The Walking Dead - Part 1

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This is a continuation thread, the old thread is [split]160869[/split]

 

[Edd Extraordinaire]

This comic kicks so much ass. Anyone else read?

 

[Rocketman]

Having just read #100 I can finally put this series to bed. Kirkman has officially shown he's from the same lazy writing school of thought as GRR Martin (Game of Thrones). There's a concept known as The Law of Instrument. It is an over-reliance on a familiar tool and is quoted as such; "I suppose it is tempting, if the only tool you have is a hammer, to treat everything as if it were a nail." - Abraham Maslow

That's Kirkman and Martin.

Writers who can't write rely on crutches to create tension, and some know how to play off of those crutches to accomplish the same while truly raising the craft. Kirkland is the former. He's done it enough in this series for me to tell he'll do it over and over. Glenn didn't need to die to build up Negan. Kirkman just doesn't know how to write. Period.

I rode the GRR Martin train too long before I realized what kind of writer he was. Kirkman wants to go 300 issues - I'm not following this ride for 200 more just to feel as pissed as I did at GoT.

About two years ago I would've laughed at you and said you were nuts... but now I'm starting to see it for myself.

Issues #100-108 have been pretty much atrocious, and I've followed the series since around 2005. #100 I could forgive because it had insane buildup... but the story is just going nowhere. It's been going nowhere - truthfully - since #48, when the prison war ended. Everything else has been the "aftermath" of that.

Negan in particular just does not work for me. A lazily written character with impossibly over-the-top language, he's almost annoying and irritating as opposed to scary or threatening. I'll be happy when he's dead because he won't have atrocious dialogue anymore. I just don't care about anything he does. There's zero suspense.

Now with Jesus, Ezekiel, and everyone else... it's just "Bleh" for me. And I don't know if it's Kirkman truly being a terrible writer, or if he's just too preoccupied with the TV show (he's producing and writing episodes for the show too). And sadly, the show is kind of going downhill too.

I don't know. There definitely seems to be a decline in the comic and the show, which is hilarious, because both are more popular than ever and are dominating the mainstream.

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

Let's not compare TWD comic to the TWD TV show just yet. The weakest issue of TWD is still far superior to the strongest episode of the TV show. But yeah, I do think the comic, while still a fun read, has never regained the greatness it held after the prison siege ended. For the comic to go out on top it probably should have ended there. To be fair, there was no way to top that. I was really bummed about Glenn dying, but it made me feel something and that means it was doing its job. It was visceral, shocking and nauseating, but I don't think it was lazy. By that token, one could argue that Lori and Judith didn't need to die either. You could apply that logic to any character in TWD that's been cut down viciously. What disappoints me more about TWD are the cop-outs (like the recent one where Negan says "wait until you see what I did to your son..." NEXT ISSUE: "Tada... Nothing!"), the new cast (I hate Jesus for his seeming perfection and absence of character flaws... what a boring character... and Ezekiel and his dumb tiger seems like a total dart-on-the-wall Macguffin.... where are the new Abrahams, Tyreeses, Axels and Glenns?) and the long stretches of absolutely nothing happening that moves the story forward (from about issue 70 to 95 or so with all the boring Alexendria Safe-Zone stuff). It seemed to be getting back some of a footing with Negan, but even that seems like it's meandering now with the aforementioned Ezekial stuff and the Carl stuff that ended up absolutely going nowhere. I still enjoy it. Even when it goes nowhere or annoys me, I still can find pleasure in it. More than I can say for the show (what they did to Andrea is reason for its cancellation alone).

Can't comment on GoT. Only watch the TV show, which I love, so I'll leave that one alone.

 

[Sawyer]

Let's not compare TWD comic to the TWD TV show just yet. The weakest issue of TWD is still far superior to the strongest episode of the TV show. But yeah, I do think the comic, while still a fun read, has never regained the greatness it held after the prison siege ended. For the comic to go out on top it probably should have ended there. To be fair, there was no way to top that. I was really bummed about Glenn dying, but it made me feel something and that means it was doing its job. It was visceral, shocking and nauseating, but I don't think it was lazy. By that token, one could argue that Lori and Judith didn't need to die either. You could apply that logic to any character in TWD that's been cut down viciously. What disappoints me more about TWD are the cop-outs (like the recent one where Negan says "wait until you see what I did to your son..." NEXT ISSUE: "Tada... Nothing!"), the new cast (I hate Jesus for his seeming perfection and absence of character flaws... what a boring character... and Ezekiel and his dumb tiger seems like a total dart-on-the-wall Macguffin.... where are the new Abrahams, Tyreeses, Axels and Glenns?) and the long stretches of absolutely nothing happening that moves the story forward (from about issue 70 to 95 or so with all the boring Alexendria Safe-Zone stuff). It seemed to be getting back some of a footing with Negan, but even that seems like it's meandering now with the aforementioned Ezekial stuff and the Carl stuff that ended up absolutely going nowhere. I still enjoy it. Even when it goes nowhere or annoys me, I still can find pleasure in it. More than I can say for the show (what they did to Andrea is reason for its cancellation alone).

Can't comment on GoT. Only watch the TV show, which I love, so I'll leave that one alone.

No. Just... no.

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

No. Just... no.

t:

 

[Brimdol]

This comic kicks so much ass. Anyone else read?

No I dont think anyone does :-P

I love this comic. It is my favourite comic at the moment.

 

[Sawyer]

At SDCC, Kirkman said there's a 12-issue storyline coming up titled "All Out War" to celebrated the 10th anniversary of the comic.

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

I can't believe no one is talking about issue#113. Wow, talk about intense. I don't have a good feeling about Andrea. (man, how can I love a character so much in a comic and hate her so much on the TV show...)

 

[NosfeRomas]

Talking about overrated Comic Books and overrated writers.


I really don't like TWD. I got really stressed with Kirkman when he expressed his really sick ideas on little kids and psychos but i gave it another shot. Recently the book is unreadable, no, not unreadable, it sucks ass and i couldn't believe that i would like the show more than the book.

I recently reread most of the trades and just what the ****. The only really, truly flawless and amazing issues were the first 6. ok the first 12 because im nice. After that Krirkman showed what a psycho he really is and what a bad writer. Sure it was good enough to make buying trades and after a while getting it monthly but that's because i was hyped and pre-excited because of the show and of the zombies i am a big fan of as a genre. People will probably flame me for this put please just read it again its mediocre to say the least and Kirkman i real ass.

 

[HighFivingMF]

Why the monkey butt did you keep reading them THEN reread them then?

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

Talking about overrated Comic Books and overrated writers.


I really don't like TWD. I got really stressed with Kirkman when he expressed his really sick ideas on little kids and psychos but i gave it another shot. Recently the book is unreadable, no, not unreadable, it sucks ass and i couldn't believe that i would like the show more than the book.

I recently reread most of the trades and just what the ****. The only really, truly flawless and amazing issues were the first 6. ok the first 12 because im nice. After that Krirkman showed what a psycho he really is and what a bad writer. Sure it was good enough to make buying trades and after a while getting it monthly but that's because i was hyped and pre-excited because of the show and of the zombies i am a big fan of as a genre. People will probably flame me for this put please just read it again its mediocre to say the least and Kirkman i real ass.

The first 48 issues (ending with the Governor's army sieging the prison) are especially awesome. You're insane and I'm not going to waste too much time with someone who has such awful opinions. Since you repeat what a "psycho" Kirkman is for his "sick ideas", I will say it seems most of your opinions are informed by being overly prudish about Carl and the other violence and not the actual storytelling structure, content, characters, dialogue, etc. Don't you have an important PTA meeting to attend or something?

And the show (sorry, Sawyer) will always pale in comparison to the comic.

 

[Sawyer]

It doesn't, but.

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

It doesn't, but.

Two words that can shut down anyone trying to defend the show as better than the comic:

TV Andrea.

 

[Sawyer]

That's an aspect that I'll agree, yes, they totally botched, but there's been just as many aspects that, IMO, they've done better. Andrea was balls, but I'll take TV Rick over Comics Rick any day.

Plus, ****ing Derle and Merle.

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

That's an aspect that I'll agree, yes, they totally botched, but there's been just as many aspects that, IMO, they've done better. Andrea was balls, but I'll take TV Rick over Comics Rick any day.

You mean the guy who forgets to save friends because he hallucinates that his other dead friend is alive? meh

Sorry but in almost all cases the comic counterpart is better than the TV counterpart (even when the TV version is okay): Comic Lori was better than TV Lori. Comic Dale was cooler than TV Dale. Comic Michionne was more badass than TV Michionne. Comic Governor was more twisted than TV Governor. Comic Carol was more interesting than TV Carol. Comic Carl is less annoying than TV Carl. And so on. And don't get me started on ridiculous additions like T-Dog.

The only TV versions that I thought were better was Shane and Herschel.

Plus, ****ing Derle and Merle.

Yeah, they're good characters, but they don't make up for all the other characters that are mediocre.

 

[Sawyer]

Comic Carol was more interesting than TV Carol.

Aaaaaaaand you're done.

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

Aaaaaaaand you're done.

C'mon.... proposing a three-way with Lori and Rick? Seducing 18 year old Billy Herschel for some steamy prison sex? And she went out like a boss. Definitely one of the best deaths in the comic. You can keep your old lady Carol who is always crying about her dead daughter, I'll take the hot, mentally unbalanced prison cougar.

 

[Lord]

How has the comic been latelly? I remember being hooked but only read till volume 5. Is the comic getting repetitive or is it still going strong?

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

I'm not digging it lately. The back-and-forth with Negan got old quickly. He's no Governor imo. And the new characters like goofy King's English speaking Elijah with his tiger, and the way-too-perfect Jesus, are just not as interesting or realistic as old characters like Tyreese and Axel. It's still worth reading, but not something I anticipate every month like I used to.

Plus, the cycle of 1) Rick takes on leadership-role, 2) Rick's arrogant or foolhardy actions leads to catastrophe, 3) Rick is shattered and loses confidence, 4) Rick regains confidence and reasserts his leadership, 5) Rinse and repeat, is starting to get old.

 

[Nightwing]

It is slow and trying to cash in on the governor which IMO was good in the comics and the first book was very clever but its old now...hes dead and they need to look at a new aspect for the comic....

Im liking the way theyre moulding Carl in the comic...the tv show version sucks in comparison...

I think the virus plot of the new season was an interesting one to go down and couldve been played well in the comic I just think the way they handled the best comic characters in the tv show is stupid.

Hershal as he is in the comic and game were alot more realistic than a super vet who can cure everyone of everything

Dale shouldnt have been killed off how he was in the show....he shouldve lived to go out in style like in the comic

Tyreese??? What is his tv show version all about? He's all yes sir no sir I darednt stand up to anyone...and isnt close to being as tough as the comic version....

I just think whilst yes they want to create something slightly different to the comic they have to realise a lot of people who watch the show wont have read the comic and they couldve kept things pretty much as is and it wouldve been a much bigger hit...the comic is fantastic and the show pales considerably in comparison....

I have to agree with JJJ's previous posts about the characters he mentioned and how they have been played out...

 

[HighFivingMF]

The TV Carl is pretty much at the same point comic Carl was before the prison stuff. He didn't become THAT Carl until post-prison when he lost his baby sister and had to protect Rick by himself.

And Hershel hasn't magically cured anything. He's kept people from choking on their blood and found some tea to calm their symptoms, but they're still sick.

Dale died because the actor wanted out, not much they could do.

Tyreese was introduced way later than normal and has some development to go through, like Carl, his picture isn't complete yet.

Not sure it would be a much bigger hit if they stuck to the comic, the show is as big a hit as a show on cable could possibly be, the only thing that would make it bigger is to somehow work in football games.

 

[Lord]

If they stuck more to the comics the ratings may have had better ratings, but i wouldn't bet on it being that much more, possibly 1 million or less than that. I have only read up to volume 5, and the comic has mostly been better, expecially when it comes to the characters, i remember that in the comics the 3 main characters i rooted for the most were Rick, Andrea and Glenn. In the show it's Rick, Glenn and Daryl (one of the few great things in the show), while Andrea's character was completelly butchered.

The plot was also mostly better, i liked the "bump in the road" events, like when the group stayed in an habitation that was full of zombies, but didn't realise it at first due to the snow, right before the reached the farm

 

[Nightwing]

The plot was also mostly better, i liked the "bump in the road" events, like when the group stayed in an habitation that was full of zombies, but didn't realise it at first due to the snow, right before the reached the farm

I liked that too...they need more of this in the show...although I liked the virus route theyve taken with it in the show...clever....and realistic

 

[JJJ's Ulcer]

Does anyone still read this? Have to say, was not a fan of the conclusion of 'All Out War.' I realize Kirkman was going for something a bit different, but after two years of build-up and Negan friggin' bashing Glenn's head in with a baseball bat, I found this to be very unsatisfying and a bit of a cop-out. After 125 issues, I'm kinda iffy on whether I'll stick around to see what comes next. The Negan saga was no Governor saga. Ah well.