Apocalypse Users Rate, Review, and React to X-Men: Apocalypse (TAG SPOILERS)

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^^^^^ Matt, so much word to your post! IA with everything

I didnt comment on it but I also didnt like how they handled Moira and Xavier. Why the hell wasnt she pissed off that he manipulated her and erased her memories from 20 years ago? She should have been more affected and that should have made her resent him

Singer has hardon for using villians to justify changes in a person's physical appearance. He did that with Rogue in Xmen 1 and Storm AND Xavier in this one. And no it wasnt necesary. Xavier is actually in his 50s. Its more than reasonable that he could have lost his hair naturally since the last film
 
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^^^^^ Matt, so much word to your post! IA with everything

I didnt comment on it but I also didnt like how they handled Moira and Xavier. Why the hell wasnt she pissed off that he manipulated her and erased her memories from 20 years ago? She should have been more affected and that should have made her resent him

I mean, when it was first mentioned that they retconned it so he wiped everything, I was kinda appalled. My initial thought was that he gave her the equivalent to a psychic roofie. Then Havok responds as if Charles did something funny. But then I figured that Havok is a bit of a blowhard, so maybe another character would take issue with it. Nope. Then Moira finally finds out and her response is that she finds it romantic?! It just left a really bad taste in my mouth. I am fine with what Xavier did, because it is perfectly consistent with his character to do unethical things when the means are justified by his end. Xavier has always been a bit of a hypocrite in that regard. But Moira should not have been okay with it. Hell, for a movie so filled with pseudo-philosophical babble, it amazes me that this was not touched on. X3 handled Charles's unethical behavior better than this movie. X-****ing-3. Logan raked Charles over the coals for what he did to Jean and that was done to suppress a god-like entity that could destroy the world. Charles mindraped Moira as a matter of convenience and she found it romantic!

Singer has hardon for using villians to justify changes in a person's physical appearance. He did that with Rogue in Xmen 1 and Storm AND Xavier in this one. And no it wasnt necesary. Xavier is actually in his 50s. Its more than reasonable that he could have lost his hair naturally since the last film

Its a really weirdly specific plot device, when you think of it. I mean, I get it with Rogue. A teenage girl randomly having a white stripe in her hair would be a bit odd. But a 50 year old man being bald would be, well, normal. It also would've helped with the problem of none of the characters aging in 21 years.
 
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The non-aging characters has become really grating this time around. It doesn't have to be dramatic, but some subtle work would have been greatly appreciated. Isn't it time for Magneto to have some sign of grey?

Charles and Eric in the 80's:
xmen1.jpg
 
Saw this today. It's not my favorite of the franchise, likely due to the fact that Apocolypse was never that great a villian for me. This film didn't suck by any means, but I wasn't blown away by it either. Days of Future Past was much better.
 
Looking back on some of the earlier posts. More than person noted how good this latest iteration of Nightcrawler was and I would have to agree. Of the newer younger versions introduced in this film, his was the best. Hope this kid stays on for more films if they make some. :)
 
Looking back on some of the earlier posts. More than person noted how good this latest iteration of Nightcrawler was and I would have to agree. Of the newer younger versions introduced in this film, his was the best. Hope this kid stays on for more films if they make some. :)

He was definitely well acted and portrayed well. Unfortunately, he didn't seem to have much of a purpose in the movie.
 
Oh and how are Scott and Alex brothers? Scott is still adopted right? Those people Alex took him from were Scott's adopted parents? They cant be biological bc Alex would have to be their son which doesnt work bc despite how he looks, Alex is in his early 40s, making him close in age with those people. With Alex being 23 years older, their comic book origin of being seperated as youngsters doesnt work or make sense in this universe. That sequence was a big WTF to me and I wish they had properly explained their relationship more especially since [blackout]Alex was killed off and Scott was deeply affected. [/blackout]I got the impression that they were close and Scott grew up with him around

Looking back on some of the earlier posts. More than person noted how good this latest iteration of Nightcrawler was and I would have to agree. Of the newer younger versions introduced in this film, his was the best. Hope this kid stays on for more films if they make some. :)

I thought he was annoying. Scott and Jean were my favorite new additions
 
On a positive note, the new, classic costumes look absolutely amazing. Can't believe they took all this time to finally put them on screen.
 
I think a mod should issue you a warning for spamming the same post in every thread, with an ugly navy blue text to boot.

Nah....I simply ban spammers and the delete their posts.
 
I saw X-Men Apocalypse today. What a let down. My expectations were mixed. On one hand, Bryan Singer's original X-Men movies (even the very overrated X2) never impressed me much and the reviews for this one have been mixed. On the other hand, I liked Days of Future Past a lot. Sadly, this turned out to be as disappointing as the Tomato Meter would indicate.
The biggest problem is the titular villain. Apocalypse should have been THE villain. Instead, he was so damn forgettable. Putting aside the fact that he looked silly (the final product was no better than the original Ivan Ooze-esque picture), the performance was so damn subdued. There was no aura of power or presence. His scheme was absolutely nonsensical, the type of thing you'd expect to see from Cobra Commander. And despite all of his grand (and inconsistent) powers, the stakes never feel real. A forgettable character from First Class dies through an accident that [blackout]Havok himself[/blackout] causes. I mean, the whole destruction of the Xavier Institute is the result of Havok accidentally blowing up a generator. That is seemingly the extent of Apocalypse's threat level, the ability to cause an accident that [blackout]kills a minor character.[/blackout] Yes, there is the nuclear missile thing, but the movie forgets about it almost immediately. It is never given due weight and therefore is easily overlooked. Everything about Apocalypse is underwhelming. That alone is a death sentence to the movie. Apocalypse needed to carry this and he didn't.

The movie may have been better served by having fewer characters. It is hard to establish a villain when there are a buttload of characters who are shoehorned in. Was there any reason to make Storm, Angel, and Psylocke Horsemen? Considering how little time was spent on them it could've literally been any generic henchman. What a waste of Olivia Munn. But they are not the only unnecessary characters/moments. Nightcrawler is just there. He is amusing but doesn't contribute enough to the plot to justify his presence. Same is true of Jubilee (luckily, not much time was devoted to her).

The most egregious examples of unnecessary weight on the film come in the form of Quicksilver and the Weapon X subplot.

As to Quicksilver, his only reason for being in the movie is that he had a cool scene in DOFP. So he is shoehorned into this one, with a near identical sequence that goes on way too long and destroys the humor and charm of the scene in DOFP with complete overkill. Singer clearly has a hard-on for the character, but his role in the film just isn't justified, especially the weight that it is given. He is not just some bit player. He's the ****in' guy. He is the only X-Man to hold his own against Apocalypse (prior to Phoenix). He doesn't just hold his own. He beats Apocalypse down like a redheaded stepchild (which really takes away from Apocalypse and diminishes any effectiveness he had left). Now the obvious response to this is that his role in the movie is justified due to his connection with Magneto. That would be true if that subplot went anywhere. It is repeatedly eluded to, then when it comes time for the payoff...NOTHING HAPPENS. :facepalm: It makes the whole character's presence and journey to that point feel like a waste of screen time and leaves the audience feeling cheated.

Further, the entire second act is pretty pointless. For example, the Weapon X scenes and Wolverine's cameo did absolutely nothing to move the plot forward. That entire half hour could've been cut without affecting the movie at all. The only thing of consequence that happens in that sequence is Xavier contacting Jean. That could've been done just as easily if she were sitting in her bedroom. The Weapon X scenes added nothing and took up time that could have been devoted to Apocalypse, the Horsemen, anyone else. It was such a weird part of the movie. It served no narrative purpose, was shoehorned in with no tie-in to the rest of the plot, and never came back up for the rest of the movie. Its not entirely unlike Stryker's extended cameo in DOFP. Singer seems to have this weird fixation on movie-verse Stryker. He seems to be operating under the assumption that he has created this timeless villain, on par with Magneto, who needs to be included in every X-film when, in reality, he is a pretty dull, cliche, military bad guy (Reverend Stryker of the comics was infinitely more interesting).

The Weapon X sequence kinda sums up the movie as a whole. It is disjointed and lacks an internal logic. A lot of random things happen, that are loosely strung together, then it ends. Oddly enough, the characters do not respond to things they ought to be responding to. [blackout]Does anyone acknowledge Jean turning into a giant ****ing fire bird that made her capable of eviscerating a god-like mutant? Storm changes sides because Apocalypse is cold about the death of some guy she barely knew. Why'd she do it? Who knows, we don't get to know her well enough to know the logic behind her actions. Hell, Scott barely acknowledges his brother's death![/blackout] None of these character moments happen, but we get a 20-30 minute Weapon X scene with no tie to the overall plot?

Don't even get me started on Magneto's arc. He loses his wife and child but never really has any emotional closure in that regard. He just kinda forgets about them half way through the movie and his plot becomes more about mending his relationship with Mystique and Charles than coming to terms with his loss. It makes the most powerful scene of the movie (the death of his family) feel hollow. Beyond that, when it comes time for his redemption, what ultimately causes it? Was it his ex-lover talking him down? Kinda but not really. Was it his son telling him that he needed him? Nope. That subplot is never even acknowledged. Instead it is some weird Tumblr-esque slash fanfiction montage of Charles and Eric's greatest hits.

In the end, it just wasn't very satisfying. The movie was all over the place thematically, was overloaded with unnecessary and underdeveloped characters, the villain was not effective and the narrative was not very compelling. What should've been the X-Men franchise's Avengers was instead a mediocre, soulless film. I think a big part of it is that the movie feels ashamed to be a comic book movie. I mean, Singer has never hidden his disdain for comics but at times it almost feels like he is apologizing for it. For example: "WAIT A MINUTE! THESE AREN'T SUPERHERO COSTUMES! THEY'RE FLIGHT SUITS! WE HAVE TO STOP EVERYTHING AND POINT THAT OUT! TEH REALISMZ!!!!" It causes the movie to shy away from the more fantastical elements. This showed in DOFP with the total under use of the Sentinels and now shows again. Apocalypse could've been so much more if Singer embraced it and just went balls to the wall with an uber-powerful demi-god. Instead, we have someone with all of the charisma of a feeble old man, spouting off pseudo-philosophical bull ****.

The best way to describe this movie is underwhelming. Even the action. While there are some cool scenes, the whole movie builds up to a final fight sequence that is little more than metal spinning around in the air, senseless destruction, and some quick shots of fights. Its not exactly Avengers-calibre action.

I really hope this is Bryan Singer's last foray into the comic book realm. It is telling that the best X-Men movie to date is First Class, a movie he had absolutely zilch to do with. This franchise needs some fresh blood. 4/10.

Oh, some other random nitpicks:

1) Why is it no one ages? First Class was set 21 years before Apocalypse yet Charles, Magneto, Moira, Beast, and Stryker all look exactly the same. I'm not saying to recast, but damn...age them up a bit with makeup. People change quite a bit in 21 years.

2) This film is very odd in the way it glosses over Charles wiping Moira's memory. First Class seemed to indicate that he took away her memory of the location of the mansion, nothing else. This movie retconned it so he wiped his existence from her memory. Xavier seriously violated Moira. That would be fine and consistent with the character, I have no problem with that. I do take issue with how it was handled. A mind rape is essentially treated as a joke throughout the movie. Then, when he does restore her memory, Moira's response is essentially "You gave me back the memories you stole from me when you toyed with my mind!? How romantic!"

3) I know I already said it, but damn Olivia Munn was wasted.

4) Did we really need an origin story of Xavier's baldness? It was kinda funny when Rogue's white stripe was given an explanation in the original X-Men, but did we really need an unnatural explanation for a middle aged man, probably in his mid to late 40s by this point, going bald?

5) Sophie Turner's American accent isn't atrocious, but it isn't very good either....also, the scene with her and Logan was creepy as hell. She (the character, anyway) is a 16 or 17 year old girl and she and Logan (a character who is physically about 45 years old and has lived for nearly two centuries at this point) have this scene where they look into one's another's eyes with all kinds of romantic subtext. Its creepy.
I agree with all your points to varying degrees
 
I honestly don't think this is a bad film at all. It has its issue but it's not a bad film. And I for one don't let critics tell me how I should feel about a movie. Some movies critics love, I can't stand. Heck critics love JLaw and IMO she doesn't do Mystique any justice. To each their own.
 
I honestly don't think this is a bad film at all. It has its issue but it's not a bad film. And I for one don't let critics tell me how I should feel about a movie. Some movies critics love, I can't stand. Heck critics love JLaw and IMO she doesn't do Mystique any justice. To each their own.
I love a great many movies that critics have panned. I try to watch a movie and judge it for myself. :)
 
^^^^^ Matt, so much word to your post! IA with everything

I didnt comment on it but I also didnt like how they handled Moira and Xavier. Why the hell wasnt she pissed off that he manipulated her and erased her memories from 20 years ago? She should have been more affected and that should have made her resent him

Why she gonna resent him for taking away some memories? It was 20 years ago and the memories were off nothing that effected her life in anyway

If anything FC ending actually made it seem like she remembered the Kiss which apocalypse sorta forgot I guess
 
Why she gonna resent him for taking away some memories? It was 20 years ago and the memories were off nothing that effected her life in anyway

If anything FC ending actually made it seem like she remembered the Kiss which apocalypse sorta forgot I guess

bc he took away her memories. He mind raped her and that wasnt cool. Most people would be upset about being manipulated like that. Being 20 years ago is irrelevant as it could have happened yesterday and the fact that he did that to her is still wrong. Actually it might make it worse bc that was a big moment in her life that was stolen from her against her will
 
Why she gonna resent him for taking away some memories? It was 20 years ago and the memories were off nothing that effected her life in anyway

If anything FC ending actually made it seem like she remembered the Kiss which apocalypse sorta forgot I guess

Umm...because he toyed with her mind against her will and essentially gave her a psychic roofie.

Make no mistake, Xavier mindraped Moira. Rape is not a heinous crime because of sex. It is a heinous crime because it is taking away someone's autonomy and forcing their body to do things that they do not want to do. Charles took away Moira's autonomy and forced her to lose memories. That is a heinous violation.

Considering how heavy handed Bryan Singer is with his social justice metaphors, I am shocked that he would gloss over something with as many unfortunate implications as a telepathic raping.
 
Lol I can't believe we are calling it mind rape, i can't believe ratner made Charles
Mind rape Jean as kid, no wonder she killed him the sicko.

Mind rape lol
 
Lol I can't believe we are calling mind rape, i can't believe ratner made Charles
Mind rape Jean as kid, no wonder she killed him.

Mind rape lol

You'll notice that Ratner actually addressed the issue though. He did not treat it as a joke or a romantic gesture. It was treated as a violation of Jean's autonomy, is it should have been treated.

You can laugh all you want, but Charles entered Moira, against her will and used his power's to take advantage of her. Was Jessica Jones not raped because she was consenting (due to psychic control)?
 
Lol I can't believe we are calling it mind rape, i can't believe ratner made Charles
Mind rape Jean as kid, no wonder she killed him the sicko.

Mind rape lol

its a term thats been used for decades. The fact that you are joking around with it highlights the issue with how it was treated in the film

And yes Xavier was wrong for what he did to Jean as a kid. One of the themes from X3 to DOFP to this film was that wrong and correcting it. He didnt realize it at first but his manipulation ultimately screwed her up and did lead to his "death"
 
Funny that this film goes some way to redeem the "mind-rape" of Jean with a more supportive Xavier, yet it managed to dip into the same territory by expanding on what he did to Moira.

I never considered the ramifications of Moira's mind-wipe in First Class, but I certainly didn't think he scrubbed so much from her. It doesn't even make sense that she could have no memory of Xavier. Other people she worked with knew she met this guy. She would have caught wind of the adventures she went on from somebody.

... How is she even still CIA? I'd bet losing your memory during a mission would be a pretty big hurdle for your career.
 
You can laugh all you want, but Charles entered Moira, against her will and used his power's to take advantage of her. Was Jessica Jones not raped because she was consenting (due to psychic control)?

Does that mean every time Charles freezes people in place that he mind raped them? Did he mind rape all those people in the CIA office, wow and he was a bad influence on Jean too since she did it to the akali lake soldiers, they had no choice but were force to see something that wasn't there, she mind raped them!

Moira forgot some memories to protect the X-Men or the school, or at least that was the idea behind it in FC, if anything she would remember and understand why he did it, mutants were still on the closet till 1973.
 
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Critics usually rate things for different reasons than we do. They get more technical, more... I don't know the word, maybe professional? but most of the times that doesn't align with what you like to see on a Saturday night chilling in your own couch eating Doritos.
 
its a term thats been used for decades. The fact that you are joking around with it highlights the issue with how it was treated in the film

And yes Xavier was wrong for what he did to Jean as a kid. One of the themes from X3 to DOFP to this film was that wrong and correcting it. He didnt realize it at first but his manipulation ultimately screwed her up and did lead to his "death"

Come to think of it, Xavier's arc with Mystique parallels quite nicely with his errors in subduing Jean. Perhaps the lessons he learned in allowing Raven to take ownership of her life impacted the way he approaches Jean's overwhelming power.
 
Does that mean every time Charles freezes people in place that he mind raped them? Did he mind rape all those people in the CIA office, wow and he was a bad influence on Jean too since she did it to the akali lake soldiers, they had no choice but were force to see something that wasn't there, she mind raped them!

Moira forgot some memories to protect the X-Men or the school, or at least that was the idea behind it in FC, if anything she would remember and understand why he did it, mutants were still on the closet till 1973.

Have you ever read the comics? These are continuous themes of Charles Xavier's character. His power is to take away the autonomy of others, read their thoughts without their consent, make them do things they do not wish to do, and yes, mind rape them. Some of the best X-Men stories have dealt with precisely this theme.

At any rate, if you cannot see how it is essentially sedating someone and getting them to do something against their will, then go back to watching the cartoons, kid. Clearly you are not mature enough for an adult discussion on the subtext. In the meantime, I will be praying that you never find yourself around an intoxicated or incapacitated girl, because clearly in your eyes, if someone cannot object to you controlling and doing something to them, there is nothing wrong with it.
 
Have you ever read the comics? These are continuous themes of Charles Xavier's character. His power is to take away the autonomy of others, read their thoughts without their consent, make them do things they do not wish to do, and yes, mind rape them. Some of the best X-Men stories have dealt with precisely this theme.

At any rate, if you cannot see how it is essentially sedating someone and getting them to do something against their will, then go back to watching the cartoons, kid. Clearly you are not mature enough for an adult discussion on the subtext. In the meantime, I will be praying that you never find yourself around an intoxicated or incapacitated girl, because clearly in your eyes, if someone cannot object to you controlling and doing something to them, there is nothing wrong with it.

yeah pretty much this. He tried to install in his telepathic students to hold their power with responsibility as it is a violation to enter someone's mind uninvited and alter it. For the most part he and Jean would primarily do so to enemies (self defense) or to protect someone. In more recent times, Marvel has delved into the darker side and dealt with times when Xavier manipulated those close to him. One perfect example is when he erased Scott's memories to make him forget that he had a brother that was killed in battle. Scott disowned Xavier after that
 
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