Sequels The Official Kevin Spacey As Lex Luthor Thread

[manofsteel4life]

Supes doesn't deal with the knowledge of his son, he just flies into his room and repeats the speech his father gave to him while Jason is asleep


but at that moment what did you want him to do?...wake up Jason, and tell him everything....he's a child...on top of that a sleeping child....that would confuse the hell out of him....and again he didnt just fly away.....Lois asked him "will i see you around?"....and whats supes response?......"im always around"....how you intrepret that he's just leaving Jason for Lois to take care of him all by herself, just blows my mind

 

[Lighthouse]

I know, how anyone can say SR had no character development is beyond me. Character development is probably the thing it had most of.

To me this was the single biggest problem of the movie. Superman I felt was barely explored in the movie. I didn't know how he felt about anything. Trip to Krypton and back? Unexplored. World moving on without him? Unexplored. The kid? Deer in headlights the whole movie. He reminded me of the kid from The Omen just looking at stuff. I felt no connection to the Superman in this movie, because it spent too much time trying to convince me it was the same Superman from the Reeve movies, which he isn't. This is a new Superman.

 

[Lighthouse]

Supes doesn't deal with the knowledge of his son, he just flies into his room and repeats the speech his father gave to him while Jason is asleep


but at that moment what did you want him to do?...wake up Jason, and tell him everything....he's a child...on top of that a sleeping child....that would confuse the hell out of him....and again he didnt just fly away.....Lois asked him "will i see you around?"....and whats supes response?......"im always around"....how you intrepret that he's just leaving Jason for Lois to take care of him all by herself, just blows my mind

Instead of flying away he could have said "Lois, we need to talk."

 

[TheComicbookKid]

Instead of flying away he could have said "Lois, we need to talk."

You want the film to be longer!t:

These are the things left for the sequel. Superman dealing with not being able to be a real father to his son, and to be with Lois.

 

[manofsteel4life]

You want the film to be longer!t:

These are the things left for the sequel. Superman dealing with not being able to be a real father to his son, and to be with Lois.

thank you!!

 

[TheComicbookKid]

Well, after seeing peoples reactions over the past year. I've come to the realization that if you don't like a movie, you can completely read a scene differently.

Silver Surfer came off so dumb to me because the fact that the relationship between SS and Galactus left me with the idea that Silver Surfer could have destroyed G at any moment. The movie never told the viewer that Norrin Radd was anything but a man with silver skin with cosmic power. Then I realized that my dislike was similar to people with Singer's vague history. So arguing about the meaning of a scene is ridiculous and pointless at this point.

 

[manofsteel4life]

Well, after seeing peoples reactions over the past year. I've come to the realization that if you don't like a movie, you can completely read a scene differently.

Silver Surfer came off so dumb to me because the fact that the relationship between SS and Galactus left me with the idea that Silver Surfer could have destroyed G at any moment. The movie never told the viewer that Norrin Radd was anything but a man with silver skin with cosmic power. Then I realized that my dislike was similar to people with Singer's vague history. So arguing about the meaning of a scene is ridiculous and pointless at this point.

i guess your right, but sometimes for me it isnt arguing....just trying to understand why some people's minds view things so differently

 

[TheComicbookKid]

i guess your right, but sometimes for me it isnt arguing....just trying to understand why some people's minds view things so differently

I know. It still gets infuriating sometimes. The scene coined as "superstalker" puzzled me at first as how people got that reaction. The whole scene before was Clark fumbling to make an excuse to Lois that would make her understand and it failed. So he goes to check in to see how her life was going since, as Clark, he wasn't able to get close to her. That was it, a beautiful scene turned into a joke like he's some kind of pervert?

I start to feel bad about the movie like maybe it wasn't as good as I thougtht. Which does happen with some movies after the initial few viewings. But as soon as I watch it, I still love every second of it. Routh, Spacey, and even Bosworth.

 

[Grinder]

In the end, the relationship was repaired and his lonelines was gone.

Which part of "If or how Clark changes depends on the individual interpretation of the viewer." you don't get?

If you don't believe Superman would leave then of course, you'd think it was all just plot development. The entire premise of the movie appears false to you and so does the development.

I have no idea were you get that from me and your rant about BBegins is hilarious. You have obviously no idea how good stories are told, nor how characters progress in a storyline. Check the Batman boards for clearity on how well crafted the story was (I'm too bored to get into that all again), it somehow even managed to rank "super" with the critics, public and fans, guaranteeing a sequel.

Even funnier: I provided you plot points that clearly have different kinds of meaning to the viewers and stirred up lots of arguments since the movie's release and you just shut it down with the stupid assumption that I hate the plot point about Supes leaving earth!??

I start to feel bad about the movie like maybe it wasn't as good as I thougtht. Which does happen with some movies after the initial few viewings. But as soon as I watch it, I still love every second of it. Routh, Spacey, and even Bosworth.

--> Congratulations: You are truly a Singer fanboy! :heart:

Arguing with you is useless. What you don't want to see can't be there.

 

[TheComicbookKid]

Which part of "If or how Clark changes depends on the individual interpretation of the viewer." you don't get?



I have no idea were you get that from me and your rant about BBegins is hilarious. You have obviously no idea how good stories are told, nor how characters progress in a storyline. Check the Batman boards for clearity on how well crafted the story was (I'm too bored to get into that all again), it somehow even managed to rank "super" with the critics, public and fans, guaranteeing a sequel.

Even funnier: I provided you plot points that clearly have different kinds of meaning to the viewers and stirred up lots of arguments since the movie's release and you just shut it down with the stupid assumption that I hate the plot point about Supes leaving earth!??
--> Congratulations: You are truly a Singer fanboy! :heart:

Arguing with you is useless. What you don't want to see can't be there.

Which I agreed with you on. Why I said Spiderman 2 is a perfect example. I never said SR was on Spidey's level.

I didn't say you as in what you thought. I was talking about how people in general can become disconnected from a story. I think BB is a solid and good movie. Just not a great Batman story. The character development involved Bruce becoming Batman. That's great. He didn't question being Batman at all. That's being brought up in the sequel.

Well you were the only one arguing in the first place, Grinder. Some people like Megan Fox in Transformers but you don't see me telling them they are kissing Bay's ass. You need to calm your self down a little bit before you come at me like that. Talking in generalities as "you" as in people is different from Grinder's an idiot if he can't see this and this. I had problems with SR, but I still like it.

 

[turtlefocker]

Character developement isn't the same as the plot of a movie. Of course do the characters interact with each other, it's just nothing of importance. Supes doesn't deal with the knowledge of his son, he just flies into his room and repeats the speech his father gave to him while Jason is asleep. (That speech also makes zero sense to everyone who doesn't know/remember/cares for the religious meaning of the Donner movies.)

Then, when he finally meets Lois after this shocking revelation, they both just stare at each other for a second and then go back to the "big elephant in the room we should just ignore" routine the whole movie is build up on and then he tells her "I'm always around!" and flies off. That's definitely NOT dealing with the impact of getting the news that you have a kid with your old girlfriend! One could argue that he more or less just leaves Lois with his son like "You're problem, deal with it!".
It's the subtleness Singer implemented in every scene that makes the whole story so irritating. You can think about most of the scenes and always come to different solutions depending on how you interpret them. We shouldn't have to ask ourselves what a significant scene, like the last one with Lois, actually means. Some here see it as the end of the Lois/Supes relationship while others see it as a sign for a new beginning of their love.

Those are key moments of this movie's plot and have to be explained till the end of it.
Otherwise it's just very irritating and results in the mixed word of mouth the movie is still suffering from.

That and some other things are the reason why we're still trying to make sense of the story and why even the biggest SR fans around here feel that Singer has some explaining to do in a sequel.

If you want good examples for character development watch "Spider-Man 2" or "Batman Begins" and then compare it to SR.
Peter and Bruce go from A to B and change their personalities in a significant way in the end.
If or how Clark changes depends on the individual interpretation of the viewer. For me, he didn't change one bit from the first time he appears. He's a lonely alien who wants some love. He's pretty much Hellboy in a Superman suit.

QFT

 

[manofsteel4life]

I know. It still gets infuriating sometimes. The scene coined as "superstalker" puzzled me at first as how people got that reaction. The whole scene before was Clark fumbling to make an excuse to Lois that would make her understand and it failed. So he goes to check in to see how her life was going since, as Clark, he wasn't able to get close to her. That was it, a beautiful scene turned into a joke like he's some kind of pervert?

I start to feel bad about the movie like maybe it wasn't as good as I thougtht. Which does happen with some movies after the initial few viewings. But as soon as I watch it, I still love every second of it. Routh, Spacey, and even Bosworth.

i do to and many others that dont post comments here

 

[Memphis Slim]

You want the film to be longer!t:

These are the things left for the sequel. Superman dealing with not being able to be a real father to his son, and to be with Lois.

The sequel opens with superman in court for child support. t:

 

[TheComicbookKid]

The sequel opens with superman in court for child support. t:

I was hoping for Maury. Superman can scream at the crowd, " I was in a different galaxy! Shut up, you don't understand!"t:

 

[Matt]

I was hoping for Maury. Superman can scream at the crowd, " I was in a different galaxy! Shut up, you don't understand!"t:

Jason: *comes out to the audience booing* YOU AIN'T KNOW ME! YOU AIN'T KNOW ME! HERE'S HOW IT IS MAURY! THIS **** *points at Lois* GOT KNOCKED UP BY AN ALIEN AND WHO RAN AWAY AND NOW SHE GETS MAD CAUSE I DO IT!?!?! BLEEEEP THAT!

And that could set up the perfect end to the trilogy.

Superman Returns 3: The Kid Goes to One of Those Talk Show Bootcamps

 

[TheComicbookKid]

Jason: *comes out to the audience booing* YOU AIN'T KNOW ME! YOU AIN'T KNOW ME! HERE'S HOW IT IS MAURY! THIS **** *points at Lois* GOT KNOCKED UP BY AN ALIEN AND WHO RAN AWAY AND NOW SHE GETS MAD CAUSE I DO IT!?!?! BLEEEEP THAT!

And that could set up the perfect end to the trilogy.

Superman Returns 3: The Kid Goes to One of Those Talk Show Bootcamps

t: Seriously, I almost spat out my soda. That would just look too funny.

 

[Excel]

Jason: *comes out to the audience booing* YOU AIN'T KNOW ME! YOU AIN'T KNOW ME! HERE'S HOW IT IS MAURY! THIS **** *points at Lois* GOT KNOCKED UP BY AN ALIEN AND WHO RAN AWAY AND NOW SHE GETS MAD CAUSE I DO IT!?!?! BLEEEEP THAT!

And that could set up the perfect end to the trilogy.

Superman Returns 3: The Kid Goes to One of Those Talk Show Bootcamps

 

[mego joe]

I know, how anyone can say SR had no character development is beyond me. Character development is probably the thing it had most of.

I don't really think it developed anyone's character that much. It certainly didn't show any growth or create an affinity for anyone but Richard WHite.

 

[superbaby]

I don't really think it developed anyone's character that much. It certainly didn't show any growth or create an affinity for anyone but Richard WHite.

i gotta agree. and i am always amused by how the sr supporters defend the movie by saying SR doesn't have a lot of action because it concentrated on the character development. what a laugh.
a movie doesn't have good action, it doesn't mean that it will have good character development. c'mon.

 

[Qwerty©]

i gotta agree. and i am always amused by how the sr supporters defend the movie by saying SR doesn't have a lot of action because it concentrated on the character development. what a laugh.
a movie doesn't have good action, it doesn't mean that it will have good character development. c'mon.

This is true.

But I thought SR did have good character development.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

I don't really think it developed anyone's character that much. It certainly didn't show any growth or create an affinity for anyone but Richard WHite.

I disagree, in the end, i cared for Superman, Lois, Jason, Richard and even Kitty (her crying during the beating scene adds a lot more emotional weight to it and her noble decision on what to do with the crystals showed me she wasnt evil). And IMO, Superman had learned from his mistakes, and was a changed man at the end of SR.

i gotta agree. and i am always amused by how the sr supporters defend the movie by saying SR doesn't have a lot of action because it concentrated on the character development. what a laugh.
a movie doesn't have good action, it doesn't mean that it will have good character development. c'mon.

That is true, but i feel that SR has a lot of very good character development. You cant honestly say the Superman at the end of SR is the same one as the beginning.

 

[YÅ«gi's BM]

Superman Returns was about how the characters react to there greatest hero returning out of the blue all of the sudden. It was also about how Superman was trying to rediscover his groove. I think the ending was pretty much a 'now that we have this out of the way, Superman can begin his life again'.

The next movie is bound to be better.

 

[Warhammer]

Agreed, i want more of the vicious, sinister Luthor from the 3rd act of SR.

Agreed.

Jason: *comes out to the audience booing* YOU AIN'T KNOW ME! YOU AIN'T KNOW ME! HERE'S HOW IT IS MAURY! THIS **** *points at Lois* GOT KNOCKED UP BY AN ALIEN AND WHO RAN AWAY AND NOW SHE GETS MAD CAUSE I DO IT!?!?! BLEEEEP THAT!

And that could set up the perfect end to the trilogy.

Superman Returns 3: The Kid Goes to One of Those Talk Show Bootcamps

*Imagines the drill sergeant guy coming out and screaming in Jason's face*

Superman Returns was about how the characters react to there greatest hero returning out of the blue all of the sudden. It was also about how Superman was trying to rediscover his groove. I think the ending was pretty much a 'now that we have this out of the way, Superman can begin his life again'.

The next movie is bound to be better.

Agreed.
The movie was about the return of a savior. Kevin Roegele needs to get his ass in here and preach his message.

 

[terry78]

Well, now that we've all gotten in touch with Superman's feelings, we can get back to some alien ass kickery.

 

[AVEITWITHJAMON]

Superman Returns was about how the characters react to there greatest hero returning out of the blue all of the sudden. It was also about how Superman was trying to rediscover his groove. I think the ending was pretty much a 'now that we have this out of the way, Superman can begin his life again'.

The next movie is bound to be better.

Exactly, well put