Ultimatum Begins!

[THANOSRULES]

Some of you guys are such pretentious geeks

Loeb sucks now.. I'll agree on that.

But writing isnt the whole picture.


Ultimates 3 had some kick ass art. Joe Mad did a GREAT job..and it was some of the best art and drawing ever for him.

SO if your gonna say Ultimates 3 sucked becuase "all the cool nerds at my comic book shop say ultimates 3 sucked" then you have no f-ing clue what you are talking about.


The writing and plot of U3 sucked...mildly..aside from killing wanda and pietro it was basically executing an inevitability...I.E. each Ultimate series could not hope to be as profound and uber -reaching as you geeks hoped it would be....so at worst U3 was "filler"...storywise...yet had some of the best pencils I've ever ****ing seen in a comic book....so excuse me if i don't want to wipe my ass with it as some of you bandwagon comic fans want to.

Most of you have even cast aside the days between Ultimates 2 11-12 when we swore the book was a joke and the whole ultimateverse was ruined..which it soundly was, as all the other Ultimate books were rendered moot by the horrid plot delays of Millar.


You guys dealt with the Ultimate Hulk Vs Wolverine joke..as well as the nullifying of cool series like Extinction because of the Ultimate verse hangin on Millar's Ultimates 2 delays ...and NOW you scream the Ultimates are "dead"....!

Needless to say... That doesnt justify Ultimatum.


WHat a ****ing Piece of ****...decent art though.

 

[random_havoc]

What, when did this happen?

Spidey found his body in Ult Spidey. I forget the issue # but I it was one of the last two issues.

 

[random_havoc]

Some of you guys are such pretentious geeks

Loeb sucks now.. I'll agree on that.

But writing isnt the whole picture.


Ultimates 3 had some kick ass art. Joe Mad did a GREAT job..and it was some of the best art and drawing ever for him.

SO if your gonna say Ultimates 3 sucked becuase "all the cool nerds at my comic book shop say ultimates 3 sucked" then you have no f-ing clue what you are talking about.


The writing and plot of U3 sucked...mildly..aside from killing wanda and pietro it was basically executing an inevitability...I.E. each Ultimate series could not hope to be as profound and uber -reaching as you geeks hoped it would be....so at worst U3 was "filler"...storywise...yet had some of the best pencils I've ever ****ing seen in a comic book....so excuse me if i don't want to wipe my ass with it as some of you bandwagon comic fans want to.

Most of you have even cast aside the days between Ultimates 2 11-12 when we swore the book was a joke and the whole ultimateverse was ruined..which it soundly was, as all the other Ultimate books were rendered moot by the horrid plot delays of Millar.


You guys dealt with the Ultimate Hulk Vs Wolverine joke..as well as the nullifying of cool series like Extinction because of the Ultimate verse hangin on Millar's Ultimates 2 delays ...and NOW you scream the Ultimates are "dead"....!

Needless to say... That doesnt justify Ultimatum.


WHat a ****ing Piece of ****...decent art though.

Wow, way to assume you know the motives of a whole bunch of people. That's not arrogant at all. You know, sometimes the consensus that a comic series sucks comes from the fact that it actually sucks, just like every issue of U3 does.
Saying that the plot of U3 mildly sucked is like suck the Grand Canyon is kind of a big hole. Following up Ultimates 1 and 2 (which many, myself included, say is one of the greatest comic storylines in existence so far) with U3 was an insult. Loeb didn't just suck, he put in changes that were completely irrational with absolutely no explanation (ie, Thor's one-of-a-kind hammer suddenly completely changed to look like the one the 616).

If U3 had NOT been called a follow-up to U1 and U2 at all then it would have just plain sucked all on its own, the fact that it WAS called a sequel to the first two makes it one of the worst arcs in comic history as far as I'm concerned.

As for the art, first, a lot of people just don't like Mad's art. Sorry to break the news to ya.
Second, When you put Mad (not a realistic style) as a followup to someone like Hitch (a realistic style) it's like if they followed up the dark knight with a sequel that was a slapstick comedy. The style is just so different that a lot of people who liked the original style will be repulsed by the new style.
Third, I don't think this was some of the best art of Mad's career, as you're suggesting, I just think the colorist did such a good job it makes Mad's art a less bad than usual (again, his art's just not in my personal taste).

Lastly, yes, the delays of Ultimates 2 and Ult W/H have been abominable and are an insult to everyone that buys Marvel comics. But that doesn't change the quality of the finished products. Ults 1 and 2 were amazing, following it up with Ults3 was one of the the stupidest things Marvels ever done and was obviously nothing more than a short-sighted cash grab.


If you want to go disagreeing with the vast majority of the people on here go right ahead, but don't go calling us names as if you know us or can see into our motives.

 

[kguillou]

Well said Random Havoc, there's no way you can read U3 asa follow-up of millar's ultimates and say its good, it is completely, totally, 110% BAD. BAD BAD BAD. I'll admit Joe Mad's art looked very pretty in some places, but it also looked like a mess in a lot of other places and it wasnt at ALL a good fit for a series thats supposed to be a realistic take on the avengers. I know everyone has their own opinion but i challenge anyone top name one good thing about this book...or Ultimatum.

 

[Brainiac 8]

http://www.i-mockery.com/comics/longbox31/


Thanos, read this and you'll see just how badly written Ultimates 3 was, and also shows how the art wasn't any help either.

 

[Blader5489]

Some of you guys are such pretentious geeks

Loeb sucks now.. I'll agree on that.

But writing isnt the whole picture.


Ultimates 3 had some kick ass art. Joe Mad did a GREAT job..and it was some of the best art and drawing ever for him.

SO if your gonna say Ultimates 3 sucked becuase "all the cool nerds at my comic book shop say ultimates 3 sucked" then you have no f-ing clue what you are talking about.


The writing and plot of U3 sucked...mildly..aside from killing wanda and pietro it was basically executing an inevitability...I.E. each Ultimate series could not hope to be as profound and uber -reaching as you geeks hoped it would be....so at worst U3 was "filler"...storywise...yet had some of the best pencils I've ever ****ing seen in a comic book....so excuse me if i don't want to wipe my ass with it as some of you bandwagon comic fans want to.

Most of you have even cast aside the days between Ultimates 2 11-12 when we swore the book was a joke and the whole ultimateverse was ruined..which it soundly was, as all the other Ultimate books were rendered moot by the horrid plot delays of Millar.


You guys dealt with the Ultimate Hulk Vs Wolverine joke..as well as the nullifying of cool series like Extinction because of the Ultimate verse hangin on Millar's Ultimates 2 delays ...and NOW you scream the Ultimates are "dead"....!

Needless to say... That doesnt justify Ultimatum.


WHat a ****ing Piece of ****...decent art though.

"Official only member on the board who doesn't hate Rob Liefield"

Case closed.

 

[squeekness]

Spidey found his body in Ult Spidey. I forget the issue # but I it was one of the last two issues.

The last ish that came out, #131.

 

[Aztec]

Actually Thanos, in addition to coming off like a pompous jerk, your defense of Mad's art is also questionable. You are free to like what you like but the whole point of the Ultimate line is to present the characters in a more realistic setting. This is ESPECIALLY true of The Ultimates. Mad's art is not even remotely realistic.

 

[Saved]

Okay, just finished reading my advance copy of Ultimatum #3. All I'll say is it's just as terrible as #1 & 2. Finch also doesn't seem to be trying as hard on the art as he used to.

So, for those of you who aren't picking up the issues (and I beg you not to, let's all please convince Marvel to never use Loeb again) but are interested vaguely in what's going on, here's a list of who died this issue and how:

These are spoilers in the truest sense of the word. You've been warned.

Spoiler

First off, the following people were confirmed as dead:
-Dazzler, beast, nightcrawler (via the tidal wave)
-The "academy of tomorrow"'s Emma frost, sunspot, cannonball, polaris (tidal wave again I think), though Havoc may have survived
-Longshot, forge, detonator, hardrive were caught and killed in the savage land
-a whole ton of madroxes were killed cuz magneto's forcing them to be suicide bombers all over the world (though there are still more alive of course)
-Seeing that the Blob has eaten Jan's guts Hank Pym (as a giant) picks up blob (without any explanation as to how he's able to do that, I thought that was supposed to be really hard but maybe that's only the 616 blob) and bites his head off and spits it out.
-Thor sacrifices himself in the land of the dead so that Cap can come back. So Thor's dead
-Then, as people were predicting, Hank dies. Basically he sacrifices himself to get Jan's body back to the Treskellion where he asks Stark to use something he'd been working on called "the Jocasta iniativie" or something like that. But a bunch of suicide bombing madroxes were about to blow up the Triskellion so to make sure Jan is safe Hank took them all on himself (giant form) and walked off, kablooie.

By the last frame it looks like the heroes finally have their crap together and are ready to actually do something useful.

Magneto still has and is wantonly using Mjolnir.

In conclusion, Loeb is still completely ruining the Ultimate MU. I must confess to having been stupid enough to buy the first two issues. I won't be buying anything else written Loeb. EVER AGAIN.

So Loeb is Frank Miller now?

 

[THANOSRULES]

Actually Thanos, in addition to coming off like a pompous jerk, your defense of Mad's art is also questionable. You are free to like what you like but the whole point of the Ultimate line is to present the characters in a more realistic setting. This is ESPECIALLY true of The Ultimates. Mad's art is not even remotely realistic.

Good point.

What can i say..a bit "in the cups" last night. Was a bit over hostile.

I agree that Joe Mads probably was a lousy fit for Ultimates...but it just pains me to see people knock on his art when It was so dang quality.

He is one of those artists where you can really see the hard work and effort he has put into each line...and I respect his work too much to call it crap.

 

[THANOSRULES]

Wow, way to assume you know the motives of a whole bunch of people. That's not arrogant at all. You know, sometimes the consensus that a comic series sucks comes from the fact that it actually sucks, just like every issue of U3 does.
Saying that the plot of U3 mildly sucked is like suck the Grand Canyon is kind of a big hole. Following up Ultimates 1 and 2 (which many, myself included, say is one of the greatest comic storylines in existence so far) with U3 was an insult. Loeb didn't just suck, he put in changes that were completely irrational with absolutely no explanation (ie, Thor's one-of-a-kind hammer suddenly completely changed to look like the one the 616).

If U3 had NOT been called a follow-up to U1 and U2 at all then it would have just plain sucked all on its own, the fact that it WAS called a sequel to the first two makes it one of the worst arcs in comic history as far as I'm concerned.

As for the art, first, a lot of people just don't like Mad's art. Sorry to break the news to ya.
Second, When you put Mad (not a realistic style) as a followup to someone like Hitch (a realistic style) it's like if they followed up the dark knight with a sequel that was a slapstick comedy. The style is just so different that a lot of people who liked the original style will be repulsed by the new style.
Third, I don't think this was some of the best art of Mad's career, as you're suggesting, I just think the colorist did such a good job it makes Mad's art a less bad than usual (again, his art's just not in my personal taste).

Lastly, yes, the delays of Ultimates 2 and Ult W/H have been abominable and are an insult to everyone that buys Marvel comics. But that doesn't change the quality of the finished products. Ults 1 and 2 were amazing, following it up with Ults3 was one of the the stupidest things Marvels ever done and was obviously nothing more than a short-sighted cash grab.


If you want to go disagreeing with the vast majority of the people on here go right ahead, but don't go calling us names as if you know us or can see into our motives.

Someone has to defend it...right?

anyway I'm sorry for calling people geeks...

I just think the whole problem with U3 is more complex..and the whole problem with Ultimate line started way before U3.

I'm not into making the blanket statement that a book sucks..when it had such fine art work (which I agree was not a good fit).

 

[random_havoc]

Someone has to defend it...right?

anyway I'm sorry for calling people geeks...

I just think the whole problem with U3 is more complex..and the whole problem with Ultimate line started way before U3.

I'm not into making the blanket statement that a book sucks..when it had such fine art work (which I agree was not a good fit).

fair enough.

 

[Brainiac 8]

Heh, I don't know if anyone that chats on a comic book forum as regularly as some of us should ever call anyone else a geek.

 

[THANOSRULES]

Heh, I don't know if anyone that chats on a comic book forum as regularly as some of us should ever call anyone else a geek.

Actually that makes us all undeniably geeks.

 

[Brainiac 8]

That's what I meant.

 

[random_havoc]

Well, the flaming turd that is Ultimate #3 should be out today. Anybody pick it up who didn't already read my spoilers? If so: first, FOR SHAME! You shouldn't reward bad behavior and at this point letting Loeb work on any major Marvel characters is definitely bad behavior... Second, what'd you think.

Also, somebody requested a pick of the Pym/Blob incident. Anyone care to oblige?

 

[ShadowBoxing]

Spoiler

Thor seems like kind of a loose end right now, I imagine he'll be back at some point

 

[kguillou]

This book is such a joke, i swear reading Ultimatum has actually really pissed me off and i dont usually get pissed off at reading comics (except One more day). It really feels like Loeb is deliberately making this as bad as possible just to see how much he can get away with, cause hey, despite what we may think, Ultimatum is a top selling book. To quote my man Charlie Brown "UUUgh! I can't stand it, i just cant STAND IT."

 

[ShadowBoxing]

What I love is this book is basically rendered moot because the Universe is just going to relaunch anyways.

 

[kguillou]

Well not really, the books will relaunch yeah but its still the same universe and continuity, Ultimatum is not gonna be some bad dream, its gonna affect the relaunches deeply. Or so marvel says.

 

[random_havoc]

What really sucks for collectors like me is that this crap is devaluing the whole line of Ultimate books. My Ult Spidey collection would've sold on ebay for over a grand not too long ago, now it's probably down to $600 or something. (not including my white variant of #1 which is luckily still worth a decent amount on its own).

Not that I'm going to be selling it, I just like knowing that my comics have sustained value.

 

[Mogwai]

word on the street is that ultimatum #3 is the worst yet.

 

[ShadowBoxing]

Well not really, the books will relaunch yeah but its still the same universe and continuity, Ultimatum is not gonna be some bad dream, its gonna affect the relaunches deeply. Or so marvel says.

Actually, that's wrong, it's a new continuity after Ultimatum. The Ultimate Universe is going to be replaced with the entirely new line "Ultimate Comics".

 

[TromaFreak64]

Actually, that's wrong, it's a new continuity after Ultimatum. The Ultimate Universe is going to be replaced with the entirely new line "Ultimate Comics".

Not sure what you are talking about but its the same continuity. In fact Ultimate Avengers and New Ultimates pick up right after this, and same with Spidey Vol. 2

New Ultimates deals with Loki planning his return since Thor is killed here, and we know Ultimate Avengers continues off this too with Cap's missing son arc.

Also Spidey vol 2 starts because of what happens to Peter Parker.. or so they claim.

Not really sure where you heard otherwise, but at WonderCon and New York they seemed to already hit that this isnt going away.

 

[kguillou]

Originally Posted by ShadowBoxing
Actually, that's wrong, it's a new continuity after Ultimatum. The Ultimate Universe is going to be replaced with the entirely new line "Ultimate Comics".

Um, actually i think you have it wrong, i'm pretty sure Bendis, millar and Quesada have said that its all the same continuity, its just a change in title dude. Ultimate Comics Spiderman is gonna pick up where Ultimatum and Ultimate Spiderman left off as will Ultimate Avengers and New Ultimates. Nothing's changing.