What do you think is the worst crime?

[Flame on!]

That's pretty much it. Rape is worst than murder to people with dignity.

Many of the people here have no dignity and it shows.

You absolute spastic.

 

[Admiral_N8]

Actually, rape is worse than murder to people who have a very fragile hold on and narrow definition of their sense of dignity.

Exactly.

Outsiderzedge youre saying us people who think murder is worse than rape means we have no dignity?

 

[Daisy]

Exactly.

Outsiderzedge youre saying us people who think murder is worse than rape means we have no dignity?

By extension it would mean that every one that has survived a rape without being killed has no dignity. I guess they should all commit suicide now. Oh wait, that's cowardly. I guess they're just doomed to be social outcasts for the rest of their lives.

 

[Outsiderzedge]

Exactly.

Outsiderzedge youre saying us people who think murder is worse than rape means we have no dignity?

I pretty much did say that, but what I should have said is less dignity than those whom rather be murdered than raped. Basically, you want to live, no matter how wretched or humiliating a life it is. There is nothing wrong with that. This is the instinct of all animals and we are animals afterall... but some people try to hold themselves above such lowly ways...

I'm not one of these people, but I understand their point of view.

 

[Flame on!]

I pretty much did say that, but what I should have said is less dignity than those whom rather be murdered than raped. Basically, you want to live, no matter how wretched or humiliating a life it is. There is nothing wrong with that. This is the instinct of all animals and we are animals afterall... but some people try to hold themselves above such lowly ways...

I'm not one of these people, but I understand their point of view.

I'm actually embarassed for you.

 

[Daisy]

I pretty much did say that, but what I should have said is less dignity than those whom rather be murdered than raped. Basically, you want to live, no matter how wretched or humiliating a life it is. There is nothing wrong with that. This is the instinct of all animals and we are animals afterall... but some people try to hold themselves above such lowly ways...

I'm not one of these people, but I understand their point of view.

See the point where you go wrong is in the assumption that being raped necessarily leads to a wretched or humiliating life. That's simply not true. It's a wretched moment, to be sure, but it ends and there's no reason to go on feeling wretched and humililated once it's over.

The belief that you don't have ability to overcome a negative experience and go on to live a happy, satisfied, dignified life shows how fragile your sense of self is. Life for those sort of people has to pretty wretched as it is, being constantly on the watch for insults to their 'dignity'.

If that's your true feeling and you're not just trying to be 'controversial', I pity you. It also goes a long way toward explaining your humorlessness.

 

[Outsiderzedge]

By extension it would mean that every one that has survived a rape without being killed has no dignity. I guess they should all commit suicide now. Oh wait, that's cowardly. I guess they're just doomed to be social outcasts for the rest of their lives.

Of course not. People can get over it, but the scar left on their spirit never goes away. They carry that with them forever and it affects those around them and they, in turn, affect those around them and so on.

Murder leaves a worse effect on a victim, but if it is justifiable, leaves no where near the same mark rape leaves on people and society in general.

 

[Flame on!]

Of course not. People can get over it, but the scar left on their spirit never goes away. They carry that with them forever and it affects those around them and they, in turn, affect those around them and so on.

Murder leaves a worse effect on a victim, but if it is justifiable, leaves no where near the same mark rape leaves on people and society in general.

So in your utopia, you'd rather folk were murdered than raped? Given that rape victims would leave such a blemish on society...

BELM!

The effect on a murder victim is death! That's it. No chance to live any sort of existence. The effect of rape is what? Physcological scarring that can be cured and treated with compassion and understanding, something that you're clearly lacking.

I'm not entirely sure if you're just playing devil's advocate here. I hope you are.

 

[Outsiderzedge]

So in your utopia, you'd rather folk were murdered than raped? Given that rape victims would leave such a blemish on society...

Murder is a more circumstantial crime than rape. It all depends on why or how the person was murdered. Murder can be just as bad or worse than rape if it is malicious enough.

 

[WeaponZ2]

Robbery/theft:4

Murder:8 (depends on the way the person is murdered)

Rape:10

Arson:8

Assault and battery:7

Possession of Narcotics: (depends on what drug)

Driving under the influence:7

Kidnapping:8

Money fraud(cheating on taxes or stealing from a company):4

Child Abuse:10

 

[Flame on!]

Murder is a more circumstantial crime than rape. It all depends on why or how the person was murdered. Murder can be just as bad or worse than rape if it is malicious enough.

Surely rape could be construed as circumstantial too. I could wake up one morning next to some girl and be accused of rape because she had one too many the night before.

Rape/murder, theft/arson. Every crime is circumstantial, but the one thing that is clear as day is that taking a life is worse than temporariliy* ruining one.




*I am fully aware that rape is not always temporary, but many recover. Unlike murder victims, but the night is young...

 

[Daisy]

Of course not. People can get over it, but the scar left on their spirit never goes away. They carry that with them forever and it affects those around them and they, in turn, affect those around them and so on.

Murder leaves a worse effect on a victim, but if it is justifiable, leaves no where near the same mark rape leaves on people and society in general.

This is EXACTLY the wrong thinking I've been pointing out for most of the thread. It's simply not true.

Further, by the same logic you can argue that murder - which is never justifiable by the way (homicide - meaning killing of a human - can be justifiable, but murder never is, although there can be 'mitigating circumstances') - scars all of the people who loved/cared/even liked the vicitim and it affects them and they, in turn affect those around them and so on. And considering that the first group of people affected by a person's murder is considerably larger than the circle affected by a rape victim... logically, murder is worse for society than rape.

 

[jaguarr]

Genocide.

jag

 

[The offspring]

every rapist and peodophile (especially pedos) should die the most horrific death over the longest possible time for ****ing up somebodies life as much as they do, they're the most heinous crimes possible, i would ppersonally execute every last one of them and enjoy it if i was given the right, i hate those bastards

 

[Calvin]

T
The only 'comfort' I can find in all this is the realization that if someone who said that public speaking was worse than death were actually presented with that scenario... you must make this speech or be shot... the overwhelming majority of people would make the speech.

But while they made it, I bet a lot of them would be thinking "christ, I should've taken the death option...."

 

[Flame on!]

every rapist and peodophile (especially pedos) should die the most horrific death over the longest possible time for ****ing up somebodies life as much as they do, they're the most heinous crimes possible, i would ppersonally execute every last one of them and enjoy it if i was given the right, i hate those bastards

Thank God you're not in charge of anything.

 

[Outsiderzedge]

This is EXACTLY the wrong thinking I've been pointing out for most of the thread. It's simply not true.

Further, by the same logic you can argue that murder - which is never justifiable by the way (homicide - meaning killing of a human - can be justifiable, but murder never is, although there can be 'mitigating circumstances') - scars all of the people who loved/cared/even liked the vicitim and it affects them and they, in turn affect those around them and so on. And considering that the first group of people affected by a person's murder is considerably larger than the circle affected by a rape victim... logically, murder is worse for society than rape.

You want me to say you're right?

Okie doke. You're right. I admit I just felt like arguing.

I would like to say that I am more content to simply understand where someone is coming from than to tell them they are wrong or right simply because they may or may not agree with me.

 

[Daisy]

Surely rape could be construed as circumstantial too. I could wake up one morning next to some girl and be accused of rape because she had one too many the night before.

Rape/murder, theft/arson. Every crime is circumstantial, but the one thing that is clear as day is that taking a life is worse than temporariliy* ruining one.




*I am fully aware that rape is not always temporary, but many recover. Unlike murder victims, but the night is young...

Outsiderzedge isn't using 'circumstancial' in the legal sense. She's saying that it's more dependent on the circumstances that led to the murder. She's still wrong though, as I pointed out earlier, murder is never justifiable under any circumstance. Murder by definition is the unlawful killing of another human. When a killing is 'justifiable' - such as in the case of self-defense - it's not murder... it's justifiable homicide.

 

[Calvin]

This is EXACTLY the wrong thinking I've been pointing out for most of the thread. It's simply not true.

Further, by the same logic you can argue that murder - which is never justifiable by the way (homicide - meaning killing of a human - can be justifiable, but murder never is, although there can be 'mitigating circumstances')

Well, in the dictionary I just checked, it only says the unlawful killing of a human being by another, usually with premeditated malice. How could that never be justifiable? You could premeditately plan to kill someone that had, say, tortured your little sister.

 

[Flame on!]

You want me to say you're right?

Okie doke. You're right. I admit I just felt like arguing.

I would like to say that I am more content to simply understand where someone is coming from than to tell them they are wrong or right simply because they may or may not agree with me.

I did mention that you may be playing devil's advocate a while back. I appreciate were you're coming from, and I'm guilty of it myself from time, but I think within the context of this thread holding to what you believe to be true is far more powerful than batting for the underdog.

 

[Flame on!]

Outsiderzedge isn't using 'circumstancial' in the legal sense. She's saying that it's more dependent on the circumstances that led to the murder.

Yeah, I was trying to express the idea, and example, of circumstances that lead to rape.

 

[Daisy]

You want me to say you're right?

Okie doke. You're right. I admit I just felt like arguing.

I would like to say that I am more content to simply understand where someone is coming from than to tell them they are wrong or right simply because they may or may not agree with me.

I don't make any judgement on the 'rightness or wrongness' of someone's point-of-view unless I'm sure I understand it first.

Perhaps if you hadn't started in asserting that where you're coming from is more superior than others (including me), then people wouldn't feel the need to show you where you are in error.

That's pretty much it. Rape is worst than murder to people with dignity.

Many of the people here have no dignity and it shows.

I pretty much did say that, but what I should have said is less dignity than those whom rather be murdered than raped. Basically, you want to live, no matter how wretched or humiliating a life it is. There is nothing wrong with that. This is the instinct of all animals and we are animals afterall... but some people try to hold themselves above such lowly ways...

I'm not one of these people, but I understand their point of view.

 

[Flame on!]

How could that never be justifiable? You could premeditately plan to kill someone that had, say, tortured your little sister.

That isn't justifiable in a court of law.

 

[Calvin]

That isn't justifiable in a court of law.

I thought we were just talking in general.

 

[Outsiderzedge]

I did mention that you may be playing devil's advocate a while back. I appreciate were you're coming from, and I'm guilty of it myself from time, but I think within the context of this thread holding to what you believe to be true is far more powerful than batting for the underdog.

My true stance is neither rape nor murder (nor any other crime for that matter) is wrong or right and, therefore, neither better or worse than each other. It all depends on what you want out of life and no one's point of view is necessarily better or worse than anyone elses.

If the world was rampant with rape and murder, it would neither be a better nor worse world than if it were devoid of it. It all comes down to majority consent and the majority may feel rape is worse or it may feel murder is worse. It doesn't really matter. It all depends on what we want and there's nothing intrinsically right or wrong about that.