The Worst President in History?

[Admiral_N8]

It's also YOUR opinion that Bush's policies aren't ****.

Yes I know.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

My mom is a teacher with over 20 years of experience on the job and she says that education is taking a big hit in Bush America and I tend to believe her on all matters pertaining to education.

As I say it very well may be underfunded (in some areas at least). Bush in fact made the policy with Ted Kennedy (D-MA) whose state is prided for their great education systems, however on a federal level this policy quiet possibly was poorly funded and executed...looks great on paper though

 

[KingOfDreams]

Oh sure, it looks good on paper. Hell, communism kind of looks good on paper.

 

[LarryLegend]

It all depends who's writing the history books... Lincoln was one of the worst presidents in history and yet if you pick up pretty much any high school history textbook it'll praise him as one of the best. Same goes for FDR.

Lincoln one of the worst? You just lost all credabilty.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

In YOUR opinion, those things arent facts.

No most of those are indeed facts...he has done all those things.

 

[KingOfDreams]

Lincoln one of the worst? You just lost all credabilty.

I agree. While it's common knowledge that the reason for the Civil War wasn't to free the slaves but that doesn't change the fact that he did. And as far as FDR goes, yes he was close to becoming a dictator with all those terms but look at all the important social programs he instituted.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

Oh sure, it looks good on paper. Hell, communism kind of looks good on paper.

Its been executed well in certain parts of the country prior to its adoption...as I say its most likely very underfunded...that was its largest criticism, plus it gives teachers a lot of paperwork. Notably teachers don't like any state or local policy that involves paperwork. In South Carolina for example we had a program that had inner city high schoolers come read to elementary school children in various parts of charleston. It was suppose to help both the younger and older children involved...and I believe did just that...it was cut because the schoolboard complained about the paperwork the teachers had to fill out

 

[Admiral_N8]

No most of those are indeed facts...he has done all those things.

"Aside from No Child Left behind (which some claim is heavily underfunded) and some of his current energy policies Bush is accused (myself included) from totally ignoring the poor (which is unfortunately very evident from the e-mails Michael Brown released from the katrina disaster...however Bush response was probably the least bad as compared to the state of Louisianna, which he declared a disaster area 48 hours before the storm hit, unprecedented). Other than that absorbing FEMA, increasing deficit spending, expanding the federal beauracracy by 64%, cutting funding several urban housing and urban development policies of the Clinton era, his recent come down on immigrants (despite his 2000 campaign running platform where he sang the National Athem in Spanish...no one else sees the irony), His inept tax policies, inability to use the "bully pulpit", the Patriot Act (goes without explanation)--thankfully little of it has been implemented yet, His use of "newspeak" to improve things like working conditions and wetlands...etc."

Ignoring the poor [your opinion]
inept tax policies [your opinion]
inability to use the "bully pulpit [your opinion]
Patriot Act being bad [your opinion]
and saying those other facts [yes there are facts] were bad policies is YOUR opinion.

 

[KingOfDreams]

The underfunding is definitely the problem. Underfunding of education in general is a problem. School's are having to cut art, music, p.e. and after school programs and that's just sad. Here in Texas the current public education funding program was deemed unconstitutionl and now there's a seemingly devided special session to try and fix this. The problem has been going on for awhile and there's a scare that school's will get no money because a compromise can't be reached.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

"Aside from No Child Left behind (which some claim is heavily underfunded) and some of his current energy policies Bush is accused (myself included) from totally ignoring the poor (which is unfortunately very evident from the e-mails Michael Brown released from the katrina disaster...however Bush response was probably the least bad as compared to the state of Louisianna, which he declared a disaster area 48 hours before the storm hit, unprecedented). Other than that absorbing FEMA, increasing deficit spending, expanding the federal beauracracy by 64%, cutting funding several urban housing and urban development policies of the Clinton era, his recent come down on immigrants (despite his 2000 campaign running platform where he sang the National Athem in Spanish...no one else sees the irony), His inept tax policies, inability to use the "bully pulpit", the Patriot Act (goes without explanation)--thankfully little of it has been implemented yet, His use of "newspeak" to improve things like working conditions and wetlands...etc."

Ignoring the poor [your opinion]
inept tax policies [your opinion]
inability to use the "bully pulpit [your opinion]
Patriot Act being bad [your opinion]
and saying those other facts [yes there are facts] were bad policies is YOUR opinion.

No using the Bully Pulpit is not an opinion, do you even know what that is. The bully pulpit is "White House as a "bully pulpit," meaning a terrific platform from which to persuasively advocate an agenda. ". Bush has held less personal press conferences than any other two term President (fact) and has also spoken directly to the press less than any other. The bully pulpit is when the President uses propoganda and very exuberant langauge to persuade the general public of his platform. His approval rating is very signifying that he has been ineffective in doing so, since Presidents like Kennedy, FDR and Teddy (who coined it) all had very high approval ratings. The bully pulpit is a check against congress since it pressures congress to act with you. However Congress has been very hesitent to act with Bush as of late another signifying factor that the bully pulpit is not being used...however the press issue is pretty much a direct knowledge that he has not used the bully pulpit

Inept tax policies...well aside from our stable economy, is this a sign of a good tax policy http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

Totally ignoring the poor is back up by the fact that he cut policies directly helping the poor and the Katrina thing...its pretty self evident, you should read the Michael Brown e-mails http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/11/03/brown.fema.emails/ and see how much this administrations officials value to poor

Quote from Bush: Bush: "Poor people are lazy"

The professor, Yoshi Tsurumi, recalled that when he was leading a discussion on whether the government should assist retirees and other people on fixed incomes with heating costs, Bush said, "The government doesn't have to help poor people...they are lazy." And when Tsurumi showed the film "The Grapes of Wrath," Bush sneered. "We were in a discussion of the New Deal," Tsurumi said, "and he called Franklin Roosevelt's policies 'socialism.' He denounced labor unions, the Securities and Exchange Commission, Medicare, Social Security, you name it. He denounced the civil rights movement as socialism. To him, socialism and communism were the same thing. And when challenged to explain his prejudice, he could not defend his argument, either ideologically, polemically, or academically."

Bush to scrap poor elderly's food program






Date published: 2/11/2006
p { font-family: Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif; font-size: 9pt; text-decoration: none; color: #000000; text-align: justify; background-color: transparent } By FREDERIC J. FROMMER
ASSOCIATED PRESS WRITER
WASHINGTON--The boxes arrive every month at churches, senior citizen centers and other sites for distribution to nearly a half-million poor elderly people. Each is stocked with a mix of nutritious foods such as cereal, peanut butter, fruit, vegetables and pasta. Sometimes volunteers deliver them right to people's homes.
Now. President Bush wants to eliminate the program, one of 141 federal initiatives that his proposed new budget would scrap or cut dramatically. He is proposing to shift people in the Commodity Supplemental Food Program over to food stamps.
Defenders of the nutrition-in-a-box program say many elderly people are reluctant to sign up for food stamps, and, in any event, the commodity program often provides a more generous package.
"It really does come under the category, in the most extreme way, of balancing the budget on the backs of those who are most needy. And in this case we're not even balancing the budget," said Wisconsin Sen. Herb Kohl, the ranking Democrat on the Senate Appropriations agriculture subcommittee.
"I call it misplaced priorities. How do you justify doing something like this, while at the same time giving people like Herb Kohl huge tax cuts?" said Kohl, a multimillionaire.
The commodity program, run by the Agriculture Department, benefits mainly elderly people, although some new mothers and children also participate. The department wants to move recipients to food stamps in the fiscal year that begins Oct. 1. The program cost about $111 million this fiscal year, including a $4 million supplement for victims of Hurricane Katrina.
The program, which dates back to 1968, operates in 32 states and the District of Columbia.
Its lack of national reach is one reason the administration wants to eliminate it, according to USDA officials.
Kate Coler, the USDA's deputy undersecretary for Food, Nutrition and Consumer Services, said the department believes it can serve people more efficiently through food stamps and the Women, Infants and Children program, which are both nationwide.
"It's really a duplicative program," she said of CSFP.
But Tim Robertson, president of the National CSFP Association, which represents state and local organizations that administer the program, challenged the USDA's premise that people will switch over to food stamps.
"Seniors have repeatedly said they don't want to be on that program," Robertson said, because of the perceived stigma of using food stamps and the paperwork hassles.
The USDA's own statistics show that just 28 percent of seniors eligible for food stamps participate in the program.
Sherrie Tussler, executive director of the Hunger Task Force, which administers the program in Milwaukee, said the commodity program helps elderly people stretch their food-buying budget.
"Sometimes, seniors are choosing between utility bills and prescription drugs and whether they get to eat," she said.
The Bush administration is proposing to provide CSFP beneficiaries with transitional food stamp benefits of $20 a month for six months, or until they are deemed eligible for food stamps, whichever comes first.
Sarah Mayek, 75, of Milwaukee, receives both the CSFP box and $10 a month for food stamps.
"You try to stretch your budget a little bit," Mayek said. Without CSFP, she said, "I would have to adjust. But I raised 11 children. I know how to cut corners."
Jean Daniel, a spokeswoman for the USDA's Food and Nutrition Service, said her agency is working to remove the perceived stigma. For example, she said, the agency is getting the word out that food stamp payments are now made by an electronic transfer card, not actual stamps.


Date published: 2/11/2006

http://www.nhi.org/online/issues/137/urbanneglect.html

I can find more...

 

[Corinthian™]

<SNIP>

****ing liberals

 

[ShadowBoxing]

****ing liberals

I especially like the Brown e-mails and the poor people are lazy...I never expected to find that

 

[KingOfDreams]

I suggest reading Al Franken's new book. It uncovers all sorts of nasty truths about the Bush adminstration. And yes it's biased but every assertion is backed up very well.

 

[Admiral_N8]

No using the Bully Pulpit is not an opinion, do you even know what that is. The bully pulpit is "White House as a "bully pulpit," meaning a terrific platform from which to persuasively advocate an agenda. ". Bush has held less personal press conferences than any other two term President (fact) and has also spoken directly to the press less than any other. The bully pulpit is when the President uses propoganda and very exuberant langauge to persuade the general public of his platform. His approval rating is very signifying that he has been ineffective in doing so, since Presidents like Kennedy, FDR and Teddy (who coined it) all had very high approval ratings. The bully pulpit is a check against congress since it pressures congress to act with you. However Congress has been very hesitent to act with Bush as of late another signifying factor that the bully pulpit is not being used...however the press issue is pretty much a direct knowledge that he has not used the bully pulpit

Inept tax policies...well aside from our stable economy, is this a sign of a good tax policy http://www.brillig.com/debt_clock/

Totally ignoring the poor is back up by the fact that he cut policies directly helping the poor and the Katrina thing...its pretty self evident, you should read the Michael Brown e-mails http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/11/03/brown.fema.emails/ and see how much this administrations officials value to poor

Quote from Bush: Bush: "Poor people are lazy"




http://www.nhi.org/online/issues/137/urbanneglect.html

I can find more...

Saying "totally ignoring the poor" means "totally' and he hasnt totally ignored them. You may THINK in YOUR opinion that he hasnt done enough to help them, but thats your opinion.

saying "inept" tax policies means you THINK in your OPINION that it hasnt worked well....which is up for debate and not a fact.

And you may think he hasnt used the bully pulpit well, but how has he "scared" people into believe him, and got himself re-elected? Thats pretty good use of the bully pulpit.

Stop saying your opinions are facts.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

I suggest reading Al Franken's new book. It uncovers all sorts of nasty truths about the Bush adminstration. And yes it's biased but every assertion is backed up very well.

I am not so much a fan of those books, but maybe I'll look into it...

 

[Admiral_N8]

I suggest reading Al Franken's new book. It uncovers all sorts of nasty truths about the Bush adminstration. And yes it's biased but every assertion is backed up very well.

All political books like that are backed up very well, but they only show their selection of facts, since as you said its biased.

 

[KingOfDreams]

I am not so much a fan of those books, but maybe I'll look into it...

Granted, his previous book was better.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

Saying "totally ignoring the poor" means "totally' and he hasnt totally ignored them. You may THINK in YOUR opinion that he hasnt done enough to help them, but thats your opinion.

saying "inept" tax policies means you THINK in your OPINION that it hasnt worked well....which is up for debate and not a fact.

And you may think he hasnt used the bully pulpit well, but how has he "scared" people into believe him, and got himself re-elected? Thats pretty good use of the bully pulpit.

Stop saying your opinions are facts.

Bully Pulpit is a check against the congress not so much focused on voting. How did he get re-elected...probably by doing what most Presidents do, having your campaign manager organize a constituency for you, running advertisements, holding debates, doing one the road grass roots campaigns...has nothing to do with the bully pulpit separate entity.

Perhaps totally is a bit of a strong word, but he has drasically cut benefits and ignored them to a very high degree.

Inept tax policy, well if its a good tax policy we don't have a deficit.

 

[Admiral_N8]

Bully Pulpit is a check against the congress not so much focused on voting. How did he get re-elected...probably by doing what most Presidents do, having your campaign manager organize a constituency for you, running advertisements, holding debates, doing one the road grass roots campaigns...has nothing to do with the bully pulpit separate entity.

Perhaps totally is a bit of a strong word, but he has drasically cut benefits and ignored them to a very high degree.

Inept tax policy, well if its a good tax policy we don't have a deficit.

"if its a good tax policy we don't have a deficit" very untrue. Having a good tax policy doesnt require no defcit....as shown by the 80s.

And Bush has used the bully pulpit well sometimes, by pushing things like his tax cuts [using the bully pulpit], patriot act, and no child left behind just to name a few.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

"if its a good tax policy we don't have a deficit" very untrue. Having a good tax policy doesnt require no defcit....as shown by the 80s.


And Bush has used the bully pulpit well sometimes, by pushing things like his tax cuts [using the bully pulpit], patriot act, and no child left behind just to name a few.

If you're refering to trickle down economics the flaws of that system are highly recognized and most would not consider it a good tax policy, in fact it passes the buck of the deficit onto future generations.

Tax cuts were pushed by an already decided congress, as for the Patriot Act 9/11 did that for him and No Child Left Behind was largely pushed by Senator Ted Kennedy who co sponsored and created it.

 

[Admiral_N8]

If you're refering to trickle down economics the flaws of that system are highly recognized and most would not consider it a good tax policy, in fact it passes the buck of the deficit onto future generations.

Tax cuts were pushed by an already decided congress, as for the Patriot Act 9/11 did that for him and No Child Left Behind was largely pushed by Senator Ted Kennedy who co sponsored and created it.

Tax cuts were not already decided by congress, without Bush pushing for them then and now they wouldnt be there still. A good use of his pulpit. And same for the patriot act, he used the pulpit to keep it around. No Child Left Behind wasnt soley put ahead by Kennedy, Bush used his pulpit to push that largely flawed [imo, even if it was funded well] legislation through. I am sure you remember the opposition to it at first.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

Tax cuts were not already decided by congress, without Bush pushing for them then and now they wouldnt be there still. A good use of his pulpit. And same for the patriot act, he used the pulpit to keep it around. No Child Left Behind wasnt soley put ahead by Kennedy, Bush used his pulpit to push that largely flawed [imo, even if it was funded well] legislation through. I am sure you remember the opposition to it at first.

No Child wasn't funded well....

 

[Admiral_N8]

No Child wasn't funded well....

Yep

 

[KingOfDreams]

If you're refering to trickle down economics the flaws of that system are highly recognized and most would not consider it a good tax policy, in fact it passes the buck of the deficit onto future generations.

And Bush, I believe, is the only president who has cut taxes during wartime.

 

[chaseter]

Bush is not the worst.