The Official Stupid Question Thread: Marvel Edition - Part 2

[Scarecrow_King]

Quite a few. The reason behind Asgard's destruction in that trade is revealed later on in the arc. Thor wasn't aware of it because he was stuck in the Heroes Reborn universe after "dying" in the fight against Onslaught.

Thanks. I'm thinking about reading all of the Heroes Return stuff together since the Cap and Iron Man stories are collected in nice Premiere Editions. They seem to all cross over quite a bit, and they all have awesome writers on them. Waid on Cap, Busiek on Iron Man, and Jurgens on Thor. All good writers, with good artists too.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Yeah, they were all pretty good. Busiek's Avengers from that period was as well.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

Yeah, I've already read that. But it was years ago, so I should give it another read with the rest of 'em. When I think of the Avengers, that's the book I think of.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

There's a really awesome crossover like 60 issues into each of the big three's runs called "Standoff." It's obviously not directly related to all the problems Cap, Tony, and Thor would have with each other later on because Dan Jurgens isn't a fortune teller, but it could be viewed as the first major fracture between the three of them after their camaraderie built up and before the real overt feuds of Civil War and its follow-ups.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

I do want to build up my collection of the big 3, but I don't think there are trades that far in. Marvel has a pretty shoddy trade collection of things from the 90s. I was growing up in the 90s and want to go back and read the complete stories that I had scattered issues of as a kid.

I just don't know it tracking down the backissues probably wouldn't be worth it for me. But if I can find it, I might check out that Standoff story. I'm always into crossover stories. thanks for the recommendation.

 

[runawayboulder]

Standoff was a great story with a great/tragic ending, Thor looking at a broken picture of Cap, Iron Man and himself back in the old days. It's kinda funny that Marvel ran with something for so long that was mostly conceived by Geoff Johns and Jurgens since they were long gone by the time Disassembled came around.

Jurgens run on Thor is one that's not really given as much props as I would like it to. He was on the book for about 5 years. It nearly rivals Simonson if you ask me. His Cap run on the other hand......it was pretty pale in comparison.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

I didn't even know Jurgens wrote Cap. When was that?

edit: and I looked it up. the "Standoff" is collected as an Avengers trade. sweet.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Standoff was a great story with a great/tragic ending, Thor looking at a broken picture of Cap, Iron Man and himself back in the old days. It's kinda funny that Marvel ran with something for so long that was mostly conceived by Geoff Johns and Jurgens since they were long gone by the time Disassembled came around.

Jurgens run on Thor is one that's not really given as much props as I would like it to. He was on the book for about 5 years. It nearly rivals Simonson if you ask me. His Cap run on the other hand......it was pretty pale in comparison.

I think Jurgens' run isn't talked about in the same terms as Simonson's because there were a few ups and downs. It had some arcs that were kind of meh and others that were outright boring, but when Jurgens got it right, he was every bit as amazing as Simonson. There are some damn fine comics in that run.

 

[Anubis]

I'd say everything from death of Odin to the end was awesome.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

I agree. That part of Jurgens' run has three things that rival the death of the Executioner in terms of sheer badassitude: "Standoff," Thor rising from the rubble after that priest's nuke, and Thor's apology to Sif and goodbye to Magni after he's finally regained his senses. I damn near cried at that last one. Just a shame that Thor and Sif's romance is usually tepid at best in the present because Marvel never wants to let anyone outside of the Fantastic Four settle down.

 

[plushbug]

I'd say it is, actually. Outside of Fraction's first arc and Fear Itself, he hasn't done anything especially horrendous.

*sigh* It’s that first arc that kills it, for me…especially after re-reading a couple of times and realizing how completely he guts JMS’ rebooted Thor down to regressed mook and (lovin’ your own phrase for it) coarse, short-tempered asshat. A severe enough break from everything preceding that I’d qualify it as a timeline split (616-F, perhaps) and after following it 6 months in, in parallel with Fear Itself, euuch. 'Nuff already, for me.

On the other hand, I’ve really enjoyed Jurgens’ run through the trades. “Standoff” (Gods On Earth) was awesome, and OK, yes, ups and downs, but when he rocked, he rocked.

 

[Panthro]

I agree. That part of Jurgens' run has three things that rival the death of the Executioner in terms of sheer badassitude: "Standoff," Thor rising from the rubble after that priest's nuke, and Thor's apology to Sif and goodbye to Magni after he's finally regained his senses. I damn near cried at that last one. Just a shame that Thor and Sif's romance is usually tepid at best in the present because Marvel never wants to let anyone outside of the Fantastic Four settle down.

Comic book writers/publishers in general seem to have a vendetta against couples settling down. Hell, DC just undid the marriages of Clark Kent/Lois Lane and Barry Allen/Iris West and put an end to Green Arrow & Black Canary's marriage before that. No wonder Carol Ferris and Hal Jordan haven't tied the knot; on some level they must be aware that if they did get married some universe altering event would just undo it.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Also, Hal Jordan's a womanizing toolbox of the highest order.

 

[Panthro]

Also, Hal Jordan's a womanizing toolbox of the highest order.

So is Green Arrow, but apparently it's okay for him.

 

[Manic]

Just a note: Even if you're a part of the Fantastic Four, your marriage is doomed unless your name is Richards. Remember when Johnny and Alicia were married? And that was after the relationship between Ben and Alicia was ruined.

 

[Panthro]

Just a note: Even if you're a part of the Fantastic Four, your marriage is doomed unless your name is Richards. Remember when Johnny and Alicia were married? And that was after the relationship between Ben and Alicia was ruined.

The moral of the story - being a superhero ruins your love life.

 

[runawayboulder]

The moral of the story - being a superhero ruins your love life.

Being a superhero at Marvel ruins your life. They won't let anybody be happy. Look at Steve and Sharon, they're forever stuck in neutral. I don't see why they can't be married, it's not going to hurt anything.

 

[Panthro]

Being a superhero at Marvel ruins your life. They won't let anybody be happy. Look at Steve and Sharon, they're forever stuck in neutral. I don't see why they can't be married, it's not going to hurt anything.

Apparently it's more important that Steve always have the option of meeting whatever new love interest a future writer thinks of so we can have "exciting & dynamic new storytelling angles" even if they're really the same old angles done with a different character.

At DC they'll either wipe your marriage from existence, leave your girlfriend as an elemental force spirit thing or stuff your girlfriend in the fridge.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

At DC they'll either wipe your marriage from existence, leave your girlfriend as an elemental force spirit thing or stuff your girlfriend in the fridge.

Marvel does that one, too.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

The moral of the story - being a superhero ruins your love life.

It doesn't have to, though. That's the stupid part. It only ruins your love life if you're a *****e and try to keep it hidden all the time. Thor and Sif certainly don't have any secret identity malarky to contend with, plus they're married in the myths, plus Thor hasn't really been tied to anyone else other than Sif or the Enchantress in like 20 years anyway. They don't even have that s***ty-writer-favorite of the aging problem, given that they're both eternally youthful gods. I don't get why they don't just settle the two of 'em down and pop out a Magni and Modi or three.

 

[runawayboulder]

Thor would only be like, THE COOLEST DAD OF ALL TIME.

 

[Panthro]

Thor would only be like, THE COOLEST DAD OF ALL TIME.

As long as it's not in the "Next Avengers: Heroes of Tomorrow" universe.

 

[Anubis]

Yeah, he certainly wasn't father of the year material in that universe.

 

[TheCorpulent1]

Ugh, what did they do to him there?

 

[Panthro]

Ugh, what did they do to him there?

They gave him the "Superman Returns" treatment.

In the universe of "Next Avengers" all the assembled Avengers except Iron Man settled down & had kids, but then most of them get killed except for Iron Man and Thor, but that's mostly because Thor had become King of Asgard - and didn't lift a finger to help out his human buddies nor did he do anything to stop Ultron from conquering the world (yeah it's one of those "you have to pretend the Fantastic Four & X-Men wouldn't have lasted against the designated big bad" deals), so Iron Man spends years raising the kids in a secret base - James Rogers (son of Captain America & Black Widow), Azari (son of Black Panther & Storm/she who cannot be named for legal reasons), Henry Pym Jr. (son of Hank Sr. & Janet "The Wasp" Van Dyne - I guess Hank didn't have a nervous breakdown in this universe), and last but not least Torunn (or Torrun or Torrunn the spelling varies across the few media outlets that recognized the feature), daughter of Thor and Sif (actually there's Hawkeye's son but he grew up in the slums & ended up working for the rag tag human resistance). Later in the film Iron Man says Thor played the "Asgard is my responsibility" card as an excuse for not pitching in when the Avengers needed him. At the end of the film Torunn almost gets herself killed tossing Ultron into space, at which point Thor (sporting his beard from the 1980s) finally gets off his ass and saves her, tells her he's proud of her for facing certain death & "learning what it means to be human" and that she can come home to Asgard now; Torunn opts to stay on Earth with her foster family instead, but as a going away present Thor gives her an Asgardian costume to replace the Ultimates style costume she spends most of the film wearing.

So "Next Avengers" basically depicts Thor as both a cowardly false hero who doesn't really care about the people of Earth/Midgard, not even his closest friends in the hero community, and a negligent slacker deadbeat dad who knowingly left his daughter in a war-zone in and in the care of someone whom Thor knows for a fact has a history of substance abuse and womanizing because he was either too lazy or too stupid to teach Torunn the basics of being a good little Asgardian war goddess (Odin would totally himself if he knew). When you take all that into account it's easy to see why Torunn decides to stay with her foster siblings & old man Tony Stark; if Thor & Stark went to court to argue custody rights Stark would probably win - and he wouldn't even have to bribe anyone.

It doesn't have to, though. That's the stupid part. It only ruins your love life if you're a *****e and try to keep it hidden all the time. Thor and Sif certainly don't have any secret identity malarky to contend with, plus they're married in the myths, plus Thor hasn't really been tied to anyone else other than Sif or the Enchantress in like 20 years anyway. They don't even have that s***ty-writer-favorite of the aging problem, given that they're both eternally youthful gods. I don't get why they don't just settle the two of 'em down and pop out a Magni and Modi or three.

Yeah it's messed up. If Mera can join Aquaman on his adventures, why can't Sif join Thor?