things about SS. They should be doing Suicide Squad 2 and the Harley movie.

Yeah a Harley movie is about the only thing that makes sense, but even there I think maybe it'd be best to just put her in a Suicide Squad 2 before you spin off into a solo movie. She was wildly popular for reasons I can't quite fathom so I'm a little skeptical that a Harley movie is just money in the bank.

Maybe, but there's also a higher likelihood that there'd be at least ONE die-hard DCEU fan on these boards who would be defending WB/Leto/Ayers.

But-- nope. Crickets.

For what it's worth I've seen at least one person (not going to call them out specifically) do so on these boards.
 
Yeah a Harley movie is about the only thing that makes sense, but even there I think maybe it'd be best to just put her in a Suicide Squad 2 before you spin off into a solo movie.



For what it's worth I've seen at least one person (not going to call them out specifically) do so on these boards.

I too would release SS2 before a Harley film and include her in it :up:
 
The Harley Quinn solo film is as problematic as the Joker solo film. Neither are a good idea.
 
But Harley Quinn is such an inspirational character because she decided to stop helping her abuser murder people and went out to kill people on her own!
 
I understand the pessimism here, but I'm not that upset about this. I just hoped the Scorsese film would've been in the continuity of the rest of the universe they built towards.

Not that it matters but I'm just going to layout what I would've done if I were WB/DC.
Much like the Wonder Woman franchise, have the Joker film set before Suicide Squad.

I mean not so far behind that it's full blown period piece, but far enough that the audience feels a little character development when they re-watch Suicide Squad.

The best way to go forward with this is to adapt Brian Azzarello's Joker graphic novel, with minor changes as to having a different character other than Johnny Frost narrating the story and taking on that role as we see him in Suicide Squad, so this should be a henchman prior to Jim Parrack's Johnny Frost. Although I think he should cameo in as a new recruit. Harley Quinn should reprise in the short role she has from the graphic novel, but she should look more like her appearance in the comics without the tattoos. Joker in this film should not have the grills or any of his tattoos and should look almost 100% comic accurate. Towards the climax of the original story Harvey Dent pleads Batman to help him, instead of that I think he should lure Robin in front of the Joker, knowing that he will kill him angering the Batman to stop the Joker once and for all. Joker should then kill Robin and head towards to escape.

So my take is to blend the Brian Azzarello story to a great extent. The main story should be that. Robin is killed by Joker in a fit of rage trying to escape without any nuissance getting in his way. The climax should be the same as narrated by the henchman (in this case not Johnny Frost) by having him shot by the Joker on the chin and falling to his death from the bridge, viewing Batman knocking the teeth out of him. That would close the film on a cliffhanger and that should be that.

Batman doesn't even really need to be Ben Affleck as it can be just a silhouette of him that appears. Joker should have his classic laugh and a more accurate voice.

I think this can be done without a big budget and have an indie film vibe. It should be dark and R-rated as a Joker film should be. It would be even more brilliant if Todd Philips and Scorsese take this on for the DCEU with Jared Leto reprising his role.

This would really get a lot of people onboard Jared Leto as the Joker and will be the right film to be made in my opinion. Joker wasn't even in Suicide Squad for long and his take and appearance is all part of Ayer's creative decision. Jared Leto can deliver a great Joker that the fans want and will love if they give him the right take on the character.

This is the only kind of Joker film that makes sense to me for WB/DC to make. Not an origin film that Todd Philips is planning to make outside the DC extended universe. A film like this expands the universe too. This specific story has the Riddler, Killer Croc, Penguin and Harvey Dent appear. This film also lets there be a chance to redeem Killer Croc as well.

WB/DC set up a universe for a reason, why go out of it when the universe collectively gives you more profitability if you just focus on making it right? An indie style dark low budget film with story similar to what I was saying should do the trick.

Another gripe I hope they kind of fix is how Jared Leto's nose looks. It should be long and pointing downwards.

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Oh and he should be laughing like a maniac alot please.
 
Maybe, but there's also a higher likelihood that there'd be at least ONE die-hard DCEU fan on these boards who would be defending WB/Leto/Ayers.

But-- nope. Crickets.

Oh, I know of at least two users who love this.
 
But Harley Quinn is such an inspirational character because she decided to stop helping her abuser murder people and went out to kill people on her own!
Perhaps not a popular opinion in the current climate, but it kills part of her charm as a villain (yes, villain, not an antihero). I really like her obsession with Joker. Without that she becomes, I don't know, PG-13 version of Tank Girl. Or some other obnoxious punk chick. I feel Harley needs to have it, at least deep down.
 
Perhaps not a popular opinion in the current climate, but it kills part of her charm as a villain (yes, villain, not an antihero). I really like her obsession with Joker. Without that she becomes, I don't know, PG-13 version of Tank Girl. Or some other obnoxious punk chick. I feel Harley needs to have it, at least deep down.

Yeah. And if I recall, in her original incarnation on TAS, she was an accomplice who thought "Mr. J" was the most wonderful man in the world, whereas he just kinda let her pal around with him but didn't really show any romantic interest.

But then the comics tried to turn her into some feminist hero. And look, I'm all for feminist heroes, but Harley is a psychopath and a villain. Putting her on the Suicide Squad never made any sense at all to me. Characters like Deadshot and Deathstroke makes sense because they're trained assassins who know how to follow orders. A lunatic with no special fighting skills whose sole motivation is impressing her homicidal boyfriend with how many people she can kill is NOT the type of person you set free to be part of your covert operation.
 
Yeah. And if I recall, in her original incarnation on TAS, she was an accomplice who thought "Mr. J" was the most wonderful man in the world, whereas he just kinda let her pal around with him but didn't really show any romantic interest.

But then the comics tried to turn her into some feminist hero. And look, I'm all for feminist heroes, but Harley is a psychopath and a villain. Putting her on the Suicide Squad never made any sense at all to me. Characters like Deadshot and Deathstroke makes sense because they're trained assassins who know how to follow orders. A lunatic with no special fighting skills whose sole motivation is impressing her homicidal boyfriend with how many people she can kill is NOT the type of person you set free to be part of your covert operation.
The comics are a problem. But in a world with Travis Bickle and Walter White, what exactly is wrong with Harley Quinn, the anti-hero?
 
The comics are a problem. But in a world with Travis Bickle and Walter White, what exactly is wrong with Harley Quinn, the anti-hero?
What's the point of Harley Quinn as an antihero? What's her shtick?
Yeah. And if I recall, in her original incarnation on TAS, she was an accomplice who thought "Mr. J" was the most wonderful man in the world, whereas he just kinda let her pal around with him but didn't really show any romantic interest.

But then the comics tried to turn her into some feminist hero. And look, I'm all for feminist heroes, but Harley is a psychopath and a villain. Putting her on the Suicide Squad never made any sense at all to me. Characters like Deadshot and Deathstroke makes sense because they're trained assassins who know how to follow orders. A lunatic with no special fighting skills whose sole motivation is impressing her homicidal boyfriend with how many people she can kill is NOT the type of person you set free to be part of your covert operation.
BTAS did it right. I also don't get why Harley is on SS. Well, as this reformed antihero (yawn) she probably fits.
 
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I wonder how many people who complain about Harley Quinn the antihero have read her solo stories.

In the comics, the antihero thing and the approach to her as a feminist hero tends to be more or less a running gag. She's still a terrible, terrible person, but she's a terrible person with a heart of gold. It's a fairy unique mix when done well. Sort of a female Deadpool. She's not exactly reformed, though. She just operates as though she thinks she's on the side of the angels and occassionally bumbles her way into saving the day.

I like the idea of a Joker movie sort of on principle, because he's a fascinating character, and there's some great source material to draw from.

I get that Leto isn't exactly popular, but I suspect that fanboys overestimate the loathing that the general audience had for the portrayal and for Leto himself. I think there's room to redeem this version of the character, who was barely portrayed as it was.
 
I'm not a fan of heart of gold Harley. I love rotten heart Harley. In a super-gritty adult adaptation of the character she would probably be someone like Ginger from Casino. Always belonging to some rotten bastard. Attached to a certain life style.

But, hey, she's adorable and her tragedy is familiar and relatable to anyone, let's make her break out and conquer it because female empowerment probably.
 
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Harley breaking free of The Jokers spell on her should of meant her becoming her old self. But then WB wouldn’t be able to sell Harleen Quinzell merch because no-one is going to cosplay as a psychiatrist, so she’s something of an antihero now. I kinda dislike a lot of what HQ has become, from her costume, to her relationship with Ivy, they’ve twisted the character now to a point where she’s not really likeable, and has become annoying and oversaturated.
 
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Maybe, but there's also a higher likelihood that there'd be at least ONE die-hard DCEU fan on these boards who would be defending WB/Leto/Ayers.

But-- nope. Crickets.

I was actually very impressed with Leto's Joker. He was intense, at times he was very predatory, imposing and unsettling.
At first I was put off by the tattoos but I grew to appreciate it. The Joker has always been one of the most flexible villains, from kooky prankster to mass murdering monster there's a wide range of different Jokers out there. Sometimes his look is based on old style gangsters, but with circus colours, why not do the same with modern gangsters? Criminals having tattoos is nothing new, why shouldn't the Clown Prince of Crime have some?
Suicide Squad made some big mistakes, but I don't number Leto's Joker among them.
That said, I'm not jumping for joy at the idea of him getting a solo film.

Frankly, I'm not sure there's any version of the Joker that I'd want to get a solo film, he's the greatest Batman villain, and I want to see him go up against Batman.
As a fan of Leto's Joker, I'd prefer he doesn't get a solo, but appears in a Batman or maybe a JL vs LOD film.

I'm also not sold on the Joaquin Phoenix film, I've never like the idea of a Joker origin, I think he's much better if he isn't humanised and we never know who he was before.
 
Harley breaking free of The Jokers spell on her should of meant her becoming her old self. But then WB wouldn’t be able to sell Harleen Quinzell merch because no-one is going to cosplay as a psychiatrist, so she’s something of an antihero now. I kinda dislike a lot of what HQ has become, from her costume, to her relationship with Ivy, they’ve twisted the character now to a point where she’s not really likeable, and has become annoying and oversaturated.
Agree. Even though Harley-Ivy adventures in BTAS were fine. Still villains, killing and abusing people for personal gain, still hunted by Batman.
 
For what it's worth I've seen at least one person (not going to call them out specifically) do so on these boards.

I thought Leto's Joker was a failure. Not purely because of Leto, but a bunch of different factors.

And yet I'm curious to see this, just to see how it would pan out.
 
Perhaps not a popular opinion in the current climate, but it kills part of her charm as a villain (yes, villain, not an antihero). I really like her obsession with Joker. Without that she becomes, I don't know, PG-13 version of Tank Girl. Or some other obnoxious punk chick. I feel Harley needs to have it, at least deep down.

I agree with you. It's her entire motivation into a life of crime in the first place.
 
Joker movie with Leto I agree is a bad idea. But a Harley movie is a good move. She was one of the most popular things about SS. They should be doing Suicide Squad 2 and the Harley movie.

I agree with you that the Harley movie is a good move, sorta. It depends on the supporting cast. Harley is not a solo character. She /needs/ someone to bounce off of. Hence The Joker, Batman, Batgirl, Ivy, Catwoman. Characters people are invested in. Not some made for her, Zlist characters. No thanks.

I seriously disagree that Suicide Squad 2 needs to be made. At least with Harley or Joker involved in any capacity. Neither character belongs on that team, or involved with it at all. It didn't work the first time around and I maintain that.
 
Hollywood Reporter makes it sound like Joaquin Phoenix is a done deal for the Todd Phillips film, so hopefully we can get this thread back on track by celebrating that.

They also suggest that the film may start shooting in the fall and has a $55 million budget:

The Hollywood Reporter said:
Then there are two potential Joker features — one to star Jared Leto, who played the character in 2016's Suicide Squad, and another, starring Joaquin Phoenix, that Todd Phillips will direct. Phillips' movie, expected to begin shooting in the fall, is budgeted at about $55 million, a fraction of most superhero pics, and may be launched under a new label that could be branded with a name like "DC Dark" or "DC Black."

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/h...ad-movie-plans-making-sense-dcs-moves-1119489
 
That budget is good news. Keep it small.
 
If this all pans out, I'm glad they're sticking with a relatively small budget for this. Hopefully that means more creative freedom (so long as Phillips' vision is a good one).
 
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