Dealing with a superhero who has a legacy can be a bit of a pain as this thread has demonstrated, since there's room for disagreement about which character best represents the hero. It's a problem that to my knowledge Marvel doesn't really see much of (outside of stuff like "which X-Men team is the ultimate one?"), but it's very much an issue within DC fandom, particularly with The Flash.
Which is why the legacy has never really been explored to this day.
And that is why I think the best route to go is a passing of the torch story, kind of like Mask of Zorro. There are a lot of different ways they could approach it too, which is part of why I think there's so much potential to be had.
I understand the comparison, but Mask of Zorro and Flash are two completely different animals. Mask of Zorro worked because the story and the characters were taylor made for that specific film and they fit that specific story. In order to cram all the (over 30 years long) Flash legacy in the first movie, major retooling/reinventing/rewriting is required, so much so that the characters will be their comics counterparts in name and likeness only, which defeats the purpose of trying to do the legacy story in the first place, as you demonstrate with your ideas below:
Option 1: Prologue features Barry as the vintage Flash with a young Wally as Kid Flash. Wally has to hang up his Kid Flash tights and live a "normal life." In act one, we jump ahead to "modern times," where a solo Barry Allen flash comes across a super villain plot. The villain kills Barry, and when Wally learns of his uncle's death, he dons the costume to pick up Barry's trail and beat the bad guy.
Option 2: Same as above, except that the reason Wally stops being Kid Flash is because Barry dies while stopping a supervillain, and Wally hangs up his costume because he doesn't think he can go it alone. Years later, the world needs The Flash again, and he resolves to put on his uncle's costume and give the people the hero they need.
Option 3: Barry dies while Wally is a teenage "kid flash," and we get to see the awkward transition between being a teen sidekick and a full fledged superhero. We get to see Wally putting on the boots before he's even sure he's big enough for them, while dealing with the loss of his mentor.
These are just a few examples. There's a lot of places they could go, but I'd wager that the potential for this kind of story is far more interesting than a typical origin story. All we really need to know is that they were both involved in a laboratory accident that gave them speed powers, possibly through a flashback (heck, they could even try to make things more believable by having them get their powers at the same time from the same accident).
See? All the retooling you have to go thru to tell this one story and to make Wally adaptable to the big screen? Barry requires none of this. And what happens once Wally "fills Barry's boots" and that premise has ran its course with the first film? What type of Wally stories do you tell then in later films if they happen, without the weight of the legacy looming over Wally's head, Wally is just a poor man's Barry Allen.
Also, you mentioned believability. Barry Allen is the most believable/realistic Flash. His background even has a certain grittiness to it. Isn't that what DC is going for with their new film strategy? Setting them in the "real" world a la Batman Begins and The Dark Knight? So they're all compatible that way? Barry's story certainly fits that better than Wally's does, it's much less fantastic and, if you'll excuse me, "comic bookish". Plus there's the whole forensics aspect of it.
Before the main titles Barry (Peter Krause) should sacrificing himself to stop some villain
After the credits it should start with Wally (Scott Porter), the former Kid Flash picking up the Flash suit from Jay Garrick.
The story pans out from there Wally tires to find out who killed Barry and stop him
...didn't you complain about Barry "solving murder mysteries" when here you have a whole movie dedicated to Wally trying to find out who Barry's killer is?
So Barry has to "die" and be this "uncle Ben" prop because that's the only way you've ever read him? As a "dead guy". Cuz that's all he is to you haha?
Honestly, this idea has much more in common with the Captain America "legacy" then it does with The Flash. It's much closer to the comics version of it and is just the way you want to adapt The Flash.
Consider:
1) Steve Rogers actually
is murdered, unlike Barry Allen in your story.
2) Bucky Barnes has a more original and more believable story than Wally West, and it would be easier to adapt to film, it requires little retooling compared to what has to be done with Wally to get him as the main character in the first film.
3) Instead of just posing as Steve Rogers, Bucky actually has his own Captain America suit. Imagine that, originality.
4) Instead of whining about how he isn't the man his mentor was, Bucky is a total badass.
^ So if there's a legacy to adapt on screen for the first movie, why not do Captain America's? It's pretty much exactly the same way you want to adapt Flash anyway, except it actually accurately reflects how it's depicted in the comics.
So take your legacy movie idea to the Captain America thread, replace "Barry Allen" with Steve Rogers and "Wally West" with Bucky Barnes and see how they feel about Steve Rogers dying within the first 5 minutes of the Captain America movie and the rest of it being about Bucky Cap.
The real origin story though would be about Wally taking up the mantle of a hero that came before him, and coming into his own as the hero of a new generation. They could even have some humor about fanboyism, hehehe.
So those complaints about not doing Barry Allen because of the "origin story" are unfair, because you're getting the same thing with Wally West. An origin is an origin.
But, for the sake of the movie's title....
THE MOVIE NEEDS TO BE ABOUT THE FLASH, NOT KID FLASH!
If they're going to do a Flash movie, they should give it all they've got.
If by "giving it all they've got" you mean telling the best story they can to get people on board with The Flash then I agree. If by "giving it all they've got" you mean blowing their load on the first film by cramming a story that developed over decades into a 2 hour time slot then I very much disagree.
He's not as big of an industry staple as the likes of Batman,
Exactly why they need to do the iconic (yes, I'm calling it that) version of the character first. Same with GL.
and if Wally is the character most people want to see, then they should make sure he's represented in the first movie. As I pointed out, doing a passing of the torch story featuring Wally would really set this apart from all the other superhero origin flicks out there.
The way you want to do Barry's death and Wally's story is like Abin Sur and Hal Jordan. By the time Flash hits screens, GL will have already been released, and the "legacy" aspect the way you want to explore it will have been done already in GL. Yes, Barry is a much, much, much more MASSIVE and important character than Abin Sur. But audiences don't know that, and using Barry as a plot point prop like Abin Sur and then trying to build a film about a character who's trying to live up to unestablished history of another character is going to be
meaningless to the audience and will not have the emotional weight that it had in the comics. It will be like Hal taking the ring from Abin Sur. No one will give a **** about Abin Sur and they won't about Barry either. But I guess because you don't, neither should they, right? Hell, even in the GL script, early on, Abin dies after taking on Legion. Having Barry die at the hands of a villain in the first act and then having Wally take the reins will be too close for comfort, then trying to build a story where your main character has so much guilt over taking over for a character nobody knows anything about/cares ZERO about because he's so unsetablished in the first place is not going to work. It would be like making the GL movie about Hal trying to live up to Abin Sur's reputation, Abin Sur, a character no one cares about who died in the first 10 minutes of the movie.
Plus if they do Wally this way and it inevitably
doesn't work then it will have destroyed any chance of Flash getting a shot at the big screen again for at least a very long time. Reason #23 for Barry Allen, he's the safe choice.
I think people would take a lot more interest in a movie about a sidekick becoming a superhero than they would about the typical "scientist has accident in lab, gets powers, decides to become superhero, designs costume" story that we've seen oh-so-many times already.
Perhaps they would, but this is a story that cannot be done any justice unless Barry is estabished
first. Otherwise it will have been a pail imitation of Wally's story at best and no one will care. You tell people you're doing a movie about The Flash, you need to do it about The Flash. Do the expanded universe crap later when people know enough to care. To tell the best Wally story and do justice to it, you need to have a long, established history and familiarity with Barry Allen first. That's why it worked in the comics, why it had so much weight and emotion. None of that is there if Barry is gone in the first 5. Not even if there are flashbacks.
typical "scientist has accident in lab, gets powers, decides to become superhero, designs costume" story that we've seen oh-so-many times already
Yes, and we'd see it again with Wally West, only that "cliche" and "impossible" accident will have already happened once and it will happen again, this time to a kid, making it
hokey even by comic book standards. We'll see Wally decide to fight crime as both Kid Flash and Flash, plus we'll have to deal with his uncle's decision to fight crime (which is much more defined and realistic then Wally's "I'm the new guy!" shtick), all this, which we've seen "oh-so-many-times" we'd have to deal with, twice, and in an unmanageable, convulted way that will seem stupid to newcomers in the end result.
Barry's origin or Wally's origin. An origin is an origin. Barry's is better. If there's an origin to be told, go with Barry.
If the goal is just to please Barry Allen fans without doing much to set up a franchise, then doing a generic origin film without the most popular version of the hero would be the way to do it.
In regard to the "popularity" issue, Barry's status is going to come back up after Rebirth just like Hal's did. You don't have to believe me, just stick around and you'll see. Barry, like Hal, already has an established, hardcore die hard fanbase (that knows everything about the Flash and has sat thru every issue of Wally West), a fanbase that has been around long before Wally put on his boots, plus as the new Flash, he'll have attracted tons of naive newcomers. The end result is a massive, core Barry Allen fanbase, same as Hal Jordan.
without doing much to set up a franchise
Haha! I find this ironic, as doing Barry Allen first would be the actual
start of the franchise, starting with Wally West is picking up more in the middle/end of the franchise. They do Barry Allen and they plant the seed for sequels, Wally West, Jay Garrick, and eventually Wally Flash and make the most of ALL the characters. Same with GL.
then doing a generic origin film
I'm sorry, but why does it have to be "generic"? Is there some reason why we can't have a fleshed out, well defined, compelling Barry Allen story? Other than the reason that you don't want to tell one, the answer is "NO!".
The idea, in concept, is generic and a formula. It's the same "generic formula" in
all superhero movies, and Wally West is no exception. The idea is to tell that formula differently each time. Do that and it doesn't seem "generic", films like Superman: The Movie, Batman Negins, Iron Man, and Spider-Man have proved that.
Look, to delve into the legacy aspects in the very first film requires entirely too much retooling and reinventing of the characters, to the point where they're unrecognizable in comparison with the comic book story, which defeats the purpose of using them in the first place, it does not do justice to
ANY of the characters and is not an accurate representation of the source material. Overlooking the vast history that makes the legacy and Wally's history as Kid Flash in the end result, makes it "generic" as you called it. I wish fans could see that. They'd be pissed off, but if they do it that way, they'd be getting what they asked for whether they know it or not - a watered down, flimsy version of Wally West's story.
Make the most of the franchise I say. Use
every character to ther fullest potential. More can be done with Barry Allen before killing him after his first five minutes of screen time and much more can be done with Wally West before shoe-horning him into his uncle's suit. Make the best of every character before closing the story on one and starting another chapter.
Besides, am I the only one who is looking at the
BIG PICTURE? That's not just Flash, but Green Lantern, Batman, Superman, JLA...the whole DC Movie Universe! One of the biggest reasons why we will never see Singer's Superman and Nolan's Batman in a movie together is because they are uncompatible. They didn't think BIG when they were starting those films. Batman just began and was played by an older actor, Superman just returned and the film was based on a virtually non existant, 5 year continuity and Superman was played by a younger actor. Is this what you want with The Flash? Surely we want them all to lead into a JLA film and mesh with each other. Hal Jordan is already the GL in the GL film, Hal and Barry are the same age and are founding JLA members, if Barry is no more than a prop in the Flash movie and Wally West is Flash, then who is Flash in JLA? Surely not Wally, because they'd have to recast Hal Jordan as an older actor because you know they'd want to start with a young guy in the GL film so they can use him for multiple films. Same with Flash. They'd want those guys to be about the same age.
...^^ Anybody else think of this stuff?
BOTTOM LINE:
Everyone benefits if they do Barry Allen first. It is the logical, most econimcal and practical choice in every way. There is not one good reason why they should do it with Wally West first. The only thing even remotely close to a good reason for Wally is that right now, he seems to have more fans. But that doesn't even matter because of what I said eariler.
Now, having said that, in closing, I would like to say, Barry, Wally, Jay, whoever they go with, I think this is where we all agree (I think, I could be wrong tho), I will be there opening night in my red and gold suit to see the film. No matter what happens, even if they don't tell the story I want, I'll be there to see it. I just want them to do the best that is possible with it and make the most of it. That's all.
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