The Kennedy Thread

Originally posted by Mr Parker
typical insults when you got no counter argument to give,how pathectic.

This is from a review of Stone's film on Amazon, beautifully said, and it pretty much sums it up.

Garrison had no credible evidence, changed theories more often than he changed his shirt, and relied on a cast of witnesses that would make the average county jail population look like the Chamber of Commerce by comparison. He proceeded to railroad forward a prosecution of Clay Shaw that was so transparent it became a national embarrasment. When the case went to trial, it was not Garrison who courageously argued it in court (like the movie depicts). He assigned that suicide mission to his deputies. He had started his investigation in early 1966, arrested Shaw over a year later in March 1967, then took nearly two more years to get the case to trial. He thus had over three years to investigate and assemble his proof, but when it finally went to the jury, the evidence was so insubstantial that in 45 minutes (and just one ballot) they acquitted Shaw. For a prosecutor, that's like getting pantsed in a Louisiana downpour. One juror later reported they would have been back in half the time, but a few of them needed to use the restroom before returning to court.
 
Originally posted by wobbly
Was there a conspiracy?
Well, thanks to my Dad's fascination in the matter Ive seen a good number of films and documentaries handling the assasination and imo, based on all I've seen heard and read (both fact and fiction), I'd have to say yes.

There are a number of suspects who could have been involved, all with motive and opportunity from the CIA, FBI, Mafia to Big Business, but any suggestions on just who did what where and when requires speculation rather than hard evidence.

But its when you do examine the hard evidence that the argument for Oswald acting alone (or acting at all) falls apart.

According to the Warren commission Oswald allegedly fired off 3 shots from a dodgy rifle in less than 7 seconds, scoring 2 direct hits (one of them the infamous 'magic bullet') missing with the other. Scoring 2 hits on a moving target in the same time from the same rifle is a feat even top marskmen have trouble emulating, and at odds with the records showing Oswald's rifle skills were known from his army career to be nowhere near up to such a task.

Then the aforementioned Magic Bullet, concocted by the commission to get around the problem that if a fourth shot had been fired they would have been forced to admit there had to be a second shooter, and therefore a conspiracy.
This bullet apparently struck JFK in the back approximately 3-5 inches below the top of his right shoulder making a hole that was described during the autopsy as being at approximately a 45 - 60 degrees downward angle. This bullet then went upward, exited his throat and then returned to it original downward angle to strike the Governor.
This same bullet, having hit two bodies, passing through bone and cartilidge, was later found in implausibly pristine condition (conveniently connecting the bullet to the rifle found in the book depository).

And there's the Zapruder footage.
It shows that when hit by the fatal shot JFK's head jerks backwards, and matter is blown backwards.
It doesn't take a degree in physics to realise a bullet from behind (where Oswald was supposed to be) would have forced his head forwards, and blown his brain matter forwards.
Now I've read and heard debunkers try to explain this one, the best anyone's done is to suggest that Kennedy was wearing a brace on his back, which would have kept him rigidly upright even when hit by a shot from behind. All I can say is the next time you see a documentary showing the footage, make up your own mind about just which direction the bullet is spreading JFK's brain.

Anyway, even with these doubts about the only hard evidence there is, history still records (thanks to the Warren Commision) that Lee Harvey Oswald was the lone gunman.
The truth is that it has never been proven, never mind beyond 'reasonable doubt', that Oswald acted alone, or even acted at all, in the assasination, and sadly it never will.

Very well spoken Wobbly.There is not a shread of evidence that proved that Oswald could POSSIBLY have done it.
 
Originally posted by MJZ
This is from a review of Stone's film on Amazon, beautifully said, and it pretty much sums it up.

Garrison had no credible evidence, changed theories more often than he changed his shirt, and relied on a cast of witnesses that would make the average county jail population look like the Chamber of Commerce by comparison. He proceeded to railroad forward a prosecution of Clay Shaw that was so transparent it became a national embarrasment. When the case went to trial, it was not Garrison who courageously argued it in court (like the movie depicts). He assigned that suicide mission to his deputies. He had started his investigation in early 1966, arrested Shaw over a year later in March 1967, then took nearly two more years to get the case to trial. He thus had over three years to investigate and assemble his proof, but when it finally went to the jury, the evidence was so insubstantial that in 45 minutes (and just one ballot) they acquitted Shaw. For a prosecutor, that's like getting pantsed in a Louisiana downpour. One juror later reported they would have been back in half the time, but a few of them needed to use the restroom before returning to court.

Yes the movie wasnt accurate in the respect that Garrison tried the whole case.Garrison did have his deputys do a lot of the trial work for him because he had no choice since he had some physical ailments back then to deal with.what they fail to mention is that Garrison later discovered that Cia operatives had penetrated his office with plants he did not know about and his office was bugged just like it showed in the movie.That was a huge advantage to the other side.they also fail to address that evidence that CLAW SHAW had ties to CIA was later proved to be true but Garrison could not prove it back then that Shaw was connected to the CIA because they were able to suppress that information from him.They also fail to address that the jury although Garrison failed to present evidence to them to convince them that Shaw was involved,that through the zapruder film,he WAS able to convince them that a conspiracy took place.We now know through the efforts of the ARRB which declassified some documents thanks to the film,that we now know that CLAW SHAW "DID" in fact have ties to the CIA which Garrison could not proove back then.
 
And aliens and UFOs have a resort at Area 51, Elvis is still alive, Pete Rose was framed,etc...

You're a silly fool. Anyone with half a brain and some patience can determine that what you just spouted was a lot of garbage that's been disproven time and again.
 
Originally posted by MJZ
And aliens and UFOs have a resort at Area 51, Elvis is still alive, Pete Rose was framed,etc...

You're a silly fool. Anyone with half a brain and some patience can determine that what you just spouted was a lot of garbage that's been disproven time and again.
Eh...I think the thinking by many that a conpiracy was at the root of the JFK assasination has a bit more credibility than aliens, Elvis and Pete Rose. It's a poor comparison.
 
Originally posted by MJZ
And aliens and UFOs have a resort at Area 51, Elvis is still alive, Pete Rose was framed,etc...

You're a silly fool. Anyone with half a brain and some patience can determine that what you just spouted was a lot of garbage that's been disproven time and again.

No anyone with half a brain can see the warren commission is the biggest con job and biggest lie of the century.No I dont believe all that other stuff you said is true like some others do,and "your" the fool because you show that you believe all that propoganda and garbage the government tells you just like the mindless drone you are.You'll believe any crap they tell you no matter how absurd it is because you are incredibly naive.You just proved like so many others here do that when they are losing the argument,you have to result to name calling and insults.I'm done with you.
 
Originally posted by MJZ
And aliens and UFOs have a resort at Area 51, Elvis is still alive, Pete Rose was framed,etc...

You're a silly fool. Anyone with half a brain and some patience can determine that what you just spouted was a lot of garbage that's been disproven time and again.
Thats a bit harsh dude.

You cant compare these theorys to the JFK one.
Just because a conspiracy theory for one thing could be way off, doesnt mean that they ALL have to be!
 
Originally posted by Mr Parker
No anyone with half a brain can see the warren commission is the biggest con job and biggest lie of the century.No I dont believe all that other stuff you said is true like some others do,and "your" the fool because you show that you believe all that propoganda and garbage the government tells you just like the mindless drone you are.You'll believe any crap they tell you no matter how absurd it is.You just proved like so many others here do that when they are losing the argument,you have to result to name calling and insults.I'm done with you.

I take it you've read all 26 volumes of the Warren Report then? Or is your knowledge limited to Stone's film and Jim Marrs' Crossfire?

And Tukiluka, the comparison was a sound one, as Jim Marrs, the author of Crossfire(book on which Stone's film was based), has a book called "Alien Agenda" in which he tells us everything about UFOs and why the govt is covering that up, and why they're here,etc... I'm sure his next project will be how the govt killed Elvis as well :p .

Want some more laughs? Check out Coup D'Etat in America: The CIA and the Assassination of John F. Kennedy
by Alan J. Weberman, Michael Canfield . One of the authors went from digging in Bob Dylan's garbage to being a self-proclaimed researcher and assassination "expert."
 
The most I know of it is from a video I watched in my history class last year.

The possibility of it being a conspiracy is very real. Do I think it was? I don't know. The fact that there are so many theories and all have some level of merrit just contributes to the confusion, and the lack of true evidence is staggering.
 
Originally posted by Atrax robustus
Thats a bit harsh dude.

You cant compare these theorys to the JFK one.
Just because a conspiracy theory for one thing could be way off, doesnt mean that they ALL have to be!

yeah no kidding,thats how most these immature posters here are when they cant counter an argument,they resort to name calling because they cant admit they are wrong and that their points have been countered.truely sad.
 
Originally posted by MJZ

And Tukiluka, the comparison was a sound one, as Jim Marrs, the author of Crossfire(book on which Stone's film was based), has a book called "Alien Agenda" in which he tells us everything about UFOs and why the govt is covering that up, and why they're here,etc... I'm sure his next project will be how the govt killed Elvis as well :p .
Again, this is invalid reasoning. If Michael Jackson were to write a book on child care, you wouldn't discredit the whole idea of child care, would you?

Garrison had some wild notions, and I have done a bit of research into the movie, and found that it has HUGE, glaring flaws. I've also done a lot of reading on Momo Giancana, Johnny Roselli, Santo Traficante, and Carlos Marcello. The mob was WAY too cozy with higher ups in the government. Higher ups capable of assasinating the President. So to simply write the idea of a conspiracy off, because some nuts have written books on the subject is folly.
 
Originally posted by Madigan
jfk jr was so hot..
I killed him you know? I flew to Europe that same day. This was before 9/11, and I had never heard of two big plane crashes in one day. So I prayed to the Lord Jesus Christ that a major air catastrophe would happen, thus making my own flight safe. And Lo and behold, when we arrived safely in Paris, I learned JFK Jr. had taken an eternal swim.
 
I heard the movie was smokey in a strip club, plotless, and stupid?
 
Originally posted by slinger
JFK fired the head of the CIA, and who was one of the members on the Warren Commission? The former head of the CIA.

The movie is great, but it isn't 'the truth'. However it does bring up the question of the magic bullet theory. One shot was the fatal head shot, one shot hit the street curb and the other shot apparently went through JFK and Connolly and was in prestine condition after it was found in a hospital stretcher.

Re-inact that.

That is just one reason "WHY" OSWALD could not possibly ever have pulled it off is the magic bullet theory.No bullet can stop in midflight and turn and do all those crazy things the warren commission said it suppossedly did,that defies logic,and then to wind up in PRISTINE condition on a stretcher in the hospital? yeah right,give me a break.the zapruder film shows that Connolly has not yet been struck by a bullet like the warren commission said it struck him and JFK at the same time because he is still holding his stetson hat at the time JFK has been shot which is humanly impossible to do after getting struck by a bullet in the wrist.

and like you SAID,JFK fired the head of the CIA- ALLEN DULLES after the bay of pigs dissaster,and then this guy winds up on the warren commission and is the lead person in the investigation? talk about the fox guarding the henhouse.like I said,that one guy I was discussing this with is EXTREMELY naive.they never could prove oswald did it,yet people like that one guy,believe in books that are plain crap like CASE CLOSED which is full of so many lies endorcing the warren commission,its unbelievable.
 
Originally posted by Mr Parker
,yet people like that one guy,believe in books that are plain crap like CASE CLOSED which is full of so many lies endorcing the warren commission,its unbelievable.

Have you read the book, sh1t heel? What would those "lies" be? There's over 80 pages worth of notes and references in CASE CLOSED. Posner debunks every conspiracy theory out there and exposes the charlatans who push it. Science has proven the "magic bullet" to be what actually occured, too. However, the conspiracy kooks are still left grabbing at straws to support their claims.

The work of the AARRB didn't get a whole heck of a lot of press when they were finally dissolved. Why, you say? Oh, because even though they de-classified over 4 million pages of government documents, there was no evidence of any conspiracy, no smoking gun, no links that Oswald was employed by the government, etc... These were the supposedly "suppressed" files that weren't to be released till 2038, according to Mr. Stone. Well, his film created so much hooplah, that they did what he pleased, and he hasn't said much about it since. Why? Because it shows his claims to be full of hot air.
 
Originally posted by MJZ
It was proven. Look into all these conspiracy nuts who've written books, films, docs,etc... Someone posted this on another board and it bears repeating:

Look at it this way. No conspiracy theory can account for all the facts of the case, leaving the conspiracy theorist groping for some nebulous, indeterminate plot against the president.

All the facts of the case can, however, be explained by supposing Oswald acted alone.

When was it proven?
The closest thing I've seen to someone presenting a remotely convincing case to cover all the very real doubts over the physical evidence was a tv show I saw a couple of years back where they used a computer modelling program to find a scenario where the magic bullet could have done what the offical accounts always claimed. They then peformed a re-enactment based on the computer model's scenario in Deeley Plaza, using a limo and dummies and projected the computers proposed bullet trajectory lines from the dummies in the car up to the book depository window. All clever stuff and very impressive at first glance.
The problem with that is when you think about what they are doing it's just doing the kind of thing that debunkers usually aim at the conspiracy theorists; that they tinker with some facts and ignore others to support a desired outcome, rather than addressing what is actually known.
In this case they had to take a few liberties with the recorded facts regarding the angle of the entry wound to Kennedy's back so that the bullet could still exit out his throat and go on to hit Connolly, they also had to lean Kennedy forward and twist his body over to his side at an angle somewhat, a supposition not supported by the Zapruder footage or witness accounts at the time, and a little at odds with the notion of him wearing a back-brace that they introduced later to account for his head not being thrown forwards from a hit from behind (That his head was actually jerked backwards and his brain sent spraying backwards was ignored).
If I remember right they also had a marksman repeat the shots scoring 3 hits on a moving target in slightly less time. Key point there being he was a top marksman. Oswald was not.
I also recall they shot a bulllet through 2 cadavers or something similar to see what condition it would come out in, and though surprisingly intact it was not in the same pristine condition of the one found on the stretcher, and the fact the the bullet that hit Connolly shattered the bones in his wrist and would likely have suffered a good deal more damage was also not addressed.

All of which was done to suggest that a lone Gunman shooting from the Book Depository may have been possible, more food for thought than what would, or should be considered proof, and at no time did they present any evidence that could prove it was Oswald actually doing the shooting in any way.

So if there's been anything else since that has proved anything, rather than given us just another 'maybe', I'm afraid I've not seen it as yet.

I personally don't think Oswald acted alone in the shooting based on all the observations I've seen on the physical evidence from both sides over the years. If I see or read something that presents a convincing case otherwise, and does not have to ignore certain facts to reach their conclusion, then I'd happilly change that opinion.

A regards the quote you posted, either way both options are suppositions, and whichever you choose to beleive in, neither has conclusive proof one way or the other.
 
Ask yourself these questions. If there was some big govt conspiracy, why didn't anyone come out and blow the whistle? JFK was a beloved man and anyone with such first-hand knowledge would be hailed as a national hero.

If there was a big conspiracy, why didn't the Kennedy family use all their power and influence to uncover it? Surely they'd be interested in finding out the truth, and Bobby could've won the Presidential election right then and there. And again, you'd have the whole country behind you.

Lemme see if I can dig up that old Boston Globe article I posted awhile back.
 
From the Boston Globe:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Getting Closer to the Truth About the Death of JFK
Author: By Max Holland
Date: FRIDAY, September 18, 1998

Page: A27

Section: Op-Ed Page


For the federal government, and all Americans, it has been a long, torturous road from the 6th floor of 411 Elm St. in Dallas to the second floor of 600 E St. in Washington. But now these two red brick buildings are irrevocably connected in history as the federal government writes the last chapter of its part in the tragedy which, 35 years ago, struck dumb an entire nation.
Four-eleven Elm Street is more commonly known by the name of its former tenant, the Texas School Book Depository Company. The nondescript building at 600 E St. has no such claim on the national consciousness, though over time the work of one tenant there will do as much or more to shape history -- if reason ever prevails over our paranoia with respect to the assassination of President Kennedy.

For the past four years, five presidential appointees have labored almost anonymously, yet tirelessly, in Suite 208 to make public every significant artifact and document related to Nov. 22, 1963, and its aftermath. Within a matter of days the Assassination Records Review Board, as the appointees are collectively known, will publish its final report and shut down for good on Sept. 30.

Unlike every previous federal effort, however, the review board will not assert a single conclusion, in keeping with its mandate. It will report only what it managed to find. It's up to others to make sense out of the four-million-page collection, assembled at the cost of $8 million to the taxpayers.

While there are 10,000 stories in those documents, including many peripheral to the assassination, it is not premature to ask how, if at all, they affect our understanding of the emotional and political Grand Canyon that opened beneath our gaze in 1963.

Many of the documents have lain open for months already. Whether by accident or design, the review board has shed new light on the genuine Rosetta stone to that weekend in Dallas, namely, the response of Robert F. Kennedy to his brother's murder.

The version heretofore propagated was congenial to the Camelot metaphor, though independent of it. Roughly described, the preferred account has been that Robert Kennedy, attorney general at the time, was so profoundly devastated by the loss that he paid little heed to who was responsible for the assassination. ``Jack's gone and nothing is going to bring him back'' was RFK's refrain whenever he was intermittently pressed on his apparent uninterest in the Warren Commission's investigation.

The truth turns out to be considerably more complicated and interesting. Through the review board's efforts, you can piece together as never before the genuine, underlying reason for Robert Kennedy's uncharacteristic response. His pain was compounded by guilt. Because what occurred in Dallas was roughly what Robert Kennedy hoped and planned to have happen in Havana.

While a dozen documents retrieved and declassified help to build this case, the single most striking is an Oval Office memorandum of conversation dated Jan. 4, 1975, almost 12 years after Dallas. There are only three men in the room that Saturday morning as the discussion begins: Gerald Ford, president for a mere five months; Henry Kissinger, who held unprecedented power as Ford's secretary of state and national security adviser, and Brent Scowcroft, the note-taker (and later a national security adviser in his own right). The urgent, 9:40 a.m. meeting was called because the season of inquiry spawned by Watergate had not exhausted itself. But now the target was not a president but the sacrosanct Central Intelligence Agency, which was hanging in the fire after press reports of ``massive'' wrongdoing.

Kissinger is conveying to Ford the gist of his just-concluded breakfast conversation with former CIA Director Richard Helms, who had been summoned from Tehran to brief the White House about the alleged misdeeds. ``What is happening,'' Kissinger tells the president, ``is worse than in the days of McCarthy. You will end up with a CIA that does only reporting, and not operations.

``Helms said all these stories are just the tip of the iceberg. If they come out, blood will flow. For example, Robert Kennedy personally managed the operation on the assassination of Castro.''

The suggestion has already been made (this memo was opened in July) that the document does not really mean what it states in plain English, that it must be carefully put into context. Yet it is precisely the context that makes this document dispositive. Unless the White House could devise a mechanism, the CIA's days as an instrument of presidential power were numbered. But the president had to have all the facts to act effectively. It is inconceivable that Richard Helms told Henry Kissinger anything less than the full, hard truths as Helms knew them and as Kissinger needed to know them. As Allen Dulles once explained the need-to-know principle, ``I would tell the president of the United States anything . . . I am under his control. He is my boss.''

This truth about Robert Kennedy's bottomless melancholy, which never fully lifted during the reminder of his life, has at least three implications. For one, it helps explain his uninterest in the Warren Commission. Months before that federal panel presented its conclusion -- indeed, probably no later than Christmas 1963 -- he had reached the unavoidable conclusion, relying on his own crack investigators: Oswald, though enamored of Castro, had acted alone and Jack Ruby was a self-appointed vigilante. None of RFK's bete noires -- not Castro, Jimmy Hoffa or the Cosa Nostra -- had anything to do with the Dallas murders. Consequently the Warren Commission was not going to tell him anything he did not already know.



Conspiracy books usually treat John and Robert Kennedy as innocent babes who would not have thought about dirty tricks -- much less assassination plots -- against Castro. But the reality is very different. See:
An earlier article by Max Holland that focusses on Bobby Kennedy's attitude toward Castro and the assassination.
An article by ARRB member Anna Nelson on recent document releases, including one "smoking gun" memo that ties JFK to dirty tricks against Castro.

Indeed, in some respects the Warren Commission's investigation represented a threat, first to the Kennedy administration's image and then to RFK's own political viability. That is the only conceivable reason why Kennedy, when specifically asked by Earl Warren, did not share his knowledge of anti-Castro plotting with the Warren Commission. One is left with the bleak, sobering fact that Robert Kennedy and other high-ranking officials, no less than the CIA, realized that the national interest (as apart from the truth) would not be served by having the Warren Commission delve into and probably expose the plotting.

Rock-solid intelligence proved Castro had nothing to do with Oswald. Therefore, whatever the US government was trying to do was irrelevant to the issue of Oswald's culpability. The same need-to-know principle that compelled full disclosure in 1975 dictated in 1964 that the chief justice and Warren Commission staff be kept in the dark insofar as possible. And so they were.

Robert Kennedy's anguish and predicament turns out to be the metaphor for understanding the aftermath of the assassination. The entire, vast apparatus of the federal government had been put in motion to find out who had murdered a president. But once the facts pointed overwhelmingly in one and only one direction, the truth was portioned out to protect individuals and bureaucracies.

It's not the civic portrait (a government of laws, not men) depicted by high school textbooks. But it is the legacy left behind by the Assassination Records Review Board, and it ought to shift the entire axis of public understanding. Will Americans ever come to terms with this portrait of imperfection, and understand that for all the omissions, their government did not fail in its one supreme duty -- which was to tell the people who had killed their president.
 
Originally posted by Tukiluka
Again, this is invalid reasoning. If Michael Jackson were to write a book on child care, you wouldn't discredit the whole idea of child care, would you?

Garrison had some wild notions, and I have done a bit of research into the movie, and found that it has HUGE, glaring flaws. I've also done a lot of reading on Momo Giancana, Johnny Roselli, Santo Traficante, and Carlos Marcello. The mob was WAY too cozy with higher ups in the government. Higher ups capable of assasinating the President. So to simply write the idea of a conspiracy off, because some nuts have written books on the subject is folly.

exactly.
 
Originally posted by wobbly
When was it proven?
The closest thing I've seen to someone presenting a remotely convincing case to cover all the very real doubts over the physical evidence was a tv show I saw a couple of years back where they used a computer modelling program to find a scenario where the magic bullet could have done what the offical accounts always claimed. They then peformed a re-enactment based on the computer model's scenario in Deeley Plaza, using a limo and dummies and projected the computers proposed bullet trajectory lines from the dummies in the car up to the book depository window. All clever stuff and very impressive at first glance.
The problem with that is when you think about what they are doing it's just doing the kind of thing that debunkers usually aim at the conspiracy theorists; that they tinker with some facts and ignore others to support a desired outcome, rather than addressing what is actually known.
In this case they had to take a few liberties with the recorded facts regarding the angle of the entry wound to Kennedy's back so that the bullet could still exit out his throat and go on to hit Connolly, they also had to lean Kennedy forward and twist his body over to his side at an angle somewhat, a supposition not supported by the Zapruder footage or witness accounts at the time, and a little at odds with the notion of him wearing a back-brace that they introduced later to account for his head not being thrown forwards from a hit from behind (That his head was actually jerked backwards and his brain sent spraying backwards was ignored).
If I remember right they also had a marksman repeat the shots scoring 3 hits on a moving target in slightly less time. Key point there being he was a top marksman. Oswald was not.
I also recall they shot a bulllet through 2 cadavers or something similar to see what condition it would come out in, and though surprisingly intact it was not in the same pristine condition of the one found on the stretcher, and the fact the the bullet that hit Connolly shattered the bones in his wrist and would likely have suffered a good deal more damage was also not addressed.

All of which was done to suggest that a lone Gunman shooting from the Book Depository may have been possible, more food for thought than what would, or should be considered proof, and at no time did they present any evidence that could prove it was Oswald actually doing the shooting in any way.

So if there's been anything else since that has proved anything, rather than given us just another 'maybe', I'm afraid I've not seen it as yet.

I personally don't think Oswald acted alone in the shooting based on all the observations I've seen on the physical evidence from both sides over the years. If I see or read something that presents a convincing case otherwise, and does not have to ignore certain facts to reach their conclusion, then I'd happilly change that opinion.

A regards the quote you posted, either way both options are suppositions, and whichever you choose to beleive in, neither has conclusive proof one way or the other.


Thats what the main stream media always does to try and proove their wild notion that oswald did it.they always go to computers instead of showing actual evidence.thats EXACTLY what they do when they use those computers to stimulate it all,they tinker with the facts and distort everything and ignore the facts that prove conspiracy.Like you said,there has never been any evidence shown that proved oswald did it.and do you not understand english or something MJZ? I told you I am done with you because you just engage in name calling when your points are countered and you got no argument.:rolleyes:
 
LBJ, the mob, the Soviets and Kermit the Frog were all conspirators.
 
Originally posted by Dr Jones
LBJ, the mob, the Soviets and Kermit the Frog were all conspirators.
DAMN THAT KERMIT! :mad:

I KNEW IT!!!!!!!!! :mad: :mad: :mad:

kermit.jpg


;) :p
 
Most people have no idea what an evil SOB he is in real life.
 
Originally posted by Mr Parker
Thats what the main stream media always does to try and proove their wild notion that oswald did it.they always go to computers instead of showing actual evidence.thats EXACTLY what they do when they use those computers to stimulate it all,they tinker with the facts and distort everything and ignore the facts that prove conspiracy.Like you said,there has never been any evidence shown that proved oswald did it.and do you not understand english or something MJZ? I told you I am done with you because you just engage in name calling when your points are countered and you got no argument.:rolleyes:

Why don't you read and comment on the article I posted. I guess you're choosing to ignore it because it refutes all your bull**** claims. Typical of conspiracy nutjobs.
 
MJz, interesting article and asking why no-one has ever blown the whistle and why Robert Kennedy didn't pursue a possible conspiracy is a good and valid point.
But just because those answers are not known and can only be speculated on one way or another does not constitute proof against a conspiracy, rather it just adds to the intrigue.
That's mainly why I generally avoid discussing the nature or possible details of any conspiracy; For every plausible theory put forward there will be someone who can put valid arguments against it, with neither side having proof positive either way. So as regards the who, the what, the where and the why of a conspiracy, none of us here knows and we probably never will.

But what can be discussed with confidence is the evidence at hand, and that's what I base my own opinion on.
In one the Sherlock Holmes novels Arther Conan Doyle had Holmes say this famous line (or something very much like it):
"Once you have eliminated the impossible whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth."
Simple enough statement and very apt with the JFK assasination.

Basically, all the tangible evidence available shows it was impossible for Oswald to have been a lone assassin.
The Zapruder footage discounts any of the more recent speculations obtained through creative computer modelling which has to ignore that film to reach a conclusion that allows for the magic bullet, and subsequently ignore the obvious direction from which the fatal shot was fired: Beginning an argument of proof by ignoring the most tangible evidence available is in no way convincing to any objective analysis.

So to account for the physical evidence of the Zapruder footage, and the recorded injuries to both Kennedy and Connolly, there had to have been a fourth shot. And again based on that evidence, that fourth shot came from the front, fatally blowing a significant chunk of Kennedy's brain out of the back of his head.

So what we are left with then, having eliminated the impossible, is a possible scenerio of a second shooter and a fourth shot. Unlike Oswald acting alone, this scenario does fit the evidence. If by definition that means there was a conspiracy, then that's what there was, no matter how improbable (or more likely depending on your pov) that may seem in the light of any events that followed.


Everything else that comes after regarding the nature of said conspiracy is mostly all speculation, either in trying to prove or disprove it, and unless someone back then was insane enough to really leave incriminating evidence lying around in an archive somewhere, then that's all it will remain.
 

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