The politically incorrect thread

[BlackLantern]

I know...but I think its important that young people learn how truly competitive the outside world can be...shielding them from that with language liked 'deferred success' can hurt them in the long run.....

 

[DBella]

Aww you know I was joking. It would be a loss to the forums if he was gone. I may not agree with him, but I don't have to. He makes some great debates out of certain subjects

You were joking? D'oh! *slaps forehead*

It's good to have posters who like to debate and not afraid to disagree with opinions of the majority and speak of the things he believes in.

Down to the crux. PC is important, but it's difficult to draw a line with it, hence some of the stupid examples on display in this thread.

'Freedom Fries'

I believe it was a politician who made that change. Just shows what brilliant people we have running this country.

Deferred success is another PC term that ticks me off....just tell the kid he failed and he's a ******...that should motivate him

Children needs to be protected but not to a point where we have to lie to them and tell them they're 'doing good' when they're not. Be in in academics or in sports. How are kids going to be motivated to do well when, even as they fail, the adults tell them that they are 'doing good'?

Also, I used to teach and at school, the kids are told that they is no such thing as self-defense, that if they are being harassed by bullies, they should not fight back, that they should tell an adult instead. I'm no violent person but I disagree with that. The only way to deal with bullies, imo, is to show them that you can't be picked on. *pow!*

 

[Eggyman]

Well, bear in mind that it could also have the opposite effect, crushing his spirit and making him think he's not good for anything. Remember the whole rhyme of "Sticks and stones will break my bones, but words will never hurt me?" It's nonsense. Words have power, and if used improperly they can hurt, anger, offend, opress, and even enslave. That's why it's so important to use wisdom...and yet at the same time, we should never let an unhealthy level of concern for people's feelings stop us from speaking the honest truth.

I agree with this completely. Too much PC awareness can paint you into an intellectual corner. People can be insulted, offended, or laughed at. It's a hard world where everyone gets a hard time at some point. We can try to make it less common; we can try to be more understanding; we can try to love without discrimination. We can try to do all of those things, but something will always slip through the net. So, hand in hand with political correctness, there should be understanding from the other side too that some times people put their foot in it, that sometimes there is no way round saying 'you are fat', or 'you are a raging homo'.

Bad examples, but my point is clear. I hope t:

 

[DBella]

Well, bear in mind that it could also have the opposite effect, crushing his spirit and making him think he's not good for anything. Remember the whole rhyme of "Sticks and stones will break my bones, but words will never hurt me?" It's nonsense. Words have power, and if used improperly they can hurt, anger, offend, opress, and even enslave. That's why it's so important to use wisdom...and yet at the same time, we should never let an unhealthy level of concern for people's feelings stop us from speaking the honest truth.

I agree that words hold a lot of power, it can either motivate and inspire or have a destructive effect.

When you mentioned "the honest truth", I assume you're speaking of words from the Bible? Do you have respect for those whose belief differ from yours and those who question the 'truth' of the Bible?

(O gosh, this is going to turn into another religious thread... maybe I should post this question in the "God/Religious" thread.)

 

[DBella]

I agree with this completely. Too much PC awareness can paint you into an intellectual corner. People can be insulted, offended, or laughed at. It's a hard world where everyone gets a hard time at some point. We can try to make it less common; we can try to be more understanding; we can try to love without discrimination. We can try to do all of those things, but something will always slip through the net. So, hand in hand with political correctness, there should be understanding from the other side too that some times people put their foot in it, that sometimes there is no way round saying 'you are fat', or 'you are a raging homo'.

Bad examples, but my point is clear. I hope t:

Sir, you are hereby issued an infraction for making insensitive and homophobic comments. Other than those two remarks, I think that you made a good point. Get in my office!

 

[Majic Walrus]

Well, bear in mind that it could also have the opposite effect, crushing his spirit and making him think he's not good for anything. Remember the whole rhyme of "Sticks and stones will break my bones, but words will never hurt me?" It's nonsense. Words have power, and if used improperly they can hurt, anger, offend, opress, and even enslave. That's why it's so important to use wisdom...and yet at the same time, we should never let an unhealthy level of concern for people's feelings stop us from speaking the honest truth.

And now for...

I don't think that was Whirly's intent at all (although he'd probably be the best source of reliable info on that). What I took from it is the following sentiment: since it's now technically legal for homosexual couples to adopt children, what's to stop the government from legalizing such things as pedophilia? While I don't agree with Whirly's view of "most political activists being pedophiles", I think the point being made is that if the government has already legalized the former, what's to prevent them from doing it again, when "politically correct" citizens remain silent?

Sticks and stones may break my bones, but comparing gays to pedophiles is okay.

 

[DBella]

And now for...

Sticks and stones may break my bones, but comparing gays to pedophiles is okay.

Good find.
I'd like to read moviefan's response to that. Is he really comparing homosexuality to pedophelia?

 

[Eggyman]

Sir, you are hereby issued an infraction for making insensitive and homophobic comments. Other than those two remarks, I think that you made a good point. Get in my office!

Infraction, going in Bella's office - fair trade

 

[Eggyman]

And now for...



Sticks and stones may break my bones, but comparing gays to pedophiles is okay.

Good find.
I'd like to read moviefan's response to that. Is he really comparing homosexuality to pedophelia?

You see, I know I read that, but I never picked up on it. Ignorance due to familiarity? I think so. I've heard him say things like that before in the Higher Power thread - never outright, but implied like in this case.

I'd like to see him clarify this.

 

[Majic Walrus]

Good find.
I'd like to read moviefan's response to that. Is he really comparing homosexuality to pedophelia?

Thanks. It sounds to me like he is. He's done it before on the Higher Power thread comparing homosexuality to murder.

You see, I know I read that, but I never picked up on it. Ignorance due to familiarity? I think so. I've heard him say things like that before in the Higher Power thread - never outright, but implied like in this case.

I'd like to see him clarify this.

So Moviefan, can we get a comment?

 

[DBella]

You see, I know I read that, but I never picked up on it. Ignorance due to familiarity? I think so. I've heard him say things like that before in the Higher Power thread - never outright, but implied like in this case.

I'd like to see him clarify this.

It's been a while since I visted the Higher Power thread. Theology discussions can be great if people are able to participate with an open mind. That's not usually the case in that thread. I see a lot of "I'm right and you're wrong" type of posts.

I thought the purpose of religion is for enlightenment. I've always thought that faith without question can be quite dangerous. I thought that faith means being able to look at those who are different than you with love and tolerance. I think a lot of things... my head hurts.

 

[DBella]

Thanks. It sounds to me like he is. He's done it before on the Higher Power thread comparing homosexuality to murder.

How is that?
I can see homosexuality as nature's way of 'population control', which isn't a bad thing. I see it also as a chance for some children without parents to have a chance of having a home where they can be loved and cared for.

Anyway, I think he said all those things because he believes them to be 'the honest truth', because that's what his faith tells him... and if it's the 'truth', it shouldn't offend anyone.
I could be waaaaaaaay wrong so it'd be nice to have him clarify.

So Moviefan, can we get a comment?

He's logged off for now, it seems.

 

[Eggyman]

It's been a while since I visted the Higher Power thread. Theology discussions can be great if people are able to participate with an open mind. That's not usually the case in that thread. I see a lot of "I'm right and you're wrong" type of posts.

An Agnostic thread would work

I thought the purpose of religion is for enlightenment. I've always thought that faith without question can be quite dangerous. I thought that faith means being able to look at those who are different than you with love and tolerance. I think a lot of things... my head hurts.

Indeed it is. Religion, politics - any organisation with a body of rules for you to follow - should never be followed blindly, by faith alone, without question. It is a lesson we should have learned from the Nazis, and from terrorists that do the bidding of monsters because they are told that it is 'the way', their 'destiny', their 'divine chance'.

Question your leaders! If they are worthy leaders, then they will be able to give satisfactory answers. Faith without thought is very dangerous.

 

[The Senator]

I don't think that was Whirly's intent at all (although he'd probably be the best source of reliable info on that). What I took from it is the following sentiment: since it's now technically legal for homosexual couples to adopt children, what's to stop the government from legalizing such things as pedophilia? While I don't agree with Whirly's view of "most political activists being pedophiles", I think the point being made is that if the government has already legalized the former, what's to prevent them from doing it again, when "politically correct" citizens remain silent?

I know you aren't reading this, but frankly I do not care.

Pedophilia and homosexuality are two different things. Homosexual relationships, the legal relationships you are trying to unjustly compare to child molestation, are relationships between two consenting adults. Child molestation is a vile act which occurs when an adult rapes a child. The adult FORCES the child to take his/ her sexual advances.

No one is going to make RAPE legal, you're just parsing with this bull **** philosophy of yours.

 

[The Senator]

What next, Moviefan? Are you going to compare homosexuality to bestiality?

Are you going to suggest we go back to enslaving people, because the Bible says we should?

 

[Majic Walrus]

How is that?
I can see homosexuality as nature's way of 'population control', which isn't a bad thing. I see it also as a chance for some children without parents to have a chance of having a home where they can be loved and cared for.

Anyway, I think he said all those things because he believes them to be 'the honest truth', because that's what his faith tells him... and if it's the 'truth', it shouldn't offend anyone.
I could be waaaaaaaay wrong so it'd be nice to have him clarify.

He's logged off for now, it seems.

One of my childhood best friends was adopted my a straight couple, but I can only imagine the hell he would have had to live through if they hadn't adopted him. I can't think of absolutely no reason that a child should have to suffer in foster care when loving gay couples want to raise children.

I think that Moviefan probably has a mentor like figure in his life that seems charismatic and has lots of good ideas and makes lots of pretty sounding arguments. When Moviefan buys into that he can't opt out for fear of looking stupid so any counter argument must be the devil's work.

I also think that Moviefan may have identity issues that he copes with by using religious arguments to justify he's negative feelings towards himself. Of course a few chats on a forum is hardly a good way to make such a diagnosis... But if it looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, and flies like a duck it's probably a damned duck.

 

[Moviefan2k4]

When you mentioned "the honest truth", I assume you're speaking of words from the Bible? Do you have respect for those whose belief differ from yours and those who question the 'truth' of the Bible?

Of course I do; God fully intends for people to analyze and research Scripture. However, I also realize that while some may be looking to the Bible for answers about God, others are looking for reasons to discredit Him with it.

I'd like to read moviefan's response to that. Is he really comparing homosexuality to pedophelia?

Not in the details, no; what I said was since the U.S. government has made homosexual adoption legal in some states, what's to stop them from doing the same with pedophilia, unless concerned citizens take a stand against it? I was stressing the point that not all "change" or "social progress" is inherently good, and some of it can be quite destructive.

I thought the purpose of religion is for enlightenment.

I define religion as being built on a system of "do's" and "dont's", without any moral or spiritual context whatsoever. Christianity isn't like that. Take the "golden rule", for example. Many people believe that this teaching is universal across the board, but they're wrong. All other faiths teach things like, "If you don't want people to steal from or decieve you, then don't steal from or decieve them." That's not the "golden rule" - that's basic survival. By contrast, the Bible says, "Think of what you would want someone to do for you, then take the initiative and do it for them." Notice the difference? One is positive, the other negative.

I've always thought that faith without question can be quite dangerous.

It can be, which is why Jesus explicitly commanded His disciples to question the things they heard. Not everything that sounds "religious" or "spiritual" actually is, and we need wisdom to discern one from the other.

I thought that faith means being able to look at those who are different than you with love and tolerance.

Love, absolutely. Tolerance, however, is where it gets tricky. The modern view of "tolerance" isn't that at all, but rather a twisted distortion which says, in effect, "People have the right to say or do whatever they want, without any kind of questioning, debate, or opposition." That kind of thinking leads to a worldview where the only thing not tolerated is intolerance...and it's extremely dangerous. A "world without rules" may sound enticing, but in truth the absence of all boundaries would lead to us destroying ourselves. We'd have no "dividing rod" to distinguish good from evil, because we'd be controlled by our own selfish, ever-changing opinions.

...and if it's the 'truth', it shouldn't offend anyone.

On the contrary; Scripture says multiple times that God's truth often causes division and separation, because some people just don't want to believe Him. that is their choice, but their lack of belief doesn't nullify the truth which God has set in place.

I know this principle has been used a lot, but think of gravity or the wind. We can't physically see either of them, yet we know they exist by the effects which they produce. God is the same way; we can't see Him with our mortal eyes, but we can see the effects He has on the lives of those who seek, love, and place their faith in Him. Consider the following for a moment...

"But the basic reality of God is plain enough. Open your eyes and there it is! By taking a long and thoughtful look at what God has created, people have always been able to see what their eyes as such can't see: eternal power, for instance, and the mystery of his divine being. So nobody has a good excuse." ~Romans 1:19-20 (The Message)~

 

[The Senator]

NO ONE is advocating the legalization of pedophilia, except for those oh-so-wonderful citizens who are pedophiles themselves. No sane, rational adult will EVER support legalizing pedophilia, because pedophilia is essentially RAPE.

There is a HUGE difference between pedophilia and homosexuality. Homosexual relationships are legal because two consenting adults are involved; pedophilia is illegal because that situation involves an adult FORCING sex on children.

How can you be so ignorant?

 

[Moviefan2k4]

NO ONE is advocating the legalization of pedophilia, except for those oh-so-wonderful citizens who are pedophiles themselves. No sane, rational adult will EVER support legalizing pedophilia, because pedophilia is essentially RAPE.

Thankfully, it's true that the U.S. government has not currently made pedophilia legal. But if they chose to do so at some point (or anything equally despicable), how would they be stopped? How many freedom-loving U.S. citizens refuse to combat corrupt politics because they're terrified of what others will think? That's the point I've been trying to make...and as the saying goes, "all it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." Sadly, modern-day America seems to be leaning in that direction, and if the people don't stand and fight it, it will only get worse.

 

[Majic Walrus]

Thankfully, it's true that the U.S. government has not currently made pedophilia legal. But if they chose to do so at some point (or anything equally despicable), how would they be stopped? How many freedom-loving U.S. citizens refuse to combat corrupt politics because they're terrified of what others will think? That's the point I've been trying to make...and as the saying goes, "all it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." Sadly, modern-day America seems to be leaning in that direction, and if the people don't stand and fight it, it will only get worse.

Are you kidding? That's like thinking that America is going to legalize rape and murder based on the fact that they're not bringing back segregation or the fact that prostitution is legal in some places.

No one is afraid of offending pedophiles because we all pretty much agree that they're bastards. We don't feel the same way about homosexuals because they are not evil.

 

[Majic Walrus]

O
Not in the details, no; what I said was since the U.S. government has made homosexual adoption legal in some states, what's to stop them from doing the same with pedophilia, unless concerned citizens take a stand against it? I was stressing the point that not all "change" or "social progress" is inherently good, and some of it can be quite destructive...

Where has the legalization of pedophilia ever been referred to by a respectable politician as change or social progress? Seriously don't compare these two very unrelated things.

...Love, absolutely. Tolerance, however, is where it gets tricky. The modern view of "tolerance" isn't that at all, but rather a twisted distortion which says, in effect, "People have the right to say or do whatever they want, without any kind of questioning, debate, or opposition." That kind of thinking leads to a worldview where the only thing not tolerated is intolerance...and it's extremely dangerous. A "world without rules" may sound enticing, but in truth the absence of all boundaries would lead to us destroying ourselves. We'd have no "dividing rod" to distinguish good from evil, because we'd be controlled by our own selfish, ever-changing opinions...

Actually I think you're thinking of diversity being preached instead of tolerance. See tolerance is "sympathy or indulgence for beliefs or practices differing from or conflicting with one's own or the act of allowing something(merriam-webster online dictionary)"

Would it be so bad to allow someone else to do something that you don't like or even approve of? What would happen if people were allowed to do as they please. Not a world without rules, but a world where the rules aren't decided by any god or religion (like in the US!)

...I know this principle has been used a lot, but think of gravity or the wind. We can't physically see either of them, yet we know they exist by the effects which they produce. God is the same way; we can't see Him with our mortal eyes, but we can see the effects He has on the lives of those who seek, love, and place their faith in Him. Consider the following for a moment.


"But the basic reality of God is plain enough. Open your eyes and there it is! By taking a long and thoughtful look at what God has created, people have always been able to see what their eyes as such can't see: eternal power, for instance, and the mystery of his divine being. So nobody has a good excuse." ~Romans 1:19-20 (The Message)~

Exactly. No one has a good excuse not to be a Christian can't you all see his mystery? Can't you all solve it? What? No? You can't solve the mystery of his divine being. But there it is... Oh what? It's absolutely unfathomable by the human mind? Well that's convenient.

Physical effects are different from emotional effects. For instance, if the presence of God in a room caused the room to grow and eerie gold light and the voice of angels could be heard that is something, but a feeling that someone gets is no more valid to another person than it is to anyone else.

__________________
God loves you just the way you are, but too much to leave you that way.

Well I suppose you're right. God loves me so much he wants to make think and act differently to fit into his apparently rather narrow world view.

 

[The Senator]

Thankfully, it's true that the U.S. government has not currently made pedophilia legal. But if they chose to do so at some point (or anything equally despicable), how would they be stopped? How many freedom-loving U.S. citizens refuse to combat corrupt politics because they're terrified of what others will think? That's the point I've been trying to make...and as the saying goes, "all it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." Sadly, modern-day America seems to be leaning in that direction, and if the people don't stand and fight it, it will only get worse.

NO politician will ever vote to legalize pedophilia because their citizens will vote them out of office faster than you can blink. Either that, or a kid who was raped as a child will walk into their office with a handgun and fire a few rounds into them to get his point across.

If there is ANYTHING society cares most about, it is protecting the innocence of childhood. It will NEVER evolve so far as to legalize rape.

 

[Marx]

This thread continues to boggle my mind.

 

[Moviefan2k4]

If there is ANYTHING society cares most about, it is protecting the innocence of childhood.

Then why is the justice system now allowed to place innocent children in an environment where homosexuality is the norm?

 

[knowsbleed]

I can't believe that you still believe that homosexuality is a choice.

People can CHOOSE to vote for Obama or McCain... not what sexual preference they have to live with.