The New Nova

[Mr. Dent]

Yea that sounds about right. At the very least we know this book should run of at least three years.

 

[CConn]

You forgot to mention that sales for the book will plummet the second the good direction and talented writer is established. Thank you intelligent reading audience.

 

[THANOSRULES]

We are sounding an awful like what happened to Secret Avengers Vol. 1

..at any rate in some respects DnA's run was the template for what a guy like Nova needs...a dedicated creative staff that has a plan and commitment.

Problem was Marvel never Promo'd the book or made RR Nova relevant in any major books, events, or tie ins (even ones like Secret Invasion)...that is what doomed that Nova Vol....not the drop in quality.

..bah whatever..been said a million times.

 

[sandwraith]

We are sounding an awful like what happened to Secret Avengers Vol. 1

..at any rate in some respects DnA's run was the template for what a guy like Nova needs...a dedicated creative staff that has a plan and commitment.

Problem was Marvel never Promo'd the book or made RR Nova relevant in any major books, events, or tie ins (even ones like Secret Invasion)...that is what doomed that Nova Vol....not the drop in quality.

..bah whatever..been said a million times.

Well, it was a time when Marvel Editorial were high on HEROES vs HEROES ideas which is why we essentially got that in Civil War and Secret Invasion to some extent.

I was actually glad that Richard's involvement with any of these so-called mega events was peripheral at best. And with all the hype surrounding the >snicker< return of Captain Marvel, I'd say there were one too many heroes making a "comeback" during that period for them to have a care about Nova.

In short, for the quality of stories that we got in DnA's run, that was a GOOD thing.

 

[JewishHobbit]

That Captain Marvel return was actually pretty cool for how shortlived it was. Even his mini when you realized he was a skrull was pretty awesome. The issue he returned in by Jenkins (I think) was decent. The mini was awesome. His introduction in Secret Invasion against the Thunderbolts was a Heck YEAH! moment... and then he fizzled in a crappy death.

Still, it was the first time I've cared about Captain Marvel, ever.

 

[THANOSRULES]

it was decent ..which was what made it all the worse when marvel just fluffed it off and botched it.

 

[sandwraith]

Marvel's handling of Captain Marvel just indicates how the mainstream Editors feel about Cosmic characters in general. They treat Cosmic the same way they treat Mystical: as a plot device.

 

[THANOSRULES]

Its even worse than that though with Captain Marvel...I mean it's ridiculous.

I mean even since Skrull-vell we've had 3 different captain marvels! (noh'varr who took the mantle in a profound way, a brief AvX resurrection of Mar'vell and now Carol)

..wait maybe there is more..when did Chaos War happen? I'm not sure when Phyla stopped using it either..I've lost track!

 

[sandwraith]

We did get Cancerverse Mar-Vell who I think was too briefly used. If the Thanos Imperative was a longer series or if there were more tie-ins with GOTG and Nova to expand on Cancerverse Mar-vell, he might have made for a more compelling villain.

 

[JewishHobbit]

Both Chaos War and Phyla's days as Captain Marvel were after Secret Invasion, so they count.


Of the six Captain Marvels mentioned, Skrull-Vell is still my favorite. He had an intriguing story all around. The redeemed Skrull. It honestly should have been a much bigger part of the Secret Invasion story.

 

[THANOSRULES]

They should still bring him back..even if it's as a different sort of character. Skrull characters are pretty cool. I dig Pai Bok, Super Skrull, Lyja, and Hulkling and that kid Crusader (he was interesting)..basically the only named Marvel U characters who re-occur...we need more skrulls out there..especially heros.

 

[sandwraith]

I keep talking about this so much that suddenly I'm not sure if its real. Post-Annihilation, the guy who did the Super-Skrull Annihilation mini said he had a new mini in mind called "Armada" in which K'lrt would become like Moses to the Skrulls and lead them to a new homeworld. I think post-Conquest and pre-Secret Invasion the plan fell through because apparently Super-Skrull was more concerned about his "daughter" to actually give a crap about the rest of his species.

I like K'lrt. He evolved from a typical 1-dimensional Alien baddie to an unlikeable but respectable foe to a guy whose defeats outnumbered his victories and led to his fall from grace and eventually gave him a new sense of being. He is still an unlikeable dick but and unlikeable dick with honor...ish.

 

[JewishHobbit]

Super Skrull was mentioned as being in Infinity

 

[THANOSRULES]

Super Skrull took a hit when in secret invasion a lot of other skrulls basically seemed to have his powers.

 

[sandwraith]

Super Skrull took a hit when in secret invasion a lot of other skrulls basically seemed to have his powers.

If I recall in Nova, the other Skrulls gave him this "obsolete model" attitude when he's survived more encounters with FF, the Avengers and all the crap he went through in Annihilation. Heck he died in Annihilation but came back to life because he's awesome.

 

[THANOSRULES]

I just read issue #3 and man..this book is not going to work.

It's just "average" and amidst what a book like Nova needs to catch on..it's not going to happen.

Marvel needs to bring back somebody like Giffen to clean this mess up.

 

[JewishHobbit]

Yeah, I didn't even bother picking up the 3rd issue. I'm just not digging it, which will likely also lead to us not getting anything with Rich for a while because Marvel will take that as us not wanting a Nova book period... because they're stupid like that.

I'm hoping for a Rich return in Infinity, but doubt it will happen.

 

[THANOSRULES]

Yeah, I didn't even bother picking up the 3rd issue. I'm just not digging it, which will likely also lead to us not getting anything with Rich for a while because Marvel will take that as us not wanting a Nova book period... because they're stupid like that.

I'm hoping for a Rich return in Infinity, but doubt it will happen.

What baffles me..word is Marvel still has not cancelled Captain Marvel and will not. Kinda makes you scratch your head when Nova sold mid 20s when it got canceled. Captain Marvel has been sub 20 k for some time now.

WHats bothering me about a lot of these NOW titles is there has been such a quick hook with a disregard for long term or even multi arc quality.. especially in the secondary books like T-bolts and Nova and on creative teams and talent all around.

 

[Xeno-noesis]

It's interesting to read all of the comments in this thread. I'm actually new to Nova...actually new to all of the Marvel Cosmic titles.

At this point, I find this the most enjoyable out of the titles I currently collect (Iron Man, Fantastic Four, GOTG) and collected prior (both X-Force titles, which I dropped because they are absolute junk). Nova has been by far the most efficient, consistent, and logical in it's story and art.

Ok, now about Sam as Nova. Do they intend to keep Nova as a kid throughout the duration of the series? Or could they transition him into an adult?

And I'm trying to get the chronology straight. Was Sam's dad Nova after Richard Rider? Or is his father Rider himself?

 

[JewishHobbit]

Sam's dad would have been a Nova prior to Rider, which brings up some continuity problems. The problem with this book is that it's ignoring aspects of continuity. For example: they mention in issues 1 and 2 that Rocket and Gamora were Guardians of the Galaxy 17 years ago when Sam's dad was a Nova. Problem with that was that the Guardians of the Galaxy were only formed maybe 2 years ago in the comics. Also, Richard Rider was always the first Nova from Earth (and he was looked down upon for that). There's room to wiggle with that, however, due to this whole black Nova corps maybe being different from the regular Nova Corps, but it's still weird.

And no, Sam will not age much at all. Marvel doesn't age characters, or if they do they quickly regress them. If Sam lasts that long as a character, expect him to be a teenager/very early 20s for the next 30 years.

And this book is decent on it's own without anything else to compare itself. It falls apart when you compare it to Annihilation and the previous volume of Nova that started after Annihilation and ended with the Thanos Imperative.

 

[Xeno-noesis]

Sam's dad would have been a Nova prior to Rider, which brings up some continuity problems. The problem with this book is that it's ignoring aspects of continuity. For example: they mention in issues 1 and 2 that Rocket and Gamora were Guardians of the Galaxy 17 years ago when Sam's dad was a Nova. Problem with that was that the Guardians of the Galaxy were only formed maybe 2 years ago in the comics. Also, Richard Rider was always the first Nova from Earth (and he was looked down upon for that). There's room to wiggle with that, however, due to this whole black Nova corps maybe being different from the regular Nova Corps, but it's still weird.

And no, Sam will not age much at all. Marvel doesn't age characters, or if they do they quickly regress them. If Sam lasts that long as a character, expect him to be a teenager/very early 20s for the next 30 years.

And this book is decent on it's own without anything else to compare itself. It falls apart when you compare it to Annihilation and the previous volume of Nova that started after Annihilation and ended with the Thanos Imperative.

Thanks! So the continuity appears to be more of a mess than I realized...now everyone's complaints are starting to make sense lol.

Right now I'm building a list of Nova issues (and other Cosmic titles, such as Silver Surfer) to buy. I've been reading Marvel comics since the early 90's and not once did I touch a cosmic title. Why, I don't know...and I regret it. Even as poor as these current cosmic runs seem to be to most seasoned readers, they are still enjoyable to newcomers.

Thanks again for the information and background.

 

[THANOSRULES]

Thanks! So the continuity appears to be more of a mess than I realized...now everyone's complaints are starting to make sense lol.

Right now I'm building a list of Nova issues (and other Cosmic titles, such as Silver Surfer) to buy. I've been reading Marvel comics since the early 90's and not once did I touch a cosmic title. Why, I don't know...and I regret it. Even as poor as these current cosmic runs seem to be to most seasoned readers, they are still enjoyable to newcomers.

Thanks again for the information and background.

I wouldnt say the continuity is a "mess" it's a retcon where one could be feasible.

Working off it's own logic, and the concept of what this newly invented notion of the "black Nova Corps" is ..I don't have any major issues, but i find the execution annoying...

Whats killing me is the book is just an average generic superhero tale..and the decompression is extremely annoying to me at this point.

Loeb is also asking a lot of readers in terms of retcon, the core issue is that the Nova Corps may have a somewhat spotty and unexplored back history, especially pre Vol. 1 Nova, but the Corps have been through extremely dire conflicts before...it doesnt really add up that there was some clandestine Nova organization behind the scenes through the multiple destruction of Xandar and the Corps...I mean at one point Xandar was conscripting minor Nova Villians to fight for them as the champions of Xandar

..and that "retcon sticker shock" got even more severe with the introduction in issue #3 of the Chitauri as Marvel 616 villains, they have no history save for the movie and Ultimate books.

I actually like the Black Nova Corps concept, however, and I think creatively it could work, but I'm really doubting that at this point.

I don't mind many of the retcons..but with slow decompression of the narrative, it's just becoming annoying to me.

This book was set up as something that Loeb was going to be "all in" on , and perhaps he and marvel wanted to see this job as maybe having some emotional profound connection with his real life son, who passed away. I'm just not seeing that so far.

So far I'm seeing a generic sci-fi movie script and commercial cash in..and Loeb is even declared he will be off and on with writing duties.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

If they're using the Chitauri as just a generic warrior race, as they did in the movie, I don't mind. They'll probably be working for someone else (likely Thanos, if this ties into Infinity), so they don't need much of an identity of their own. For all we know, they could've been bred for this purpose, so they wouldn't even need a history or an explanation of why we haven't seen them before. Not a big deal.

The black helmets haven't been shown doing any really unsavory work yet, so I'm okay with them too. If they turn out to be assassinating people for Xandar, then I'll have a problem. But an off-the-books squad of Nova Centurions isn't necessarily a morally questionable thing by itself.

I'm actually finding myself liking Sam, too. As new young hero stories go, it's a good one.

 

[THANOSRULES]

If they're using the Chitauri as just a generic warrior race, as they did in the movie, I don't mind. They'll probably be working for someone else (likely Thanos, if this ties into Infinity), so they don't need much of an identity of their own. For all we know, they could've been bred for this purpose, so they wouldn't even need a history or an explanation of why we haven't seen them before. Not a big deal.

The black helmets haven't been shown doing any really unsavory work yet, so I'm okay with them too. If they turn out to be assassinating people for Xandar, then I'll have a problem. But an off-the-books squad of Nova Centurions isn't necessarily a morally questionable thing by itself.

I'm actually finding myself liking Sam, too. As new young hero stories go, it's a good one.

It's also possible the Black Nova Corps were defunct well before the events of Nova Vol.1....

Marvel doesnt give a real estimation of how "marvel time" works, but from there own wiki most estimates are FF#1 era stuff happened about 14 years ago.

http://marvel.wikia.com/Marvel_Time

Therfore "17 years ago" is a LONG time.

Then again we have GOTG with Racoon and Gamora..urgh.

I think I agree with you..no big problems with these "retcons" ..but they are just being executed a bit sloppy.

 

[Silicon Surfer]

If FF# is only 14 years ago then how is it that the FF and the Red Ghost were the first people on the moon?