Birds of Prey Was the R rating necessary?

[samsnee]

Movie massively underperformed. Fortunately the budget wasn’t huge so the losses won’t be too embarrassing but this is definitely a stumble.

Was WB wrong to make it R-rated, thus limiting its audience? I don’t see Harley as the same league as Deadpool that made an R rating work to its favor. But nothing in this movie warranted that rating for me.

 

[TheVileOne]

I think the R-rating worked in the sense that they could do a bunch of cartoony levels of gore and violence. And I think it worked because it was from Harley Quinn's perspective. So because she has this maniacal, demented and twisted world view, all the cartoony levels of gore and violence, like R-rated Looney Tunes, worked. But that's just my opinion

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

The only real blood and guts were

Spoiler

Those flashbacks to the Bertinelli massacre and whenever Huntress and Zsasz killed someone

But if they just reigned in the language, left only one well comedically timed motherfather from Rosie Perez, then they could've shaved this movie down to a hard PG-13. The R really wasn't necessary, just like it wasn't for The Killing Joke adaptation.

 

[-JKR-]

Yes. It is about the criminal underworld of Gotham City and has a psychopath as main character. The rating was perfectly in line with what they were telling, and that's what matters the most to me.

A PG-13 crime-tinged action movie (featuring all sorts of weapons) in the vein of Quentin Tarantino or Guy Ritchie, such as this, wouldn't do it for me.

Also, movies such as "Mad Max: Fury Road," "It," "John Wick," "Deadpool," "Joker" and other prove that an R-rating is not a problem.

Before "Deadpool" was released people would whine about how the rating would cut out the character's teenage audience and all sorts of BS. And as much as Harley's... "league"... whatever that means, Deadpool wasn't exactly a household name for the general audience either.

They chose the right rating for the kind of story they were telling and movie they were making. Audiences are baffling sometimes. Lots of movies where the right creative choices (as I believe is the case here) are made underperform. This will probably end up on the same pile as "Edge of Tomorrow" and "The Nice Guys" and other unseen and initially underappreciated cult gems.

I hope that, if rumors of James Gunn's "The Suicide Squad" being shot with an R-rating in mind are true, the studio won't backtrack based on this movie's opening weekend. Especially after coming off a $1B movie. They should be smarter than that.

P.S.: The fact that the violence and gore isn't incessant doesn't mean that it wasn't worth it. Few, sparse, grislier moments influence an entire movie tonally more than you think. The small, infrequent details are just as much part of the whole as the rest.

 

[TheVileOne]

Sorry Shaw, there was a lot more R-rated violence than just that.

 

[Sithborg]

Sorry Shaw, there was a lot more R-rated violence than just that.

What is Cathy Yan's hatred of legs?

 

[MadVillainy]

I rarely think a SH movie needs an R rating. I haven't seen BoP, but you could make a great BoP or Harley Quinn movie with a PG13 rating. I don't think an R rating is bad for this though

 

[Shinobi Shaw]

Sorry Shaw, there was a lot more R-rated violence than just that.

There really wasn't though. I mean the whole GCPD scene wasn't bloody, I think if anything the language was more R than the violence.

I rarely think a SH movie needs an R rating. I haven't seen BoP, but you could make a great BoP or Harley Quinn movie with a PG13 rating. I don't think an R rating is bad for this though

It felt PG-13 to be real with you aside from the language, and maybe two or three action sequences. You'll see eventually.

 

[-JKR-]

See, it's that "aside from..." that doesn't make sense. It's there. It's part of the movie. This felt like a proper R-rated movie just as much as John Wick, Mad Max and Deadpool.

Let's not mistake the R-rating with its extremes. Just because it isn't a Rob Zombie movie doesn't mean it's not an R-rated movie.

 

[TheVileOne]

There really wasn't though. I mean the whole GCPD scene wasn't bloody, I think if anything the language was more R than the violence.

Harley feeding a human leg to a hyena. What she did to Black Mask's driver.

 

[kguillou]

Ehhh the movie absolutely felt like it was a PG-13 movie at heart. Or maybe, i should say some middle ground between 13 and R sort of like the Daredevil TV series. The movie wasnt that gory guys. In fact they pull away from some intense moments. And they didnt really use the F bomb that much (which actually i appreciated as it gave it more impact when it was used). I think this could have been a hard PG-13 movie.

 

[-JKR-]

The Daredevil TV series would absolutely get an R-rating if it were rated by the MPAA.

Please stop with the assumption that R-rating = "this gooory." The John Wick movies aren't, either.

An R rating doesn't mean you have to overdo it with the gore and mature content.

 

[Sithborg]

Yeah, there are a few things that would have to be dropped to make PG-13. Likely one scene that had no gore, no real language, but was extremely disturbing.

 

[Yowza]

@SomeOldGuy
Yeah, I think the real lesson here is “don’t spend $97 million (BoP’s reported budget before tax credits) on a Harley Quinn movie.” Somehow they made other female-led actioners like Atomic Blonde and Charlie’s Angels for $30-50 million. I get why you need $100 million for Shazam, with its effects-heavy character and baddie. But Harley? She swings a big mallet.

Tomb Raider had $94M budget, which is higher than that of BoP, and it had even lower opening week at $24M. But it managed to do well at Overseas market and reached at worldwide total of $274 M. So, each movie has it's own quirks. Let's see what happens here.

Edit: The movie's also getting a sequel.

I think the above quotes work from the Box Office Thread as there's some factual points that one can derive a cogent or even valid reference point to stem a narrative off of as opposed to just personal opinion.

 

[Primal Slayer]

There was like zero reason for this to be Rated R...there was like 2 curse words in the entire movie lol.

 

[Sithborg]

There was like zero reason for this to be Rated R...there was like 2 curse words in the entire movie lol.

Fairly certain there was more. Just didn't exactly make note, because it was natural sounding swearing.

And lets not forget Cathy Yan's leg hatred.

I also think the one scene with Sionis in the club would not have been allowed in a PG13 film.

 

[Micromind]

I liked that they didn't hold back on brutal action scenes in the movie, it would be boring to go back to PG13 action in other DC movies now.

The action scenes justified the R rating and it helps to set this movie apart from rest of cbm crowd.

We are just debating this due to box office, otherwise this would be a non issue.

 

[Micromind]

The Daredevil TV series would absolutely get an R-rating if it were rated by the MPAA.

Please stop with the assumption that R-rating = "this gooory." The John Wick movies aren't, either.

An R rating doesn't mean you have to overdo it with the gore and mature content.

Yeah, a movie can be R rated even without language, gore or nudity.

 

[Sithborg]

I liked that they didn't hold back on brutal action scenes in the movie, it would be boring to go back to PG13 action in other DC movies now.

The action scenes justified the R rating and it helps to set this movie apart from rest of cbm crowd.

We are just debating this due to box office, otherwise this would be a non issue.

Ehh, I remember it coming up with Deadpool.

Granted, that person was heavily mocked...

 

[Yowza]

I'm not going to get into the narrative concerning the marketing (really not much to say besides the obvious) but here's another reference point pertaining to another smaller budgeted film franchise according to Forbes:

'John Wick' Franchise Passes $500 Million At Box Office
...The first John Wick film opened with a $14.4 million weekend in the U.S. back in 2014. It went on to accrue $43 million over its domestic run and $88.8 million worldwide. It currently ranks 17th in Reeves’ entire catalog.

John Wick: Chapter Two made $30.4 million on its opening weekend in 2017. It went on to make $92 million during its domestic run and $171.5 in total from foreign markets, which means the movie now ranks as Reeves’ seventh-most financially successful film.

Now the massive success of John Wick: Chapter 3 - Parabellum has pushed the grand franchise total into the $500 million territory. After nabbing $56.8 million domestically and $93.3 million worldwide in its opening weekend, the film has now made $138.7 million over its domestic run, and $252.3 million worldwide...

Copied from Box Office Mojo Sunday Night:
DOMESTIC (40.9%)
$33,250,000
INTERNATIONAL (59.1%)
$48,000,000
WORLDWIDE
$81,250,000

4,236 theaters was a wide release so definitely showing the film's level of attraction. The number will surely drastically drop off. The audience reviews largely being positive shows there's currently a reception for a film like this and the critics are moreso pushing for it than Joker so I think this type of film needed some very careful multifaceted marketing to get more buzz and interest.

 

[Micromind]

Releasing songs by various artists was multifaceted mktg, only thing is they did it too late and those talk show appearnces were pretty late too.

 

[Yowza]

It didn't peak people's curiosity enough.

Some of the events leading up to the film involving the cast members helped get this circulating through television news or trending on the internet but the TV spots playing on TV during a commercial break didn't help.

 

[Legendver2]

I'm of the mind that they forced an R on this to ride the Joker and Deadpool R-hype.

 

[Sithborg]

I'm not super sure about that.

Spoiler

The club scene where Sionus makes that woman script would not have been in a pg13 movie. And is kind of important to put Canary's situation into a full light

 

[SomeOldGuy]

All I’ll note here is that I stopped by the local mall to grab lunch at the food court today, and what do I spy in the window of Hot Topic but a big ol’ BoP poster.

According to a quick google search, HT bills itself as a store targeting girls and women from 12-22. So that’s like half your demo that can’t see the movie.

So yeah, maybe someone ought to have thought things through a little more.