The Dark Knight Rises The TDKR General Discussion Thread - Part 133

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This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]389323[/split]

 

[Thread Manager]

This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]389191[/split]

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

But honestly, what does Blake being in the Batcave accomplish to this story, to this trilogy? NOTHING in my opinion. Thats why I feel WB had a say in the ending.

I almost wish WB had some say in that... if only so Nolan (in my mind) knew that wouldn't be a truly fitting last shot.

But no... WB are rebooting regardless, so it was probably all Nolan.

 

[ImAlwaysAngry]

Did you guys love or hate Bane's line "That's a lovely singing voice."?

I loved it. I thought it was funny in a great way and added to Bane's character a little. But some people were audibly mocking it in my showing.

The words "What a *****" were uttered. It was odd.

 

[Batman137]

I almost wish WB had some say in that... if only so Nolan (in my mind) knew that wouldn't be a truly fitting last shot.

But no... WB are rebooting regardless, so it was probably all Nolan.

In about 4-5 years when I know for a fact they are not going to make some spinoff with JGL, I will appreciate that shot more.

 

[joker1524]

Honestly...ive gone to two showings n my crowds were quiet and underwhelming as ****....we applaused at the end but i hope the crowd tonight is better

 

[ChrisB]

Did you guys love or hate Bane's line "That's a lovely singing voice."?

I loved it. I thought it was funny in a great way and added to Bane's character a little. But some people were audibly mocking it in my showing.

The words "What a *****" were uttered. It was odd.

I didn't like it. It just seemed out of place. I also didn't like when he said "Thank you" at the stock exchange when he grabbed his helmet.

 

[Mr.?]

I feel the Batman/Catwoman relationship in this was better written and thought out then it was in Returns (One of my favorite Bat movies). Never really made sense to me in Returns how Bruce is trying to hook up with an obviously mentally unstable woman, also that he couldnt figure out she was Catwoman till the third act.

It seems alot of people wanted a depressing, downer ending to which I say that already happened in the last one. Im glad they ended it on a happy note, Bruce deserves to be happy.

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

In about 4-5 years when I know for a fact they are not going to make some spinoff with JGL, I will appreciate that shot more.

Dear Lord... leave JGL were he is please.

No spin-offs. No JGL as a spiritual successor to Christian Bale for a more fantastical series and Justice League movie.

 

[Art Damage]

Did you guys love or hate Bane's line "That's a lovely singing voice."?

I loved it. I thought it was funny in a great way and added to Bane's character a little. But some people were audibly mocking it in my showing.

The words "What a *****" were uttered. It was odd.

I LOVED it! It was creepy and sinister...

 

[HighFivingMF]

I LOVED it! It was creepy and sinister...

I remember Chris's mention of cheesy elements returning and Bane having a couple. I expected him to sing along, but the voice line was great. t:

 

[ImAlwaysAngry]

I didn't like it. It just seemed out of place. I also didn't like when he said "Thank you" at the stock exchange when he grabbed his helmet.

That kind of thing is great to me. I don't know why. I feel like it rounds out the character, instead of him being one note.

Now- "Let the games begin"- Really? Ugh.

 

[georgec]

Reposting this:

I loved it as a standalone, a follow up to TDK, and a conclusion to a trilogy.

Here's the core issue:

TDK was a great sequel to BB. Bigger, better, deeper...it was the Empire to Star Wars. I think some of the disappointment we're seeing comes from expecting TDKR to be the same leap from TDK as TDK was from BB. That was just not possible. So it sets up people for disappointment and the flaws of the film attract more attention.

To me, TDK has similar flaws as TDKR. I love TDK as much as anyone, but that movie also has some pacing issues, cheesy lines, plot contrivances, etc. The difference is that because TDK was such a revelation to watch, that overshadowed its shortcomings.

The bar for TDKR was set so high by both TDK's success and by the anticipation that it was bound to not be as well received by some fans. To me, the manner in which some people are excessively criticizing TDKR is a product more of their need to rationalize their disappointment. Not saying the criticisms are invalid, but the more they talk about their dislike of elements of the film, the more comfortable they feel in being disappointed.

I saw the divisiveness coming, but I didn't imagine that there would be as many negative responses. We all had expectations or ideas for how the movie should wrap up the story, what role each character would play, etc. Some are more open minded than others in this regard. I can't speak for everyone, but with TDK you pretty much knew what you were getting. There were great little details and surprises, but ultimately Dent would become Two-Face. We were all mostly excited to see the new Joker

Everyone has the right to feel however they do about the movie. I wouldn't take that from anyone. But I remember people making similar criticisms about TDK and being silenced by the majority who were simply swept off their feet by the majestic scale and scope of that film. I personally found TDKR to be equally grand and entertaining.

 

[Mr.?]

Dear Lord... leave JGL were he is please.

No spin-offs. No JGL as a spiritual successor to Christian Bale for a more fantastical series and Justice League movie.

I agree it ends perfectly, no need for a Blake as Batman movie.

 

[ImAlwaysAngry]

Reposting this:

Why? Haha.

 

[darklord1967]

The problem is that people get it in their heads that it's meant to be able to take place in a real world. It's not. It's heightened realism, yes, but there's still meant to be a suspension of disbelief, and the 'realism' aspect has been blown far out of proportion by critics and fans. For instance, you're not supposed to believe that a man would actually dress up in a black armoured costume adorned with bat silhouettes and wearing a mask that has an angry face and bat-ears on top, let alone that he would cause the city millions of dollars worth of damage and be embraced by the police. However, it does give reasoning why someone would do that. It's only when you view it through the lens of 'this must be able to happen in exactly the same way as real life' that it starts to fall apart. Same for many great films.

And if you missed all the fun in the film, you were probably too focused on the fact that a man probably couldn't [BLACKOUT]effortlessly deadlift a 6 foot man in heavy armour into an overhead press.[/BLACKOUT]

Well... you're probably correct. So I say why not just simplify things to avoid that problem all together??

Why not just make a Batman film that is true to the comics world of Gotham City and true to the exaggerated nature of these characters within that world? The result would be gothic, dark, gritty, AND fun... AND the audience would be FAR more inclined to suspend disbelief as you say.

For YEARS, I have been championing the need for a LESS "hyper-realistic" Batman in the movies, and pushed for one that while still dark and gritty, nevertheless embraces the exaggerated world of the comics.

Whenever I said that The movie Batman should have had blank eye lenses in the cowl (like in the comics) I was told "It's not "realistic". "It doesn't translate well in live action film". I countered that it would make the character more frightening... more imposing (in an "Alien" sort of way). Since the eyes are the mirrors to the soul, having this guy with blank eyes makes him seem like a creature ... in-human, emotionless, dark, and un-relenting... completely un-stoppable. "Nope", they said. "Not realistic!".

Then Nolan adds glowing night vision lenses to The Batman's cowl in "The Dark Knight", and it was arguably one of the coolest-looking on screen moments for the character. And EVERYONE suddenly thought so... even the guys that told me it would be "un-realistic"

For YEARS... dating back to even Burton's Batman films... I said the character did not need a butt-ugly armored Bat-suit to fight criminals. I was told that "The armor is a "realistic" take on Batman, and in the "real" world, he would not last one night out in the street against armed thugs unless he had some kind of armor."

Nevermind that he trained FOR YEARS in all of the different martial arts, stealth, ninja, and shadow techniques to make him a supreme fighter.

Nevermind that LOGICALLY-speaking, armor would just slow him down, hinder his natural movements, speed, and agility, and virtually nullify all of the martial arts training that Wayne supposedly underwent.

So now in this latest film we see Catwoman (if that's what she can even be called) fighting multiple dudes ... armed with handguns ... and she never gets a scratch... even though she doesn't wear any friggin' armor!!

There is no consistency in LOGIC even within Nolan's own universe, and a LOT of that is due to his complete ignorance of (and disregard of) the comic book universe where things are simpler and (for the most part) consistently laid out.

But when you make a film where you mix elements of a comic book within our "realistic" world, the result is going to be un-even and contradictory.

 

[Art Damage]

Reposting this:

I loved it as a standalone, a follow up to TDK, and a conclusion to a trilogy.

Here's the core issue:

TDK was a great sequel to BB. Bigger, better, deeper...it was the Empire to Star Wars. I think some of the disappointment we're seeing comes from expecting TDKR to be the same leap from TDK as TDK was from BB. That was just not possible. So it sets up people for disappointment and the flaws of the film attract more attention.

To me, TDK has similar flaws as TDKR. I love TDK as much as anyone, but that movie also has some pacing issues, cheesy lines, plot contrivances, etc. The difference is that because TDK was such a revelation to watch, that overshadowed its shortcomings.

The bar for TDKR was set so high by both TDK's success and by the anticipation that it was bound to not be as well received by some fans. To me, the manner in which some people are excessively criticizing TDKR is a product more of their need to rationalize their disappointment. Not saying the criticisms are invalid, but the more they talk about their dislike of elements of the film, the more comfortable they feel in being disappointed.

I saw the divisiveness coming, but I didn't imagine that there would be as many negative responses. We all had expectations or ideas for how the movie should wrap up the story, what role each character would play, etc. Some are more open minded than others in this regard. I can't speak for everyone, but with TDK you pretty much knew what you were getting. There were great little details and surprises, but ultimately Dent would become Two-Face. We were all mostly excited to see the new Joker

Everyone has the right to feel however they do about the movie. I wouldn't take that from anyone. But I remember people making similar criticisms about TDK and being silenced by the majority who were simply swept off their feet by the majestic scale and scope of that film. I personally found TDKR to be equally grand and entertaining.

Great assessment!

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

A moment I really loved was when...

[BLACKOUT]Batman said to Bane: ''Then you have my permission to die!''[/BLACKOUT]

I can't remember what he said before that line but I thoght it was awesome.

 

[ImAlwaysAngry]

A moment I really loved was when...

[BLACKOUT]Batman said to Bane: ''Then you have my permission to die!''[/BLACKOUT]

I can't remember what he said before that line but I thoght it was awesome.

I believe he said "Garblebharrgrfrassintrigger!"*


*i actually like the Batvoice.

 

[Mr.?]

A moment I really loved was when...

[BLACKOUT]Batman said to Bane: ''Then you have my permission to die!''[/BLACKOUT]

I can't remember what he said before that line but I thoght it was awesome.

I believe it was

Spoiler

Tell me where the detonator is, then you have my permission to die!

And that line gave me goosebumps.

 

[darklord1967]

I feel the Batman/Catwoman relationship in this was better written and thought out then it was in Returns (One of my favorite Bat movies). Never really made sense to me in Returns how Bruce is trying to hook up with an obviously mentally unstable woman, also that he couldnt figure out she was Catwoman till the third act.

It seems alot of people wanted a depressing, downer ending to which I say that already happened in the last one. Im glad they ended it on a happy note, Bruce deserves to be happy.

Does it make more sense that The Batman keeps trusting a woman who betrayed him as badly as Catwoman did in this film?

I certainly did not want a "depressing downer of an ending" but an ending that was NOT ridiculously contrived, and offensive in it's lack of logic and reason ability would have been nice. I won't mention the end of the movie plot point I'm talking about except to say there is NO WAY IN HELL the Batman's bull-crap armor could have saved him from that!!!

 

[Johnny Drama]

Does it make more sense that The Batman keeps trusting a woman who betrayed him as badly as Catwoman did in this film?

I certainly did not want a "depressing downer of an ending" but an ending that was NOT ridiculously contrived, and offensive in it's lack of logic and reason ability would have been nice. I won't mention the end of the movie plot point I'm talking about except to say there is NO WAY IN HELL the Batman's bull-crap armor could have saved him from that!!!

Spoiler

Or maybe the Bat was built like a mobile bomb shelter, in which case it's completely feasable

 

[Pfeiffer-Pfan]

I believe it was

Spoiler

Tell me where the detonator is, then you have my permission to die!

And that line gave me goosebumps.

Thats it... I got chills.

Another thing is, did anyone notice Christian Bale's facial reactions in the movie... his mouth and chin were working over time in that mask.

When Bane was walking up to him he was all, ''ARRRGGHHAHHHH!!''. He did a good job of emoting under the cowl in this one.

 

[ImAlwaysAngry]

Spoiler

Or maybe the Bat was built like a mobile bomb shelter, in which case it's completely feasable

Ooh. Or magic.

He was in the damn thing with five seconds to go.

Maybe there was a fridge to crawl into in the Bat.

 

[Scarecrow_King]

Does it make more sense that The Batman keeps trusting a woman who betrayed him as badly as Catwoman did in this film?

I'm not quite sure she ever actually betrayed him, though. [BLACKOUT]I mean, when she brought him to Bane? He asked her to take him to Bane. It's kinda his own fault he wasn't ready for what was waiting for him.[/BLACKOUT]