Thor/God of Thunder - Chris Hemsworth

Discussion in 'Avengers: Endgame' started by Iceman, Oct 16, 2018.

  1. Ragnaroknroll Registered

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2013
    Messages:
    3,738
    Likes Received:
    94
    I hear what you're saying. I mean to me that's no different than Thor hanging out with Hawkeye and Black Widow and even Cap (although the MCU seems to have made him much stronger). To me only Hulk, Iron Man, Captain Marvel, Wanda, and Vision are really on or close to Thor's level.

    Drax has been under utilized but he has been shown to have some insane durability (the GOTG2 space travel sequence with him tethered do the back). Gamora is clearly enhanced. Groot can hang. I very much enjoyed Thor, Groot and Rocket on the battlefield of Wakanda and that's probably Thor at his strongest in these films. I still think they can make it work with a fully powered Thor and really won't be on board with something else. Surely they can keep Thor busy with a foe on his power level while the other Guardians do their thing.

    If they don't want Thor to be Thor then invent a new character I guess.
     
  2. Ragnaroknroll Registered

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2013
    Messages:
    3,738
    Likes Received:
    94
    I had the exact same reaction when I saw this in the theaters. My head canon says because Cap had just wielded Mjolnir he was still possessing the "power of Thor". Maybe's there's a 60 second timer like back in the Lee/Kirby days. :-)

    I mean if Cap couldn't retain Thor's power momentarily then the hammer could never return to him like it does for Thor.

    I don't think Thor was worthless in this film at all. But he wasn't an MVP like he was in Infinity War. His story here is more character oriented. They were a little heavy handed with the humor and I also disliked the Cheese Whiz comment but I thought it was a good story. The conclusion is not satisfying for me but hey more films blah blah. I guess that's how Marvel keeps us on the hook. I am glad to be getting more Thor but that depends... I don't want more Fat Thor. I'm taking a wait and see attitude.

    However in AEG, Thor did serve the plot. He brought back Mjolnir in the main timeline (had to be him). He was definitely instrumental in the final battle. Holding off Thanos buying time and just in general I mean you want Thor on your side during something like this.

    Lastly, I know Cap gets all the limelight near the end but the most obvious role Thor plays to me is that he's the one juicing up Cap. If Thor dies where does Cap get the power? Odin was very clear in Ragnarok that the hammer was not the source of Thor's power - just a conduit. The power was his own. So in Thor's weakened state, he gave that power to Cap (by means of the Mjolnir enchantment). Cap was Thor's surrogate in that moment. So yeah Thor had to be there.

    That's how I see it.
     
    Iceman likes this.
  3. Flint Marko Bring me Thanos (P)

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2006
    Messages:
    18,060
    Likes Received:
    3,982
  4. Bren Forevernoob

    Joined:
    May 28, 2007
    Messages:
    3,485
    Likes Received:
    187
    That's pretty cool!
     
  5. Fosterson Registered

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2015
    Messages:
    1,307
    Likes Received:
    923
    The difference is that Thor has never really spent prolonged periods of time working alongside the likes of Widow or Clint. In AOU, he went off on his own for a large chunk of the movie, in IW he was again on his own personal quest and in EG, well, y'know.

    That's quite different from Thor spending an ENTIRE movie with Quill, Mantis and Co., in which virtually any problem they face that's a challenge for them can be effortlessly solved by Thor.

    That still isn't remotely comparable to Thor taking the force from a neutron star. Drax would have been instantly incinerated by that.

    It's definitely possible. It would just take some pretty creative writing and the temptation will always be there to keep Thor fat in order to make the rest of the team seem relevant - as well as to get more laughs out of the audience.

    They pretty much already did, and they have been richly rewarded for it.
     
    #1030 Fosterson, May 22, 2019
    Last edited: May 23, 2019
  6. OdinBorson Registered

    Joined:
    May 23, 2019
    Messages:
    1
    Likes Received:
    0
    He tried to when he stepped forward to put on the gauntlet and bring everyone back. "Let me do something good." He wanted to make that sacrifice to redeem himself of the failure he felt.
     
  7. Fosterson Registered

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2015
    Messages:
    1,307
    Likes Received:
    923
    Thor did save his people from Hela. She was killed, right?

    Sure, he couldn't save everyone, and Asgard itself ended up getting destroyed, but then again Cap wasn't able to prevent a lot of innocent Shield agents from getting killed in WS as part of his effort to take down Hydra. And Cap wasn't able to prevent Shield itself from being destroyed as an organisation.

    So, is Cap a failure too?
     
    Ragnaroknroll and KRYPTON INC. like this.
  8. Silvermoon Made To Be Ruled

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2003
    Messages:
    7,361
    Likes Received:
    2,383
    If you watch, she actually vanishes in a flash of green *just* before Surtur's sword would've hit her
     
  9. Fosterson Registered

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2015
    Messages:
    1,307
    Likes Received:
    923
    Nope, she's most definitely dead. All of those fan theories about her appearing in IW/EG turned out to be moot.

    Besides, if she can teleport, then what was the point of her needing Heimdall's sword to operate the Bifrost?
     
  10. Silvermoon Made To Be Ruled

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2003
    Messages:
    7,361
    Likes Received:
    2,383
    Those theories turning out to be moot isn't proof that she's dead.

    Also, just because she can teleport herself doesn't mean she'd be able to teleport her entire army, which I'm pretty sure is what she wanted Bifrost for (to continue conquering worlds)
     
    Ragnaroknroll likes this.
  11. Ragnaroknroll Registered

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2013
    Messages:
    3,738
    Likes Received:
    94
    That's not creating a new character. That's changing an existing character. Which just bolsters my original point. That Thor fans don't want Thor to become unrecognizable. Because that's not why they became fans to begin with.
     
  12. Spider-Fan SHHFFL 2014/2019 Champion

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2003
    Messages:
    58,168
    Likes Received:
    14,079
    They gave him closure to THIS arc. He's realized he needs to stop trying to be a guy he isn't and has decided to go figure himself out. That was the arc of this movie. Thor discovering is he is not that guy then who is he is a different arc. So saying they didn't pay off is Endgame arc is patently false.
     
    doink likes this.
  13. Fosterson Registered

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2015
    Messages:
    1,307
    Likes Received:
    923
    But it does make it more likely. Not to mention the fact that Hela surviving would completely ruin the ending of Ragnarok as Thor's decision to destroy Asgard would have been in vain.

    That's just speculation. Hela never demonstrated the ability to teleport on her own. And no, the fact that she exited Hel in Norway isn't teleportation, since if it was, it would have made more sense for her to go straight to Asgard. More likely that Odin's imprisonment meant that she would be freed wherever he happened to die.

    No Asgardian has ever demonstrated the ability to teleport on their own. Even Thor is only able to travel between the Realms with Stormbreaker; he can't do it on his own.

    And if Hela did teleport away from Surtur, wouldn't it have made more sense for her to go straight to the Asgardian ship? And what was she doing during the five years that followed (assuming she survived the Snap)? New Asgard is a glorified fishing village with an overweight, alcoholic king, making it an easy picking for Hela. So why didn't she (again, assuming she survived the Snap) go to Midgard and claim her birthright?
     
  14. herolee10 No More Miracles

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2007
    Messages:
    28,157
    Likes Received:
    3,589
    If his scene with Frigga was meant to serve as closure to this stage/phase of his life then I feel like the buildup to it left a lot to be desired.

    Up until Thor's reunion with his mother, his whole Fat and Depressed Thor phase was mainly played for laughs. His depression was not because of the burden of being who everyone thought he was supposed to be but more from the guilt of not being able to stop Thanos.

    One could also argue that Thor's whole arc, from the moment he was introduced in his first solo film, was about him learning to be a wise king. So for him to throw away that responsibility in the end so easily did not make any sense to me.

    And even if you look pass everything mentioned above, that still does not explain on what his purpose was in this film and what he specifically contributed towards stopping Thanos.

    Everyone else had their moment where they did something important that contributed towards Thanos's defeat. The only useful thing that Thor did was bringing back his old hammer for Cap to use while serving as a punching doll for Thanos.
     
  15. herolee10 No More Miracles

    Joined:
    Aug 31, 2007
    Messages:
    28,157
    Likes Received:
    3,589
    Shield was not Cap's responsibility from the start like Asgard was for Thor.

    And at least people can say that Cap was essential in stopping Thanos once and for all in endgame. Can people really day the same for Thor?
     
  16. Spider-Fan SHHFFL 2014/2019 Champion

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2003
    Messages:
    58,168
    Likes Received:
    14,079
    This seems more like you're unhappy with the approach for the character in the movie, which is blinding your opinion. We can argue all day if the Russos went too far into comedy with Thor, but Thor's regret and PTSD were 1000% a major part of his arc in this movie. Why did he not like anyone saying the name "Thanos" if it didn't touch a particular nerve? Why is he telling his mother he is a failure and confessing to his mother that even in killing Thanos he realizes it changed nothing going as far as to call himself an "idiot with an ax" then? I get not liking the approach the used for Thor, but being disappointed with his arc/story doesn't mean he didn't have one. He absolutely did.

    As for what he did in the defeat of Thanos, he didn't have a major role in beating him. But guess what? Neither did Captain America. Yes, Cap got to wield the hammer and fight Thanos, but he too was tossed like a rag doll (like Thor) when they were trying to keep him away from the gauntlet. Thor's role in the battle was the same as everyone else's: fight whoever was near him in the battle. Yes, he didn't get as much emphasis in the action sequence as maybe Cap and such did, but he was absolutely in the battle fighting with everyone else.
     
    #1041 Spider-Fan, May 24, 2019
    Last edited: May 24, 2019
    doink, KRYPTON INC. and Flint Marko like this.
  17. Flint Marko Bring me Thanos (P)

    Joined:
    Oct 10, 2006
    Messages:
    18,060
    Likes Received:
    3,982
    It's telling that the loudest detractors of Thor in this movie seemingly can't express their frustration without relying almost entirely on hyperbole.
     
    doink and metaphysician like this.
  18. KRYPTON INC. Incorporated Kryptonian

    Joined:
    May 23, 2013
    Messages:
    80,778
    Likes Received:
    35,395

    [​IMG]
     
  19. Fosterson Registered

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2015
    Messages:
    1,307
    Likes Received:
    923
    It technically was when you consider that the Strategic Science Reserve from WW2 was the predecessor of Shield. And besides, Cap became one of Shield's most elite operatives between Avengers and TWS, so he definitely bore responsibility for the well-being of Shield as well as by extension the United States. He wasn't able to prevent Hydra from massacring many innocent civilians and Shield agents, just as Thor wasn't able to prevent Hela from massacring Asgardians.

    Once, again, does this make Cap a failure?

    Cap didn't do any more to win the final battle with Thanos than Thor did. Even with Mjolnir, he quickly got bodied by Thanos 1v1. Heck, Tony was arguably the least impressive of the Big 3 in the fight with Thanos given that he was the first to be taken out (straight up KOd - ironically by Thor - in one hit).

    And that was a fat, alcoholic version of Thor. Of course he wasn't going to be the MVP again.
     
  20. HammerDown High Tide Or Low Tide

    Joined:
    Apr 13, 2015
    Messages:
    7,951
    Likes Received:
    3,148
  21. JtheDreamer Slangin Grannys Peach Tea

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2015
    Messages:
    4,193
    Likes Received:
    296
    Thor's "arc" in EG was complete and utter BS. They spent all that time getting him to the throne and then in Ragnarok he's finally leading his own people into the cosmos. The Russo's scrap it for cheap laughs justified through some drive-by Frigga dialogue and turn the kingdom over to Valkyrie (really?). She wasn't a leader, in fact she was a quitter who quit on her own people.

    That's my one issue with this genre is that anything can change in a split second from cheap dialogue. It's even harder to swallow due to his poor showing in the final EG fight. This is a freaking GOD we're talking about. But that whole end sequence turned into the Cap and Tony show.
     
    #1046 JtheDreamer, May 24, 2019
    Last edited: May 24, 2019
    herolee10 likes this.
  22. Ragnaroknroll Registered

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2013
    Messages:
    3,738
    Likes Received:
    94
    That did bug me a little bit with Valkyrie but I figured she must have demonstrated leadership qualities helping the Asgardians resettle in Tønsberg during the past 5 years while Thor was sequestered away in his useless funk. Thor can still assume the mantle of king again in the future and eventually probably should but the time is not right. Thor being unwilling to take the throne is certainly within character.

    And even though he led his people in Ragnarok he admitted to Hela that he didn't want it but there was no better alternative because she was "just the worst".
     
  23. JtheDreamer Slangin Grannys Peach Tea

    Joined:
    Jul 17, 2015
    Messages:
    4,193
    Likes Received:
    296
    We already saw Thor being unwilling to take the throne when he chose Earth over it. It's like are we ever going to really see King Thor?

    I'm starting to wonder if part of it is due to a screenwriting cover up for the fact that a Tonsberg-located Asgard doesn't make rich story-telling for a character like his so they need him out in the cosmos. Then again he is supposed to be a protector of all the nine realms. You'd have to wonder if the Thor/Guardians dynamic tested really high in panels they did too.

    In regards to your Valkyrie comments, it just bothers me when stuff is developed off-screen especially if it's not minutia.
     
  24. davetbeau Registered

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2017
    Messages:
    84
    Likes Received:
    19
    This is possibly my favorite look for Thor. That transformation scene was amazing.
     
    doink likes this.
  25. ArmsHeldOut Registered

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2004
    Messages:
    17,985
    Likes Received:
    2,814

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice
monitoring_string = "afb8e5d7348ab9e99f73cba908f10802"